Unreleased and New Card Discussion

[DirkGently]

@Dunadain @TheGildedGoose The attack trigger is fine - not much of a build-around, but in general piling cards is a fun mechanic if a bit time consuming (luckily as an attack trigger it usually won't happen too often).

It's the second paragraph I take issue with. Do you actually think Liar's Pendulum becomes a good card if it says "each opponent loses two life"? Especially when your commander is already a pretty effective CA engine, which (1) makes additional draw (something a lot of the cards which involve piles provide) somewhat redundant and (2) makes direct damage less valuable (you're winning the long game via CA, what's the rush to burn everyone down?).

There's also, at least to my searching, not very many cards it applies to, and most of them are pretty expensive to where burning for 2 makes a very small impact on their power level (which was my point with FoF - which incidentally is a fine draw spell in a vacuum, but I wouldn't play it if my commander was a 3-drop that drew a bunch of cards). This isn't exactly a Guttersnipe situation where we can significantly improve the power of a Ponder by tacking 2 damage onto it. Boneyard Parley + shock is maybe 1% better than Boneyard Parley on its own.

[Dunadain]

Do you actually think Liar's Pendulum becomes a good card if it says "each opponent loses two life"? Especially when your commander is already a pretty effective CA engine, which (1) makes additional draw (something a lot of the cards which involve piles provide) somewhat redundant and (2) makes direct damage less valuable (you're winning the long game via CA, what's the rush to burn everyone down?).

No, bad card is still bad, but Liar's Pendulum becomes significantly better w/ toymaker.

Meanwhile, the improvement to cards like Boneyard Parley is minimal.

I'm not saying the card is good.

[TheGildedGoose]

I'm not saying the card is good.

It's a massive step up from Atris, Oracle of Half-Truths, I'll tell you what.

[Dunadain]

I'm not saying the card is good.

It's a massive step up from Atris, Oracle of Half-Truths, I'll tell you what.

By "the card" I was referring to Liar's Pendulum.

The Celestial Toymaker is actually about right power-wise imo.

[duducrash]

For a little off topic of a real format.
Novice Inspector - is Thraben Inspector 4-8 in pauper and I think that actually matters in some decks, good timing with the Murder of Monastery Swiftspear I suppose. I'm actually moving forward with boros All That Glitters .

Now back to silly stuff

Aurelia, the law above is cool a suppose. Weak I suppose, but thats not her problem, its the formats

[yeti1069]

I think the wording on the ability is awkward, and yeah, it applies to a fairly narrow set of cards. I also don't think pushing players to go dense on choice/pile cards is going to make for enjoyable gameplay.

That said, I also don't think it's terrible. Adding 2 damage to those spells is only irrelevant if your game plan is to win by some means other than bringing everyone to 0 life without an infinite combo. It's not enough of a boost to build around, especially not with how few cards there are that fit into this "archetype", and how few of THOSE are worth playing (and are low enough cost to be able to string multiples together in a turn).

[Ruiner]

Gonna need custom proxies of these Clue characters like Commander Mustard to feature the cast of the classic Clue movie.

[DirkGently]

The fourteenth doctor allows the first 5c partner commanders. But it's doctor-tribal (and also really bad) so I doubt too many people will care.

No, bad card is still bad, but Liar's Pendulum becomes significantly better w/ toymaker.

Honestly if I had to run liar's pendulum I'd rather run it in a deck that lacked CA and so would actually need the draw, vs one that had a draw engine in the CZ.

Once upon a time it might have been borderline playable in Karn, Silver Golem, though ofc these days there are a ton of better options even in mono-brown.

It's a massive step up from Atris, Oracle of Half-Truths, I'll tell you what.

Honestly, is he though? Atris lets you be the chooser (generally the preferrable role) and as an etb (1) it's reliably going to happen at least once even vs removal and (2) you can synergize with it via blink and such, whereas attack triggers are much harder to get extra copies of. Though at the same time, a 2/4 for 3 isn't so burly in combat that it's a free draw engine - you still probably need to support it via evasion or protection.

Of course toymaker does cost 1 less and he does add an extra color, but Atris is extremely unimpressive as a commander imo so it being anywhere close is not a great sign.

That said, I also don't think it's terrible. Adding 2 damage to those spells is only irrelevant if your game plan is to win by some means other than bringing everyone to 0 life without an infinite combo.

Functionally irrelevant.

I'm sure it will matter sometimes but it's very minor text, and what value exists is almost entirely around his own ability, not including other pile/choice cards. If he said "when he attacks, yadda yadda and each opponent loses 2 life" then it would just be an okay value commander, rather than a very halfhearted attempt to make a new archetype happen.

[Serenade]

Generic common spoilers on day one? I, for one, am excited to put Topiary Panther in my Phylath, World Sculptor plant deck.

(Probably the only one)

[Sporegorger_Dragon]

Just a bit off-topic, but my mind has been reeling for the past 6 hours or so because I thought the set's name was Murders At Markov Manor and I was like "man, I understand utilizing the omenpaths but this a bit too far, we've got two paruns from Ravnica in the first batch and nobody from Innistrad. I understand Rakdos wandering off but Aurelia sticking her nose into Innistrad is really odd; does she think she have jurisdiction over Innistrad?"

Then just 10 minutes ago I realized that it said Karlov Manor.

[Mookie]

Just a bit off-topic, but my mind has been reeling for the past 6 hours or so because I thought the set's name was Murders At Markov Manor and I was like "man, I understand utilizing the omenpaths but this a bit too far, we've got two paruns from Ravnica in the first batch and nobody from Innistrad. I understand Rakdos wandering off but Aurelia sticking her nose into Innistrad is really odd; does she think she have jurisdiction over Innistrad?"

Then just 10 minutes ago I realized that it said Karlov Manor.

Meanwhile, I've been spending the last six hours wondering 'where is Teysa Karlov?' and 'who is this Alquist Proft, Master Sleuth guy?'

[NZB2323]

I mean, how many cards that aren't shock lands have any demand?

Assassin's Trophy
Divine Visitation
Guardian Project
Priest of Forgotten Gods
The Finale cards, specially Finale of Devastation
T3feri
Karn, the Great Creator (pls ban wotc)
Narset's Reversal
Hellkite Tyrant
Crypt Ghast
Blind Obedience
Protean Hulk

I mean, we've had a lot of ravnica sets

• Birds of paradise
• Deathrite Shaman
• Cyclonic Rift
• Ruric Thar, the unbowed
• Aurelia, the warleader
• Dark Confidant
• Golgari Charm
• Boros charm
• Rakdos charm
• Izzet charm
• Mission briefing
• Supreme verdict
• Abrupt Decay
• Despark
• Bolas's Citadel
• Vivien, champion of the wilds
• Liliana, dreadhorde general
• Jace, wielder of mysteries
• Narset, parter of veils
• Life from the loam
• Grand Arbiter Augustin IV
• Dovescape
• Counterflux
• Boros Reckoner
• Notion Thief
• God-Eternal Oketra
• God-Eternal Rhonas

And I'm excited about Demand Answers. I'm a big fan of Thrill of Possibility, especially in decks like Ghen, Arcanum Weaver and Neheb, the Worthy that want to be discarding cards. Even in decks that don't, it's 2 mana instant speed card advantage in red, and most decks have ways of using their graveyards.

[EonAon]

Wojek Investigator seems fairly powerful since yeah its somewhat conditional draw but its draw you can time to always get the best of.

[gsgfdf]

Just a bit off-topic, but my mind has been reeling for the past 6 hours or so because I thought the set's name was Murders At Markov Manor and I was like "man, I understand utilizing the omenpaths but this a bit too far, we've got two paruns from Ravnica in the first batch and nobody from Innistrad. I understand Rakdos wandering off but Aurelia sticking her nose into Innistrad is really odd; does she think she have jurisdiction over Innistrad?"

Then just 10 minutes ago I realized that it said Karlov Manor.

Seriously, I was wondering how on earth did Aurelia end up in Innistrad?

[Dragonlover]

Whereas I knew it was on Ravnica, but have been calling it Markov Manor because it rolls off the tongue so much better.

Dragonlover

[RxPhantom]

Aurelia, the Law Above is going right into General Ferrous Rokiric. I'm still on the fence with this dossier art treatment, though. On one hand, I'm trying to get as many unique frames into this deck as possible, but on the other...I just don't know if I like it.

[5colorsrainbow]

Pretty hyped, I wanted a WUG clue commander deck and that will be one of the pre-cons.

[Cyberium]

I'm not saying the card is good.

It's a massive step up from Atris, Oracle of Half-Truths, I'll tell you what.

In terms of getting cards, Toymaker requires an attack, Atris cane be blinked repeatedly.

[RxPhantom]

Looking at the flavor text for Demand Answers, I think the attempt on Aurelia's life was a false flag* operation conducted by the Boros Legion so they can justify moving against the Rakdos Cult.

*I know this terminology is a dog whistle of sorts, and wasn't my intention.

[kirkusjones]

Looking at the flavor text for Demand Answers, I think the attempt on Aurelia's life was a false flag* operation conducted by the Boros Legion so they can justify moving against the Rakdos Cult.

*I know this terminology is a dog whistle of sorts, and wasn't my intention.

Sounds like a win-win for the Golgari.

[duducrash]

Looking at the flavor text for Demand Answers, I think the attempt on Aurelia's life was a false flag* operation conducted by the Boros Legion so they can justify moving against the Rakdos Cult.

Hmm, they are cops afterall, does seem in character

[5colorsrainbow]

Looking at the flavor text for Demand Answers, I think the attempt on Aurelia's life was a false flag* operation conducted by the Boros Legion so they can justify moving against the Rakdos Cult.

*I know this terminology is a dog whistle of sorts, and wasn't my intention.

Sounds like a win-win for the Golgari.

The Golgari are basically non-existent atm, Vraska purposely compleated most of the guild by having Realmbreaker open up in the Undercity as the first strike of the Ravnican Invasion.

[NZB2323]

Looking at the flavor text for Demand Answers, I think the attempt on Aurelia's life was a false flag* operation conducted by the Boros Legion so they can justify moving against the Rakdos Cult.

*I know this terminology is a dog whistle of sorts, and wasn't my intention.

Or it's a false flag by the Dimir, which could be easy to pull off with shapeshifters.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

The fourteenth doctor allows the first 5c partner commanders. But it's doctor-tribal (and also really bad) so I doubt too many people will care.

I'm sorry but technically this is not true. The first 5c partners are Othelm, Sigardian Outcast/Cecily, Haunted Mage. Also very bad and therefore pretty rare, but you gotta give Stranger Things that dubious honor.

[Toshi]

The first 5c partners are Othelm, Sigardian Outcast/Cecily, Haunted Mage. Also very bad

Cries in having that sleeved up and ready to go