Garth one-eye, maybe? [brainstorming]

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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 4 months ago

I'm always reticent to take on a 5c commander, but I do kinda like Garth One-Eye and, more importantly, he's not getting hugely overplayed on EDHrec compared to other commanders (chatterfang...*rolls eyes*). In fact he's all the way back in 7th place, which I wouldn't have expected considering the hype around him. He makes black lotuses, and he's just barely ahead of Zabaz, for crying out loud, and all the modular creatures suck except for ones named "arcbound ravager".

Anyway, the thing I like about Garth, having not played him, is that he kinda does everything. He can kill any artifact, enchantment, or nonblack creature. He draws and recurs cards. He makes beatsticks. He even ramps. What a fella.

So with all that in the CZ, what should the actual DECK do?

I don't think there's a lot of obvious synergies with the cards he casts - probably some gross time warp obnoxiousness could be done with regrowth, but that's not a direction I'm interested in going. For the most part I think the cards speak for themselves. It's more about filling in the gaps, and making sure Garth is a reliable engine for the things he can do.

-Garth protection. None of his spells save him from a simple Terminate, so anything to grant shroud/hexproof/indestructible, or anything to recur him, seems crucial to prevent him getting priced out. If we want to rely on him for the functions he provides, we have to provide that reliability.

-Garth enhancement. In a similar vein, being able to cast more than one spell a turn is also useful in ensuring Garth value flows. Bit of a drag if we sit on braingeyser value only to be forced to use a terror to block a combo and waste the other mana. So untaps are great, haste is great, and ways to blink him are great to reset his spells. Could also do spell copying, spell triggers, or dragon synergies, though I'm not sure it's worth it. Seems a bit win-more.

-Counterspells. This fits into protection as well, and lets us interact with things on the stack, plus an emergency answer when Garth is unavailable. Especially high utility with Garth doing his Nin, the Pain Artist impression to draw us tons of cards.

-Ramp. The earlier Garth comes down, the sooner we get value. Obviously he can provide some degree of future ramp past that point with lotuses, but he needs to be on the field first. Stuff like Kodama's Reach is obviously great in that respect to ramp to 5 cleanly.

-Wipes. Garth can kill single target stuff, but big boards are not his forte. Stuff like Duneblast seems especially effective, but even cards like Divine Reckoning could be great when he can pick off the remaining creatures if they're a problem.

-Well, except black creatures. We probably want some answers for black creatures just in case, and for nonblack creatures when Garth is offline.

Those are the main sorts of cards that come to mind for me. This seems like a fairly straightforward control deck that replaces draw and most of its targeted removal with ramp/protection/enhancement effects for Garth. Personally the part that seems like the most fun to me is the sweet EOT shivan dragons. I kinda want to get my hands on some of them to use as tokens - too bad the alpha ones are outrageously expensive.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

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pokken
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Post by pokken » 4 months ago

Since he has Regrowth on himself I'd be inclined to consider like a haste reanimator/token thing. Stuff like Feldon of the Third Path turning into a 5 mana disenchant/regrowth feels pretty good, and Corpse Dance effects are pretty solid.

I also kinda like Twinflame'ing him since it puts him in the bin and you can in theory use him first, then use that to pay for the twinflame netting a mana and then use the token to make more of whatever.

I'm sure there's a pretty good list of those "reanimate or copy with haste" effects.

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Post by DirkGently » 4 months ago

Not sure if it's what you meant, but it'd be pretty hilarious to use Feldon to make a copy of him and then regrowth the original with the copy. Could even Corpse Dance, activate the ability to make regrowth, sac him, and then target him with the regrowth when the ability resolves since you don't declare a target until you cast the spell.

Kinda janky but it's funny.

In general I want to plan around keeping him on board and actually working through his spells (probably will focus on single-shot blinking rather than repeatable stuff, otherwise it seems too easy to go off with regrowth and/or lotus), not getting burst value. Maybe he's too strong to stick around without ending the game, but I want to hope otherwise. The removal options and dragon seem pretty tame, it's the lotus, regrowth, and braingeyser that might be problematic I think.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

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pokken
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Post by pokken » 4 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
4 months ago
Not sure if it's what you meant, but it'd be pretty hilarious to use Feldon to make a copy of him and then regrowth the original with the copy. Could even Corpse Dance, activate the ability to make regrowth, sac him, and then target him with the regrowth when the ability resolves since you don't declare a target until you cast the spell.

Kinda janky but it's funny.

In general I want to plan around keeping him on board and actually working through his spells (probably will focus on single-shot blinking rather than repeatable stuff, otherwise it seems too easy to go off with regrowth and/or lotus), not getting burst value. Maybe he's too strong to stick around without ending the game, but I want to hope otherwise. The removal options and dragon seem pretty tame, it's the lotus, regrowth, and braingeyser that might be problematic I think.
Yeah that's mostly what I am thinking of..just playing him out of the graveyard repeatedly and/or making copies of the tokens he leaves etc. Like if you make a copy with Feldon of the Third Path and then Cackling Counterpart it, it sticks around? Dumb chains of interactions with temporary-permanent copies from various effects, having multiples of them etb'ing and dying all the time :P Could even use Helm of the Host to make additional copies that aren't legendary so you can copy them too, or put a Spark Double in the bin.

And any excuse to put Mimic Vat int he deck thinking it'd be good and then cut it later :P

Honestly I think Disenchant and Terror are the most problematic things he can do in terms of how it impacts the game, which is weird, but it's gonna be pretty oppressive easily if you can remove almost anything on command. But Regrowth is definitely rough too.

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Post by DirkGently » 4 months ago

So having thought about it a bit more, I think including almost any amount of blink/copy/recur etc on Garth is going to be very dangerous in a control deck. Because every time you reset him, you've got access to regrowth again, and in a control deck that regrowth could hit any number of board wipes, which are almost certainly necessary to run. So then Garth becomes a repeatable cyc rift on a stick, and that's probably not going to be very fun to play against.

And it gets even trickier because even if you focus on single-shot blink effects, his braingeyser can virtually guarantee you hit more of them. Every time you use it, you'll be drawing more cards. For that matter you can just draw into those same board wipes. With corpse dance you could repeatedly recur him, use regrowth for hour of revelation, then cast it to sent him back to the yard - 10 mana to wipe the board with buyback. All pretty gross play patterns that I'd want to avoid.

So I can see a few ways forward.

One option is to completely avoid anything that resets Garth except him dying a natural death. This gets a little tricky with board wipes since anything symmetrical "resets" him since I can put him back in the CZ, but he does cost 2 more ofc. That's probably not a big deal in itself. Any kind of recursion (even say Volrath's Stronghold) could start to look a lot loopier, though. Especially with a bunch of ramp and a haste enabler.

Of course, I could also eschew all symmetrical wipes and only use Cyc rift type stuff, which would make it harder to reset him. But then any single-target kill spell that doesn't say "opponent controlled" could reset him too.

The second option would be to include precisely one single-shot blink effect, something like Cloudshift. He can recur it with his regrowth ability to continuously reset himself, but that effectively trades off allowing the regrowth ability to hit anything else, at least until he dies a natural death. I could run tutors to hit cloudshift to ensure that I find it. Still runs into problems with using my own kill spells on him, but so long as he has no way to avoid the tax I guess it's probably not so bad. Repeated loops seem less worrisome if they keep getting crappier over time.

Third option would be to play a more on-board deck that doesn't run many, or any, wipes, to reduce the power of the regrowth. If I'm getting back some random wincon then eventually I'd either win, or someone would find a way to stop me, instead of ending up in some permanent board wipe situation. Works fine in theory but not really my style.

I think the ideal play pattern that I'd like the deck to encourage would be *roughly* that I want to use all 6 abilities before resetting him, so the harder it is to reset him the closer I'll get to that. On that score, maybe it's best to just not include any resetting whatsoever? Hard to say for sure. Going through all 6 abilities could take a while, even with an untapper.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

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Post by DirkGently » 3 months ago

Ok so here's my semi-exhaustive list of ideas for resetting Garth:

(most options could be repeatable or single-use)

Complete cycle:

blink (Eerie Interlude)
flicker (Cloudshift)
bounce (Unsummon)
bounce to topdeck (Submerge)
global bounce (Evacuation)

Leave:

destroy/sac (Terminate)
exile (Path to Exile)
chump block
chump attack
global destroy (Wrath of God)
global exile (Final Judgment)

Return:

grave to hand (Raise Dead)
grave to play (Reanimate)
grave to topdeck (Volrath's Stronghold)
short-term grave to play (Faith's Reward)
short-term grave to hand (Verdant Rebirth)
recast from CZ

As far as how I feel about them:

blink/flicker are both very dangerous in a repeatable way, less dangerous in a single-use way since the require a "turn off" to be recurred. On the other hand, with enough of them in the deck you can just keep finding more with braingeyser. So at a minimum, caution seems advisable. It's nice that they double as protection.

Bounce is cute since it requires a recast, plus it doubles as removal or weak protection. I kinda like it.

Bounce to topdeck is kinda the same except better offensively than as a reset option. There's not many cards that do this anyway though.

Global bounce seems really annoying since you can just keep doing it once you have enough mana. Probably ill-advised. Though at least you're kind forced to stop doing it if you want to progress your board state?

Single-target destroy/exile is obviously nice to have for reactivity and by default doubles as a last-ditch option to reset. Could run only enemy-targeting removal, but that seems a bit extreme as this is not very efficient imo.

Sac is more likely to be repeatable and does leave open the door for some annoying loops. At least it increments his cost, provided there isn't recursion.

Chump attacking/blocking is obviously the last last last ditch option to reset. Can't really get rid of it if I wanted to.

Global destroy and exile could get pretty annoying with recursion, even with the tax. As such, it might be better to go with partial wipes like Slash the Ranks that will prevent such a loop.

Single-shot grave to hand recursion seems relatively safe. Basically just bounce with extra steps. But, it doesn't double as anything else.

Reanimation is kinda the same deal, just with a 5 mana discount.

Same for topdeck, though really the only one worth talking about is VS probably. Repeatability does have the potential to be gross, though with partial/asymmetric sweepers that is significantly reduced since you'd need another way to bin him.

Short-term grave to play/hand is also just bounce with extra steps, though some of them do double as ramp with fetchlands which is spiffy.

Recast from CZ - well obviously.

Right now I'm leaning towards allowing bounce and maybe short-term reanimation, while avoiding wipes that would (always) kill Garth. We'll see if there are enough to make that a good option, though.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 3 months ago

I rushed through building a deck so I could try to get an idea of the commander. I only went through about 1/2 of my cards, and pretty quickly at that. 5c is just so time consuming.

I might put up the list or I might try to refine it a bit first. It's nothing too fancy, a simple land-heavy control shell, something like 50 land, 8 wipes, 10 ramp, 20 counters, 12 removal. The main innovation I tried to use was avoiding wipes that would kill Garth, so it wouldn't be too easy to reset him.

Won 3/4 games over the evening iirc. I did find that every spell had its purpose, though lotus was definitely the least useful. Braingeyser was by far the most impactful. Usually the game would involve me getting Garth out, playing control for a turn or two, either using removal or getting a dragon into play, then a moderate-size braingeyser of 4-7 which led to more ramp and control cards. I'd use Garth for a few more turns, then eventually I'd reset him with a chump block or targeting him myself, and then get a huge braingeyser on the order of 10-20. After that it was pretty trivial to win with dragons.

I did enjoy the dynamic when my opponent realized he'd made a huge mistake by attacking me so I could chump and reset Garth, and then later when he decided to stop attacking me to prevent reset, but the amount of removal did make it kinda irrelevant tbh. Once I got a decent braingeyser off I usually had plenty of removal for him, it just felt kinda stupid so chumpblocking was preferable. I do like how slow it is to reset him without haste or anything - it feels like a real cost, at least. I think any blink could get out of hand pretty quickly since it largely circumvents summoning sickness.

Overall it didn't feel TOO busted, thanks to how hard I nerfed it. I did win a lot, but most of my opponents had pretty weak decks so I don't think that's necessarily indicative of a problem. In terms of the build, I think I need to go harder on ramp, T5 Garth is excruciating and getting mana stuck on the way to 5 is even worse. Braingeyser makes ramp valuable even post-Garth so I don't think it's ever really dead. I'll probably shift a few lands and a few counters into ramp, and try to improve the overall quality by digging through the rest of my cards, then call it good.

Random sidebar for the zero people who care: annoyingly didn't get to play with the physical card because my LGS has some pretty weak customer service. They give out tickets for prizes that can be redeemed for store credit, which I find hard to use since they can't be used for events and I don't crack sealed product except to draft. I bought most of my Golos deck with it but now I'm kinda running out of ideas and I keep racking them up. Anyway, I figured I'd splurge on the retro-frame Garth, but I didn't have quite enough store credit, but I've got tons of these tickets lying around and don't really want to spend real money to cover the difference when I've got all these tickets to burn. So I called them and asked "hey, can you send the card to the store, and then I'll just pay for it with tickets when I pick it up?" Nope. "These tickets have serial numbers on them, can I just tell you some serial numbers so you can add them to my account?" Nope. "What's the point of the numbers then?" Shrug. "You know I've got a ton of these, can you just stick the money on my account and I'll give you the tickets tomorrow when I come for commander?" Nope. So I had the choice between driving 45 minutes to cash in 2 tickets, paying real money, or playing with a proxy - I went with the latter option and cashed in the tickets at the event.

Amusingly I just bought him, and they've since lowered the price a couple bucks, so I guess the joke's on them, they could have gotten me to pay a bit more.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

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Post by Outcryqq » 3 months ago

I made a Garth list, it's a bit different from yours, but still pretty low-powered: a few clones (Sakashima of a Thousand Faces, Spark Double, Helm of the Host), a few haste enablers (Greaves/boots, Rhythm of the Wild, Fires of Yavimaya), lots of ramp and removal, and a few slots to satisfy my old school nostalgia. My pod, with whom I brainstorm decks, thinks its too focused on Garth, but I think that helps keep it pretty medium-powered. Of course, I haven't played it yet, but I think without a source of infinite mana, that even a few hasty Garths won't be too overpowered.

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Post by DirkGently » 3 months ago

Garth is relatively slow and takes some hoops to jump so I don't think he's overpowered exactly, but I worry that he'll create unfun situations like recurring cyc rift over and over. Helm of the host makes that pretty easy. Ofc that's not a problem if you don't play cards which are frustrating when repeatedly recurred, or if the people you play don't mind.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

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