Tergrid...but not what you're thinking - the contrarian build (USDA prime bastardry) (extremely not budget)

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

Tergrid, God of Fright is one of those cards that, when it got spoiled, my first thought was:

"Ooh, that seems cool. I want to build it."

And then my second thought was:

"Balls...everyone is going to want to build this. And they're all going to be exactly the same."

And so it was. She's practically tied on EDHrec as the most played commander in Kaldheim, and people are playing her with all the best discard and sac effects to exploit her ability. Who can blame them? The build pretty much spells itself out. Play Tergrid, play discard and sac, get a bunch of free stuff, win game.

But I've never been one to go with what's easy and popular.

So instead I decided to focus not on the obviously build-aroundable front side, but the seemingly much weaker back side, tergrid's lantern. On the surface it looks lot less powerful, but it's got some major advantages that Tergrid doesn't have.

The first and most obvious is that it's an artifact, while Tergrid is a creature. Creatures are not only easier to remove, but they also get in the way of one of black's bigger strengths - board wipes, and general creature hate.

In addition, Tergrid does almost nothing on her own - which not only means she requires support, but it also means she's vulnerable to being removed at inopportune times. By contrast, the lantern can be used immediately, and except for Krosan Grip, can't really be completely shut down. If someone tries to mess with you, they're going to feel some pain.

Another of black's major strengths is its ability to produce absurd amounts of mana with Cabal Coffers and the like, especially in mono-black where colorless mana is a minor drawback, which plays heavily into the lantern's goals, but not as easily into Tergrid herself.

So starting from those strengths, I started working on the deck, and realized that lantern provides mono-black something it hasn't really had much access to until now - a commander that really, truly does not give a crap about battlefield hospitability, and to a lesser extent (thanks to having a reliable, powerful mana sink) the ability to cast spells at all. Which means we get to unleash the absolutely disgusting suite of mono-black stax cards that are rarely played because most people actually want to keep their squishy commander creature alive. Without that hangup, we've got access to cards like Spreading Plague, Tainted Aether, The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Ensnaring Bridge, Death Match, and the like. While our opponents are struggling to keep a single creature on the board let alone attack, we can keep merrily ramping up our mana, and unleashing enormous chains of lantern activations at whoever seems most inclined to break out of the miserable prison we've established for the game. Throw in black's suite of top-tier tutors, and we're in business. And business is EVIL.
Decklist
Approximate Total Cost:

Two pretty obvious notes:

1) This deck ain't cheap, probably the most expensive mono-colored deck I've ever built. I'm kind of psyched that I found a place to play so many of my cool old cards, even if some of them (hi mirror universe) probably aren't quiiiite worth it. But unless you've got them lying around, I probably wouldn't bother.
2) This deck probably won't make you a lot of friends. Maybe double check before slamming this bad boy down.
Last edited by DirkGently 8 months ago, edited 5 times in total.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
folding_music
trelasarra main
Posts: 1412
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: they / them

Post by folding_music » 8 months ago

this is beautiful :3 Seems like one of the few places Liliana of the Veil would fit in multiplayer, right?

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

folding_music wrote:
8 months ago
this is beautiful :3 Seems like one of the few places Liliana of the Veil would fit in multiplayer, right?
Potentially, but I had a few reasons to ultimately pass on her:

1) We don't have great tools to counteract the discard (except running out of cards and not caring about it anymore).

2) She doesn't fit very nicely into our curve (generally trying to play lantern T2-3 after ramp pieces).

3) I generally tried to avoid other discard/sac effects except the lantern itself lest I accidentally make a deck where Tergrid ended up being better choice to cast on accident :shhh:
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
pokken
Posts: 4035
Joined: 2 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: he / him

Post by pokken » 8 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
8 months ago
So starting from those strengths, I started working on the deck, and realized that lantern provides mono-black something it hasn't really had much access to until now - a commander that really, truly does not give a crap about battlefield hospitability, and to a lesser extent (thanks to having a reliable, powerful mana sink) the ability to cast spells at all.
This is seriously one of my favorite things about these flip commanders. Jorn too. Being able to play on a completely different axis is *interesting*. I still wonder whether they ought to be pushing the envelope like that with playable planeswalkers and enchantments like Heliod, God of the Sun and co that are often not creatures and so resilient they might as well last forever. But I love it from a design space.

A few small things I'll say:

1. I have found cards like Thaumatic Compass // Spires of Orazca to overperform in these decks. We really like the back half, we really don't mind spending 5 mana to find a swamp because we're able to play fairly reactively and we always want to hit our lands. And they have a huge upside because of Coffers. Similarly, I have found Thawing Glaciers to be usually correct, allowing you to keep a two land hand and just slow play into a sweeper.

This might even be a Crucible of Worlds deck.

2. I think you may want access to an artifact based sweeper. Oblivion Stone would be my pick I think. There's just a lot to be said for being able to blow up the world. Mono black struggles so badly with some things.

3. Bolas's Citadel combos disgustingly with Ensnaring Bridge. I think I'd probably find room for it.


User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

pokken wrote:
8 months ago
1. I have found cards like Thaumatic Compass // Spires of Orazca to overperform in these decks. We really like the back half, we really don't mind spending 5 mana to find a swamp because we're able to play fairly reactively and we always want to hit our lands. And they have a huge upside because of Coffers. Similarly, I have found Thawing Glaciers to be usually correct, allowing you to keep a two land hand and just slow play into a sweeper.
compass was among my last-cut cards (also maze of ith and mystifying maze)...ultimately I'm not sure how useful a maze effect is, given how much control we're trying to exert over the board. Might give us a little more breathing room so we can be more judicious with removal, or it might just be unnecessary. I might see if I can find a spot but I'm kinda hoping it'll be unnecessary.
This might even be a Crucible of Worlds deck.
Potentially, but I just built Cosima as a crucible deck :P
2. I think you may want access to an artifact based sweeper. Oblivion Stone would be my pick I think. There's just a lot to be said for being able to blow up the world. Mono black struggles so badly with some things.
Possibly, though I do think we commit heavily enough to artifacts and enchantments that it might be a bit dicey. I suspect a lot of games where I "save" myself by playing o-stone, I then lose anyway because I've disabled all my stax nastiness. So it might be better to run Karn 1.0 or Ugin 2.0 to deal with permanents on a single-target basis.

My plan for dealing with any particularly problematic permanents right now is to start targeting them with lantern, and tell them it'll stop if they sacrifice the permanent :P
3. Bolas's Citadel combos disgustingly with Ensnaring Bridge. I think I'd probably find room for it.
Hmm, maybe. Citadel is one of those cards I generally avoid on principle, but that's probably stupid when I'm running Nether Void.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
pokken
Posts: 4035
Joined: 2 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: he / him

Post by pokken » 8 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
8 months ago
Possibly, though I do think we commit heavily enough to artifacts and enchantments that it might be a bit dicey. I suspect a lot of games where I "save" myself by playing o-stone, I then lose anyway because I've disabled all my stax nastiness. So it might be better to run Karn 1.0 or Ugin 2.0 to deal with permanents on a single-target basis.

My plan for dealing with any particularly problematic permanents right now is to start targeting them with lantern, and tell them it'll stop if they sacrifice the permanent
Yea, that might be the case, I think you'd need to be pretty mindful of your sequencing if you thought you were going to have to find and pop an o-stone. Karn/Ugin or even Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger might wind up being the better plays anywho, although I kinda like having a reset-everything available.

Which reminds me, I think a Torpor Orb is likely to overperform in this deck as well as far as hate pieces go.

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

pokken wrote:
8 months ago
Which reminds me, I think a Torpor Orb is likely to overperform in this deck as well as far as hate pieces go.
Orb has a reaaallly bad interaction with Spreading Plague, Tainted Aether, and Death Match though =/
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
pokken
Posts: 4035
Joined: 2 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: he / him

Post by pokken » 8 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
8 months ago
Orb has a reaaallly bad interaction with Spreading Plague, Tainted Aether, and Death Match though =/
Eh, I feel like you probably would rather have access to orb than not though, given the tutor count and how bad you get blown out forever by Bane of Progress or Aura Shards or whatever.

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

pokken wrote:
8 months ago
Eh, I feel like you probably would rather have access to orb than not though, given the tutor count and how bad you get blown out forever by Bane of Progress or Aura Shards or whatever.
Orb isn't really a great answer to bane of progress, though. Am I going to play orb (let alone tutor and play it) for fear that they have bane, nerfing some of my most brutal stax pieces in the process, without even knowing if anyone is playing bane? Plus if they can blow up orb, then the problem is right back where we started.

I'd certainly rather have orb vs aura shards than not, but I think the much simpler answer is just to play karn or ugin to get rid of uniquely problematic permanents like that.

I might put him in instead of death match actually, I forgot that the trigger was optional =/
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
pokken
Posts: 4035
Joined: 2 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: he / him

Post by pokken » 8 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
8 months ago
pokken wrote:
8 months ago
Eh, I feel like you probably would rather have access to orb than not though, given the tutor count and how bad you get blown out forever by Bane of Progress or Aura Shards or whatever.
Orb isn't really a great answer to bane of progress, though. Am I going to play orb (let alone tutor and play it) for fear that they have bane, nerfing some of my most brutal stax pieces in the process, without even knowing if anyone is playing bane?

I'd certainly rather have orb vs aura shards than not, but I think the much simpler answer is just to play karn or ugin to get rid of uniquely problematic permanents like that.

I might put him in instead of death match actually, I forgot that the trigger was optional =/
I think Torpor Orb is better than all three of those combined and you'd be better off straight up cutting all three and playing better stax pieces if you are worried about the interaction; the stuff that beats you is pretty much all stuff like bane, aura shards, even blinking a Reclamation Sage is somewhat problematic for you. But having access to both is reasonable (though I think Death Match is pretty suspect--people will collaborate since it's a may trigger).

If you think about things that are going to up your odds of winning games against creature heavy decks, Torpor Orb is basically the best thing you can be doing in Commander with Cursed Totem second (note: In CEDH, it's the reverse, totem first torpor orb second).

I do think the idea of running Karn Liberated is a great idea. It's a pretty legit wincondition on its own given how much board control you have.

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

pokken wrote:
8 months ago
I think Torpor Orb is better than all three of those combined and you'd be better off straight up cutting all three and playing better stax pieces if you are worried about the interaction; the stuff that beats you is pretty much all stuff like bane, aura shards, even blinking a Reclamation Sage is somewhat problematic for you. But having access to both is reasonable (though I think Death Match is pretty suspect--people will collaborate since it's a may trigger).

If you think about things that are going to up your odds of winning games against creature heavy decks, Torpor Orb is basically the best thing you can be doing in Commander with Cursed Totem second (note: In CEDH, it's the reverse, totem first torpor orb second).

I do think the idea of running Karn Liberated is a great idea. It's a pretty legit wincondition on its own given how much board control you have.
Seems like a meta call to me. Personally I don't like running more niche answers (of course most decks will have some cards effected by torpor orb, but not necessarily enough to be a major problem). Most etb effects I don't necessarily care about that much anyway. I see bane and aura shards pretty rarely, and 1 rec sage isn't going to undo the whole deck. Besides which, if we have big mana available, we can pressure people to leave us alone or we'll grind them into the dirt with lantern chains. I'd maybe run it if it didn't hurt my other cards, but I see spreading plague as a frequent tutor target for this deck and probably the single most important stax piece for most games.

I agree that death match isn't great and is probably cuttable for karn (still plays well from behind, but useless while ahead which is probably where we'll be playing from a lot of the time). I think you're way underratting Spreading Plague though. Especially in commander, where most decks are multicolor, it often means only one commander can exist on the field at the same time, if that, and usually just a couple creatures total at maximum. Except for colorless creatures, it means no one can have their commander and another creature on board at the same time. It pretty much makes any creature that doesn't get its money's worth on etb almost entirely useless. It's a filthy, filthy card.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
TheGildedGoose
HONK HONK
Posts: 267
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: it /its
Contact:

Post by TheGildedGoose » 8 months ago

I know you're intentionally avoiding cards that also strongly synergize with Tergrid, but I first saw her card spoiled in a Legacy Pox group on Facebook, and Lantern wants to reduce life totals and disrupt board. You might as well play the three good Poxes. You run a ton of rocks and artifact/enchantment stax pieces that you break parity in a big way, and at any rate since this deck's MO is taking a giant dump on the game you might as well truly embrace your inner archvillain and learn to count in fours.

I think you should run Torpor Orb in addition to Tainted Aether and Spreading Plague, even if they clash. The only reason I don't play Orb is because it interferes with Gray Merchant of Asphodel, which I often use to reset my life total. Even above and beyond hosing things like Aura Shards or Bane of Progress you catch stuff like Craterhoof Behemoth, Thassa's Oracle, and Guardian Project. It's good. Likewise, you should run Cursed Totem just in case.

This is absolutely the deck for Liliana of the Veil and multiple other planeswalkers. It's even more hostile to creatures than my own list, so you should be running all the good ones, from Karn, the Great Creator to Liliana, Waker of the Dead. They put in work in slow, stax-y lists.

If you're so scared of Aura Shards why not play Feed the Swarm?

The best way to play this deck is judicially. Obviously, don't plop out all of your stax elements just to get blown out by a sweeper. You'll want to play 2-3 board control elements, 1-2 resource denial elements, and then just kind of let things stew. The longer the game goes on, the more value you accrue, and lower life totals get for you to burn people out.

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

TheGildedGoose wrote:
8 months ago
I know you're intentionally avoiding cards that also strongly synergize with Tergrid, but I first saw her card spoiled in a Legacy Pox group on Facebook, and Lantern wants to reduce life totals and disrupt board. You might as well play the three good Poxes. You run a ton of rocks and artifact/enchantment stax pieces that you break parity in a big way, and at any rate since this deck's MO is taking a giant dump on the game you might as well truly embrace your inner archvillain and learn to count in fours.
Among other reasons, Pox hurts my own lands, and especially with coffers and company I want as many lands as possible. I don't think it's a good synergy.
I think you should run Torpor Orb in addition to Tainted Aether and Spreading Plague, even if they clash. The only reason I don't play Orb is because it interferes with Gray Merchant of Asphodel, which I often use to reset my life total. Even above and beyond hosing things like Aura Shards or Bane of Progress you catch stuff like Craterhoof Behemoth, Thassa's Oracle, and Guardian Project. It's good. Likewise, you should run Cursed Totem just in case.
I'm not running torpor orb. Cursed totem is fine I guess but I don't think I'll start it, it seems too narrow to me, especially since I think most creatures are going to die pretty quickly. If I wish I had it later I'll think about it.
This is absolutely the deck for Liliana of the Veil and multiple other planeswalkers. It's even more hostile to creatures than my own list, so you should be running all the good ones, from Karn, the Great Creator to Liliana, Waker of the Dead. They put in work in slow, stax-y lists.
I kinda want to see how the deck performs before I commit too heavily on planeswalkers. I agree that they could potentially be strong but I'm not sure how quickly and reliably we can lock down the board. That said I think at least Karn 1.0 will be added and maybe Ugin 2.0. Liliana WotD I don't actually have, annoyingly, but she seems plausible. I'll keep an eye out for one.
If you're so scared of Aura Shards why not play Feed the Swarm?
I'm not "so scared" of aura shards.

Karn and Ugin both seem like nice flexible answers for all manner of potential problems though, that happen to answer aura shards in addition to other things and also provide long-term value.
The best way to play this deck is judicially. Obviously, don't plop out all of your stax elements just to get blown out by a sweeper. You'll want to play 2-3 board control elements, 1-2 resource denial elements, and then just kind of let things stew. The longer the game goes on, the more value you accrue, and lower life totals get for you to burn people out.
Yeah that's kinda what I'm planning. I'm curious to see how people react when I play something like spreading plague (besides "During the pandemic? That's in poor taste dude").
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 8 months ago

Played 2 games with it tonight. Overall experience was...eh. First game I was starting to ramp up into something useful, and then abruptly died to an entwined T&N fetching DEN and peregrine drake...yawn. Second game also ended abruptly because one player (who had previously won off the T&N) ragequit after I cast Nether Void and Sphere of Resistance, and then the other guy (who actually was in a decent position) awkwardly scooped too...idk. I think I need to just not play it with that guy.

Overall, though, it never really got to a place where I felt comfortable spending my turn on the lantern. Getting control of the battlefield was difficult and my commander was almost no help in that regard. I suspect I should probably alter my tutor priority towards board control instead of mana ramp, if I play the deck again.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 7 months ago

Played it one last time tonight and finally won. Somehow I managed to not draw a single stax piece, but I got coffers, urborg, deserted temple, and Horizon Stone...so I just sat on my butt basically not affecting board state whatsoever but threatening to kill anyone who tried to hurt me...and eventually I won with 100+ mana. Very eventually.

This deck is honestly awful. It's got these brutal stax pieces that everyone hates, so it's totally inappropriate for casual, but then it's also completely incapable of presenting a threat that doesn't take a million turns to manifest. 4 mana per activation is a ton, especially when people have so many buffers to mitigate the life loss. Unless you happen to have the right stax piece, and it doesn't get removed, you're going to have very hard time interacting in any meaningful way with most decks on a time scale that isn't geological.

Congrats to Tegrid, who is only the second 1-star commander deck from the 120 or so decks I've built. For being evil, terrible, and stupid. You definitely earned it.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

Dunadain
Posts: 58
Joined: 1 year ago
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Dunadain » 6 months ago

I must know: who got the other one star? Lol

User avatar
DirkGently
My wins are unconditional
Posts: 2289
Joined: 2 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by DirkGently » 6 months ago

That was Melek, Izzet Paragon, who single-handedly gave me a strong aversion to UR spellslinger.

The problem with the archetype in general is that it sucks at advancing it's position so you're usually just spinning your gears until you win, which is usually some time-consuming tedious storm garbage. I didn't want to do storm, so I went control, which meant I had no way to end the game in a reasonable time frame. Lots of "take 3 turns....pass". While playing lands for turn and dreaming of 20-pt Comet Storm off the top.

I only build spellslinger if I can find a novel way to do it, which is very rare. So as a general rule I don't play it at all and I'm happier for it.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic

Return to “Decklists”