Unreleased and New Card Discussion

[Serenade]

Do we know which other elder dinos survived the invasion? I'm assuming Etali is donezo.

[Hermes_]

eh, I have ways to cheat it into play and equip it for free but I run Akiri, Line-Slinger/ Ardenn, Intrepid Archaeologist voltron so the annihilator 1 will be interesting to me and I already have ways to get past creatures via other equipment, so menace is eh for me.

Annihilator 1 is so minor. If you're cheating every part of the cost I think there are dozens of more impactful equipment.

speaking for myself and my own meta/deck, you may consider Annihilator 1 to be minor, but it's the most exciting part of the card for me. I'm at the point with the deck where it's a question of "What do i take out to try this card" instead of "how can this deck be better?"

[DirkGently]

Rogue's Passage is one of the better tech lands ever made, and for many decks, this is an upgrade.

As a connoisseur of utility lands, rogue's passage is some overplayed jank. Etbt coloured is generally worse than etbut colourless, but a shadow counter is better than 1 turn unblockable. But not a ton better imo. Usually if you're actually activating passage it's because you're killing someone. Activating it multiple turns in a row is really expensive. You should probably have something better to do.

@Hermes_ I'm not sure what your point is. You acknowledge the card is weak but you find it exciting anyway? Fair enough, though it doesn't refute my assessment.

[materpillar]

Welcome to... // Jurassic Park makes me just so happy. "Each dinosaur card you have in your graveyard has escape" is just one of the top 5 lines of text in magic.

[DirkGently]

Can someone explain what's included in these scene boxes?

[Hermes_]

Can someone explain what's included in these scene boxes?

from the IGN article

Each of the four Scene Boxes is themed around a legendary character from The Lord of the Rings: Gandalf, Galadriel, Aragon, or The Witch-King. They come with a brand new card featuring that character, plus five more new cards within their color identity that fit them both visually and mechanically. When placed in a two-by-three grid, the six cards make up a full art scene - the box even comes with cards that are just the art on their own and a stand to display them, as well as three LTR Set Boosters.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

Minas Morgul, Dark Fortress is okay I guess but it's kinda just weirdo Rogue's Passage.

Rogue's Passage is one of the better tech lands ever made, and for many decks, this is an upgrade.

Is it even an upgrade though? Let's look at them side-by-side:
RP
- 4 mana + tap gives anything unblockable for a turn. You don't even have to control the target, which can be politically useful.
-Does not ETBT
-Colorless mana

MM, DF
- 4 mana + tap gives anything shadow and creature type permanently*. You must control the target. EDIT: Clearly I cannot be bothered to RTFC today. Ignore me!
- ETBT
- Black Mana

Bonus!
The Black Gate
- 2 mana + Tap gives unblockable against the highest lifetotal for a turn.
- has an option to avoid ETBT
- Black mana

I still say Rogues Passage is probably the best and cleanest of them, but in black aggro decks I think the gate is probably the best for keeping your curve in check and keeping damage up. I think you need to be specifically doing something with Shadow in order for MMDF to be superior to either of the other ones though. Permanently losing the ability to block most creatures is a big downside IMO and that plus functionally 5 mana is kinda stiff.

What do you think?

EDIT: SO MMDF can target opposing creatures, thus robbing THEM of their ability to block which is a neat trick RP cannot do. So that's a wrinkle in my comparison, but generally I stand by my reasoning.

[DirkGently]

@Hermes_ is that it though? Surely at that price point there has to be more than 6 cards?

[5colorsrainbow]

Do we know which other elder dinos survived the invasion? I'm assuming Etali is donezo.

When last saw them the remaining the five elder dinos where themselves and where a factor in Ixalan being able to hold off the phyrexians.

[Dunadain]

Never thought I'd have to defend Rogue's Passage of all things. This card consistently wins games for me.

I'm not even sure what there is to defend, it's a land that helps Voltron decks push over the finish line/get there sword triggers

Edit: The fact that you only have to activate Minas Morgul, Dark Fortress once is nice, but the big advantage it has over Rogue's Passage is that you can activate it in the end step of another players turn. You can pass the turn, leaving up mana for protection/interaction, and if you don't need it, slap shadow on your commander. It depends on the deck, but honestly I think it's an upgrade to Rogue's Passage in Ebondeath, Dracolich which is the only Voltron deck that matters anyways.

Kind of moot point when I'll be running both though.

[Hermes_]

@Hermes_ is that it though? Surely at that price point there has to be more than 6 cards?

the cards that make the scene plus three LTR Set Boosters.

[DirkGently]

I think I figured out the build for Galadriel, Light of Yalinor - it's not Chulane 2.0, it's actually Raise the Alarm tribal. Every turn dig for another card, make tokens, and keep making your board taller, while keeping up answers since all your plays are instants? Seems pretty strong.

Never thought I'd have to defend Rogue's Passage of all things. This card consistently wins games for me.

I'm not even sure what there is to defend, it's a land that helps Voltron decks push over the finish line/get there sword triggers

Edit: The fact that you only have to activate Minas Morgul, Dark Fortress once is nice, but the big advantage it has over Rogue's Passage is that you can activate it in the end step of another players turn. You can pass the turn, leaving up mana for protection/interaction, and if you don't need it, slap shadow on your commander. It depends on the deck, but honestly I think it's an upgrade to Rogue's Passage in Ebondeath, Dracolich which is the only Voltron deck that matters anyways.

Kind of moot point when I'll be running both though.

I would think most voltron decks should have sufficient evasion to push damage through without the passage though. Plus it's restricted to black, which is probably 4th place in voltron strats.

I do think minas morgul is a stronger card than rogue's passage in a deck that can run both, it's just that I don't think I've seen someone actually activate rogue's passage in several years. 5 mana is a crazy amount of mana for that effect. It's a last resort evasion tactic when the rest of the deck has had struggles.

Minus Morgul is definitely not unplayable or anything, I think it's a decent roleplayer for black voltron decks. I just think that's a pretty narrow space, and it's not wildly powerful within that space, just decent.

the cards that make the scene plus three LTR Set Boosters.

That's my bad, I was trying to read and drive at the same time and somehow missed most of what you posted xD

I was afraid it'd be something like that, though. I already collected the set when it was the draft set du jour. I sure as hell don't need any extra booster packs =/ I wonder how hard it'll be to get the unique cards as singles.

[Dunadain]

I was trying to read and drive at the same time

Shame on you! Put your phone down!

[DirkGently]

I was trying to read and drive at the same time

Shame on you! Put your phone down!

But then how will I get better at phoning while driving?

In my defense, I'm driving around in the extremely wee hours. I see maybe a couple cars per hour.

[Hermes_]

Some new stuff including a Princess Bride, evil dead themed SLs, sorry for the pics but they are from a con

SPOILER

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[Hermes_]

https://nerdist.com/article/jurassic-pa ... the-coast/

The Lost Caverns Of Ixalan UB Jurassic Park spoilers

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(I think this one will make dirk mad right off the bat lol)

[Dunadain]

Indominus Rex, Alpha would make a fine Voltron commander if it had +1 power, still probably fine though.

[Dunadain]

Plus it's restricted to black, which is probably 4th place in voltron strats.

What does this line mean? Im reading it like you are saying black is the 4th best color for Voltron, but I feel the wording is a bit funky so I just wanted to clarify.

If so, I mean it certainly depends on the KIND of Voltron deck, but i'd consider black to be one of, of not THE best Voltron color. You get a bunch of removal, Nightmare Lash/Lashwrithe, even Hatred if that's the route you want to go.

Of course, if you want to go aura Voltron, then you'll need white, if you want to go pump-spell Voltron, you'll need green. Ultimately though, in my eyes, the best Voltron strategy is equipment, which is largely colorless.

All colors can make Voltron decks, the commander's abilities matter a lot more than the color itself, but I think Black would be one of the better ones.

Honestly, most of the best equipments are colorless, so the best mono color for Voltron is probably just the best mono color full stop. Which is probably black or green, maybe blue.

[DirkGently]

White and red have the most equipment synergy, green and white have the most enchantment synergy. There aren't nearly as many black creatures that lend themselves to Voltron strats as those colours.

I don't think nightmare lash or lashwrithe are powerful enough to move the needle to any great degree. Don't think I even played them in my last black Voltron deck, and they're mono-black only so quite niche.

I'd say white is easily the best supported Voltron colour, like not even close tbh. Red and green are usually support colours. Blue and black have powerful tools to be sure, but as far as supporting a Voltron strategy specifically, meh. They have many better options.

[TheGildedGoose]

I don't think nightmare lash or lashwrithe are powerful enough to move the needle to any great degree. Don't think I even played them in my last black Voltron deck, and they're mono-black only so quite niche.

I'm sorry, what?

I agree that mono-black doesn't offer a lot to Voltron but not running four mana Blackblade Reforged in a Voltron deck is a choice.

The best Voltron commanders evade the Commander tax in some capacity, making them inevitable threats, so Ebondeath, Dracolich, Phelddagrif, and hell, even Borborygmos and Fblthp fill the role to some degree.

[Dunadain]

Take your equipment synergies, I'll take actually good cards XD. White might have Voltron support, but it's also just a pretty bad (mono) color.

[BeneTleilax]

Do we know yet what Map tokens do?

[duducrash]

Do we know yet what Map tokens do?

I think it is scry or surveil, fits with the other ability from kellan.

Princess Bride secret lair rocks. I might pick it up sealed just in case the extra card is also a banher.

The new LOTR reprints are also nice, cool art

[DirkGently]

I don't think nightmare lash or lashwrithe are powerful enough to move the needle to any great degree. Don't think I even played them in my last black Voltron deck, and they're mono-black only so quite niche.

I'm sorry, what?

I agree that mono-black doesn't offer a lot to Voltron but not running four mana Blackblade Reforged in a Voltron deck is a choice.

The best Voltron commanders evade the Commander tax in some capacity, making them inevitable threats, so Ebondeath, Dracolich, Phelddagrif, and hell, even Borborygmos and Fblthp fill the role to some degree.

It's only blackblade reforged if you have only swamps. Which you probably shouldn't? Even then it's only a 1-mana discount. And bbrf isn't a great Voltron card anyway imo. No evasion, no value, and scales for lategame when Voltron is usually an aggro strat. It's not bad but it's not top-tier imo.

Ofc mono-black decks often want almost-all-swamps with coffers, but Voltron decks aren't typically able to get huge value from big mana. So I'd usually prefer to run some utility lands instead of all-in coffers (such as the one we're talking about.,,).

I disagree completely about evading tax being a high priority for Voltron. You still miss an attack and need to reequip everything even if there's no other downside. I'd much much rather have hexproof or some other form of protection. Plus there are plenty of other powerful abilities that are waaay more powerful than some slow recursion ability (Slicer, Hired Muscle // Slicer, High-Speed Antagonist, Light-Paws, Emperor's Voice come to mind…)

Phelddagrif isn't a Voltron deck either. He rarely gets buffed at all. There's no real reason to bother.

[Dunadain]

Kind of depends what you want from your Voltron deck, tbh, calling all decks that win with commander damage "Voltron" is kind of ridiculous anyways.

Slicer, Hired Muscle // Slicer, High-Speed Antagonist is the best Voltron commander out there with Light-Paws, Emperor's Voice being a distance second.

But they also play very different from a Wydwen, the Biting Gale/Ebondeath, Dracolich.

Personally, I'd rather not play a deck that loses the game if an opponent ever plays Plaguecrafter but that's just me.

Also, the full speed ahead Voltron decks tend to get hated out real quick and aren't great at rebuilding. Pretty sure I have a higher win rate with Ebondeath, Dracolich then the guy in my play group that plays Slicer, Hired Muscle // Slicer, High-Speed Antagonist, despite his deck being objectively much more powerful. A small part of that might come down to player skill, but I'm pretty sure most of it comes down to the fact that I can work with opponents, and Slicer, Hired Muscle // Slicer, High-Speed Antagonist is public enemy #1 starting turn 1.