[Off-Topic] Community Chat Thread

[kirkusjones]

A roundtable show with banlist, rules and random card of the week/pod discussion would be fun, as would a "Playin' Politics w/ Dirk Gently" segment. Perhaps sponsored by the good people from the Church of IGMCYUSL.

[TheGildedGoose]

Disappointed I'm not in Dirk's top five tbh but given my low post count I consider it a victory. lyonhaert does play in the stream and I mostly tune in for him.

Once I get around to resetting up my play space I would gladly ruin some games with my sense of humor.

[Feyd_Ruin]

Just noticed the "MTGNexus is streaming live" thing up the top - might be my new comp not having adblock installed yet lol.

If you're logged in, there aren't really any ads for your adblock to have to hide. We only have one traditional ad, and it's only shown to logged out users. (I figure if you're logged in and participating in the site, you're helping make it what it is and shouldn't have to see ads - I can't promise it'll always be this way, but we're surviving for now). The streaming live is only an "ad" in that it's advertising the fact that we're streaming live, and only shows up when we are.

Kinda disappointed to not see familiar names playing - I recognize wildfire but he's more of a mod and posts pretty rarely.

Wildfire and Kaburi are both admins, Jank is our most active writer, and Rabid has been a mod from the beginning. They're each responsible for helping make this place run, and are regulars in the lineup. Cryo was a regular before, but he's gotten away from magic. We've had many different guests, etc, and are definitely open to more.

there should just be a podcast of 3drinks, Dirk, Legend, and Pokken (with a special guest each week!) arguing about speculative EDH rule changes and bans/unbans.

So convince them to do it :p
I think Jank/Diz/Kit do a great job with the news podcasts. They're not avid posters here, but they put a lot of work into WNXS.
We are always looking for more article/podcast type content. We don't pay much, but we pay what we can.

[Janky_as_heck]

See, I feel the same way about the MTGN podcast ngl. It's not that I have anything against them or how they do their show, but none of them are people I would associate as "premier" members of the site. I can't look at their bibliography of posts and threads on the site and really understand the nuances of their opinions or personalities as broadcast representatives of the community. %$#%, there should just be a podcast of 3drinks, Dirk, Legend, and Pokken (with a special guest each week!) arguing about speculative EDH rule changes and bans/unbans. That would a podcast that would register on the Richter scale and be measured in Scoville units.

So here's the thing regarding the podcast. We aren't doing it in an opinionated way, it's more like a local news program with segments and stories structured around the bare bones news. We include jokes and all So it's not just reciting facts, but it's not a discussion cast like magic mics or such. That being said, I could certainly be more active in the forums and such

[Hermes_]

So what I'm hearing is that unlike everywhere else in life you guys are really interested in hearing from the spammers.

I can tell you about all the hot singles in your location you should be playing with. Like Tithe.

But Chandra, Pyromaster is actually hot....in many ways lol

Fun fact: there's a guy at my LGS who had a serious crush on Chandra. Had several binder pages of her cards. He ended up marrying a red-head who looked startlingly similar to her. I still feel a touch weird about it but more power to him I suppose.

I have one of her cards and the funko pop, but that's it. lol

[DirkGently]

Disappointed I'm not in Dirk's top five tbh but given my low post count I consider it a victory. lyonhaert does play in the stream and I mostly tune in for him.

Lol, I was picking names in the order I saw them in random threads I clicked on, not based on my personal opinion of that person.

Wildfire and Kaburi are both admins, Jank is our most active writer, and Rabid has been a mod from the beginning. They're each responsible for helping make this place run, and are regulars in the lineup. Cryo was a regular before, but he's gotten away from magic. We've had many different guests, etc, and are definitely open to more.

That makes sense, I just haven't personally interacted with them much.

So convince them to do it :p
I think Jank/Diz/Kit do a great job with the news podcasts. They're not avid posters here, but they put a lot of work into WNXS.
We are always looking for more article/podcast type content. We don't pay much, but we pay what we can.

What sort of articles? I'm fairly busy atm (and less busy playing magic since my new apartment is a bit isolated - maybe finally desperate enough to play online since the alternative is currently 2 hours of driving), but I could have some fun writing up something. Couldn't hurt to have a few more writing gigs on my resume. First one's free

[kirkusjones]

I think Jank/Diz/Kit do a great job with the news podcasts. They're not avid posters here, but they put a lot of work into WNXS.
We are always looking for more article/podcast type content. We don't pay much, but we pay what we can.

Where do I apply?

[TheAmericanSpirit]

Hell yeah. This is what I wanna see! Some real for the forum, by the forum kind of %$#%! I look to forward to reading all of it, nebulous and speculative as it may be.

[kirkusjones]

Hell yeah. This is what I wanna see! Some real for the forum, by the forum kind of %$#%! I look to forward to reading all of it, nebulous and speculative as it may be.

My goal is to be the Weekly World News of MTG.

[Venedrex]

Oh, you've really started something now. You better close this down before I try and submit a thirteen page dissertation on the finer merits of the color pie and it's continued refinement.

Ahem... if you will scroll to pg 12. section a, sentence five. "The importance of each color possessing a means of interaction" Historically, out of all the colors, Green suffered the most from not being able to deal with opponent's creatures. As time went on however, a sudden shift in philosophy at R&D led to the development of what are now known as "fight" spells. While one could debate the exact time and reasoning for this change, in the years since its inception it has proven to be a valuable tool for green decks, and furthermore....

DM me if you want the rest

[kirkusjones]

Oh, you've really started something now. You better close this down before I try and submit a thirteen page dissertation on the finer merits of the color pie and it's continued refinement.

Ahem... if you will scroll to pg 12. section a, sentence five. "The importance of each color possessing a means of interaction" Historically, out of all the colors, Green suffered the most from not being able to deal with opponent's creatures. As time went on however, a sudden shift in philosophy at R&D led to the development of what are now known as "fight" spells. While one could debate the exact time and reasoning for this change, in the years since its inception it has proven to be a valuable tool for green decks, and furthermore....

DM me if you want the rest

What's the peer-review process look like for such an undertaking?

[Venedrex]

Oh, you've really started something now. You better close this down before I try and submit a thirteen page dissertation on the finer merits of the color pie and it's continued refinement.

Ahem... if you will scroll to pg 12. section a, sentence five. "The importance of each color possessing a means of interaction" Historically, out of all the colors, Green suffered the most from not being able to deal with opponent's creatures. As time went on however, a sudden shift in philosophy at R&D led to the development of what are now known as "fight" spells. While one could debate the exact time and reasoning for this change, in the years since its inception it has proven to be a valuable tool for green decks, and furthermore....

DM me if you want the rest

What's the peer-review process look like for such an undertaking?

Uh, I have no idea. In all seriousness though, I think it would be cool if you or others made some content for real, and maybe someday I'll be able to submit something worth posting here as an article. I've always wanted to write online, but I don't think I'm ready to try my hand at it just yet. I thought about submitting something to EDHREC a while ago but I chickened out. I'm just not sure what would be a really engaging article series to write about. That or if I can actually write for that matter.

If the powers that be on this forum don't mind me throwing something out there and seeing if anyone likes reading it, I'd give it a go. But I'd have everyone take it with a metric ton of salt, since it would be my first article.

[benjameenbear]

Go for it @Venedrex! I don't have the time to write out an article, but I'm happy to offer some suggestions, editing, etc. I'm a professional copywriter who happens to specialize in emails, online ads, and landing pages lol. But I'd love to see the site get some more traffic so we can make @Feyd_Ruin a bajillionaire with the best MTG site on the internet!

[toctheyounger]

Go for it @Venedrex! I don't have the time to write out an article, but I'm happy to offer some suggestions, editing, etc. I'm a professional copywriter who happens to specialize in emails, online ads, and landing pages lol. But I'd love to see the site get some more traffic so we can make @Feyd_Ruin a bajillionaire with the best MTG site on the internet!

Yep seconded. Its been a while but we were talking amongst the primer committee about writing some content. I think we all got kind of busy, a pandemic happened and well intentioned plans got swept aside, but the scope is still there. @Venedrex, get to scrawling.

[DirkGently]

I'll have to think of a decent article. Wish I was playing more. I'd be down to play with people on here if that's still a thing people are doing.

On less-topical news, rewatching GoT I had a revelation - I hate battle scenes. It's fine when it's a small number of people and it's done well, but when one or both sides are a big force, it devolves into mostly just a bunch of shots of two random dudes on opposite sides stabbing each other, it's so boring because those shots have no real relevance to the actual outcome. A night watchman kills a wildling, a wildling kills a night watchman...it's not like we even know the total number of each side, and even if we did, one background character dying has precisely zero impact on who is going to win. It's basically just "a night watchman died, you should feel anxious" "a wildling died, you should feel more confident"...but I don't feel either of those things because no real information is being conveyed by those shots. Can be similar even in 1v1 fights with familiar characters, which otherwise might have actual tension, when handled badly - for instant, Jon Snow gets his head slammed into an anvil at one point...I'm not a doctor but I'm pretty sure that would leave you at least dazed for a bit. But he keeps fighting like it made no difference at all except now he has some more makeup on. So the only point of that scene was to make us feel anxious, but it didn't have any actual impact on what's happening.

Anyway now that episode's over with, we're back to the good part of Game of Thrones - people talking.

[Rumpy5897]

I've written a few articles on here, and let me tell you, it's actually kind of paralysing once you try to put pen to paper. Cooking up a primer about a deck list comes with you really knowing your subject matter, and the primer coming with expectations on what content is to be there and how it is to be structured. Meanwhile now the world's your oyster, and you can technically write about anything you want, and structure it however you want! Ultimately I went with some topical musings as I was coming to terms with things like TWD, or trying to figure out what made a legend popular while another one was not. Still, more content would be good, and could help bridge the "mod Nexus" and "user Nexus" a bit. Get writing!

I've got a few half-baked ditties that I never finished. Musing about various things - green becoming the powerhouse colour it is today, controlling a deck's variance, some thoughts on power (both communicating it and pursuing a certain level of it). A recent topic that would make for a good ramble would be WotC "learning to design for EDH", as evidenced by Satoru Umezawa.

[materpillar]

I'll have to think of a decent article. Wish I was playing more. I'd be down to play with people on here if that's still a thing people are doing.

On less-topical news, rewatching GoT I had a revelation - I hate battle scenes. It's fine when it's a small number of people and it's done well, but when one or both sides are a big force, it devolves into mostly just a bunch of shots of two random dudes on opposite sides stabbing each other, it's so boring because those shots have no real relevance to the actual outcome. A night watchman kills a wildling, a wildling kills a night watchman...it's not like we even know the total number of each side, and even if we did, one background character dying has precisely zero impact on who is going to win. It's basically just "a night watchman died, you should feel anxious" "a wildling died, you should feel more confident"...but I don't feel either of those things because no real information is being conveyed by those shots. Can be similar even in 1v1 fights with familiar characters, which otherwise might have actual tension, when handled badly - for instant, Jon Snow gets his head slammed into an anvil at one point...I'm not a doctor but I'm pretty sure that would leave you at least dazed for a bit. But he keeps fighting like it made no difference at all except now he has some more makeup on. So the only point of that scene was to make us feel anxious, but it didn't have any actual impact on what's happening.

Anyway now that episode's over with, we're back to the good part of Game of Thrones - people talking.

I feel like the Battle of the Bastards was really well shot to kind of emphasize this. Curious to know what your memories of that scene were.

Why're you rewatching GoT? You planning on watching through the ending too or just up to whatever earlier season?

[DirkGently]

A recent topic that would make for a good ramble would be WotC "learning to design for EDH", as evidenced by Satoru Umezawa.

As a good example or a bad example?

I feel like the Battle of the Bastards was really well shot to kind of emphasize this. Curious to know what your memories of that scene were.

Why're you rewatching GoT? You planning on watching through the ending too or just up to whatever earlier season?

I don't remember being as bored by it as I was by the battle of castle black but I was never a fan of the full-episode battles. It's just too long for too little narrative information.

I think the other part of the problem with that fight in particular is that there's really only one character worth caring about (and don't you dare tell me to care about Sam or Gilly).

Rewatching it with Lily since she hasn't seen it. Probably ought to be watching breaking bad instead but for whatever reason GoT is the one that I like rewatching more.

[Hermes_]

A recent topic that would make for a good ramble would be WotC "learning to design for EDH", as evidenced by Satoru Umezawa.

As a good example or a bad example?

now there's a thought....one person writing why the card is good and @DirkGently writing why the card is bad.


EDIT: I just now found out that Kormus Bell includes the phrase "And so forth" and now I want one.

[Rumpy5897]

A bad example. The easiest way to make an EDH deck do a thing is to grease it up with ramp and draw, and a lot of legends have started doing that out of the command zone. Satoru does both. I acknowledge I don't get to throw stones here, as I run some command zone card advantage myself, but I prefer legends that synergise differently with a particular game plan.

[DirkGently]

A bad example. The easiest way to make an EDH deck do a thing is to grease it up with ramp and draw, and a lot of legends have started doing that out of the command zone. Satoru does both. I acknowledge I don't get to throw stones here, as I run some command zone card advantage myself, but I prefer legends that synergise differently with a particular game plan.

Lol, I'm actually just more confused now. When we're comparing good to bad commander design, are we saying bad design in terms of being too weak or uninteresting (i.e. Zalto, Fire Giant Duke) or bad design in terms of being too easy to go off the rails (i.e. Golos, Tireless Pilgrim)?

[toctheyounger]

A bad example. The easiest way to make an EDH deck do a thing is to grease it up with ramp and draw, and a lot of legends have started doing that out of the command zone. Satoru does both. I acknowledge I don't get to throw stones here, as I run some command zone card advantage myself, but I prefer legends that synergise differently with a particular game plan.

Lol, I'm actually just more confused now. When we're comparing good to bad commander design, are we saying bad design in terms of being too weak or uninteresting (i.e. Zalto, Fire Giant Duke) or bad design in terms of being too easy to go off the rails (i.e. Golos, Tireless Pilgrim)?

To me its not necessarily where it falls on that spectrum. A good design to me allows variance in play styles, has strong synergies that aren't immediately busted and aren't pseudo-flavor text, and leads to enjoyable and fun pkay patterns. Its not an easy mark to hit tbh.

A slightly biased case in point is Varina, Lich Queen. I know you despise tribal so let's not go there, but in every other way its a strong but well balanced card for the format that's capable of playing in a variety of ways and at a variety of power levels.

Honestly I find the 'good vs bad design' discussion a little weird. Often it just devolves into 'can this card go off and how quickly' or 'not strong enough, why would you run this' and nothing between. It just feels like there's often a gap between what designers think a good design is and what your average player thinks a good design is, especially if they're just wanting the most value they can get in the 100. Its hardly a neutral footing to be assessing cards from.

[DirkGently]

A slightly biased case in point is Varina, Lich Queen. I know you despise tribal so let's not go there, but in every other way its a strong but well balanced card for the format that's capable of playing in a variety of ways and at a variety of power levels.

Lol, actually I dislike Varina mostly because I think she's too much value too easily. Looting for every mere attack is fairly bananas already, and then she also makes zombies herself on top of that in a way that'd fed by the looting she herself provides? She could go off the chain fairly quickly even in a deck with no synergy whatsoever. Plus I don't love 3+ colors. Every time I look at her I think....nah, too easy.

I like the design of, say, Feather, which could maybe be argued as a similar power level, but at least I feel like Feather requires more thought to actually be good. If you just stuck her into a random RW deck she's not going to do much, even if you throw some Brute Strengths in there or whatever.

Considering how many commanders I've built, my window for "good design" is rather narrow I suppose. And I think I tend to skew lower on power level in terms of what I prefer than most people.

[kirkusjones]

A bad example. The easiest way to make an EDH deck do a thing is to grease it up with ramp and draw, and a lot of legends have started doing that out of the command zone. Satoru does both. I acknowledge I don't get to throw stones here, as I run some command zone card advantage myself, but I prefer legends that synergise differently with a particular game plan.

Lol, I'm actually just more confused now. When we're comparing good to bad commander design, are we saying bad design in terms of being too weak or uninteresting (i.e. Zalto, Fire Giant Duke) or bad design in terms of being too easy to go off the rails (i.e. Golos, Tireless Pilgrim)?

To me its not necessarily where it falls on that spectrum. A good design to me allows variance in play styles, has strong synergies that aren't immediately busted and aren't pseudo-flavor text, and leads to enjoyable and fun pkay patterns. Its not an easy mark to hit tbh.

A slightly biased case in point is Varina, Lich Queen. I know you despise tribal so let's not go there, but in every other way its a strong but well balanced card for the format that's capable of playing in a variety of ways and at a variety of power levels.

Honestly I find the 'good vs bad design' discussion a little weird. Often it just devolves into 'can this card go off and how quickly' or 'not strong enough, why would you run this' and nothing between. It just feels like there's often a gap between what designers think a good design is and what your average player thinks a good design is, especially if they're just wanting the most value they can get in the 100. Its hardly a neutral footing to be assessing cards from.

Objective assessments of cards, especially in this format, is tough. Plus, if we're talking about content creation, a hot take is most likely going to draw more clicks than an objective evaluation of a card's quality based on some set of metrics.

Example:
"Toxrill is Breaking EDH and the RC is Doing NOTHING! (More at 11)" vs. "A Scientific Approach to Determination of Card Quality: Determining the Metrics, Part IV"

Hyperbole aside, I'm willing to bet more people side with sensationalist over rationalist. Especially on the internet.

[toctheyounger]

A slightly biased case in point is Varina, Lich Queen. I know you despise tribal so let's not go there, but in every other way its a strong but well balanced card for the format that's capable of playing in a variety of ways and at a variety of power levels.

Lol, actually I dislike Varina mostly because I think she's too much value too easily. Looting for every mere attack is fairly bananas already, and then she also makes zombies herself on top of that in a way that'd fed by the looting she herself provides? She could go off the chain fairly quickly even in a deck with no synergy whatsoever. Plus I don't love 3+ colors. Every time I look at her I think....nah, too easy.

I like the design of, say, Feather, which could maybe be argued as a similar power level, but at least I feel like Feather requires more thought to actually be good. If you just stuck her into a random RW deck she's not going to do much, even if you throw some Brute Strengths in there or whatever.

Considering how many commanders I've built, my window for "good design" is rather narrow I suppose. And I think I tend to skew lower on power level in terms of what I prefer than most people.

Lol I despise Feather. The premise is strong and from what I've seen if she goes unheeded she can put the table on a very short clock, but she does precisely one thing and nothing else. I get the Varina thing and while it does look strong there are a few hoops at least to jump through in terms of making her deck really hum. So, different strokes for different folks I guess.

I guess this just goes to show card design can't be everything to everyone.