With the way the commander economy is blown up, is the new optimal strategy in deck building to find the "2nd in class"?

[3drinks]

Finance types spec, and spec hard on commander and know how to make a buck off the average masses that view cards as "must plays", turning what would be a $300 deck into a $1300 deck at least. But they focus only on what others perceive as "can't ignore cards", so then does this mean the best way to play and build is to scour for the 2nd best in slot cards - i.e. that do the same thing as the chase version being spec'd on - to help curb your own cost?

I.e. Damnation despite all these prints is still $30, while a Crux of Fate for better or worse is bulk. Yes it's 1mv more, but largely will do the same thing about when it's needed given the general speed and lax nature of the format. You can apply this metric to all manner of easy-ish replaced cards too.

The problem then comes only with genuine unique effects that can't be replicated...Rhystic Study comes to mind, new w catch-up cards, blatantly undercosted strong effects that can't be recreated (tutours, overly efficient removal). Like obviously if you have the cards, play the cards, but if you don't and you're looking to mitigate your barrier to entry...

I'm just trying to stimulate some discussion. How do you approach this format, as inflation continues kicking into higher and higher gear, with finance types spec'ing harder and harder in hopes of preying on the casual appeal of the format, in the hopes of keeping your costs and overall deck values down?

This topic came up in a friend discord server I'm in, so after digging for the conversation I'm going to paste that snippet here for context.

"I know, right? And it's not even necessary tbh (me, on the subject of Damnation). There's enough B wipes that are either on par, better, or slightly below that it's negligible. It's like I said, we've reached such a saturation point that the secret to keeping commander costs down is looking for the second best in class that's only very mildly "worse" than the "chase best in class". This is only problematic when the best has no close substitute. I.e. demonic tutour, fast mana, overtly unique cards like massacre wurm or obliterator."

[TheAmericanSpirit]

I have a few rules for keeping my expenditures reasonable:

1. Acquire real estate first. Lands are notoriously expensive and usually don't go down. I buy mine a month after release and hold.

2. Most cards are cheap, if you're willing to read. By law of averages, not everyone grows up to be an astronaut. Same thing with cards, but that doesn't mean they're unplayable by any means. Go on scryfall and search all rares in modern that are less than a dollar, and I guarantee you'll find some cool stuff with which to work, even if those cards do fly coach.

3. Bite bullets when flush. Cash flow must be managed, we all know this. Many cards are prohibitively expensive most of the time, but when you've hit a windfall, that's the time to take a PORTION of that money and buy those wishlist items you've been craving.

4. Do not buy cards in April/Early May barring must haves. The market spikes every time those tax checks go out, so avoid the 10-15% premium of competing against impulse buyers.

5. Watch what other people are playing. If you see a card having an outsized impact on games in your area, wgaf if the internet scorns that card as "bad". Pick that %$#% up, that there is a hidden gem.

Anyway, that's what I do.

[Serenade]

With new sets, I work under the assumption that the high-end stuff will be reprinted eventually and push down the price. Trust no one. Goldspan Dragon or Assassin's Trophy can pop up on any plane. They'll be back. So I just grab the cheaper rares I like and plane-specific or special-art lands.

I also pick up random cards with mechanics or tribes (especially from the Commander sets) that could explode one day if they print more legends that interact with them. Killer Service? Disorder in the Court? Kashi-Tribe Elite? Glad I have those now. Maybe nothing will happen, but that's what I spec. They are cheap. I do the same with reserved list cards.

[Hawk]

I mostly play with what I own. My collection has some weird boons and blindspots and I just deal (for instance I own like five copies each of Rhystic Study and Cyclonic Rift but zero copies of the best countespells like Fierce Guardianship, Mana Drain, Force of Will etc.) For those cards it's easy enough to just suck it up and play Counterspell and Dissipate.

It does get harder when there are no substitutes, and I'll sometimes avoid strategies where the losses feel too great. For instance even though I own a Doubling Season I have steered away from WGx token builds, because I don't own Anointed Procession, Parallel Lives, and a lot of other staples. Where the line is is tricky - it felt fine to run a Lurrus of the Dream-Den RavFfinity deck without Jeweled Lotus, but I'm debating if I want to do Wyll, Blade of Frontiers dice.dec when I'll never be able to get a Ancient Copper Dragon so is the deck even still good? I dunno.

I do wish they did better on reprints. I'm honestly pretty peeved that the Flawless Maneuver cycle didn't make it in to the new set for instance.

[TheGildedGoose]

Proper optimization involves buying a printer, buying paper, buying ink...

[3drinks]

Proper optimization involves buying a printer, buying paper, buying ink...

I mean obviously, but for those LGS that don't let you play without genuine cards, or playgroups that refuse to let you in with "creative alters".

[Magiqmaster]

I rarely, if ever, buy 2nd versions of cards because I can't afford the expensive stuff. One exception being Growing Rites of Itlimoc // Itlimoc, Cradle of the Sun... When I saw that card previewed, I jumped right away and bought a playset. My investment has not been so great (only a 50$ increase of value since that time), but who cares, I now have 4 "copies" of Gaea's Cradle, even if the original will always be miles ahead in playability.

Otherwise, I use what I own and for the expensive staples, I now trade away for the good stuff when cards in my collection spike, due to the latest releases affecting the value of otherwise low value cards in my collection.

[3drinks]

I rarely, if ever, buy 2nd versions of cards because I can't afford the expensive stuff. One exception being Growing Rites of Itlimoc // Itlimoc, Cradle of the Sun... When I saw that card previewed, I jumped right away and bought a playset. My investment has not been so great (only a 50$ increase of value since that time), but who cares, I now have 4 "copies" of Gaea's Cradle, even if the original will always be miles ahead in playability.

Otherwise, I use what I own and for the expensive staples, I now trade away for the good stuff when cards in my collection spike, due to the latest releases affecting the value of otherwise low value cards in my collection.

I feel this. I just sold a small brick of cards to an online retailer for $550, and invested just 20% of that into MODO to get my fetch-dual suite up and running (the latter going to cover my merch expenditures when I go on vacation next week). I don't have any remorse or regret turning old "power" cards into a watchful eye toward new age "power". Not like I was playing those cards anyway.

[Dragonlover]

I have a slightly orthogonal approach: I lower my physical quality requirements. Rather than going for near mint or nothing, I'll drop to played/excellent. People will often under grade cards so they don't have to deal with someone moaning over a barely perceptible nick, whereas other than in Moliomo which I'm trying to foil, all I care about is that the card has the right words on it and isn't actively folded in half. The Mycosynth Lattice in wincons is utterly shot, but I saved a fortune on it.

Dragonlover

[NZB2323]

I have an Edric, Spymaster of Trest deck that plays only commons and cost only $30.

Damnation may be expensive, but Crippling Fear may be better for a tribal deck.

Snapcaster Mage is really expensive, but in commander is it really better than Mission Briefing?

I'm absolutely planning on picking up Deep Gnome Terramancer, Archivist of Oghma, and Battle Angels of Tyr, but I'm hoping to trade for those cards.

I've also adjusted the number of decks that I play from 10 to 5, and trade in expensive cards from the decks I no longer enjoy playing.

[Sinis]

does this mean the best way to play and build is to scour for the 2nd best in slot cards - i.e. that do the same thing as the chase version being spec'd on - to help curb your own cost?

I mean, arguably people have been doing this with mana bases since forever. How many people do you know run real ABUR duals? I don't even play my copies anymore.

new w catch-up cards, blatantly undercosted strong effects that can't be recreated (tutours, overly efficient removal). Like obviously if you have the cards, play the cards, but if you don't and you're looking to mitigate your barrier to entry...

I think those cards are most important for mono-white or Boros. Yes, it would be nice to leverage White's strengths more in, say, a w/u or w/b deck, but... yeah.

I think a lot of people committed to this idea a long time ago. I don't see a lot of demonic tutors or dual lands, or even cyclonic rift all that much anymore. People don't want to spend that kind of money on the game, and most people aren't so competitive that they want to optimize, even within a non-cedh strategy.

[3drinks]

I think a lot of people committed to this idea a long time ago. I don't see a lot of demonic tutors or dual lands, or even cyclonic rift all that much anymore. People don't want to spend that kind of money on the game, and most people aren't so competitive that they want to optimize, even within a non-cedh strategy.

I'm....working on this. Years of looking at decks as "why this when I can that" led to an upscaled process that really isn't very cost friendly as it once was. Buying fire covenant for 0.50¢ wasn't a big deal but now that it's $4.75.......

When Ritual of the Machine goes from bulk to $15. It's just so much to process. Really puts the whole "acceptable hobby costs" thing in a new light.

[DirkGently]

Sometimes BIS is cheap. Sometimes second best is still expensive.

It's the same strategy it always was. Play the best cards that are cheap enough for your budget. Trying to find some "new optimal strategy" is just making a pointless hot take that says nothing original.

[RxPhantom]

I don't know how people get into this hobby in 2022. I had a few conversations about this at CommandFest. As I was updating my decks for it, I noticed that the price of my decks had exploded. I could never afford them with today's prices. Then again, enemy fetches are the lowest they've ever been. Everything's all topsy turvy! Attrition is $14? Ashnod's Altar is $21? I had the foresight to pick up a lot of staple lands, mainly shocks, checks, and allied fetches, when they were in Standard. Still though, what a daunting prospect to start today.

[materpillar]

Proper optimization involves buying a printer, buying paper, buying ink...

I've only been playing online the past few years, so I just have printed off proxies of the last few sets. No one really can tell online. I usually just either do that or don't update my decks. I can't justify spending $50 on a couple of magic cards when I can get an entire new board game.

I also haven't had a problem with people prohibiting me from playing proxies in person the last couple of times I was actually in person.

[Legend]

I cut costs by selling off all but one deck and resisting the urge to foil it. I do wish I had Beta duals, but that Beta Volcanic Island is about $11,000.00 (because there isn't an Alpha printing).

[Sinis]

Really puts the whole "acceptable hobby costs" thing in a new light.

6 months ago on these very forums, some people said that board games would probably provide a better dollar to fun ratio. I don't think the prices have moved that much in 6 months, but I stand by the idea that the $50 I've spent on Battlestar Galactica was the best money I ever spent on a boardgame.

[duducrash]

I think the hobby should partially fund itself, its specially hard with how hard prices go nowadays, but I take a few hours and scour every set for cards I think are playable and are super underhyped. Then I get plenty of them and trade thena few months latter. About 15$ in storm-kiln artist let me build a new EDH deck about a year later. Finance is badly perceived but I honesty think keeping an eye on underhyped cards and trends (I got pathways when the pioneer event was announced, traded for cards I could never justify the spending for example).

I'll buy an expensive card if I really want to play with it. Otherwise I'll eventually trade a pile of bulk for it

[Mookie]

I've been sticking to a policy of not buying any cards over $2 for a while now, and it has worked out pretty well. That isn't necessarily something I would do if I were in a cEDH setting and needed to squeeze out every iota of power from my decks... but in a more casual meta, it's more than enough. It certainly would be nice to run Smothering Tithe and Archaeomancer's Map in all my white decks... but I'm capable of separating 'want' from 'need', and the vast majority of cards are in the 'want' category. The number of cards that reach the category of 'I wouldn't bother building the deck if I didn't have a copy' / 'the deck would be fundamentally different without it' is usually only 3-4 per deck, IMO. (edit: I actually looked through my decks, and looks to be closer to 5-6. still low though)

That said, I have played in higher-power metas and pods where I have certainly felt outgunned, and I would probably end up either spending a bunch of money or proxying if I found myself in those games more frequently.... or I'll get salty and ask opponents to play weaker decks. >.>

[Sinis]

That isn't necessarily something I would do if I were in a cEDH setting and needed to squeeze out every iota of power from my decks...

As I understand it, cEDH players are pretty proxy-friendly, because I am very sure most of them don't own Timetwisters, etc.

[BaronCappuccino]

I've managed to keep EDH affordable by adhering hard to thematic and other outside limitations. For example, in my current D&D deck, the secondary theme due to lack of main theme materials, is clue, food and treasure tokens - primarily the latter. Those are actually the win condition. Anyhow, all my removal either required D&D dice, ventured into the dungeon, or created one of the mentioned artifact tokens. Hard to believe, but you can "pimp out" a D&D deck with an artifact token subtheme with every specialty print and the deck is still 165.34 at current estimate. Having placed my TCG order for the 11 Baldur's Gate cards I needed, the deck wants nothing. There simply aren't any expensive cards on theme that hem to the rules, and the arbitrary rules are never direct price caps, They're something creative that solves price issues in a roundabout way. The only way I can enjoy Magic is if my deck is 100% complete.

[Lifeless]

I'm somewhat blessed as I'm a long time player with a varied collection so many of the staples are cards I already have multiple copies of. That being said as a general rule nowadays I simply do without unless a card is critical for deck functionality. If I'm building a treasure deck I'm certainly going to spring for that Revel in Riches but my green decks are going to go without the Great Henge.

[3drinks]

Welp while I just made this thread, I spent $55 on singles to enhance the Party Time deck (which also cost me $55 from my LGS) because I just had to add that Archivist of Oghma because it's a cleric 😐. Battle Angels of Tyr as well, but that's for zenith seeker itself lol.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

Welp while I just made this thread, I spent $55 on singles to enhance the Party Time deck (which also cost me $55 from my LGS) because I just had to add that Archivist of Oghma because it's a cleric 😐. Battle Angels of Tyr as well, but that's for zenith seeker itself lol.

Do as 3drinks says, not as 3drinks does.

[3drinks]

Welp while I just made this thread, I spent $55 on singles to enhance the Party Time deck (which also cost me $55 from my LGS) because I just had to add that Archivist of Oghma because it's a cleric 😐. Battle Angels of Tyr as well, but that's for zenith seeker itself lol.

Do as 3drinks says, not as 3drinks does.

😂😂😂

Man I can't believe I fell right into the new card trap. I wonder if with all the toys I just got, that I could do a Magic no-buy for a year.