Unreleased and New Card Discussion

[Hermes_]

idk why they switched it up for only 1 card (so far).

Haven't you realized by now they are out to piss you off and hope you stop playing

[folding_music]

wellll at least they made the keeper of secrets hot <3

[Dunharrow]

Not sure why that would be the case. Their motivation to include them in set boosters depends entirely on the demand for the alternate versions, which is likely to be higher if people abstain from these decks for flavor reasons. Really, they're most motivated to make a non-UB version if tons of people complain about UB and don't buy them, but loudly complain about wanting the mechanical cards.

In theory, you are right. In practice, this will be difficult to evaluate. If people abstain from buying Warhammer decks, the message will be to drive UB in a different direction. Not that people want to play with these cards. If anything, it would discourage them from investing more into these cards/mechanics. How would they know players want to play with them if they don't seem popular? They aren't scouring discussion forums and tallying the number of people who say they like the cards but not the flavour. Or is the expectation that people will complain to Maro and he will compile a list?
Maybe they will assume which ones are the coolest for commander based on anecdotal information coming from staff, the RC, etc. That's the best you could hope for.
But maybe there is niche card you want for commander and they won't think to put it on The List.
this isn't Stranger Things SLD. There were a limited number of cards and it was easy to throw them all into set boosters.

You should hope that this sells really well and that it becomes clear which cards are played in commander, and so WOTC has financial incentive to reprint cards with new flavour.

[Serenade]

I feel like we won't get UW versions due to the new creature types. I also didn't realize how many new cards they were printing for this product.

[Wallycaine]

@Mookie eesh, I figured that was the least likely solution given the mess it'd make when combining things from UB and UW. Like imagine 10 years from now, someone with the UW version of Haruspex casts Control Magic on Tyranid Harridan, how the hell are you going to know that they interact?

I mean, there's only 2 ways it'll get played. Either neither player knows about the substitution and it gets played as though it doesn't interact, or 1 or more players do and it gets played correctly. Sure, one of those is technically incorrect, but there's no confusion, just lack of knowledge. No different than a player playing Blighted Agent and Glistener Elf and not realizing they share a creature type.

[Wallycaine]

I feel like we won't get UW versions due to the new creature types. I also didn't realize how many new cards they were printing for this product.

It was mentioned on the previous page, but Maro already went over how they've got a (tentative) plan in place for that: they'll make up a new creature type that hasn't been used in magic before, such as Schmyrinids, then put in the general rules that "Tyranids and Schmyrinids are equivalents", just like they do with the names of Universe Within and Universe Beyond cards currently.

[Serenade]

Ugh, forcing it is worse. Just make them all Phyrexians. The whole thing was hyping me for our return to NPH before you said that.

[benjameenbear]

As Mookie stated, we now have seen the whole of the Swarm, and I gotta say, I'm impressed. Fantastic stuff, and this is coming from someone who was/is skeptical of UB as a whole.

I love the fact that the Gene-Stealer Cult is in charge of ramp, setting up for the heavier hitters to come down later, just like they do in the lore.

The cards have great art, fun mechanics, and don't seem to be too overpowered so far. The reprints are awesome flavor wise as well, with Hardened Scales and Hull Breach being super fun fits with the new art. I love it.

10/10 for this deck. My only quibble is I wish they could have found room for one Tyranid with Devour since it seems spot on, but I suppose Ravenous took that role. Again, I really appreciate that there are so many ramp creatures in the deck to prevent players from just having a bunch of bombs in their hand but not enough mana to cast them, as can happen when you have a deck with lots of expensive creatures.

Dang, now I really want to preorder these...

As much as I hate to say it, you're right. This deck looks hella fun out of the box. It reminds me of what would happen if Slivers ever got Phyrexianized...

Dammit, I may have to get copies of these decks as a separate inclusive board game (like another poster already mentioned). Argh...

[Mookie]

Following up on the Tyranid deck, we have some interesting stuff coming from the Ruinous Powers / Chaos deck.

• Chaos Defiler is a five mana Rakdos Ashen Rider. A bit random in what you'll hit, but still seems quite solid. Also, artifact synergies for Goblin Welder stuff (and not random at all in 1v1). Seems strong. I might have to get one for my cube.
• Khârn the Betrayer looks amusing, if you ever wanted Humble Defector in the command zone. Combos with Homeward Path, among other things.
• Tallyman of Nurgle is an alright draw engine - generally outclassed by Morbid Opportunist, but cool if you can get seven things to die.
• Lord of Change looks like a plausible upgrade over Sphinx of Uthuun, depending on how you feel about Fact or Fiction vs Concentrate. At the very least, ward 3 is quite relevant.
• Heralds of Tzeentch and Let the Galaxy Burn are more cascaaaaade. Throw in Noise Marine and that's three more cards for my Averna, the Chaos Bloom meme deck.
• Magnus the Red is interesting, since spellslinger decks are generally a bit creature-light. Seems absurd with Empty the Warrens and Young Pyromancer, among other things.

[Krishnath]

I feel like we won't get UW versions due to the new creature types. I also didn't realize how many new cards they were printing for this product.

They'll give them newly created creature types for reprints. And in the rules, they'll be 1 for 1. Just like the godzilla cards.

[DirkGently]

The lost and the damned caused me to realize that there's only 1 non-token spawn-type creature in the game: Elder Spawn. I think it was errataed at some point because my deck tracker app still thinks its an elemental, but looks like it's back to being a spawn now.

Yeesh, big blue creatures used to be amazingly bad. I almost forgot for a minute there.

Magnus the Red and chaos defiler look like the biggest standouts in terms of power level today. Though bloodthirster is pretty bananas in Kaalia.

Haven't you realized by now they are out to piss you off and hope you stop playing

It's probably Jon pulling the strings. He seemed pretty unhappy after I repeatedly dunked on him with Lagomos, Hand of Hatred in draft. Just play a 3-toughness creature, dude. It's really not that hard to beat.

@Dunharrow I would bet at least one or two people at wotc have their ear to the ground on reddit and other big forums. They also do polls and such to answer these sorts of questions. I'm sure they have more sophisticated methods than exclusively product sales, especially when those sales don't really answer the thing they're trying to answer. After all, anyone who bought the decks presumably doesn't need another copy, so more copies sold = fewer future buyers.

You're right that they probably will have to be selective about what gets a reprint, but I think they're capable of figuring out which ones are popular. I'll be able to use EDHrec a month after release to answer that question pretty accurately, a big company like wotc can surely be even more sophisticated. TBH looking at most of the cards, 80%+ are pretty mediocre, so I don't think it'll be hard to narrow down.

I'm not that interested in any particular cards tbh, at least not from what's been spoiled so far. I'm rarely that attached to any particular card on principle, it's the game itself that I love. Closest that comes to interesting is Ghyrson Starn, Kelermorph (still can't get over how awful that name is, did they hire a middle school student to create it?), though that deck will likely be pretty narrow. Anyway, my interest in UB crashing and burning for the overall health of the game outweighs my interest in owning any particular cards by a massive factor. So I will continue to hope for this product's demise, thank you very much.

[RxPhantom]

These decks feel super pushed. The art is awesome, though I'm not a fan of the oppressive grimdark world of 40K and its comically stupid looking...ummm...battle dudes. I'm especially fond of the new Farseekthough. I'm still down on UB as a whole, mainly because I don't want Magic to become some empty vessel for other IPs.

Once again my daughter has seen my typing, so here are some emojis:

[plushpenguin]

Bloodthirster is absolutely terrifying in Xenagod decks.

[RxPhantom]

Bloodthirster is absolutely terrifying in Xenagod decks.

Where isn't it terrifying? Probably just, like, my binder.

[duducrash]

Cascade is so boring to play against I cringe a little every time a card is previewed. I want less shuffleing!

Some bangers in the set. My like or dislike of it will be defined be the availability of the set outside the US

[plushpenguin]

Bloodthirster is absolutely terrifying in Xenagod decks.

Where isn't it terrifying? Probably just, like, my binder.

Most of them probably can't do a total of 74 haste damage with no other support in a table of 4.

[folding_music]

wanted more Slaanesh stuff >:3 will not be buying, perhaps a single Keeper of Secrets. huge missed opportunity to have some fun here

edit: stuff like Mutalith Vortex Beast is so depressing... just write "If you cast it" on the card and then make the cipt ability actually good if yr scared of abuse

[pokken]

Man Bloodthirster is insane right? "take 3 combat phases per turn" yay.

Redderhoof!

pretty crazy in any general with a haste enabler -- almost surely going in my wanderer deck at some point.

[WizardMN]

Man Bloodthirster is insane right? "take 3 combat phases per turn" yay.

Redderhoof!

pretty crazy in any general with a haste enabler -- almost surely going in my wanderer deck at some point.

Unless the mockup is wrong, the additional combat steps don't seem that great since it only untaps itself. While there are ways for Red to give Vigilance to stuff, it seems like it isn't going to work that great to swing with your team too often.

It still is good for things like Xenagos for itself attacking multiple players, but I don't think it ends up being all that useful if you can't also attack with all your other stuff again too.

[Dunadain]

Man Bloodthirster is insane right? "take 3 combat phases per turn" yay.

Redderhoof!

pretty crazy in any general with a haste enabler -- almost surely going in my wanderer deck at some point.

It's probably a good thing he's not legendary, but man, that would be a fun deck.

[pokken]

It still is good for things like Xenagos for itself attacking multiple players, but I don't think it ends up being all that useful if you can't also attack with all your other stuff again too.

Yeah that does make it a bit more awkward, need vigilance enablers and such. It does still represent a lot of heat but not quite that bad.

[Mookie]

It still is good for things like Xenagos for itself attacking multiple players, but I don't think it ends up being all that useful if you can't also attack with all your other stuff again too.

Yeah that does make it a bit more awkward, need vigilance enablers and such. It does still represent a lot of heat but not quite that bad.

This sounds like a job for FORMAT STAPLE JOHAN!

...man, I was a fool for choosing Samut, Voice of Dissent as the commander of my Naya deck instead of Johan. If only I knew that its powers would be needed sooner!

[RxPhantom]

What kind of disgusting crap could Bloodthirster do in a Kaalia of the Vast deck? Good lord.

EDIT: ok, not as busted as I thought but still pretty darn good.

[NZB2323]

I'm definitely putting Necron Deathmark in my Nymris, Oona's Trickster deck. Removal on a stick and the instant speed mill can answer tutors that put cards on top of the library, or I can mill myself.

The War in Heaven seems great in Ghen, Arcanum Weaver.

[duducrash]

As we get our final 40k spoilers, heres what I'm ordering from Dominaria United. I'll get everything I can in stained glass. it looks AMAZING
For Kethis, the Hidden Hand

Silverback Elder - Value. The deck is creature based midrange and grindy. All 3 modules are nice.
Ratadrabik of Urborg - Deck is full of legendaries with hate effects. It's pretty neat here
Nemata, Primeval Warden - I love running effects like this, replacement effects for dying like Anafenza, the Foremost . It's a hate piece people miss on the board too much. dies triggers not popping off is pretty huge.
Benalish Sleeper - I'm pretty big on this card. I think I'll change the deck to include Lurrus of the Dream-Den and a package that works with him.
Plaza of Heroes - Not a great card imho, but works well specifically in this one deck.

Maybe

the dual type tap lands might be a pick too, specially the two forest ones.
Robaran Mercenaries I really need to check how many activated abilities I have. I know I have a bunch of static effects.
Greensleeves, Maro-Sorcerer - good in grindy midrangy games I suppose, I don't know if I have the space but I wouldn't mind running it. I also dig that is makes a badger token
Aron, Benalia's Ruin So, I'm trying to find where I put Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim because I kinda want to run a legendary sac outlet. Aron might be it.
Serra Paragon - Works well with the Lurrus of the Dream-Den package. It just is a bit to expensive right now.
Elas il-Kor, Sadistic Pilgrim - this seems nuts. And it seems like something that will generate too much value over a long grindy game

Cards for Veyran, Voice of Duality

Balmor, Battlemage Captain - giving trample to the team is nice. getting my spells to +2/+0 my entire board is also nice. I'm not sure how good it is, but I'll try it, not sure what payoff I'll swap for it, but it will be in at least for a while.
Twinferno [/card] - Instant speed double strike is nice. copying is okay. it's better in veyran because of magecraft and all that but I'm trying not to overboard on copy.the versatility makes me want to try.

Maybe/Misc

Impulse - I think thats my new favorite Impulse art
Shore Up - I think Lazotep Plating outclasses it, but U and the buff don't suck. I'll probably not put it in, but I think I'll get one
Timely Interference - it's a mediocre card. But U Draw a card is almost playable in this deck. U draw a card with potential upside hmmm
Founding the Third Path - It is value. It might not make the cut but it will be tried
The Phasing of Zhalfir - It is a wrath in mono blue. I don't love it, but I have a friend who does and he gets more right stuff than I do.
Electrostatic Infantry - Similar effect doesnt make the cut , like Sprite Dragon and I'm high on payoffs, but I'll test anyway...


For Raff Capashen, Ship's Mage - Planeswalking control

Urza Assembles the Titans - Good ol planeswalking value. Sagas can be cast with flash with Raph, so I get to do I and II or II and III almost together. Which is nice

Maybe

Temporary Lockdown - if we had sideboards, I would have this in the board. I think I'll get one and maybe put in whenever I'm getting beat by a bunch of tokens

For Toshiro Umezawa - Generic spellslinger control

Battle-Rage Blessing - This kind of protection is nice in mono B. This random indestructible effects are pretty common, but giving deathtouch too is nice

Maybe

Sheoldred, the Apocalypse - all arround great, but too expensive right now.


New decks I would make

Tor Wauki the Younger - Burn/spellslinger? Ever since it was spoiled I was thinking about it. Rakdos spellslinger could be fun. burn spells, kill spells, draw spells. Just all arround fun spells. I'm worried the deck wouldn't work without Tor, which can suck for a 5MV commander outside green.
Hazezon, Shaper of Sand - I would build it as a field of the dead deck
Raff, Weatherlight Stalwart - Interesting Design, I know there is a sweet spot for this deck, just dont know if I can brew it properly.

I lowkey want a battlecruiser deck. The deck you play having some drinks and not thinking too much. I like two legends from this set for this purpose. one is Shanna, Purifying Blade life gain, attacking. I think she can be build in a pretty casual way and still be pretty fun. I can even put some umbras on her to act as protection and increase the lifegain . or Danitha, Benalia's Hope . Firstr strike and vigilance are nice. It attacks well, it blocks well, and it even has lifelink. I don't hate her.


I'm going to see if I want to brew any of the decks, and if so I'll order the cards