[Off-Topic] Community Chat Thread

[RxPhantom]

Man, I'd love to have gone and actually met some of you guys. That's the same weekend as Colossalcon, in Sandusky, Ohio which I'd already locked into attending. Bah!

I've done the research, and I've concluded that you'll have a better time with us at CommandFest. Please change your plans accordingly.

Damn, Mr. Phantom, are you sure you're a pharmacist? You remind me of an intellectual carnival barker with how commited you are to promoting this get-together.

"Howdy sir, boy are you lucky to have such a beautiful edh deck by your side on this auspicious evening! But gee, sir, it looks like just the kinda deck that would love a little gameplay. Why don't you step right up, yessir you sir, step right up to Commandfest Richmond and experience a weekend of camaraderie, elation, and thrills that'll give that lovely edh deck the whirl of its dreams?"

I want this to be a massive Nexus meetup! I really love this place and the discourse that unfolds here. I think in most cases, it'll translate into good times in real life.

You're so oddly spot-on with the carnival barker thing. I'm about to make a thread in which I go for the Lyle Lanley monorail vibe.

[Venedrex]

Now here's a question, and maybe ya'll have answered it before or don't really care, but I'd be curious as to what is everyone here's color identity? I know as humans we're all pretty much all five colors but if you had to order them what would it look like in terms of how closely you relate to them?

For me it goes:



Maybe I'll give a breakdown if motivated.

What about ya'll?

What's especially funny is I am an arachnophobe. Surprise surprise lol.

[WizardMN]

That is an interesting question. If I had to order mine it would be:

B W R U G

U and R are pretty close for me so they could be interchangeable but the other 3 are solidly in those positions.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

Probably R>G>U>W >B for me.

I'm not a particularly ambitious or orderly person. I believe in honesty, passion, and the importance of leaving nature be. I also like reading and learning about things, but I also love the exhilaration of mindlessly destroying something too. I'm not social enough to be truly community oriented and not selfish enough to be in it only for myself. These things lead me to think I'm mostly RUG with a little of the other two depending on the day/mood.

[vandertroll]

Now here's a question, and maybe ya'll have answered it before or don't really care, but I'd be curious as to what is everyone here's color identity? I know as humans we're all pretty much all five colors but if you had to order them what would it look like in terms of how closely you relate to them?

For me it goes:



Maybe I'll give a breakdown if motivated.

What about ya'll?

What's especially funny is I am an arachnophobe. Surprise surprise lol.

Greatness, at any cost.

[Jemolk]

Ooh, here's an interesting question to answer! Fun stuff to think about! That's my jam!

I'd put myself as =>>>>>>>>>>>>>. I love thinking about things as deeply as possible. I'm strongly drawn to intellectual pursuits, especially things like philosophy. So blue has to be extremely high up there. But I also consider compassion to be the single most important value I hold, and believe that without such deeply held values, reason is without direction and unable to operate at all. Hence red and blue are of equal importance. I also value community greatly, in no small part because I know what it feels like to not have one. However, I also strongly reject the stratification and "order for order's sake" that white also involves as a color, meaning I take less from it than red or blue. Green is significantly more distant from white than white is from red and blue because I attach no normative importance to naturalness. If something is natural, in other words, well, so what? Doesn't make it good. I believe we ought to care for the natural world, and understand our impacts on it, of course, but green often treats nature as an object of reverence, and I don't believe it should be. Black is in a distant last place. That's not to say I have no use for ambition, or for power, but I regard power as a burden and a responsibility, and strictly a means to an end, rather than as something desirable for itself, and my ambition is directed at changing the world in ways that would make much of black's ethos either unnecessary or impossible. Hence, I take by far the least of any color from black.

How's that for an answer?

[FoxHybrid]

I think I would be w-u-g-r-b. White is definitely my primary color, as I have very specific ways of doing things and can sometimes be really subservient to a routine. I think blue would have to be my secondary color as a lot of the things I enjoy doing have to do with gaining knowledge either actively or passively. I think that my tertiary color is green as I really love the outdoors and most things nature related and I also do kinda subscribe to green's philosophy of interdependence, however, I am not the biggest fan of survival of the fittest sort of thing. Red is my second to last color because, as having white as my primary color shows, I'm not really into the spontaneity that red brings, and I'm also kind of a planner, which isn't really red's cup of tea. Black is definitely my least favored color because I'm not really willing to do much for power.

[Guardman]

rubgw

Red and blue are probably tied, as creativity is core to my identity, but I am giving a slight edge for red. While I am not an emotional person, I am very passionate. Chaos scares me, but I also find myself attracted to it. And my strongest innate desire is for the freedom to do what I please when I please, even if it is nothing. Plus I am a coward. Blue because I love to overthink things. I love to analyze things. And I have a strong desire for self-improvement for no other reason than to improve myself. I also have a strong connection with water (I almost went to college to become a freshwater biologist after all).

Black is next because I'm determined, confident, stubborn, persistent, and pragmatic. But I lack the ruthlessness and drive to truly embrace my black half.

Green is fourth (but pretty far away from black) because while I appreciate wisdom and experience, I don't have a strong connection with nature nor the past. I embrace the traditions I do because I enjoy them, not from need to give my life purpose. And my instincts are what one could call dull.

Finally is white. I find a lot of white's core tenants to be... distasteful. Order for the sake of order is the ultimate dictatorship. Conformity for the sake of conformity the ultimate oppression. Justice for the sake of justice a crutch used by too many to justify their actions. Justice should not be about punishing the wicked, but protecting the innocent. Morality is neither universal, nor black and white. It's relative.

[Venedrex]

For me, I can see myself as in so many ways. I love the concepts of knowledge, learning, research, tricks, cleverness. (not that I possess these, just that I like these qualities.) Reading, writing. I could go on and on. I love water more than any other element, between swimming and the rain, rivers and the ocean. I love the ocean especially. Not to mention the sky. Intricacy, development, complexity, lore. man I love binging lore. I can find a random universe's wiki and just tear through page after page of lore.

I think far too much and overanalyze every situation and possibility. Reserved, shy, love language and words.

Then comes . I love law and order, justice, stability, peace, community, friendship, teamwork, unity. etc etc. Even though I am solitary by nature, some of my favorite ideas are those of teams and groups of friends fighting for a common cause. I wish to be a part of a group such as that. Open areas, sunlight, good stuff. Helping others, putting your own needs aside for the group. Self-sacrifice, kindness, mercy. These are qualities I admire. Right and wrong. No gray areas, not when it counts.


Next is I am passionate about the things I love, I can have tremendous temper, (which I'm not proud of and I need to work on) but I keep it very close to the vest, which is probably the Azorius bottling it up. I get crazy sometimes. (this goes in blue as well.) I have a slight liking of fire and magma, and especially lightning/electricity. I love to joke and make people laugh, be silly and break the tension.

I think nature is fascinating from a design standpoint, full of complex parts and pieces working together (blue coming in strong) I also understand it's importance and I regret the damage humans have caused to it. But, I don't venerate it or overly enjoy being in it all the time, or tirelessly fight for it. I also love technology. I have nothing against animals, and I like to think animals see me as a neutral entity that would not do them harm. Except for all the food I eat... (so animals that are alive that I encounter)

I can be arrogant, prideful, stubborn, ambitious, willful, and I am fiercely competitive. I rarely back down. But I am not ruthless, I am not willing to sacrifice for power. I will not compromise. I do not believe that there is no right or wrong. I have no flexibility or desire to do anything to get what I want. I am a blast at parties. I will try to be the voice of reason.

[folding_music]

rbgwu

this is the fickle-minded self-centred ADHD tree-hugger who can't think straight meta. hate rules & debate, love weird, awkward, expessive outbursts. furry but don't imagine the 'sona having a job, they scavenge 'round bins and squat other people's houses. nine hundred and ninety-nine projects on the go, looking for thousandth with no plans to exit any of the others. no career skills or ambitions, just personal fantasy followed by oblivion.

green in the middle because I like to hide in the woods and stab myself with pigeon feathers

[materpillar]

Now here's a question, and maybe ya'll have answered it before or don't really care, but I'd be curious as to what is everyone here's color identity? I know as humans we're all pretty much all five colors but if you had to order them what would it look like in terms of how closely you relate to them?

For me it goes:



Maybe I'll give a breakdown if motivated.

What about ya'll?

What's especially funny is I am an arachnophobe. Surprise surprise lol.

I categorize myself better with Ravnica guilds than the 5 mana symbols. I find the mana symbols to be a bit too open ended.

Myself I'm a UR Izzet mage who thrives working with extremely explicit UW azorious laws. I've also got a side job with GW selesnya to acquire a pile of friends. I find open ended creativity to be paralyzingly in its freedom. I do better refining the systems of others. Chaos contained in a rigid hierarchy of rules is the best.

Except when I'm playing board games. Then, I'm most definitely WB orzhov. I don't play for individual games, I play for maximized number of wins. I'll significantly handicap myself in games that I'm better at, so that I'll lose the game more often. That in turn will encourage people to play me more often which means I'll in total win more games in that game over the coarse of my life. Less win% for me, but overall games played and overall more wins in total. I do not break bargains made in game because that lowers future win %. Broken bargains and betrayal of myself (in games not specifically about that theme) result in kamikaze mutual destruction to dissuade future betrayal.

[Dragonlover]

I prefer tri-colours as well, I'm pretty solidly Jeskai.

Just been updating decklists, turn out mono-W only has 99 cards in it, not a clue how that happened. Also wincons had somehow acquired a Rakdos Carnarium that it most definitely didn't start with. Again, no idea how that happened. You'd think 'decks have exactly 100 cards' would be the easy deckbuilding rule to follow.

Dragonlover

[Legend]

C>W>R>G>U >B

[DirkGently]

Lol, everyone has black at the very end. Interesting. I think I'd go:

>>>>>>>>

Blue is an easy pick for first. I've always valued book learnin' and intellectual understanding.

White and black are fairly close I think. Conceptually I'm a moral relativist, and I do sometimes let my desires override my morals (i.e. I think flying is bad for the environment, which is something I care about, but I still want to be a pilot), but despite my best efforts I still have a pretty strong naggy conscience in there (which is why I pay the stupid carbon tax on all my flights to reduce the footprint), so I think the white is greater than the black.

Red is next. I don't consider myself a particularly emotional person, but it's obviously still a part of me.

Green is solidly last. I'm not into that "acceptance" thing - if I want something different, I'm going to try to make it happen. Things can, and should, be improved whenever possible. Tradition is a useless metric for measuring worth, what is natural is not automatically better. I'll give a tiny bit of ground for being okay with camping, but I much prefer my vacation plans to give me a nice soft mattress in a warm bug-free location at the end of the day.

[materpillar]

Lol, everyone has black at the very end. Interesting. I think I'd go:

>>>>>>>>

Blue is an easy pick for first. I've always valued book learnin' and intellectual understanding.

White and black are fairly close I think. Conceptually I'm a moral relativist, and I do sometimes let my desires override my morals (i.e. I think flying is bad for the environment, which is something I care about, but I still want to be a pilot), but despite my best efforts I still have a pretty strong naggy conscience in there (which is why I pay the stupid carbon tax on all my flights to reduce the footprint), so I think the white is greater than the black.

Red is next. I don't consider myself a particularly emotional person, but it's obviously still a part of me.

Green is solidly last. I'm not into that "acceptance" thing - if I want something different, I'm going to try to make it happen. Things can, and should, be improved whenever possible. Tradition is a useless metric for measuring worth, what is natural is not automatically better. I'll give a tiny bit of ground for being okay with camping, but I much prefer my vacation plans to give me a nice soft mattress in a warm bug-free location at the end of the day.

I mean black mana is most frequently displayed cliche eeeeeeeevil. No one wants to say that they're eeeeeeeeevil. Or at least it's ambition at the cost of others or whatever. That's way less good to say about yourself compared to emotional, smart or law abiding. People also have green pretty low. Because again being a nature hippy is less flattering to say about oneself than I'm blue because intellect.

This is why I like guilds/shards better than specific colors.

[folding_music]

don't worry, giggle, saying you're law-abiding is the most uncool thing I can think of

[Dunharrow]

This is a funny exercise. I always considered myself Bant, but have noticed that I am more red than I thought.

I am most definitely green, first and foremost. I care about nature, the natural order, and do not believe in the human 'right' to own, control and conquer the world.
I am white because of the Community. I am very much Selesnya. I care mostly about fairness and equal access to all members of the community. I also care a lot about the balance of nature and civilization.
I am Blue because of my curiosity. I have a masters degree because I enjoyed science and wanted to do research. Every day I am looking up things to better understand subjects. My hobbies are all focused on educating my soul and my mind.
I am Red because if embrace my emotions. I am not hot-headed or impulsive at all, but I wear my heart on my sleeve.
Black is a distant 5th. I see nothing black in my personality. I am not selfish or ambitious. I have been in sales for the last 5 years and would sooner direct my customer to a competitor than sell them something I didn't believe in.

I love the simic but the idea of improving one's self artificially does not resonate with me.
I am a messy person, but I have high expectations of myself and those I care about to behave ethically. So not so much about laws, but more about what is philosophically right. Not quite Azorius.
So ya, for a single guild, I would call myself Selesnya the most.

[WizardMN]

That is an interesting question. If I had to order mine it would be:

B W R U G

U and R are pretty close for me so they could be interchangeable but the other 3 are solidly in those positions.

Since everyone else went into more details about their color identities, I figured I might as well do so as well.

Black: I have a very strong belief in autonomy, in pushing forward oneself for the sake of oneself. This doesn't come at the direct expense of others in my case, but I also don't allow myself to be beholden or obligated to others either unless it is something I want to do. This most often comes up in situations where I just simply don't want to do something. Doing something for someone else is great, and I do that often enough, but most of the time I need some return on my investment for me to consider it. In the end, "looking out for number 1" is a fairly apt characterization.

White: I want order and rules to be followed. Usually this manifests itself in games where I ensure all the rules are followed (probably why I know the MTG Rules as well as I do) and don't often appreciate deviation from said rules. This isn't absolute or inflexible as I still tend to bend things when it suits me or perhaps the people I am with (see "Black") but more often than not I prefer order.

Red: I am not often emotional but I tend to be passionate about my pursuits. When I want to do something, my focus becomes about that. It doesn't come illogically necessarily but I can be somewhat narrow-focused at times and other responsibilities or other things I should/could do fall by the wayside for a time.

Blue: I sort of want Blue to be higher because I do enjoy intellectual pursuits as well, but I don't think it comes before the others. Even then, it often is more supporting of my other colors: Learning Magic Rules ties into my white side, learning new things for work I think honestly ties more into my Red side (it is a means to end more so than a goal in itself), and learning trivia just allows me to share knowledge (well, as much as trivia can be considered knowledge). I just don't often learn new things just for the sake of learning them. I am good at learning new things but there usually has to be a goal beyond the learning itself. On the other hand, I do enjoy knowledge and enjoy being able to speak intelligently about a variety of topics. As well as being willing and able to engage with someone to learn something from them as well.

Green: I hate tradition to the point where I have already thought of my wedding, if I ever have one, and how much I want to deviate from the norm. I hate "fate" or anything where the world can be seen as a status quo of sorts. Nothing exists that can't be changed in some way. At best, my green side mostly manifests itself in my appreciation of the outdoors (I enjoy fishing and taking walks and being in the woods) and my love of animals. So, my green side is easily more present in terms of a connection to nature but I despise enough other things about green that it is easy to put at the bottom.

[TheGildedGoose]

I think using such an obviously flawed and limited system is more harmful than useful, even if you know that going in. Put another way: if you're spending this much time thinking about and analyzing things in terms of a card game's, uh, "philosophy" then you probably have the time to actually explore these topics seriously and should do that instead.

Sorry, boyos and girlos. No fun allowed.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

I think using such an obviously flawed and limited system is more harmful than useful, even if you know that going in. Put another way: if you're spending this much time thinking about and analyzing things in terms of a card game's, uh, "philosophy" then you probably have the time to actually explore these topics seriously and should do that instead.

Sorry, boyos and girlos. No fun allowed.

Too bad, so sad, bird man. The fun's already been had and we ain't giving it back.

More seriously, thinking about the game's colors as representatives of basic philosophical ideals and how we personally identify with them isn't pointless. Discussing philosophy in any context surrounding anything is at least getting people to engage with philosophies, personal and external, and understanding the reasoning underpinning those arguments and beliefs, i.e. the basis of rational thinking.

Besides, this is a magic forum. You expect us to be dissecting Hegelian dialogues or something?

[TheGildedGoose]

I think using such an obviously flawed and limited system is more harmful than useful, even if you know that going in. Put another way: if you're spending this much time thinking about and analyzing things in terms of a card game's, uh, "philosophy" then you probably have the time to actually explore these topics seriously and should do that instead.

Sorry, boyos and girlos. No fun allowed.

Too bad, so sad, bird man. The fun's already been had and we ain't giving it back.

More seriously, thinking about the game's colors as representatives of basic philosophical ideals and how we personally identify with them isn't pointless. Discussing philosophy in any context surrounding anything is at least getting people to engage with philosophies, personal and external, and understanding the reasoning underpinning those arguments and beliefs, i.e. the basis of rational thinking.

Besides, this is a magic forum. You expect us to be dissecting Hegelian dialogues or something?

I just think of the years it took me to unlearn using bad tools in life. In this case, without expounding on why, I think Magic's philosophies are, uh, inadequate and lead to bad philosophy which is worse than no philosophy. Basically, if you're going to build a house, use the right tools.

The house, of course, is ideology. *Slovenian sniffle*

As for dissecting Hegel, well, I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

I think using such an obviously flawed and limited system is more harmful than useful, even if you know that going in. Put another way: if you're spending this much time thinking about and analyzing things in terms of a card game's, uh, "philosophy" then you probably have the time to actually explore these topics seriously and should do that instead.

Sorry, boyos and girlos. No fun allowed.

Too bad, so sad, bird man. The fun's already been had and we ain't giving it back.

More seriously, thinking about the game's colors as representatives of basic philosophical ideals and how we personally identify with them isn't pointless. Discussing philosophy in any context surrounding anything is at least getting people to engage with philosophies, personal and external, and understanding the reasoning underpinning those arguments and beliefs, i.e. the basis of rational thinking.

Besides, this is a magic forum. You expect us to be dissecting Hegelian dialogues or something?

I just think of the years it took me to unlearn using bad tools in life. In this case, without expounding on why, I think Magic's philosophies are, uh, inadequate and lead to bad philosophy which is worse than no philosophy. Basically, if you're going to build a house, use the right tools.

The house, of course, is ideology. *Slovenian sniffle*

As for dissecting Hegel, well, I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy.

Yeah, but if you're building a pillowfort for a nerf war with your nephew, does it really matter what tools you use? You're missing the point. We're here for entertainment. We play magic for entertainment.

The rest of most of our lives will be alternately hard, serious, or boring. When I'm on a forum talking about a game in which I pretend to be a multi-dimensional wizard summoning dragons and casting fireballs, I am not necessarily seeking intellectual nutrition. I am seeking other people interested in being multi-dimensional wizards and I for one would love to hear what kind of wizard they think they'd be.

Edit: why don't you just tell us your colors already instead of being pretentious? We know Black is probably #1, but c'mon. Play the game, Harding.

[Jemolk]

Put another way: if you're spending this much time thinking about and analyzing things in terms of a card game's, uh, "philosophy" then you probably have the time to actually explore these topics seriously and should do that instead.

Could do that instead, but why not just do both? Philosophy's fun, but it can sometimes be a bit convoluted, so why not use some Magic terms to assist?

I mean, sure, I could describe myself in terms of analytic philosophy, and talk about the moral philosophies of Kant and Bentham, and where I think each go seriously wrong, and how I resolve those issues. My self-description would certainly become more detailed and precise if I'm more explicitly drawing on Albert Camus' absurdism, since I align fairly closely with it. I'd also probably involve some more niche philosophers and their ideas, like drawing on the neurophilosophy of Douglas Hofstadter, and I could discuss why I disagree with John Searle's takes on the same. And of course, the rabbit hole has still barely begun, so there's far more to dive into. And all of that's good fun, given an audience of philosophers. But that gets pretty arcane, doesn't it? Not the sort of discussion that's even easy to follow if you're not spending a bunch of time studying philosophy. And for a more basic discussion, Magic colors work well enough as a starting point.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

@Jemolk Let's please not have that discussion. I do not want to have cite my forum posts in APA or provide 10,000 annotated footnotes in an attempt at argumentative clarity.

[Jemolk]

@Jemolk Let's please not have that discussion. I do not want to have cite my forum posts in APA or provide 10,000 annotated footnotes in an attempt at argumentative clarity.

Ah, the downsides of going in-depth with academic rigor. So many downsides. I suspect that after a few too many lazy afternoons, I might start feeling like dissecting Hegel would be just the thing I'd want to do for fun, and the citations would be well worth it, but that's certainly not where I'm at right now.

P.S.: APA format wouldn't necessarily be required. I believe most philosophy journals go by the Chicago Manual of Style formatting for citations these days instead. So, in addition to citations, learning a new style of citation. CMoS might also just be the single most needlessly complicated citation format I've seen. Fun fun.