Unreleased and New Card Discussion

[Rumpy5897]

Thinking about it holistically, I really like what they've been doing with white for the past couple of years. White's issue is that it plays a fair form of Magic in a draw-happy, ramp-happy format, so it gets left behind. Tapping into the rule setting part of its nature to keep up is honestly brilliant. The fact those cards do nothing if your foes are playing fair Magic as well is great. R&D is still twiddling the knobs, and it takes a while to generate enough card pool to grant decks flexibility. But we're off to a good start.

If thinking about the various recent options from a similar flavour perspective, then recurring fetches to ramp feels kind of like cheating. However, white has been known to engage in occasional creative bookkeeping

Unofficial Spoiler Discussion

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Terramancer seems like a very good card, one of the better catch-up ramp options available in the colour now. Costing two mana is a big deal, and all you need to do is catch a solitary fetch or Rampant Growth to get a Rampant Growth of your own. People happily play two-mana ramp-ones, and it's not exactly the world's most difficult hoop to clear to get one via this card. And then you may even get more!

Of course, my prior grievances of "why the hell is this in a precon rather than the main set?!" continue applying. It really feels like a concerted effort to sauce those things up around the board.

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[Serenade]

Re-running through this set, I noticed Navigation Orb. I've had Thaumatic Compass // Spires of Orazca in nongreen decks before that cared about a certain land type (and Journeyer's Kite before that). Not sure I ever activated it more than twice (eight mana total), and those lands to go hand.

As such, I'll try the Orb out in place of those cards. I think Charix will like it.

[Mookie]

First of the new commander decks previewed, it's Illithid Horror tribal // mill.

• Brainstealer Dragon looks like a lot of fun - at seven mana, it's a bit slow / expensive, but it does promise a lot of value.
• Aboleth Spawn looks like a powerful tech card against blink / flicker decks... or just against decks with lots of ETB effects in general (which feels like most decks). I appreciate that it doesn't entirely shut down the source of the effect, so people are still rewarded for playing their cards (unlike Hullbreacher and some other hate cards). It's possible I'm overestimating it, but does look quite solid.
• Psionic Ritual is a powerful payoff for horror tribal. Seems bad if you're only getting a Spelltwine though - you really want 3+ cards off it.
• From the Catacombs is a repeatable recursion spell, assuming you have fuel for it. Five mana is a bit expensive for a reanimation effect, but could be interesting.
• Uchuulon is a very weird source of grave hate. I don't expect it to live for that long, but even just one or two triggers could make enough bodies to be worth running.

[kirkusjones]

I want to live the dream of discarding Uchuulon to Scuttletide in a lower power version of Oskar, Rubbish Reclaimer and casting it in response because synergy.

EDIT - I only just now made the Oscar the Grouch connection to Oskar, even though he's not green. I am le dumb.

[Sporegorger_Dragon]

Am I losing my mind? Zellix, Sanity Flayer? Rewards all of blue and black's incidental mill with tokens?!

[Igzex]

I think Astral Dragon is my new favorite card in the entire game. I do not know how WOTC found a way to make a card I could possibly enjoy casting more than I did Fractured Identity but I think they did it. There are so many weird plays I want to do with it right now. Let's make an army of Crucible of Fires that can also stab you. Or what if I were to tell you that I can populate Zendikar Resurgents. Tell me duelists how does it feel to want to disenchant my Doubling Season EVEN MORE? Guess who found a new way to kill you all with Dragon Tempest?

[Mookie]

Am I losing my mind? Zellix, Sanity Flayer? Rewards all of blue and black's incidental mill with tokens?!

Altar of the Brood → Zellix seems... quite strong. Throw in Undead Alchemist and Altar of Dementia for some further redundancy.

As for more stuff....
Artificer Class is a solid bit of value for artifact decks.
Astral Dragon is total nonsense. Yes, I would like two copies of my opponents' best artifacts/enchantments.
Bothersome Quasit is very interesting. I've consider some goad stuff for my Kess deck in the past, just to ward off attacks for a turn cycle, and having a repeatable goad engine sounds quite nice.

[Dragoon]

I feel somewhat cheated that the Draconic Dissent deck only has two new dragons, but Astral Dragon is indeed nice.

[TheGildedGoose]

From the Catacombs is amazing. 5 mv is a tad high, considering 4 is the going "fair" rate, but Escape really elevates it to the next level. Since any serious reanimator deck is going to be running ways to stock its graveyard anyway, 5 cards is an easy cost. Sure, losing the creature to exile sucks, but when I was running The Mimeoplasm I got used to it. A+ card.

[DirkGently]

It initially looked great to me, but then I remembered Diabolic Servitude exists and isn't that popular. Obviously there are some advantages and disadvantages but they're fairly comparable. So I think it'll be a fine role-player but not super common.

I gotta say, any card with the text "take the initiative" makes me not want to play it just for the annoying overhead of managing dungeons for each player for the rest of the game. Huge internal groan.

[TheGildedGoose]

Servitude can only reanimate one creature at a time. I mean, yeah, ostensibly you don't want to overcommit with an army of large critters, but the versatility and difficulty of interacting with it really make it something special. Initiative is... fine, I guess.

[BeneTleilax]

At least the Initiative dungeon is pretty relevant as a game object. It'll make interesting things happen as long as exists, if nothing else giving some people free cards and changing the rationale for attacks. My pet peeve coming out of innistrad is all the incidental Day/Night cards. I have no problem with the new Werewolves, or Vadrik, where that's your deck, but I've now seen several times where someone's played a The Celestus, had it destroyed, and then had to track an effectively meaningless marker for the rest of the game in case someone else drew their random incidental day/night card. Miserable bookkeeping that feels like a slide back into the graveyard-order days.

[TheGildedGoose]

MID/VOW are two sets chock full of awful design. I think it's best if we never go back to Innistrad.

[DirkGently]

Servitude can only reanimate one creature at a time. I mean, yeah, ostensibly you don't want to overcommit with an army of large critters, but the versatility and difficulty of interacting with it really make it something special. Initiative is... fine, I guess.

Well yes, like I said there are plusses and minuses. Servitude costs less, doesn't get removed by gy hate, and doesn't require exiling your graveyard, ftC lets you bring back multiple things, gives the initiative, doesn't get removed by enchantment hate, and can target enemy graves. I think ftC is better, but not by a ton.

[Yatsufusa]

Baeloth Barrityl. Entertainer looks fun as board control for Animar. Only gonna cost R and I shouldn't have issues getting +1/+1 counters on him. Sure, probably still more straightfoward to just trample, but he's definitely the more entertaining choice.

Spectacular Showdown really feels like Insurrection meets Cyclonic Rift in a way, but because it's reliant on the same conditions as Insurrection and actually even slower than it if you're waiting for the goad to play out (and backfires on you if it turns it to a 1v1)... it can be argued to be worse than even a card that rarely sees a place in decks anymore, even if it's templated like one of the most powerful cards in the format.

Endless Evil is a windmill slam in terms of name/flavor for Grimgrin, but anything worth attaching this to is already a removal magnet on its own and I don't need any more incentive for 2-for-1s since this isn't in the tribe (not complain though, Zombies are obviously multitudes stronger than horrors as tribe anyway). Neither is this worth attaching to just generate zombies (at this point I'd rather just risk Endless Ranks of the Dead and I'm at a point even that card doesn't cut it anymore due to board dependency). I'll stay satisfied with Necroduality.

[TheGildedGoose]

Well yes, like I said there are plusses and minuses. Servitude costs less, doesn't get removed by gy hate, and doesn't require exiling your graveyard, ftC lets you bring back multiple things, gives the initiative, doesn't get removed by enchantment hate, and can target enemy graves. I think ftC is better, but not by a ton.

Graveyard hate is irrelevant; if you're playing Re:Animator, well-timed 'yard hate is already the bane of your existence, so getting your recursive reanimator getting exiled along with your creatures is a moot point.

Really, the only significant benefit Servitude has is its marginally lower mana value. That's important on turns 3, 4, 5, or 6, sure, but beyond that, the difference is generally negligible, and the upsides of FtC (namely dodging enchantment removal and ease of recursion) far, far outweigh the lower mv of Servitude. The biggest issue is countermagic. If someone counters Servitude, well, tough titty. If someone counters FtC, see you in a few minutes.

[folding_music]

Haunted One Atogatog lol

edit: I would never do that of course :3 but it'd be even better in Dina, Soul Steeper I think and I love her approach, as if I don't already have enough black+green decks

[Lifeless]

Baeloth Barrityl. Entertainer is just perfect for what I like to do in our group and the added flexibility from the Background should help a lot. Can't wait to get this guy on the table.

[Mookie]

Sarevok's Tome is interesting - I like cards that can act as ramp in the early game, and provide value in the lategame. I may have to test it out, although if you aren't running other ways to venture into the dungeon, it may be too slow. I guess the baseline is 5 turns, assuming you keep the initiative and venture into the undercity every turn? Hmmm....

Venture Forth amuses me greatly. I've found it somewhat rare to get more than two casts of Inspiring Refrain off, so may be too slow. I'll probably still try it out though - if you're looking for a long, drawn-out game, it can represent a fair amount of ramp.

edit: Folk Hero is an okay white draw engine for tribal decks.

Black Market Connections is interesting to contrast with Phyrexian Arena - it costs an extra life, but you also get the card immediately. Throw in the treasure and token production, and it looks quite strong.... assuming you can afford the life cost. (edit: reading is tech >.>)

Deep Gnome Terramancer seems like an interesting hate card. As others have noted, it triggers off fetchlands, which is sort of nice. Doesn't even require your opponent to have more lands than you.

[duducrash]

Bothersome Quasit
Delayed Blast Fireball will be tested in Veyran, Voice of Duality

[DirkGently]

Black Market Connections is interesting to contrast with Phyrexian Arena - it costs an extra life, but you also get the card immediately.

Precombat main. Unless you can flash it in on upkeep, you'll be waiting until next turn.

Idk why it's precombat main instead of upkeep tbh, seems random.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

Black Market Connections is interesting to contrast with Phyrexian Arena - it costs an extra life, but you also get the card immediately.

Precombat main. Unless you can flash it in on upkeep, you'll be waiting until next turn.

Idk why it's precombat main instead of upkeep tbh, seems random.

Precombat main > upkeep. You've got to draw a card and have already paid costs, so you can best assess your needs from BMC. It's a weird, slight buff if anything. Personally, I would pay four just to give it the frontier siege treatment and collect on both main phases. That would be sweet.

[Serenade]

It would be neat to get every background for every iteration of enchantress I ever hope to run. I'll pick up Myrkul, Lord of Bones as well. Other than that there is not much to grab for me from this set. The DND theme still has a big "this is not for me" feel to it, like I should not be touching it because it is not my thing.

(I am ignoring the objectively good white cards because I will not be paying that much for them now. I can wait three years for reprints in Commander Masters. Probably two years. Probably next year.)

[Sporegorger_Dragon]

I'm at work and I saw the spoiler for Nalfeshnee and I misread the type line as "Breast Demon" and I NEARLY DIED.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

NGL, these precons seem above average. I think I'll get one. All but the horror one I find very appealing. So weird. A set from which I want nothing has 3/4 decks I'd feel fine buying.