Unreleased and New Card Discussion

[TheAmericanSpirit]

I do hope there isn't a hullbreacher situation, though.

I would pray to (a, The, whichever) God that your hopes are made real, but given my clerical rank and the current size of my miter, I'll instead pray to the God of IGMCULSL that I can instead snag a copy of HB 2.0 or whatever nonsense before the price balloons.

More seriously, do you really believe WotC learned its lesson after last time? The urge to be cynical is nearly irresistible, but I ask that question in earnest.

[Dragoon]

I do hope there isn't a hullbreacher situation, though.

I would pray to (a, The, whichever) God that your hopes are made real, but given my clerical rank and the current size of my miter, I'll instead pray to the God of IGMCULSL that I can instead snag a copy of HB 2.0 or whatever nonsense before the price balloons.

More seriously, do you really believe WotC learned its lesson after last time? The urge to be cynical is nearly irresistible, but I ask that question in earnest.

I hope whatever happens happens in white.

[5colorsrainbow]

Loving seeing adventures branching out into non-creatures. Means it maybe possible to make a really adventure heavy deck without sacrificing too much as all adventures are basically all modular spells. Again nice to see a fixed Chulane with Gorion and hopefully some fun adventures i the set and/or the decks.

[kirkusjones]

Sad to see it go, but Dark Privilege is getting cut from Grismold for Cultist of the Absolute. Also have to make room for the one that produces squirrels, I think. I'm still working on cuts from New Capenna, too. Woof.

[Mookie]

• Majestic Creation looks very interesting - it's essentially a discount Genesis Wave if your commander costs 6+ mana. It's a flat amount, so not quite as impressive if you have absurd amounts of mana, but the fact that it doesn't care amount the mana value of the cards you flip makes it a meaningful upgrade over Genesis Wave's low end. Obviously absurd if you're running Ghalta, Primal Hunger, The Ur-Dragon, or another super-expensive commander.
• Duke Ulder Ravengard looks fun for a beatdown deck. You don't get extra attack triggers (so missing out on a bit of Sun Titan value), but still very good with ETB effects (or just big stompy things). I approve.
• Wilson, Refined Grizzly is amazing. Won't unseat Ayula, Queen Among Bears as the de-facto bear tribal commander, but I won't complain about a refined gentlebear for the distinguished player.
• Gluntch, the Bestower is a legendary jellyfish - erm, Flumph. If that doesn't amuse you, then this set probably isn't for you.

[folding_music]

Korlessa rules <3 you get to play all the worst dragons, then trainwreck them all into play off the top... Mist Dragon... Tek... Belltoll Dragon... all the hits <3 and you don't get any kind of cost-reducing ability to make them good apart from being in UG. very funny commander

[Dragoon]

Korlessa rules <3 you get to play all the worst dragons, then trainwreck them all into play off the top... Mist Dragon... Tek... Belltoll Dragon... all the hits <3 and you don't get any kind of cost-reducing ability to make them good apart from being in UG. very funny commander

She really seems like limited fodder at best to me. She's a conditional draw engine in the two colours best at drawing cards, so what's the point?

[folding_music]

I think every legendary creature I've ever liked has been limited fodder lol
i'm swiftly getting the desire to build every uncommon Rulebook commander while ignoring the big powerful options that show up in the precons

[Hermes_]

[*]Duke Ulder Ravengard looks fun for a beatdown deck. You don't get extra attack triggers (so missing out on a bit of Sun Titan value), but still very good with ETB effects (or just big stompy things). I approve.

[/list]

Would Godo, Bandit Warlord work with it or not?

[Rumpy5897]

If by "work" you mean "perform an infinite combo", then no. Myriad creatures depart at the end of combat, so even if you chose to keep a token copy of Godo over the original, he'd be gone by the time the next combat starts. If by "work" you mean "tutor out more equipment" then yes, but I somehow don't think you meant that.

Also Sun Titan would still work quite nicely as the recursion is an ETB as well

[Mookie]

Also Sun Titan would still work quite nicely as the recursion is an ETB as well

Hence 'missing out a bit of value' instead of 'missing out on all the value'. But yeah, probably not the best example.

Korlessa, Scale Singer is... very interesting - I suspect it will primarily appear in the 99 of 5C dragon decks like The Ur-Dragon, but two mana Future Sight is pretty solid. Dragon tribal without red seems pretty odd, but if there is one tribe that has enough off-color members to support a deck, it's probably dragons.

Viconia, Drow Apostate is an interesting callback to Oversold Cemetery. I've found it fairly inconsistent in the past, but putting it on a creature lowers the opportunity cost a bit for decks that would want it (i.e. decks that want their graveyard to be full of creatures). Probably not as powerful as Ravos, Soultender in the command zone, but still intriguing.

[Hawk]

Far Traveler is fascinating as a way to turn any commander (but especially the "Choose Your Background" commanders) into your very own Conjurer's Closet. After Cultist of the Absolute it is the Background I'm anticipating seeing the most both in the command zone and even in the '99.

For Korlessa, Scale Singer I actually am sorta intrigued. At last count when I was research for Volo there was something like 31 dragons in Simic and that was pre-Neon Dynasty which added Kairi, the Swirling Sky and Kura, the Boundless Sky and also doesn't count changelings (since Volo can't run changelings). I think there's a real chance one could make a real deck there.

[Dragoon]

For Korlessa, Scale Singer I actually am sorta intrigued. At last count when I was research for Volo there was something like 31 dragons in Simic and that was pre-Neon Dynasty which added Kairi, the Swirling Sky and Kura, the Boundless Sky and also doesn't count changelings (since Volo can't run changelings). I think there's a real chance one could make a real deck there.

If you want to reliably have a dragon on top, you either need a lot of top deck manipulation (which will dilute your theme) or at least 30+ dragons (which will result in a very high curve). I really think those type of cast-from-the-top effects are traps for any type of card that you don't have at least 30 of. How many times did you whiff with a Courser of Kruphix for example? And that's with 35-38 lands in your deck on average. At least, Herald's Horn also ramps you.

[Serenade]

Eh, I still want to dig around with Nalia. Looking at the top of deck always feels strong to me. Maybe I should just run a Reality Chip deck.

[DirkGently]

What's the EV of "you may play the top of your deck" in terms of card draw?

With no qualifiers (Future Sight) you'd expect to brick a second land after ~5 cards? So you get 4 cards on average? Ofc this assumes you can cast all spells which obviously won't be the case especially early-game, making these effects worse early.

With casting only, first land is on average like 2.5-3 so you only cast 1.5-2 cards on average. Actually it might be lower since 2.5-3 is when you'd expect 1 land, but it's not necessarily the last of those cards. Hmm.

With 30% dragons or whatever, it's 30% to cast 1 spell, 9% to cast 2 spells, 2.7% to cast 3 spells, etc. so your EV is around .6 cards per turn? Again assuming infinite mana. Wait, I'm wrong - it's not 30% for exactly one spell, it's 30% for at least 1 spell, so it overlaps with the 9%. So it's .3 + .09 + .027 etc, so more like .43 cards per turn.

Up to 50% dragons, it's easier math… .5 + .25 + .125 etc which asymptotes to 1 card per turn, hooray.

All of that also assumes no top deck manipulation and again, infi mana.

[Vertierer]

No opinions on Faldorn, Dread Wolf Herald aka Aggro Prosper so far? It doesn't generate mana advantage as Prosper does but I think it could be a viable aggro commander with all the impulse draw red has gotten lately.

[DirkGently]

No opinions on Faldorn, Dread Wolf Herald aka Aggro Prosper so far? It doesn't generate mana advantage as Prosper does but I think it could be a viable aggro commander with all the impulse draw red has gotten lately.

Honestly he looks awful. Prosper costs 1 more to cast, but he generates free card advantage while enabling himself. Faldorn costs a mana to use, plus taps him, and doesn't even generate card advantage. And the payoff is a 2/2 wolf token? Weak sauce. How on earth is he mythic? And another thing, why is his trigger so much clunkier than prospers? I can't imagine why it wouldn't equate to the same thing.

Getting value off casting stuff from exile is a trash-tier strategy anyway imo, it's so much harder to make a coherent plan when your cards are all this-turn-only, and visible to your opponents to boot. You're locked into just playing a bunch of stuff and hoping to stumble into a win. At least Prosper helps give you more mana to lower the odds of being unable to cast an important card that just got exiled, but the strategy is flawed from the start imo.

[BeneTleilax]

Cultist of the Absolute I'm not so sure about. Seems good to give +3/+3, flying, and ward to Tymna, and sacrificing creatures like Arena Rector, Academy Rector, or an ETB creature I can get back with Ravos seems good, but most of my creatures I don't want to sacrifice.

That's the card that had my interest, but from what I've read you can only use them with creatures that have "chose a background".

So I believe that it works as a partner for cards that have "chose a background," but you can play it as a normal card in your deck otherwise.

Does "choose a background" still tutor if both are in the 99? Anyway, Cultist looks excellent for Syrix, it'll probably take Vorpral Sword's spot.

[DirkGently]

Does "choose a background" still tutor if both are in the 99? Anyway, Cultist looks excellent for Syrix, it'll probably take Vorpral Sword's spot.

I don't think there's any reason to think it uses the "partner with" tutoring thing, given that cards with "choose a background" have reminder text but don't mention it. Partner with only let you tutor one particular card, this would be just casually stapling a fairly flexible tutor onto a card. Hell, it would functionally mean any commander would have 2 backgrounds - the one they're partnered with, and the one they tutor for when cast xD (plus more when recast).

[Venedrex]

Well, the one thing I know about Faldorn, Dread Wolf Herald is that it is BFF's with Escape to the Wilds.

[Dragoon]

How on earth is he mythic?

It's the front face commander for the gruul precon.

[Vertierer]

No opinions on Faldorn, Dread Wolf Herald aka Aggro Prosper so far? It doesn't generate mana advantage as Prosper does but I think it could be a viable aggro commander with all the impulse draw red has gotten lately.

Honestly he looks awful. Prosper costs 1 more to cast, but he generates free card advantage while enabling himself. Faldorn costs a mana to use, plus taps him, and doesn't even generate card advantage. And the payoff is a 2/2 wolf token? Weak sauce. How on earth is he mythic? And another thing, why is his trigger so much clunkier than prospers? I can't imagine why it wouldn't equate to the same thing.

Getting value off casting stuff from exile is a trash-tier strategy anyway imo, it's so much harder to make a coherent plan when your cards are all this-turn-only, and visible to your opponents to boot. You're locked into just playing a bunch of stuff and hoping to stumble into a win. At least Prosper helps give you more mana to lower the odds of being unable to cast an important card that just got exiled, but the strategy is flawed from the start imo.

Stumbling into a win with a game plan based on impulsive actions sounds like my cup of tea, tbh :D
The activated ability isn't that cool, unless you're pitching Anger or something like that, but being able to create bodies whilst playing stuff could be good if you have the means to use them for your advantage. And you're in green with access to ramp, so it's more likely to be able to cast the stuff you're exiling.
But maybe it's just too cute and I should stick to playing Pako and Haldan ^^

[Serenade]

I'm obsessed with Livaan, Cultist of Tiamat. Not sure what background to pair with her, but an ability based on casting noncreature spells...always feels strong. Maybe I am just bored of Kykar. Maybe this is the UR artifact deck I want? Perhaps a lot of ramp spells? No way I do another enchantress deck...

[NZB2323]

That's the card that had my interest, but from what I've read you can only use them with creatures that have "chose a background".

So I believe that it works as a partner for cards that have "chose a background," but you can play it as a normal card in your deck otherwise.

Does "choose a background" still tutor if both are in the 99? Anyway, Cultist looks excellent for Syrix, it'll probably take Vorpral Sword's spot.

I don't believe so. I'm not a rules expert and I've never played D&D, but from what I understand you chose a background for your creature before you start playing, and that creature has the background for the whole adventure. So it would work more like partner, not partner with. Also I haven't seen anything saying it allows tutoring.

[GuJiaXian]

I'm obsessed with Livaan, Cultist of Tiamat. Not sure what background to pair with her, but an ability based on casting noncreature spells...always feels strong. Maybe I am just bored of Kykar. Maybe this is the UR artifact deck I want? Perhaps a lot of ramp spells? No way I do another enchantress deck...

Would she work well with Feather, the Redeemed?