[mtgnexus] Random Card of the Day - Rishkar, Peema Renegade
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I feel like this was a cool mechanic that got wrecked by powercreep. A 4/4 for 4 in white of all colors that gains relevant protections was a great rate back then, though having to wait for the opponent to resolve a creature was still a significant drawback. Today these cards would need to be more aggressively costed or fatter threats. As a 6/6 I'd slam this into giant tribal or enchantress easily. If it cost 3 and had the same stats, I'd do the same (being a valid sun titan target would help a lot). As it is, just too weak for today's game even in more casual tables.
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DirkGently My wins are unconditional
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Is bad.
The way I play I would almost never kill an enchantment, even an annoying and potentially game-winning one like rhystic, on an early turn. Sure, it might give them enough value to win, but it also paints a massive target on their head and keeps pressure off me. Or someone else might answer it first. I want to see how things develop before going in guns blazing.
I could imagine aura shards being something I'd want to kill sooner rather than later, especially if it was primarily hurting me, but honestly I don't think I've seen that card in like 5 years. Maybe that's just a coincidence.
Only partly the fact that it can stick around - it's also that karn can hit literally anything, so I don't need to also run an artifact answer or a planeswalker answer or a land answer or whatever. Nor do I need an alternate answer when I'm on single-digit life.TheGildedGoose wrote: ↑3 years agoI would much, much rather tutor for a 2mv answer than a 7mv answer, even if in theory the 7mv answer can stick around to cause more damage. Feed the Swarm does have two significant drawbacks, but it's not like it's a dead card. Karn can rot in your hand for several turns due to his high cost, but you can always just pinpoint kill a problematic creature like Gaddock Teeg or Hushbringer, or a value enchantment like Rhystic Study or Smothering Tithe. They don't have to be win conditions to be game winners, as I'm sure you know.
Also, expletive Aura Shards with a rake.
The way I play I would almost never kill an enchantment, even an annoying and potentially game-winning one like rhystic, on an early turn. Sure, it might give them enough value to win, but it also paints a massive target on their head and keeps pressure off me. Or someone else might answer it first. I want to see how things develop before going in guns blazing.
I could imagine aura shards being something I'd want to kill sooner rather than later, especially if it was primarily hurting me, but honestly I don't think I've seen that card in like 5 years. Maybe that's just a coincidence.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Wayta - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Eris - Magda - Ghired2 - Xander - Me - Slogurk - Gilraen - Shelob2 - Kellan1 - Leori - Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Wayta - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Eris - Magda - Ghired2 - Xander - Me - Slogurk - Gilraen - Shelob2 - Kellan1 - Leori - Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
The only one of the Opal/Veiled/Hidden series that I ever consider is Opal Acrolith since it can change back…but those stats, ick. Maybe we'll get an homage to these guys one day with a major boost to power, but for now this guy is just nostalgia (Opal Gargoyles saw heavy play in my earliest 60-card days).
Mirri, Cat Warrior counts as a Cat Warrior.
- hyalopterouslemur
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Hmm...vanilla 4/4 for four mana? No. So why not give it a downside? A mild downside, yes.
Yeah, not a fan. But it does demonstrate how conservatively costed creatures were back then, that even the lolwtfbbq what's a playtest block (Like, literally, at least Urza's Destiny had zero playtesting.) has things like this.
Anything with Hidden, Opal, Veiled, or Lurking in the name rom this block is similar. Opalescence is related, not quite the same, and hilarious for rules issues that were resolved in the mid-00s.
Yeah, not a fan. But it does demonstrate how conservatively costed creatures were back then, that even the lolwtfbbq what's a playtest block (Like, literally, at least Urza's Destiny had zero playtesting.) has things like this.
Anything with Hidden, Opal, Veiled, or Lurking in the name rom this block is similar. Opalescence is related, not quite the same, and hilarious for rules issues that were resolved in the mid-00s.
Thanks to Feyd_Ruin for the avatar!
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3drinks Kaalia's Personal Liaison
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Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
I collect Kaalia of the Vast normal-size cards. Do you have any extra taking up space in your binder? Help me grow my collection!
Kaalia HQ
I collect Kaalia of the Vast normal-size cards. Do you have any extra taking up space in your binder? Help me grow my collection!
Kaalia HQ
Bolas rock is good. It's interesting to me how rarely I see it but I think it must be the necropotence effect (triple black). The Mana cost is rough but man its just busted when it sticks even in a value role.
And of course it combos on accident.
And of course it combos on accident.
Landed it three times. Two got immediate scoops (it was effectively winmore). Last time it was a topdeck where I had one turn left. I dug three or four cards deep looking for a sweeper but dig not it (then I scooped). No regrets. I only use it for my big black mana deck but probably should try it in others.
Mirri, Cat Warrior counts as a Cat Warrior.
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DirkGently My wins are unconditional
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I really dislike this card. It has the paradox engine effect where it comes down and I immediately internally groan thinking "how long is THIS crap going to take?" It provides insane CA, insane mana cheating, and why not a wincon too. Imo it's the posterchild of "what a sweet commander card!" that's actually miserable - at least for cards outside of the CZ.
I've probably played it once or twice, but as a general rule I try pretty hard not to. It's just not fun imo.
I've probably played it once or twice, but as a general rule I try pretty hard not to. It's just not fun imo.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Wayta - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Eris - Magda - Ghired2 - Xander - Me - Slogurk - Gilraen - Shelob2 - Kellan1 - Leori - Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Wayta - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Eris - Magda - Ghired2 - Xander - Me - Slogurk - Gilraen - Shelob2 - Kellan1 - Leori - Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
I wonder if people playing it would cut it for Yawgmoth's Bargain if it were unbanned.
The New World fell not to a sword but to a meme
Very strong, solid card. I currently play it in only one deck, Karlov, where the life payment is fairly trivial. It has straight out won me games on more tha one occasion.
I have 68 active EDH decks, with more in progress. I don't consider this a problem. Do you?
I am also one of those barbarians who enjoys winning by turning creatures sideways.
I am also one of those barbarians who enjoys winning by turning creatures sideways.
Flavor wise, it's very very Bolas, but too combo-enabling for my taste, but oh so Bolas.
*Groan* Oh hi distant cousin of Paradox engine. Not even the original Mirrodin block's Johnny cards were THIS blatantly obnoxious.
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Krishnath Mechanical Dragon
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This card is the exact reason I keep an artifact removal spell in hand if I draw one and play against black. That said, the few times I've seen it, it's been good but not game winning. I find that often people who play it end up overspending life making them easy targets.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.
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Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.
Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.
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Guardman A Dog's Dream of Man
- Posts: 1771
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- Location: In a Turn-Based World
My favorite memory of this card was one of my opponents was combing off with Bolas's Citadel and Aetherflux Reservoir picking off each opponent with Aetherflux Reservoir activations. When he came to me I had a Cavalier of Flame and one red mana up, which I used to Bolt Bend the Aetherflux activation targeting me back at him, winning me the game.
One of the poster cards for why Wizards shouldn't design for commander. It seems like they too often confuse "over the top and splashy" with "overpowered nonsense that breaks the game." Crap like this looks like a big fun Timmy card, an expensive flavorful artifact that does big things, but it just does too much in this format and takes over the game in a boring, repetitive way. God I hate this card.
FIRE design brought with it a lot of cards that elicit a jaw-drop of a reaction on first sight. Surely this can't be real, how could they have printed something so busted? More often than not, trying to playtest the thing reveals some hidden drawback that wasn't apparent at first. The poster child for this is Moraug, a card that's not quite as brainless as it appears.
Bolas Rock was the first of those that I remember. It casually showed up on screen as a preview in the middle of the first big Arena tournament, to zero response from the casters. My pulse quickened - this card is insane! How do they have nothing to say about it?! In all my time playing Magic, never had a new preview elicited such a strong and sustained excitement from me. Kudos to my friend who put up with me jabbering about how crazy awesome it is for about five consecutive weekly lunches. At the time, I viewed it as a phenomenal, balanced design - after all, you're aggressively haemorrhaging life to make this happen, and if you brick on consecutive land then that's the end of things for a turn. You need a topdeck editor and/or life gain to make this crazy. Daxos has bits of both! And so a six mana non-enchantment something made its way into the deck, and my fiery passion for the card made me not realise that a deck which previously rarely did anything too stupid before turn 8-9 was sometimes able to accomplish insanity on turn four or so.
Only recently did I sober up to how ridiculous this card is in general. Point one, topdeck editors and/or lifegain are not really that harsh a restriction, especially if Necropotence counts as a topdeck editor here. Point two, even without those, the card is crazy goodstuff, as evidenced by my goodstuffy friend shoehorning it into every single x deck he's built lately and it doing work without synergy. Point three, it's a ridiculous time sink that puts you far ahead in a protracted fashion. I got to watch Selenia slow-roll a Bolas Rock turn through an ever-increasing mountain of support pieces recently. It was obvious we were done for once it landed, but it took quite a while for the constituents to come together.
In true 2019 fashion, Bolas Rock establishes a category of attention-grabbing card that would follow, but overshoots the mark and creates a bit of a monster.
Bolas Rock was the first of those that I remember. It casually showed up on screen as a preview in the middle of the first big Arena tournament, to zero response from the casters. My pulse quickened - this card is insane! How do they have nothing to say about it?! In all my time playing Magic, never had a new preview elicited such a strong and sustained excitement from me. Kudos to my friend who put up with me jabbering about how crazy awesome it is for about five consecutive weekly lunches. At the time, I viewed it as a phenomenal, balanced design - after all, you're aggressively haemorrhaging life to make this happen, and if you brick on consecutive land then that's the end of things for a turn. You need a topdeck editor and/or life gain to make this crazy. Daxos has bits of both! And so a six mana non-enchantment something made its way into the deck, and my fiery passion for the card made me not realise that a deck which previously rarely did anything too stupid before turn 8-9 was sometimes able to accomplish insanity on turn four or so.
Only recently did I sober up to how ridiculous this card is in general. Point one, topdeck editors and/or lifegain are not really that harsh a restriction, especially if Necropotence counts as a topdeck editor here. Point two, even without those, the card is crazy goodstuff, as evidenced by my goodstuffy friend shoehorning it into every single x deck he's built lately and it doing work without synergy. Point three, it's a ridiculous time sink that puts you far ahead in a protracted fashion. I got to watch Selenia slow-roll a Bolas Rock turn through an ever-increasing mountain of support pieces recently. It was obvious we were done for once it landed, but it took quite a while for the constituents to come together.
In true 2019 fashion, Bolas Rock establishes a category of attention-grabbing card that would follow, but overshoots the mark and creates a bit of a monster.
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TheAmericanSpirit Supreme Dumb Guy
- Posts: 2237
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- Location: IGMCULSL Papal Palace
I like it personally. Necropotence is one of my all time favorite cards and this is double the cost to have that ability on steroids.
That being said, it definitely taps way too deep into my avarice and I damn near kill myself with it every time I play it. I just can't help myself, I'm a sucker for big splashy artifacts.
oh why did you have to go, Paradox Engine? Why didn't you take me with you? No stinking citadel could ever replace you, it's galaxies apart from your greatness. You'll always be unbanned in my heart.
That being said, it definitely taps way too deep into my avarice and I damn near kill myself with it every time I play it. I just can't help myself, I'm a sucker for big splashy artifacts.
oh why did you have to go, Paradox Engine? Why didn't you take me with you? No stinking citadel could ever replace you, it's galaxies apart from your greatness. You'll always be unbanned in my heart.
There's no biscuits and gravy in New Zealand.
(Except when DirkGently makes them!)
(Except when DirkGently makes them!)
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3drinks Kaalia's Personal Liaison
- Posts: 5004
- Joined: 5 years ago
- Pronoun: he / him
- Location: Ruined City of Drannith, Ikoria
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
I collect Kaalia of the Vast normal-size cards. Do you have any extra taking up space in your binder? Help me grow my collection!
Kaalia HQ
I collect Kaalia of the Vast normal-size cards. Do you have any extra taking up space in your binder? Help me grow my collection!
Kaalia HQ
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TheAmericanSpirit Supreme Dumb Guy
- Posts: 2237
- Joined: 5 years ago
- Pronoun: he / him
- Location: IGMCULSL Papal Palace
I read this in Hank Hill's voice for some reason, and now I can't stop imagining the whole device being powered by propane and propane accessories lol.
There's no biscuits and gravy in New Zealand.
(Except when DirkGently makes them!)
(Except when DirkGently makes them!)
WArlen of the SparkTheAmericanSpirit wrote: ↑3 years agoI read this in Hank Hill's voice for some reason, and now I can't stop imagining the whole device being powered by propane and propane accessories lol.
Mirri, Cat Warrior counts as a Cat Warrior.
That card ain't right.TheAmericanSpirit wrote: ↑3 years agoI read this in Hank Hill's voice for some reason, and now I can't stop imagining the whole device being powered by propane and propane accessories lol.
Tinker-able Future Sight + Yawgmoth's Bargain = straight to Vintage. I'm not sure it was ever one of those "casual"/splashy EDH cards.
What they don't seem to get is that there is literally not a mana cost for a spell to say "You win the game" on it. And it sure as hell is not less than 10. And it sure as sure as hell is not 6.onering wrote: ↑3 years agoOne of the poster cards for why Wizards shouldn't design for commander. It seems like they too often confuse "over the top and splashy" with "overpowered nonsense that breaks the game." Crap like this looks like a big fun Timmy card, an expensive flavorful artifact that does big things, but it just does too much in this format and takes over the game in a boring, repetitive way. God I hate this card.
They keep making adjustments like:
"OK, they don't like 6 mana game winning bombs like Bolas's Citadel and Thousand-Year Storm."
"Ok, how bout 8? Aminatou's Augury still bullcrap."
"Ok, how bout 9?" Reshape the Earth still bullcrap. Expropriate also even more bullcrap."
"But why aren't X spells that win the game at 15 or so okay? Torment of Hailfire still bullcrap."
"But Tooth and Nail has bene here doing it for 9 for a while and Enter the Infinite for 11. That has to be okay right?"
There is no point at which you should auto-win with a sorcery of any cost. Ramping is easy. Making infinite mana is just not hard and it's more and more common every year.
Part of the ethos of commander should be "It just takes more than one card to win."
Let's stop with the I-Win buttons already
(The reason these single card I-win buttons are so problematic is that it just lets you load up on ramp, interaction, tutors and draw because you don't need to string multiple cards together to win. Some of these cards (e.g. augury, expropriate, tooth and nail) do require other cards in your deck but you only have to tutor for one of them to win which is the problem)
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DirkGently My wins are unconditional
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While I mostly agree, I don't think anyone is complaining about Comet Storm or let alone Fireball. If someone gets infinite mana, it doesn't really matter between infinite x-cost or Kumano, Master Yamabushi. X-spells I think are a special case because you can't really cheat the cost. Torment of Hailfire is arguably too efficient (plus back has more capacity to go big mana than other colors between coffers, doublers, and and tutoring - arguably even bigger than green, when we're talking non-infinite large numbers) but if you're generating enough non-infinite mana to fireball the table out, I'd say well played.
Other good thing about big x-cost burn spells is that there's more play with them. You can lifegain out of range, or produce tokens to combat hailfire, etc.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Wayta - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Eris - Magda - Ghired2 - Xander - Me - Slogurk - Gilraen - Shelob2 - Kellan1 - Leori - Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Wayta - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Eris - Magda - Ghired2 - Xander - Me - Slogurk - Gilraen - Shelob2 - Kellan1 - Leori - Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Yeah I definitely gave in to my natural predilection for hyperbole, but realistically speaking the mana cost needs to be like 50 or 60 to require infinite these days. You can just make such absurd mana with stuff like Nyxbloom Ancient and similar.DirkGently wrote: ↑3 years agoWhile I mostly agree, I don't think anyone is complaining about Comet Storm or let alone Fireball. If someone gets infinite mana, it doesn't really matter between infinite x-cost or Kumano, Master Yamabushi. X-spells I think are a special case because you can't really cheat the cost. Torment of Hailfire is arguably too efficient (plus back has more capacity to go big mana than other colors between coffers, doublers, and and tutoring - arguably even bigger than green, when we're talking non-infinite large numbers) but if you're generating enough non-infinite mana to fireball the table out, I'd say well played.
Other good thing about big x-cost burn spells is that there's more play with them. You can lifegain out of range, or produce tokens to combat hailfire, etc.
You pretty much need to be designing cards assuming someone at an EDH table will be making 20 mana at the very least and so random cards that cost 7 mana and present a "counter this or lose" scenario - that's just too damn much.