ISB Raffine

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TheAmericanSpirit
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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 1 year ago

Decklist

Artifacts (3)

Approximate Total Cost:

Took me a while to post this, but here it is. This deck is a blast to play and an aggro lover's dream. I blatantly stole the skeleton from @ISBPathfinder and I haven't looked back. The general want list is in the spoiler below, but it stands on its own as it is now.
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Temporal manipulation
Fierce guardianship
Entomb
Imperial seal
Vampiric tutor
Mana crypt
Gemstone caverns
Last edited by TheAmericanSpirit 1 year ago, edited 10 times in total.
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Post by ISBPathfinder » 1 year ago

lol the commander and deck is a lot of fun. My issue is that I think in the 8ish games I played I think I lost one and the ones I won I cleaned up by turns 6-8 most of the time. It really felt like they would need to interact with my commander the turn I played it or be super fast themselves to compete. It just got to the point that I felt like I was a half step behind cEDH and it wasn't where I wanted to be.
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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 1 year ago

ISBPathfinder wrote:
1 year ago
lol the commander and deck is a lot of fun. My issue is that I think in the 8ish games I played I think I lost one and the ones I won I cleaned up by turns 6-8 most of the time. It really felt like they would need to interact with my commander the turn I played it or be super fast themselves to compete. It just got to the point that I felt like I was a half step behind cEDH and it wasn't where I wanted to be.
People play a lot of random combos in my meta, so I guess I just don't have the same ethical qualms about ruthlessly pursuing a comparitively fair win condition. There's no real ramp, no huge explosion of mana or draw, no combos, no board locking or stax. Just curving out with little goons, which is still very good but fair by all my marks and measures!

Anyway, thank you for once again being a great inspiration. I wish I had your talent and imagination for brewing, but since I don't, I'm glad I get to pirate lists as cool as yours lol
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Post by Dunadain » 1 year ago

I'm curious now, can someone link me isb's deck?
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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 1 year ago

Dunadain wrote:
1 year ago
I'm curious now, can someone link me isb's deck?
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Post by duducrash » 1 year ago

Low curve builds are challenging and super fun to do! I build Raffine, Scheming Seer too, taking great inspiration from @ISBPathfinder's list. I took it apart because I the conquest format (variation?) is getting popular over here and I think I'll make a Raffine conquest

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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 1 year ago

duducrash wrote:
1 year ago
Low curve builds are challenging and super fun to do! I build Raffine, Scheming Seer too, taking great inspiration from @ISBPathfinder's list. I took it apart because I the conquest format (variation?) is getting popular over here and I think I'll make a Raffine conquest
Do you have a list up anywhere? I'd love to compare notes.

As for conquest, I don't think multiplayer magic can ever be truly competitive. French Duel Commander is where it's at for competitive singleton imo. But I gotta say, I can appreciate a subsection of the cedh community jumping ship for a format built to their specifications. Good riddance to bad rubbish says I.
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Post by duducrash » 1 year ago

TheAmericanSpirit wrote:
1 year ago
Do you have a list up anywhere?
I don't have a list I think, a card I really liked I don't think yo run is Glen Elendra Archmage !

Conquest has been really popular here as of late

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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 1 year ago

duducrash wrote:
1 year ago
TheAmericanSpirit wrote:
1 year ago
Do you have a list up anywhere?
I don't have a list I think, a card I really liked I don't think yo run is Glen Elendra Archmage !
Ol' Archmage is a classic and counters two spells. I'll give it a shot if I can acquire one!
Conquest has been really popular here as of late
Well, let me know if I'm wrong and it's the next hotness! But bear in mind: Tiny Leaders was once popular too.
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Post by kirkusjones » 11 months ago

A few caveats: my new playgroup is pretty casual. They don't play tutors or fetches for the most part. No infinite combos (not even endless bees, courtesy of @TheGildedGoose). People run some spot removal, in a typical game there might be one, maybe two board wipes at the most.

So this is the deck. The strategy is simple, best articulated by @TheAmericanSpirit: "deploy and destroy."

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decklist

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Return to the Ranks and maybe Patch Up should make their way into the list, as should Hopeful Initiate. I'm open to suggestions, I know the manabase could use some work.

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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 11 months ago

ISB Raffine, Aggro Filter Queen

Artifacts (2)

Enchantments (2)

Approximate Total Cost:

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All of these cards are probably good enough, but alas there is only so much room. I switch things out as necessary
Because I traded into modern a few months ago, I have some things to re-acquire.
want list
Approximate Total Cost:

@kirkusjones here it is, sorry for the delay! This is my cardboard Cadillac, my marquee deck. I have stuffed as much raw power as I can into each and every slot, I once again have to thank @ISBPathfinder for laying the groundwork and inspiring me to build what has become my favorite EDH deck ever by a huge margin.

Looking at your list, I think you're off to a great start but there's a few things that seem a bit dubious imo:
-thopter foundry/sword of the meek combo is pretty random
-Are the equipment really better than more creatures? Sword of the Animist is functionally a 4 drop and can't swing by itself. Jitte is probably good enough, to justify itself anywhere, but all the rest are probably worse than Skullclamp and I'm not sure even that is worth it.
-I have an irrational hatred of Vedalken Orrery in most decks, but here it really feels like the ceiling is haste for the goon squad and little beyond. At least the leyline can be free sometimes. I'd cut 'em both for goons
-I highly recommend investing in the real estate of this deck. Curving out perfectly in turns 1-3 is essential to a consistent aggressive start. Being color-screwed and delaying Raffine by even one turn can be fatal to the tempo advantage.
-I know this is going to sound like a direct contradiction to my previous statement, but do look into the manlands. I've found that being able to pile counters onto a Blinkmoth Nexus or whatever and then hide that threat in my manabase is another way to keep attacking through sweepers. I don't really count them as lands though a la Strip Mine or Maze of Ith because of their inability to contribute to a t3 Raffine.
-Also, you gotta try Skyhunter Strike Force. Not only is the name of this card cool as all hell, but the damage this thing can create out of nowhere is truly unbelievable. Basically a F-16 fighter jet made of biceps (Powerthirst, anyone?).
-EDIT: Speaking of insane 3 drops, look into Breena, the Demagogue. She can add up to 8 counters per turn cycle, so she functions as a backup buff machine with a dash of CA to sweeten the deal. I switch between SSF and Breena based on whether I feel like I want the speed (SSF) or the durability (B,tD) on a given game night.

Anyway, my list is decidedly NOT casual, but I have deliberately eschewed as many EDH taboos are possible. No combos, no mld, no alternate wincons, no stax, nothing but pure combat damage. The time magic might as well be an additional combat spell stapled to Explore for my intents and purposes, so even the saltiest aspect has been brought down to its floor for abuse. And you know what, I have yet to meet the player who can justly complain about being beaten by the most eminently fair win condition in the game, especially in my meta which I would generally characterize as slightly faster than average and a touch combo heavy.
Last edited by TheAmericanSpirit 11 months ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by kirkusjones » 11 months ago

I don't know how I missed Skyhunter Strike Force in my initial search. Good googly moogly is that thing a house. I'm going to cut Alela, Artful Provocateur for it, which means the equipment can kick rocks as well, opening up room for goons and Clever Concealment.

I'll fiddle with the manabase, I have the shocks, they're just tied up in other decks currently.

I had a blast playing an even worse version of the list above last week, so I can't imagine how much I'm going to enjoy sitting down with something much more streamlined come Tuesday.

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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 11 months ago

kirkusjones wrote:
11 months ago
I don't know how I missed Skyhunter Strike Force in my initial search. Good googly moogly is that thing a house. I'm going to cut Alela, Artful Provocateur for it, which means the equipment can kick rocks as well, opening up room for goons and Clever Concealment.

I'll fiddle with the manabase, I have the shocks, they're just tied up in other decks currently.

I had a blast playing an even worse version of the list above last week, so I can't imagine how much I'm going to enjoy sitting down with something much more streamlined come Tuesday.
Brace yourself for an unreal experience. It feels like playing the best Legacy cube deck of all time, a pure opiate to the senses if you have any love for the red zone at all.

You're gonna like the way it plays,
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Post by pokken » 11 months ago

These decks need more Thieving Skydiver and Stormscape Familiar :) (I see Kirk has one at least)

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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 11 months ago

pokken wrote:
11 months ago
These decks need more Thieving Skydiver and Stormscape Familiar :) (I see Kirk has one at least)
Stormscape is great and is included. Skydiver was tested and found wanting. Even nabbing a sol ring or a crypt is just a little eh to me given the heavy colored costs in my build. Maybe if there were more equipment decks in my meta it would be better, but there's just not much stuff I'd actually want to bother poaching. Also, to steal anything at all, it becomes a 3 drop and 3 drops have to be above and beyond the moon for this deck to justify the weight of spending 3 whole mana on a single thing.

However, thinking of 3 drops reminds me that I never tested Adeline, Resplendent Cathar. Now that's a 3 drop. Thanks Pokken, for once again coming in clutch for the worn out manual transmission of my memory.
Last edited by TheAmericanSpirit 11 months ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by pokken » 11 months ago

I think I must have typo'd when I searched or something lol :) Real genius here.

I also like Scheming Fence for similarly crapping on early plays.

My opinion on Thieving Skydiver is that if it just blew up their Sol Ring it'd be plenty strong, because this deck cares so much about early game tempo and stopping people from exploding. So maybe Loran of the Third Path is right for that (though probably not at the lower to the ground end).

The thing I dig about SkyD is that it can just curve out as a 2 drop flier when that's the right play.

incidentally, something I've learned from Breena is that vigilance is outsized good in these decks. Having your pumped creatures available to block really messes with the tempo / combat math calculations.

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Post by kirkusjones » 11 months ago

I'm on the fence about the Foundry/Sword combo. The prospect of making a few 1/1s at the end of an opponent's turn or some surprise blockers really appeals. And the incidental lifegain isn't terrible. I'm going to test it and if it doesn't measure up, it'll get cut. Stormscape Familiar is back in after cutting the equipment. Thanks fellas!

@pokken - I'm definitely on board with the vigilance plan. I had OG Heliod in a draft of the list but swapped him for Reconnaissance. Too bad there wasn't an incarnation that granted vigilance. Stupid Valor.

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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 11 months ago

kirkusjones wrote:
11 months ago

@pokken - I'm definitely on board with the vigilance plan. I had OG Heliod in a draft of the list but swapped him for Reconnaissance. Too bad there wasn't an incarnation that granted vigilance. Stupid Valor.
I know right?! First strike is good and all, but Vigilance is just so much better. And when red is getting haste and blue is getting flying in the same cycle, you know it's unfair. I really need to find another Reconnaissance.

As for skydiver, again there might be a time/place for it but I haven't found it yet. Good card, just not good enough here imho. The goon slots are just waaaay too competitive.
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Post by ISBPathfinder » 11 months ago

Man Raffine was so fun. Its almost a shame how dang fast it is lol. I like that Gold-Forged Thopteryx pickup. Also wow on Skyhunter Strike Force lol.
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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 11 months ago

ISBPathfinder wrote:
11 months ago
Man Raffine was so fun. Its almost a shame how dang fast it is lol. I like that Gold-Forged Thopteryx pickup. Also wow on Skyhunter Strike Force lol.
You can come back anytime you like, you are the progenitor of this great thing after all. We get new toys almost every set. Honestly, I think your initial design is one of your finest works yet, and though I think I have innovated a little on that decklist, I can't help but recognize that I am definitely standing on the shoulder of a giant here. 👍👍👍
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Post by Moonlighter » 11 months ago

TheAmericanSpirit wrote:
11 months ago
snip
Basically a F-16 fighter jet made of biceps (Powerthirst, anyone?).
snap
Anyway, my list is decidedly NOT casual, but I have deliberately eschewed as many EDH taboos are possible. No combos, no mld, no alternate wincons, no stax, nothing but pure combat damage. The time magic might as well be an additional combat spell stapled to Explore for my intents and purposes, so even the saltiest aspect has been brought down to its floor for abuse. And you know what, I have yet to meet the player who can justly complain about being beaten by the most eminently fair win condition in the game, especially in my meta which I would generally characterize as slightly faster than average and a touch combo heavy.
I've been trying to decide on a new deck. @toctheyounger's Tayam, Luminous Enigma deck was definitely on the list, as it is streamlined, brutal, and the kind of sharp deck design I expect from toc - but I ended up deciding against it just because that would make 2.5 graveyard decks out of my relatively small pile (Baba Lysaga, Night WitchCadaverous Bloom needs some better grave support), and it would be my second combo-centric grind-out GY deck, after Alesha. I truly struggle with feeling like blue is fair in magic, so most of my decks don't run it, except Phelddagrif (on Dirk's design), which is decidedly unfair about it's control package, but the intent is different. This looks like a lean, mean, fun deck. The last paragraph there about avoiding combo, avoiding mld, just trying to make a sharp, incisive deck, is definitely something I'm interested in, so I think this is my next deck. I'll be excited to report back when it's here! Thanks for reading my blog post. Smash that like button to subscribe.
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Post by toctheyounger » 11 months ago

Can't blame you, Tayam is known as one of the more complex decks in any format of magic.
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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 11 months ago

@Moonlighter Good to have you aboard! Our aim here is to do something simple and do it well. I will admit, it is kinda a graveyard deck, especially if you go with the buried alive/bloodghast/prized amalgam/incarnation plan like I have. There is also room for a light combo package if you want by adding Abdel Adrian, dance of the dead, and corpse knight (just in case your meta absolutely demands a backup plan).

I look forward to see how you build it. Make bold choices!
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Post by pokken » 11 months ago

Ephemerate and Time Warp and Archaeomancer is probably the most compact wincon of all good cards you can get.

Add Recruiter of the Guard to be able to go recruiter → spellseeker → ephemerate spellseeker for Mystical Tutor, Mystical Tutor for Time Warp, raffine dig into time warp, cast Time Warp, ephemerate Recruiter of the Guard for Archaeomancer and the game is over.

Costs a decent amount of mana to do in one cycle, but no bad cards in the piles, just slightly medium (Recruiter of the Guard and Archaeomancer are the worst ones, but still decent).

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Post by duducrash » 11 months ago

I have to put Raffine back together, was my favorite deck for a while, but a bit too good. It jusr goes brrrrrrrr

Cards I remember liking were

Healer's Hawk
[Triton Shorestalker
Lurrus of the Dream-Den
Remorseful Cleric

One card I did not personally play but I wanted too when saw
Ayara's Oathsworn

Card I remember always being underwhelming for me was, surprisingly, Sol Ring Id rather play a dork. Also didnt need much generic mana

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