MCD: White Board Protection Instants

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Post by PrimevalCommander 1 year ago

It all started in 2017 with Teferi's Protection. A new class of board protection that also saved your bacon against combat alpha strikes, targeted spot removal, Cyclonic Rift, and nigh anything that would affect you or your board. This card became an instant staple, and I didn't see the immediate potential. I went several years knowing it was a good card, but the price turned me off significantly.

Three years later in 2020 the commander free spells came out with Flawless Maneuver. Now we all know which two other cards in this cycle caught the most attention, so like many, again I overlooked the potential for such an efficient way to protect my on-board focused decks from interaction. The ability to easily use this offensively is also a boon to the free cast ability. By the time I saw the light, this was also $20+ and unattractive to me because I knew it would get a reprint eventually, which it did.

After 2020 when white board protection spells started to become more prominent and available with Grand Crescendo and Akroma's Will the same year, I was determined not to miss the boat this time, so I made sure to get at least a copy or two of most every playable board protection spell that came out. Well after a couple years, they kept printing more and more variants, many more than I expected in a short amount of time. As we see in the budget section, these effects have been around for over a decade, but it's obvious that Tef.Prot. with the return of phasing got everyone thinking about mass board protection again. Along with Heroic Intervention in green. Now I have so many board protection options I couldn't hope to play them all, which is not a bad place to be, I'm just in awe of how much juice they pumped into this space in 2023 and 2024.

Today I have mono-white tokens playing 5 variants. Tef.Prot, Akroma's Will, Flare of Fortitude, Clever Concealment, and Guardian of Faith. I think 5 is overkill but my primary method of play is if I have one in hand, I can aggressively commit to the board to bait a wrath spell. Then I can save my board and keep on chugging along. I also count Akroma's Will in the win-con slot, so dedicated slot is 4 cards. The only feel bad is to have the Flare of Fortitude only to get blasted by a Toxic Deluge. Seeing Dawn's Truce sparked the thought that, maybe I have enough things that grant Indestructible, even at 2 mana, which is efficient, I could play three other cards that can cost ZERO MANA. That is some stiff competition, I mean you really cannot beat . I'll probably pick up a Dawn's Truce because it's cheap, but only 1 copy this time after grabbing 2 flare of fortitude, 2 clever concealment, and 2 galadriel's dismissal. I still like the Hexproof clause, and the mana efficiency, but if I only have 1-3 copies of this effect in my deck, I'm usually saving is for the inevitable wipe, not for a 1-for-1 trade against spot removal unless I'm desperate.

The Nitpicking Nerds had a discussion on Unbreakable Formation, and besides the requirement to hold 3 mana with no alternative cost reduction, the conclusion was Indestructible is simply not reliable enough to get a place in the deck in a more tuned list. Too many ways around indestructbile in Bounce, Exile, -x/-x, sacrifice, and more. Now I tend to agree that if I was playing in a 85% meta, say "optimized casual" I think it's Tef.Prot. and maybe Concealment or Galadriels Dismissal. Phasing is the only way to guarantee protection from the higher power wipes in the format.


Rambling aside, my questions are: Which one of these options see the most play for you? Let's remove Tef.Prot. from the conversation, as we know it is Best-In-Class and always gets first pick if you have it available. For argument's sake, you don't have one, or don't have any more copies for consideration for this discussion ;) . Also how many of these are you playing if you feel like this effect (outside Tef.Prot.) is worth putting in your deck? Is Indestructible valuable with today's pushed removal suite, or is Phasing all you look for now?


Phasing:
Galadriel's Dismissal 2023
Clever Concealment 2023
Guardian of Faith 2021
Teferi's Protection 2017

Hexproof + Indestructible
Flare of Fortitude 2024
Dawn's Truce 2024
Akroma's Will 2020 (protection from all colors)

Indestructible (Premium)
Grand Crescendo 2022
Flawless Maneuver 2020

Indestructible (Budget)
Restoration Magic 2025
Duty Beyond Death 2025
Divine Resilience 2024
Your Temple Is Under Attack 2022
Unbreakable Formation 2019
Make a Stand 2016
Rootborn Defenses 2012

Mass Blink
Eerie Interlude
Ghostway
Glorious Protector
Lae'zel's Acrobatics
Semester's End
Last edited by PrimevalCommander 3 months ago, edited 5 times in total.

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Post by Moxnix 1 year ago

Flawless sees the most play ( its free and a Suprise that can win games) followed by arkmoas (mostlu as white createrhoof) followed by Teferi's protection I have not used the others. I did a see a dawns protection on mtgo last night to protect bumble flowers smothering tithe with 2 one rings on the field not that it really helped him staring down two oen rings and having his commander gutted every turn just kind of payed for all the tempo loss. I do however also use some selfless spirit and borimir even eldrazi monument.

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Post by yeti1069 1 year ago

I think I'm only running Teferi's in Queen Marchesa at the moment. Holding up 3 mana can be a lot for many of my decks, and especially in that turn 4-5 range when the deck is just starting to get rolling. Wraths at that stage can be back-breaking even more so than later, with a bigger board, because an engine may have been chugging along for a bit by that point.

Galadriel's Dismissal is also in QM, as both a second Teferi's and to be used offensively.

I have Clever Concealment in Frodo+Sam, Ghired, and maybe one other deck. That card is FANTASTIC! The only problems with mass phasing (aside from TP), as opposed to mass indestructible, is that they can't be used offensively very well, and they leave you open to attacks. As such, I try not to use it to save one or two cards at a time.

Flare I've added to a deck, but not sure which. I'd initially considered it for Frodo+Sam, but if I have to use it before combat, it can turn off a bunch of cards by stopping life gain. In decks that don't care about that, and tend to have a white creature I don't mind sacrificing on board early and often, I'd probably run that.

Akroma's Will I've had in and out of a couple decks, but almost exclusively as a finisher. As a reactive protection spell, I really don't want to be holding up 4 mana, and the other effects will be kind of a waste.

Flawless Maneuver I run in Frodo+Sam, Eowyn, and I think Ghired. Should probably be running this in some more decks. Sure, indestructible doesn't offer as broad protection, but it works vs a lot, and being free is just very strong. It also has been great offensively before my own wipe.

I had had Unbreakable Formation in Flaco Spara, because that deck cares about the counters, but it was either getting used to power an attack against a blocker-heavy board. I've now swapped this for something else.

I'll note that in my last Falco game, I'd had both indestructible and mass shield counters available, but got wiped twice anyway, once by Toxic Deluge and once by some Eldrazi exile board wipe.

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Post by pokken 1 year ago

Missed one of my faves Glorious Protector :)

I don't run a lot of these effects. Mostly they suck if you need to catch up and I feel like wipes are being played less and less. That said I usually will cram some if they synergize with the deck. There's fun stuff like Together Forever for counters decks and protector/guardian for blink decks.

I will run flawless maneuver a lot cos it's free and has other applications along with Akroma's Will which is also a wincon.

I usually won't run any indestructible only unless it's free or has alternate utility. They just are too narrow.

All in all I think it's a fun way that white has developed in commander because it also synergizes with your own wipes. So that's fun.

Teferi's Protection is a card I run sparingly. It's really good at just winning. But it's also good at not catching you up and leaving you as the last to die cos it doesn't stop game winning engines. I tend to play this in decks that run Farewell type cards or decks where I often have a big board state. But frankly it's not a very interesting card and I often cut it despite the power.

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Post by yeti1069 1 year ago

pokken wrote:
1 year ago

I don't run a lot of these effects. Mostly they suck if you need to catch up and I feel like wipes are being played less and less. That said I usually will cram some if they synergize with the deck. There's fun stuff like Together Forever for counters decks and protector/guardian for blink decks.
I keep wanting to like this, but needing to hold up mana for an onboard answer that still sets you back on tempo (having to recast whatever you save) has just always felt like not what I want.

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Post by Moxnix 1 year ago

I agree with all of pokkens post though I had not seen that angel before now. Teferi's is a powerful effect but predicting when to not use your mana on turn to prep for a wipe that might not come has a cost for that effect where as flawless seems to be universally good effect of this type and likewise I use Arkoma to kill not defend.

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Post by Sinis 1 year ago

My single go-to is Teferi's Protection. I have two copies (one from the commander precon, one from the Mystical Archive, which was cheap-ish on release). It's always worth playing. Sometimes you're dodging a board wipe, sometimes it's someone's artless Craterhoof strike or Torment of Hailfire. On occasion, I've played it on my own turn just as the weakest Time Walk, because opponents were tapped out and I knew I could secure the win the next turn.

After that, I'll play one or two effects that do it, depending on the deck. One of the things I think is great about this glut of them is that you can pick one that best suits. Aggressively costed commander? Flawless Maneuver is good. Very wide board? I like Clever Concealment. Tall creatures? Akroma's Will (to be fair, Akroma's Will would be good in almost any creature-oriented list).

If I had to make a top three in a vaccuum, it would probably be Teferi's Protection, Clever Concealment and Flare of Fortitude. These are a cut above for me because they can protect non-creatures as well.

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Post by PrimevalCommander 1 year ago

yeti1069 wrote:
1 year ago
I had had Unbreakable Formation in Flaco Spara, because that deck cares about the counters, but it was either getting used to power an attack against a blocker-heavy board. I've now swapped this for something else.

I'll note that in my last Falco game, I'd had both indestructible and mass shield counters available, but got wiped twice anyway, once by Toxic Deluge and once by some Eldrazi exile board wipe.
Exactly the situation I'm worried about. Makes me think the phase out options are a cut above the rest. All best-in-class wipes in , , and bypass indestructible. As does All is Dust for . I still see indestructible be useful many times, but phasing is only going to become more and more valuable over time. Until the protection : removal arms race sees our first wipe that phases in all creatures before destroying them.

Seeing many commenting on holding up mana, even for absolute protection, is hard to do might make the versions that have cost reduction or alternate cost the long term winners compared to the others that always require 2-4 mana to have up.

I'm getting a Dawn's Truce to have because it is only 2 mana, but I don't have a slot for it anywhere and still have 4 other protection pieces waiting for a deck.

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Post by PrimevalCommander 1 year ago

pokken wrote:
1 year ago
Missed one of my faves Glorious Protector :)

I don't run a lot of these effects. Mostly they suck if you need to catch up and I feel like wipes are being played less and less. That said I usually will cram some if they synergize with the deck. There's fun stuff like Together Forever for counters decks and protector/guardian for blink decks.

I will run flawless maneuver a lot cos it's free and has other applications along with Akroma's Will which is also a wincon.

I usually won't run any indestructible only unless it's free or has alternate utility. They just are too narrow.

All in all I think it's a fun way that white has developed in commander because it also synergizes with your own wipes. So that's fun.
Added a section for Mass Blink, which has been underused since commander's rise to fame, including by myself. I am using Glorious Protector in a blink shell and it's great!

I'm beginning to agree about indestructible being pretty narrow unless it's free so you don't slow your own progression while remaining protected. Hexproof + Indestructible is somewhat better because if I'm playing a big bomb that I know the table needs to answer, it is a bit easier to foresee the removal coming and be ready. If they don't target it, then I'm winning anyway with my big threat.

I'm actually seeing wipes being played as much or slightly more, since there are so many more on-board engines being assembled by each player, having a wipe, and holding on your development for 1 turn can really squash the early to midgame development of the other players. At least by those of us who value interaction. It's happened to me several times by control decks who draw-go for 4 turns then wipe on turn 5 having spent zero resources and got a nice 6-for-1 value play and some breathing room into the mid-game.

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Post by Mookie 1 year ago

I'm not currently running any of these cards, for two reasons - half because of budget (the good versions of these cards are all from precons and tend to be pricey), half because my meta is weirdly light on board wipes. I do run a fair amount of recursion to recover from board wipes though.

My search for the most-played board wipes puts the top 10 as: I'll note that 7/10 of these are stopped by indestructible, so I would consider spells that grant indestructible to generally be a fine replacement for phasing - they still usually do the job you want them to perform.

I'll give a shout to Surge of Salvation - it only stops damage-based (or targeted) sweepers, but it's cheap and flexible.

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Post by PrimevalCommander 1 year ago

I know Cyclonic Rift may not be considered a hard wipe, but I would put it into the top 10 cards I want protection from. Knocking indestructible protection down to 6:10 or a 40% chance of failure, which is painful. Now expand it down to the top 20 and your probably upwards of 80% chance of success since there are many other "industry standard" wipes that destroy.

Also in thinking, many of the every popular Asymmetrical wipes destroy, which is great. Kindred Dominance , Winds of Rath, Damning Verdict , Retribution of the Meek, The Battle of Bywater , Ruinous Ultimatum, Crux of Fate, Hour of Reckoning. I have been looking for more and more asymmetrical wipes whenever possible, even if they are not 100% encompassing. Austere Command still remains my favorite white wipe in a vacuum.

As with anything, play to your meta and what you see as the most likely outcome that you need protection from.

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Post by Toshi 1 year ago

I think Clever Concealment is up and by far the best one.
Protecting all your stuff beyond creatures for "free" and without fail against force sac, exile, tuck and the likes? Even leaves you free to follow up with a wipe yourself...

Semester's End is missing in the blink session, btw.

Overall i wouldn't run more than 2 or 3 of these effects, as i much rather stuff my deck with pro-active cards. Plus, anything 4 mana and up is really akward to hold up. Even 3 is arguably bad if we're speaking higher power levels.

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Post by capitacommunist 1 year ago

Interesting to see the different viewpoints here. I'll share my thoughts basis my Adeline high power deck. In general I've shifted my suite towards cheaper (or free) solutions that offer modularity by having offensive capabilities, doubling as single target protection, and hitting all permanents.
  • Teferi's Protection - this is the ultimate protection but I think holding up three mana for this type of effect is just too much, so I'm not playing it anymore. It does protect against Cyc Rift and Farewell, but then I prefer just playing Aven Interruptor instead.
  • Flare of Fortitude - think this is great in mono white as being free and protecting your entire board (not only creatures) at the cost of one of them is generally always worth it. Value goes ways down in multicolor though.
  • Flawless Maneuver - still great as it also serves as free protection from spot removal.
  • Galadriel's Dismissal - I don't think I will ever cut this. Having effectively four modes with one mana protect your creature/ temp remove someone's else's creature, four mana protect your board, and four mana remove someone else's board to alpha strike is amazing.
  • Akroma's Will - I would not consider this part of the category as it is far more a win condition than a protection spell (don't think I've ever played it as such.
  • Brave the Elements is another underrated one as it can also allow you to knock out one player.
  • Grand Crescendo I've never played but I can't imagine it makes the cut anymore with the other options now, especially with it only hitting creatures. I don't think any of the three mana ones without alternative costs are worth it either, even those that phase like Guardian Knight.
  • Dawn's Truce - two mana versus three is a big difference and it protects all permanents, without deckbuilding requirements. Hates on Thassa's Oracle in a pinch tooLooks great and would play this over Teferis now. On the consideration list for Adeline.
  • Clever Concealment has been pretty great on the alternative casting cost, but outside of token decks have found it hard to reliably cast this. Very nice that it protects all permanents though. Playing it Adeline right now.

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Post by Moxnix 1 year ago

Hey if they want to print me a Force of Teferi's protection I would play it all day for now costing 0 is still king as most the decks I want to use Teferi's in don't have play patterns that support having the open mana passed on. Like a deck that plays many instants and can easily pass on it is the one that needs its protection the least where as if I'm flooding the board with dudes and my hands down to 3 cards and I just tapped out to try and leverage them quickly flawless might be a 0 mana they wipe the board for me and now I blow them out so maybe it doesn't dodge deluge and friends but I cant cast Teferi's in that line anyway and if i did maybe the don't wrath as I didn't just commit another card to the board but the fact they might not alone makes it hard to pass on those critical early turns where it blows you back in a deck with tons of 1-3 cc creatures.

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Post by 5colorsrainbow 1 year ago

Call out to Cosmic Intervention I use in my exile deck. Very fun to play a wrath right afterward.
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Post by NZB2323 1 year ago

I use Flawless Maneuver and Clever Concealment. Selfless Spirit is great in cleric tribal with Ravos, Soultender. Eldrazi Monument is great in Edgar Markov. Not white, but Goblin Bombardment with cards like Zulaport Cutthroat is also great for Markov. Knight Exemplar is great in knight tribal, and I even play him in Éowyn, Shieldmaiden.
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Post by PrimevalCommander 11 months ago

Pasting some discussion from the RCotD thread for reference in this thread.
Serenade wrote:
11 months ago
I hate that CC exists and do not like anti-wipe cards.
I'm of mixed feelings on this, but largely am happy we have some more options for board protection. On the surface, board wipes are getting too absolute and too flexible. Having counter-play outside of counter spells to these extremely flexible and permanent wipes is a nice part thing to have. Cards like All is Dust, Farewell, Cyclonic Rift, and the ever more popular one-sided wipes make combat very difficult without some sort of protection to all your efforts. I think these cards are good to have and allow me to over commit to the board a little without getting completely blown out.

On the other hand, there is an arms race happening. Teferi's Protection is obviously best-in-class, however there are now several options that are FREE to cast, and I generally do not like free spells. Tapping out used to mean something, now there is no way to tell if shields are down, either for getting your big spell countered, or for your clutch board wipe falling flat. There have been a TON of these types of effects printed in the last couple years, see my thread about many of these cards for comparison and experiences with them. This will push the envelop for how effective wipes need to be to not get blown out by these protection spells.

With about every strategy having an asymmetric wipe option, having some protection from those makes combat more interesting and creates more interactivity within non-blue decks that want to play to the board. I'm not sure why anti-wipe cards would be a bad thing, they do come with quite an opportunity cost much of the time.

Clever Concealment is one of the better options because phasing is one of the most protective options. And the cost reduction is highly relevant in keeping opponent's guessing. As others have mentioned, there are pros and cons to phasing, which there should be. With Tef Prot covering almost all avenues for downside, the card is poorly designed in my opinion. All the others have done much better, besides a couple being pretty trivially zero mana to cast.


Comment on card design and the tempo of blanking a wrath effect with a protection effect:

I think my favorite designs are Clever Concealment, Galadriel's Dismissal and Flare of Fortitude, all 2022 or newer. They have a high base-cost but have other modes to make them cheaper. This provides flexibility and decision making to using the spell, unlike Flawless Maneuver which is trivially free, and are not all encompassing like Teferi's Protection.

Protecting my board from a wipe is no bigger a tempo swing than me loosing 5 cards and 20 mana worth of permanents to a 3-6 mana spell. Probably less swing since control bro only spends 1 card and a few mana while still destroying several other permanents. Also there is a considerable deckbuilding cost to playing these cards. How many and which ones do you play, and when to you hold them open? I lost a game with BOTH Clever Concealment and Guardian of Faith in my hand because I had to tap out and Farewell the board to slow down a Megatron, Tyrant // Megatron, Destructive Force deck. I lost 4 permanents and never really recovered fully since I had just played my only draw engine the turn before. The two protection pieces were dead in my hand and could have been something else. But next game, they may be the card that I ride to victory.

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Post by Moxnix 11 months ago

I think what's best is build dependent if I'm trying to kill everyone with balancing act sure I want tef protection but generally much like with counters FREE seems to be king. So TEf might have more cool unique effect but it still costs 3 and things that can cost zero can feel broken with frequency. I drew CC on mtgo my first test yesterday and cast it for 0 in that deck I cant really hold up mana but my friends love the balancing act combo so it do fear it.

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Post by 3drinks 11 months ago

The reason indestructible looks unreliable, is because it's really just regeneration.

Indestructible: destroy effects and lethal damage don't destroy it

Regeneration: the next time this would be destroyed, instead it isn't. tap the permanent and remove all damage from it

Indestructible is just a constant 0: Regenerate shield on the object.

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Post by Sinis 11 months ago

3drinks wrote:
11 months ago
The reason indestructible looks unreliable, is because it's really just regeneration.

Indestructible: destroy effects and lethal damage don't destroy it

Regeneration: the next time this would be destroyed, instead it isn't. tap the permanent and remove all damage from it

Indestructible is just a constant 0: Regenerate shield on the object.
I don't think they're the same except insofar as design has started using Indestructible where they used to use regeneration.

I think that it's worth noting that Regeneration taps creatures, and removes them from combat. That's a really salient difference; no one I know is thinking about using Wrap in Vigor even though it's commonly available and has been for a decade and a half.

Second, I think it says something about how much we use indestructible effects that people gloss over the number of "can't be regenerated" pieces of removal that are commonly played. Everyone will say "oh, Flawless Maneuver has nothing on that Swords/Path/Farewell", but people are absolutely indestructibling there way through Pongify, Rapid Hybridization, Damnation, Damn, Big Game Hunter, or oblique wraths like Decree of Pain, Winds of Rath, or Rout. Places where a cute Death Ward|ICE wouldn't do the job.

There aren't many anti-regen cards being played in a numerical sense, but, I have seen a lot of the cards above. I also see randoms like Putrefy or Snuff Out. That 'bury' text is out there, and people seem to have forgotten because Indestructible has replaced regeneration in the design space.

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Post by Sinis 11 months ago

PrimevalCommander wrote:
11 months ago
I'm of mixed feelings on this, but largely am happy we have some more options for board protection.
I'm also mixed.... but design seems intent on making all of some colours parts of the pie on creatures. For example, White gets a lot of tax/rules creatures like Mangara, the Diplomat, but gets very few enchantments that do the similar things (like Smuggler's Share). Cards like Blind Obedience are very much the exception, and we usually get Archon of Emeria or Thalia, Heretic Cathar.

As long as most of White's colour pie is going to be on things with legs or wings that could be removed or swept, I think White should also have anti-removal/sweep.

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Post by 3drinks 11 months ago

Sinis wrote:
11 months ago

Second, I think it says something about how much we use indestructible effects that people gloss over the number of "can't be regenerated" pieces of removal that are commonly played. Everyone will say "oh, Flawless Maneuver has nothing on that Swords/Path/Farewell", but people are absolutely indestructibling there way through Pongify, Rapid Hybridization, Damnation, Damn, Big Game Hunter, or oblique wraths like Decree of Pain, Winds of Rath, or Rout. Places where a cute Death Ward|ICE wouldn't do the job.

There aren't many anti-regen cards being played in a numerical sense, but, I have seen a lot of the cards above. I also see randoms like Putrefy or Snuff Out. That 'bury' text is out there, and people seem to have forgotten because Indestructible has replaced regeneration in the design space.
That's because a lot of these were written before indestructible got to be big, i.e. when the effect was rare and overcosted. For example if we got Damnation today, it'd read;

All creatures lose indestructible. Then destroy them. (similar enough to Hour of Devastation.)

Which functionally does what they want the game to do now, but the issue is regeneration still exists and has to be accounted for in design until they finally eliminate it/merge it into indestructible, or whatever.

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Post by Sinis 11 months ago

3drinks wrote:
11 months ago
Sinis wrote:
11 months ago

Second, I think it says something about how much we use indestructible effects that people gloss over the number of "can't be regenerated" pieces of removal that are commonly played. Everyone will say "oh, Flawless Maneuver has nothing on that Swords/Path/Farewell", but people are absolutely indestructibling there way through Pongify, Rapid Hybridization, Damnation, Damn, Big Game Hunter, or oblique wraths like Decree of Pain, Winds of Rath, or Rout. Places where a cute Death Ward|ICE wouldn't do the job.

There aren't many anti-regen cards being played in a numerical sense, but, I have seen a lot of the cards above. I also see randoms like Putrefy or Snuff Out. That 'bury' text is out there, and people seem to have forgotten because Indestructible has replaced regeneration in the design space.
That's because a lot of these were written before indestructible got to be big, i.e. when the effect was rare and overcosted. For example if we got Damnation today, it'd read;

All creatures lose indestructible. Then destroy them. (similar enough to Hour of Devastation.)

Which functionally does what they want the game to do now, but the issue is regeneration still exists and has to be accounted for in design until they finally eliminate it/merge it into indestructible, or whatever.
Emphasis mine. The reasons why don't matter. It *is* the case currently. I personally don't feel like Indestructible is unreliable. Exile removal is good, yes, but it's not like every single card is exile removal. Farewell and Merciless Eviction (a card for which I am infamous for in my playgroup) are strong, but that doesn't mean that indestructible isn't 'reliable'. It means that you get two more turns of nonsense before someone maybe leverages an exile wipe.

Edit: I'm being unclear here. If someone leverages Farewell over Wrath of God, Indestructible kind of buys you a turn or two because of the increased cost. The advantage, while subtle, is not insignificant.

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Post by PrimevalCommander 11 months ago

Sinis wrote:
11 months ago
Edit: I'm being unclear here. If someone leverages Farewell over Wrath of God, Indestructible kind of buys you a turn or two because of the increased cost. The advantage, while subtle, is not insignificant.
This is a good point, but the arms race is happening because as Farewell eclipses Austere Command as whites #1 wip, I'm looking for things that protect me against both options. Hence Phasing getting ever more popular because if I can leverage those 2 extra turns into a potential game winning board, then blank the exile wipe my opponent was expecting to save them, that is a big swing.

I am in agreement that Indestructible still has merit, and I will continue to play it. However I am not going to argue phasing's ability to skirt pretty much every option for mass-removal there is, which adds a significant amount of flexibility. I will be diversifying my protection to include both where I can, and prioritize phasing where I can't.

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Post by Sinis 11 months ago

PrimevalCommander wrote:
11 months ago
I am in agreement that Indestructible still has merit, and I will continue to play it. However I am not going to argue phasing's ability to skirt pretty much every option for mass-removal there is, which adds a significant amount of flexibility. I will be diversifying my protection to include both where I can, and prioritize phasing where I can't.
I think also the narrowness of Indestructible's requirement adds value to cards like Guardian of Faith, Careful Concealment or Teferi's Protection (or plain straight up counterspells). I have watched my friends tear their hair out against my maindecked Avacyn, Angel of Hope, finally find a Farewell, Hallowed Burial or Merciless Eviction only to eat a phase-out and still not have a real answer to a board full of threats + Avacyn.

I also think an interesting thing that's being a little sidestepped in this whole conversation is that we're talking about White's anti-wipe cards like they're really good, but for the vast majority of them, a simple counterspell is just as good if they're in w/u/x. Teferi's Protection is an obvious standout, and the freebies are free (natch), so that's a huge plus, but the vast majority of the time, when someone is leveraging a wipe that isn't Supreme Verdict, Negate is just as good as Unbreakable Formation or similar.

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