Ephara, God of the Polis - Flash & Taxes

[WizardMN]

In Karador, Ghost Chieftain if you're running sacrifice outlets it seems fantastic honestly, but it depends on how many creature vs. non-creature enablers you're running I'd be inclined pretty strongly to be a Viscera Seer heavy build myself where I'd just sac my board and junk everything except graveyards with some regularity. But I am very down on enchantment/artifact enablers these days, in almost all decks. Even here in Ephara I tend to not care about anything except Ephara and not run out enough onto the board I can't afford to pop creatures.

I think the main thing keeping Rift for me right now is the availability with Spellseeker and Muddle the Mixture - but I am definitely keeping my eyes peeled for new sweepers. Vanquish the Horde has been spectacular for example.

I don't like running multitudes of sac effects in Karador as I am not often trying to sac my board. I want to sac one or two things at a time which is why Viscera Seer has yet to be included. Though, I have thought about it. Yawgmoth is the main one that can sac everything. I am usually wanting something more precise though I am typically able to work around False Prophet so working around Farewell wouldn't be much different. And just firing it off to get rid of Enchantments and Artifacts isn't the worst either. I might have to revisit this now

But that is a far point about Rift. While it costs 7 mana to cast in almost every circumstance, it can be gotten off some tutors, as can Winds of Abandon, which is definitely nice and raises its stock a bit for sure.

I haven't gotten to the point of Vanquish the Horde in anything but maybe I should. I think it would fit into a few decks since firing it off for two mana is likely going to happen more often than not.

[pokken]

I haven't gotten to the point of Vanquish the Horde in anything but maybe I should. I think it would fit into a few decks since firing it off for two mana is likely going to happen more often than not.

Yeah, Vanquish the Horde has been great. It plays a bit like an early game card draw/ramp spell, in some ways, since it can let you keep slower hands that curve out. I think I only have it in Ephara right now, but I'd be inclined to think a lot about it in most white decks--my only other white decks right now are kinda special cases

- Breena really would rather not sweep the board very much of just creatures unless it's one-sided
- Abzan Enchantress - just isn't running any sorcery board wipes because it's not on theme
- Kenrith - can't make WW because of garbo manabase
- Feather - should probably be runnin it because all the protection spells make it really good. I think I ran out of slots and needed to choose between it and Hour of Revelation and went with Revelation
- God Eternal Oketra - only runs on-theme wipes (token/weenie synergy wipes and Hour of Revelation)
- Tivit - only runs Hour of Revelation. probably should be running it though -- but also the deck is kinda designed to force other people to wipe, then Faith's Reward to punish it.


Man I have a lot of white decks. Hour of Revelation is my spirit animal.

[pokken]

I've been trying to keep up a little on latest sets, here are a few cards I like:

So he's cheap, has flash, and generates repeated card draw and potentially end game ramp. That said, four chorus counters is a long time, so most likely he's a dud. Still, any 2 cmc flash creature is worth thinking about for some builds.

It's really unfortunate it doesn't let you blink other people's stuff so it doesn't go off with Gilded Drake but it's a nice option. Being a flying body and having ward is nice. I would likely play this over Mistmeadow Witch and deal with the consequences.

Still, I don't understand why UW can't get Emiel the Blessed. It's weird.

This is my favorite so far but I have suspicious that people will not just let you draw cards and treat it more like a Authority of the Consuls. but hitting artifacts is nice because it stops a lot of combos. I *think* it's worth playing.

Total bummer it's not available in foil. I wish they would stop making marquee cards that aren't in foil.

This card is pretty interesting. Feels potentially really good for a lifegain deck where reanimating soul sisters would be useful, and you'll have lots of different sized bodies most likely. It's a bit pricy. But it also ramps so that's very nice. And would ramp untapped. I like that it hits on ETB too.

side note: retro foil hallowed fountain is dope!

[SavageToaster]

Have you seen Final-Word Phantom?

3 Mana 1/4 Flash & Flying.

During each opponent's end step, you may cast spells as though they hadflash.

[pokken]

Have you seen Final-Word Phantom?

3 Mana 1/4 Flash & Flying.

During each opponent's end step, you may cast spells as though they hadflash.

Hrm, I have not

OK, so the problem with this is that, in general, it's not that useful either of my current builds -- most of my stuff is instant/flash already, or a high enough ratio that this doesn't add value. I think if it cost 1U it would be worth it.

Feels really good in a deck that is going more in on Vedalken Orrery / Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir effects to turn good non-flash creatures into flash creatures, but I am not sure that is really Ephara? Ephara doesn't really want to play a buttload of enablers like that because it dilutes the gameplan.

definitely worth thinking about, especially in a spirit build I think

[cheonice]

Good, to have you back!

I'm quite satisfied with Abuelo. He replaced Eldrazi Displacer in my build, so I don't need to hassle with colourless mana. Yep, he can't blink opponents creatures, but I don't remember the last time I used this.

I'll call out Kutzil's Flanker as another small flashy value creature that likes to be blinked. It took Remorseful Cleric's place.

Redemption Choir is the first "real" small Sun Titan, isn't it? All the other creatures can't return lands as far as I remember.

[JayDomK]

Good, to have you back!

I'm quite satisfied with Abuelo. He replaced Eldrazi Displacer in my build, so I don't need to hassle with colourless mana. Yep, he can't blink opponents creatures, but I don't remember the last time I used this.

I'll call out Kutzil's Flanker as another small flashy value creature that likes to be blinked. It took Remorseful Cleric's place.

Redemption Choir is the first "real" small Sun Titan, isn't it? All the other creatures can't return lands as far as I remember.

I rarely use it either, but it's still nice to have the option to blink opponents creatures.

Hello, everyone!

[pokken]

Good, to have you back!

Thanks! It's nice to be back, pretty low key just trying to maintain my threads occasionally.

I'm quite satisfied with Abuelo. He replaced Eldrazi Displacer in my build, so I don't need to hassle with colourless mana. Yep, he can't blink opponents creatures, but I don't remember the last time I used this.

I've gone infinite with other people's Great Whale and Palinchron before with Faerie Artisans but it's a bit of a corner case lol :D

I've also used displacer a ton with Gilded Drake but if you're not playing that, a lot of the appeal goes away for sure. Still, I have saved myself more than once with blinking enemies to prevent attacks. It even works against haste creatures like Gishath, Sun's Avatar because it puts them back in tapped.

Redemption Choir - I am not sure but I think it is the first one that gets lands <6 mana. So it's nice to see that templating still around.

[cheonice]

Good, to have you back!

Thanks! It's nice to be back, pretty low key just trying to maintain my threads occasionally.

I'm quite satisfied with Abuelo. He replaced Eldrazi Displacer in my build, so I don't need to hassle with colourless mana. Yep, he can't blink opponents creatures, but I don't remember the last time I used this.

I've gone infinite with other people's Great Whale and Palinchron before with Faerie Artisans but it's a bit of a corner case lol :D

I've also used displacer a ton with Gilded Drake but if you're not playing that, a lot of the appeal goes away for sure. Still, I have saved myself more than once with blinking enemies to prevent attacks. It even works against haste creatures like Gishath, Sun's Avatar because it puts them back in tapped.

Redemption Choir - I am not sure but I think it is the first one that gets lands <6 mana. So it's nice to see that templating still around.

The Eldrazi is a bearable loss. Gilded Drake is way out of my price range and the other corner cases are nice and fun, but probably not worth the hassle. It already was on my chopping board. Slots are getting really tight :D

[pokken]

It already was on my chopping board. Slots are getting really tight :D

Now you're playin Ephara :D

[pokken]

Got my first game in here in a long time. Played against dino discover guy, yoshimaru-deathtouchfamiliar orzhov voltron, and Karona the false god weird other people voltron (kind of a bad slicer deck).

This game was so long that I don't have much of a report but I can talk about the texture;
* They properly identified me as a major threat and started putting the heat though it was spread around some
* My Cartographer's Hawk was able to, because of some land ramp effects elsewhere, ramp me 1 early in the game too which was very nice, and then it came down to trigger Ephara and then chump block later.
* I used an early Brought Back as an EOT Rampant Growth because I had a Mystic Sanctuary in hand, which set up my mana advantage (over two green decks)
* I deployed an early Farewell for everything except enchantments, which wiped the board except for Ephara, then set up a Sacred Mesa → make a pegasus → Brought Back double fetches turn to put me way ahead mana wise
* The Dino guy was relentless and just kept piling discovers; it was like Maelstrom Wanderer but dinosaurs, or Gishath, Sun's Avatar I guess. Tons of card advantage. He would have kept up with me were it not for...Emeria, the Sky Ruin set up by all the Brought Back fetching.
* Solitude was the MVP for me, killing a crapload of creatures, double blocking, etc.
* I set up my end game by Enlightened Tutor'ing for Felidar Retreat and then casting Phantasmal Image as a copy of his discover commander Pantlaza, Sun-Favored which flipped it (my intention being to chump block with it and emeria it every turn of course:D).
* In combination with Field of the Dead I'd retrieved earlier, and a Gilded Drake trading for Pantazla's 15/5 dinosaur token, I provoked the Orzhov player into casting a Toxic Deluge for self-lethal which caused the other players to scoop. On account of they were super dead (only dragging out a turn because I missed a weird Maze of Ith on Orzhov's board :D

The deck is a little groan inducing in its current state but I'm able to play it fast and so I think I'll just keep it in this vicinity and play it every now and then. I imagine if they focus fire me a bit more I'll die regularly and have to tune the control suite.

One thing I'm cnsidering is Azorius Signet et al. I had to Hour of Revelation a couple of my mana rocks in this game and as usual it was annoying. I would have Farewell'd them earlier. I think the odds fo me adding Devastating Mastery or some similar extra good sweeper are high enough it might be correct to go back to Loyal Warhound and Knight of the White Orchid (which have been very good in the past).

I find the signets a necessary evil as an option to get way ahead of powerhouse decks, but I wonder if I might be better off just trying to sweep those guys up. It's hard to say.

The state of the game with how much power and value you get per card (see Pantlaza, Sun-Favored yeesh) is pretty grotesque, so it's hard to keep up as a control shell :D

[ISBPathfinder]

I know what you mean with Pantlaza, Sun-Favored. I have had some troubles with it myself but it can be a little clunky if they run a bunch of ramp spells because sometimes dinos just find more ramp which can run them out of steam depending on if they get unlucky or not. It can definitely feel like a deck where you constantly check how many times can I sweep or push for faster game win scenarios. I played against someone who was literally running it as straight precon the other day and it was still crazy.

[pokken]

I know what you mean with Pantlaza, Sun-Favored. I have had some troubles with it myself but it can be a little clunky if they run a bunch of ramp spells because sometimes dinos just find more ramp which can run them out of steam depending on if they get unlucky or not. It can definitely feel like a deck where you constantly check how many times can I sweep or push for faster game win scenarios. I played against someone who was literally running it as straight precon the other day and it was still crazy.

Yeah, those cards that do what ephara does but with a mana discount (kadena, pantlaza, think there was another one for spells too) are very frustrating particularly for me :D

The sheer amount of card and mana advantage they're willing to put on cards these days is really confusing to me. I wonder how long it is before Primeval Titan is too slow.

[ISBPathfinder]

Yeah, those cards that do what ephara does but with a mana discount (kadena, pantlaza, think there was another one for spells too) are very frustrating particularly for me :D

The sheer amount of card and mana advantage they're willing to put on cards these days is really confusing to me. I wonder how long it is before Primeval Titan is too slow.

It depends a lot on the meta you are in. I honestly think the meta I regularly play in its already too slow. Its very normal for games to end somewhere between turns 7 and 9 with occasionally much faster ends. I remember the time of Primeval Titan and it was slogfest ETB magic where turns often were well into double digets before ending. Back then commander tuck made it hard to be half as fast not to mention that clones used to kill commanders as well as spawn more primeval titans.

[PrimevalCommander]

I remember the time of Primeval Titan and it was slogfest ETB magic where turns often were well into double digets before ending. Back then commander tuck made it hard to be half as fast not to mention that clones used to kill commanders as well as spawn more primeval titans.

Ah, the good ole' days

[ISBPathfinder]

I remember the time of Primeval Titan and it was slogfest ETB magic where turns often were well into double digets before ending. Back then commander tuck made it hard to be half as fast not to mention that clones used to kill commanders as well as spawn more primeval titans.

Ah, the good ole' days

I both do and don't at all miss tuck and clone kills. I felt it forced us to be better deckbuilders to figure out how the deck functioned without the commander and how to get it back but it was also really horrible because it made multicolor goodstuff a lot better forcing us to play more green and black for tutors and blue and white for tuck. It made it really hard to play mono color and some cute little low profile commander because someone would come along and collateral tuck you with a Hallowed Burial and you would just be done.

I do a little tiny bit miss playing Bant because I would say Bant and BUG were the best trios back then but I don't at all dislike that it opened the meta up a lot more and gave mono color a chance that it was hard to have before that change.

[PrimevalCommander]

@ISBPathfinder heavily agree. Mostly on the better deck building, but it did highly incentivize green, blue, and white for the reasons mentioned. Now decks can be ALL-IN on commander, commonly with "draw a card" stapled on it, and just put foot on gas all game. (Pantlaza, Etali, etc). Very hard to interact with minimal ways to neutralize an overpowered commander. Gods are even worse. Indestructible enchantments that can be tutored, cheated, reanimated, in the command zone, as a creature. Stupid design I say. Irony not lost posting in Ephara thread.

Clones were fun, but too good at that time I concede. Tuck pushed goodstuff designs, clone rules pushed clones in all blue decks pulling double duty as commander kill + good stuff copy. Deck homogenization was going the wrong direction for creativity. Overall after years of reflection, I think the tuck and clone rules benefit the format, but I still think players get too lazy in deck building. I can still catch greedy players off base by pointing a bit of removal at their commander.

[pokken]

Anyone got thoughts on a cut for Metallurgic Summonings or Shark Typhoon (or even both)? And thoughts on which one of those you like better?

I added the experimental control shell build to the OP
viewtopic.php?p=587#p587

My thinking here is that the deck feels like it wants one more wincondition, and Summons adds some pretty solid recursion as well as potentially making some good sized bodies.

Even just making sure the sweepers cantrip is a pretty strong avenue I think (though the bodies don't stick ofc).

[WizardMN]

I think each does something slightly different and I think it depends on whether you are moving towards your control shell or if you are sticking with the flash and taxes. In the control shell, I think I like Shark Typhoon a little more. It triggers off more spells and can be cycled away in a pinch if needed. Summonings I like in your flash and taxes build since you are playing mostly instants and sorceries for noncreature spells anyway and it gives you a good way to get things back. Though, you are going up in Instants in the Control shell anyway and it costs 1 less mana.

So, I guess I am actually leaning towards Summonings in either case.

As to cuts, I think it is a bit tough. Our decks are quite different in the way we approach them but Saltskitter would probably be my first choice. It works to trigger Ephara efficiently but doesn't do much else in my mind. Otherwise, maybe Windshaper Planetar? I feel like in your control shell especially, you are better off trying to wrath the board anyway or just handling things with Rift or Teferi's Protection.

I know these are a bit of a stretch but I don't see anything else that stands out as being an obvious cut.

[pokken]

I think each does something slightly different and I think it depends on whether you are moving towards your control shell or if you are sticking with the flash and taxes. In the control shell, I think I like Shark Typhoon a little more. It triggers off more spells and can be cycled away in a pinch if needed. Summonings I like in your flash and taxes build since you are playing mostly instants and sorceries for noncreature spells anyway and it gives you a good way to get things back. Though, you are going up in Instants in the Control shell anyway and it costs 1 less mana.

So, I guess I am actually leaning towards Summonings in either case.

As to cuts, I think it is a bit tough. Our decks are quite different in the way we approach them but Saltskitter would probably be my first choice. It works to trigger Ephara efficiently but doesn't do much else in my mind. Otherwise, maybe Windshaper Planetar? I feel like in your control shell especially, you are better off trying to wrath the board anyway or just handling things with Rift or Teferi's Protection.

I know these are a bit of a stretch but I don't see anything else that stands out as being an obvious cut.

I think at least for a while I'm going to work on the control shell; more creature heavy stuff just is so eclipsed by all the stuff going on with creature power. Especially just how constantly I seem to run into Warstorm Surge type stuff that clears my board.

Windshaper Planetar does seem to be one of the weaker wrath effects; I have a lot fewer ways to recycle it in this build. That said, it does have a nice advantage in that it can often eliminate one player vs. just sweeping. But I do think it's probably the right cut if I want to cut interaction for a wincon. Definitely helps to talk through it so thanks

I do like that typhoon can trigger on Sensei's Divining Top which sets up some pretty strong looping scenarios.

Speaking of wraths, I think i might want to get Terminus back in this deck. Likely outperforms Windshaper Planetar.

re: Saltskitter
(hope you don't mind me pontificating; eventually I will need to write a primer for this build, and probably the most fundamental difference between this build and the OG is the answer to "why is Saltskitter good now?")

This goes to a pretty fun philosophical point of how the control shell is functioning. Generally speaking, this deck wants to play *exactly one* effect that turns Ephara into Draw 2-4 cards a turn (or generates that kind of velocity like Fleeting Spirit)

So while I hate Saltskitter in Ephara in general, in *this* build it is somewhat irreplaceable.

What the control shell wants to do is:
* drop an early card advantage piece and ride it until forced to sweep the board
* sweep the board, then drop another card advantage piece
* repeat until we hit a win condition

The wincon package is (currently)

• Elspeth, Sun's Champion
• felidar retreat
• field of the dead
• sacred mesa
• the watcher in the water
• nadir kraken
• Sun Titan

These wincons are...slow as crap, but they seem to get the job done once you're oveflowing with card advantage and ideally someone else has died.

The "try to get +2 cards a turn at least" guys are

• mystic remora
• rhystic study
• teferi, master of time
• fleeting spirit
• saltskitter
• stenn, paranoid partisan
• nadir kraken
• the watcher in the water
• field of the dead
• sacred mesa
• felidar retreat
• faerie mastermind
• ledger shredder
• faerie artisans

(not counting tutors; e.g. Weathered Wayfarer and Trinket Mage find Field of the Dead )

In general tons of overlap between the card draw and wincons too which is my favorite part about the deck.

I think if the deck could play like 7 copies of Nadir Kraken that would be the deck doing what I want :D

[cheonice]

Have you seen Illustrious Wanderglyph? It's way better than something like The Watcher in the Water and could double as a wincon.

[pokken]

Have you seen Illustrious Wanderglyph? It's way better than something like The Watcher in the Water and could double as a wincon.

I somehow completely missed that card. ordering now :D

Man that is so insanely perfect. Even E-tutorable.

[cheonice]

Have you seen Illustrious Wanderglyph? It's way better than something like The Watcher in the Water and could double as a wincon.

I somehow completely missed that card. ordering now :D

Man that is so insanely perfect. Even E-tutorable.

Yep It's everything Ephara could hope for.

[pokken]

Yep It's everything Ephara could hope for.

the first time i Bribery'd for a Tendershoot Dryad I was 1) mad it was green, and 2) hopeful white would get something similar :D

--

unrelated, I picked up a Flesh Duplicate foil so I can have more Phantasmal Image bs going on. pretty stoked for that. Sun Titan is a surprisingly common endgame for the control build.

[pokken]

I wound up cutting Winds of Abandon for Illustrious Wanderglyph -- I found without a simple recursion creature. winds was much worse, and also with a slower game without a combo finish the control shell is less interested in ramping opponents since it doesn't often have the board presence to kill from it.

as part of this same update, I am adding Flesh Duplicate over Mystic Remora -- I find Mystic Remora to be a very hit or miss early game play in more casual groups.