The Community Deck Build Project v2.0

[3drinks]

Okay. After seeing about everyone from the last thread weigh in, I agree that the most widely accepted strat is some variant of Sultai Skies. This procs both our crappy blue djinn and sets us up to proc our weird 3/7 the easiest as well. So this seems as good a place as any to focus on. Now, let me see if I can't maintain a higher degree of organization compared to the last one and say we're gonna start with ramp and fixing. Let's shoot for ...12-14 slots?

To that end, and to the surprise of absolutely nobody, my first pick is Arcum's Astrolabe. It's a simple one mv cantrip that filters colours effortlessly, and even turns non-snow into snow mana if ever that's relevant. And honestly, there's no incentive to not go snow given there's tangible non-zero amount of benefit to using snow as opposed to non-snow basics.

Arcum's Astrolabe yay - 0 nay - 0

[RxPhantom]

@3drinks, are you suggesting Astrolabe right off the bat just to get us into snow? I'm gonna nay Astrolabe, for now at least, because we're in green and I think our non Sol Ring ramp should be green land tutors.

I'll nominate Farseek today.

Also @3drinks, do you think you could copy and paste a current version of the decklist every page or two? It would really help to understand how the deck is shaping up without having to navigate back and forth.

[3drinks]

@3drinks, are you suggesting Astrolabe right off the bat just to get us into snow? I'm gonna nay Astrolabe, for now at least, because we're in green and I think our non Sol Ring ramp should be green land tutors.

What's the downside? It doesn't even cost a card, it's actually a free include.

[RedCheese]

Sure yay for Farseek and Astrolabe. If we going for the snow route, ill nominate Ice-Fang Coatl

If only focusing in ramp/fix, then Into the North would be my pick instead

[kirkusjones]

Yea to Farseek, Astrolabe and Ice-Fang. My suggestion for today is Birds of Paradise.

[duducrash]

Yay to farseek, yay to ice-fang, yay to birds of paradise

I'll nay Astrolable for now, It does fix us mana and it does cantrip. But we are in premier draw and ramp colors. Im unsold on it

My pick for the day is

Gilded Goose . Low to the ground ramp that triggers borh of ours commanders

[Legend]

I suggest Eligeth, Crossroads Augur. The top end for a fly & scry strategy.

Birds of Paradise & Gilded Goose: Yay. They fly, fix, &, ramp & synergize with both commanders.
Into the North: Nay. Yay. Ramp is probably green's main role in this deck.
Arcum's Astrolabe & Ice-Fang Coatl: Nay. Unless there's an actual plan for snow in this deck.

[3drinks]

I cannot fathom why anyone would vote against a free card. It's like being in u and saying "no, I don't think we need Gitaxian Probe, we're too good for that." No one is shattering an astrolabe because it already did it's job.

Why the hate? Is it a lack of understanding? Is it a want to use pretty basics? There's literally no incentive to not utilize snow mana, it's all upside. Help me wrap my head around this need to dig the heels in, especially that we're already talking about ice-fang coatl.

[kirkusjones]

I don't get the hate either…Arcum's Astrolabe is banned in multiple formats for being too good at what it does. What one drop would be better in its place?

[RxPhantom]

I cannot fathom why anyone would vote against a free card. It's like being in u and saying "no, I don't think we need Gitaxian Probe, we're too good for that." No one is shattering an astrolabe because it already did it's job.

Why the hate? Is it a lack of understanding? Is it a want to use pretty basics? There's literally no incentive to not utilize snow mana, it's all upside. Help me wrap my head around this need to dig the heels in, especially that we're already talking about ice-fang coatl.

I don't get the hate either…Arcum's Astrolabe is banned in multiple formats for being too good at what it does. What one drop would be better in its place?

I'm not against snow. I'm against Astrolabe. I think there are more interesting things to be doing, and a Prophetic Prism variant doesn't do it for me. What I don't understand is the need to label disagreement as "hate," "this need to dig the heels in" or even chalking it up to a rather insulting "lack of understanding." I voted nay on a card and gave my reasoning. That's all.

The salt is palpable here. If we're going to get hostile or sensitive about our picks, I'm not interested.

[Crazy Monkey]

I am usually not a big fan of the "free draw" effects that smooth out draws/mulligans unless they fit some other criteria. Arcum's Astrolabe would make sense to me if we planned on metalcraft, Brago, King Eternal, or similar. If we plan to do anything with it, then I could see astrolabe. I generally want to save my deck slots for more strategy-aligned cards. In my own blue decks, I would and do skip Gitaxian Probe unless low MV cantrips match the game plan.

That said, forcing the planned card advantage to be Coastal Piracy or Collective Unconscious is a strategy decision. Do we want this deck to get all/most draw from battlefield (disrupt-able) sources? I'm open to debate on this, and will refrain from voting nay until others have weighed in. For simplicity, and to avoid giving 3drinks a vote tally headache, I will wait to vote until later in the day so we can talk about broad plans for draw effects.

Edit: I also think we can commit to snow with no downside, so my one vote in this post is for snow basics/nonbasics.

Edit2: I am the type of deckbuilder who would run something terrible like Hovermyr over Arcum's Astrolabe for theme or strategy reasons. So use that for reference in the deck plan discussions.

[Legend]

Why the hate? Is it a lack of understanding? Is it a want to use pretty basics? There's literally no incentive to not utilize snow mana, it's all upside. Help me wrap my head around this need to dig the heels in, especially that we're already talking about ice-fang coatl.

I'd rather snow be "saved" for a later deck in which it can be the centerpiece. Otherwise, why wouldn't we put it into every deck? (I really don't know.) Of course, we can do that, too. I'd rather we didn't, but it wouldn't a be game changer for me.

@RxPhantom 3Drinks is just jive talking. He doesn't mean anything by it. 🙂

[kirkusjones]

I cannot fathom why anyone would vote against a free card. It's like being in u and saying "no, I don't think we need Gitaxian Probe, we're too good for that." No one is shattering an astrolabe because it already did it's job.

Why the hate? Is it a lack of understanding? Is it a want to use pretty basics? There's literally no incentive to not utilize snow mana, it's all upside. Help me wrap my head around this need to dig the heels in, especially that we're already talking about ice-fang coatl.

I don't get the hate either…Arcum's Astrolabe is banned in multiple formats for being too good at what it does. What one drop would be better in its place?

I'm not against snow. I'm against Astrolabe. I think there are more interesting things to be doing, and a Prophetic Prism variant doesn't do it for me. What I don't understand is the need to label disagreement as "hate," "this need to dig the heels in" or even chalking it up to a rather insulting "lack of understanding." I voted nay on a card and gave my reasoning. That's all.

The salt is palpable here. If we're going to get hostile or sensitive about our picks, I'm not interested.

"Resistance" would have been a better word choice on my part. "Hate" gets thrown around a lot on the internet and in Magic (see: gravehate) when other, less divisive words would suffice.

No salt here, just curiosity.

[duducrash]

I don't hate Arcum's Astrolabe . It's quite good and it made manabases work real smoothly in modern. Great card! I just don't see the whole auto include in EDH aspect of it. If we were to flicker it constantly or had snow theme and had to include. We are in blue so card draw isn't scarce. We are in green so we get premium fixing, so I don't personally see why, I don't see the synergy.

[Crazy Monkey]

When I build decks, I almost always have to cut 30+ cards and one or more subthemes. For that reason, the deck space becomes much more expensive than the deck thinning that Arcum's Astrolabe provides. The cost of "free draw" for one-shot deck thinning is that it bumps another card out.

The plan for this specific deck is open ended enough that a more good stuff or generic cantrip might fit. But I would rather play Baleful Strix and Ice-Fang Coatl effects first.

[3drinks]

Yeah, it's just earnest curiosity on my part, I haven't been able to justify to myself a genuine reason to not use it since MH1, in all of my decks. So when I saw it met with a fairly stiff resistance, I became incredibly curious to learn the why and that maybe that could help me better tailor my picks going forward.

[Henlock]

Ok. I am a bit lost on what is to be voted:

I am gonna yay Ice Fang Coatl and Baleful strix and yay both Gilded.Goose and Birds of.Paradise.

At this moment there are tons.of.stuff.to nominate. We are going to have a lot of lifegain triggers, but we'll get to that at some point.
Seeing that 3.of the 4 creatures have an ETB, I think Cavern Harpy could be pretty interesting. It can let us rebuy our nongreen creatures for their ETB's or In-hand abilities if we have stuff such as Nimble Obstructionist or Order of midnight.

For clarity, Cavern Harpy is my.nomination.

[aliciaofthevast]

Oh hey we got a new community build!

*Sees commanders*

Oh my -_-

[duducrash]

Ok. I am a bit lost on what is to be voted:

I am gonna yay Ice Fang Coatl and Baleful strix and yay both Gilded.Goose and Birds of.Paradise.

At this moment there are tons.of.stuff.to nominate. We are going to have a lot of lifegain triggers, but we'll get to that at some point.
Seeing that 3.of the 4 creatures have an ETB, I think Cavern Harpy could be pretty interesting. It can let us rebuy our nongreen creatures for their ETB's or In-hand abilities if we have stuff such as Nimble Obstructionist or Order of midnight.

For clarity, Cavern Harpy is my.nomination.

From what I gathered, this were the cards nominated

Sol ring
Gerald, visionary stitcher
Hope of ghorapur
Lord of the void
Unhallowed phalanx
Siren Stormtamer
Arcum's astrolabe
Farseek
Ice-Fang Coatl
Birds of paradise
Gilded Goose
Eilgeth, crossroads augur
Into the north
Baleful strix

[RedCheese]

Sorry i kinda nominated 2 cards at the same time

[Crazy Monkey]

ok, I'm not entirely sure whether any cards on the first page were actually nominated other than Sol Ring and Lord of the Void.

I'll vote yea for Siren Stormtamer, Farseek, Into the North, Ice-Fang Coatl, and Cavern Harpy.

I'll tentatively vote yea for Eligeth, Crossroads Augur. A reasonable curve-topping flier and more interesting than the standard Consecrated Sphinx goodstuff. It's a bit lackluster without Siani, Eye of the Storm, so I'm not 100% sure to works, but it hit the deck plan well.

I'll abstain on Gilded Goose and Birds of Paradise, as these need a buff to deal combat damage, and 0 power attackers for Siani, Eye of the Storm seems underwhelming. I'm leaning towards yes, but mana dorks seem a fragile way to ramp if we do end up going the draw effects based on damage or creature count.

I'll nay Arcum's Astrolabe. I don't really see a path to make this more than deck thinning and mana fixing.
I'll nay Lord of the Void, as while it's a great flying beater, but I'm not sure that it's the best flying curve-top. It doesn't fit the commanders that well beyond just having flying.

I can't vote for sol ring, as I nominated it.

I'll go ahead and officially nominate Baleful Strix. I mentioned it as a concept, and will commit to it. I'm not sure if it can retroactively gain votes from earlier.

[3drinks]

So I'm going back to re-comb the votes, noting just the ramp & fixing as that's what was initially stated we'd be doing. I'm trying to keep things more organized by comparison to last time, but I guess that message got overlooked. I'll edit this post when I have votes tallied. As a reminder please check to see which deck components we're presently working towards before making your daily pick, for the ease of everyone and flow of the conversation.

Arcum's Astrolabe yay - 2 nay - 4
Farseek yay - 3 nay - 0
Into the North yay - 1 nay - 1
Birds of Paradise yay - 4 nay - 0
Gilded Goose yay - 2 nay - 1
Sol Ring yay - 1 nay - 0

Yay to Into the North as it is functionally a rampant growth that fetches more, and rampant growth is never a bad spell.

I'm gonna issue a big nay on Gilded Goose. This card is not good. It's a scaled back birds of paradise that has all the weaknesses of birds and only works once. I'd think you'd run Lotus Petal first, and I don't exactly see that card making it into these projects either.

Yay on Sol Ring...for obvious reasons I don't think needs to be explained. Can't imagine this commander combination is part of the 3% of decks that actively eschew artifact mana.

Birds of Paradise and Farseek have been confirmed into the list.

That gets us up to date. As a reminder, we're just doing ramp and fixing first to get that out of the way, so if you suggested something else, please go back and re-submit. We're shooting for 12-14 slots for this category, though I imagine there's some room for discourse here, as is the general idea in a community build-a-deck project. I suspect 12 is the minimum we want to be on for the best odds of having a piece of ramp in our opener without flooding the deck with enough such that we see it late when we want business spells.

I feel obligated to apologize for my overtly pointed and accusatory post earlier today, I could have worded that much more amicably and it is something I still struggle with to-date...clearly. If I offended you, know that I am regretful that I didn't take the time to think it through to express myself in a far less combative way. It's never my intent to make anybody feel uncomfortable.

[3drinks]

I'd rather snow be "saved" for a later deck in which it can be the centerpiece. Otherwise, why wouldn't we put it into every deck? (I really don't know.) Of course, we can do that, too. I'd rather we didn't, but it wouldn't a be game changer for me.

It's because there's no downside. There's literally two cards that negatively iMPACT the snow mechanic, one of which sees zero play the other sees negligible play (usually for it's backside which doesn't even care about snow anyway). Meanwhile you get pure upside, such as a ritual in Jorn, God of Winter // Kaldring, the Rimestaff, efficient removal in skred, the aforementioned free include of astrolabe, mouth of ronom and a reasonably costed disruptive manland in frostwalk bastion (let's not forget Faceless Haven too). Then you got into the north, which is a rampant growth that can now grab fifteen duals, plus a removal option and a couple of manlands. The most infamous of the snow advantages, of course, is Extraplanar Lens, though we wouldn't play that here I don't think.

WotC has given us these free gifts just for using certain basic lands, and they're not even oddly expensive for basic lands anymore. It's why I wonder why they produce secret lairs with cool basic art, given commander is the #1 format and snow basics as I've illustrated here are far superior.

[Venedrex]

Yay to the ring, Yay to Eligeth, and Yay to the goose! I mean, we have a forum member named GildedGoose, we would be amiss not to run their namesake. THE GOOSE. IS. LOOSE.

My suggestion might get blown away to the next county but dang if I wont suggest it even if it's not top tier. I promised myself I wouldn't just nominate staples, so I nominate Maraleaf Pixie. Yeah, I know it's not particularly strong, but I feel like this is a deck that's meant to be played in a nice mid power pod where we do fun and cool stuff like play Sultai flyers and bonk people with our winged bros.

P.S. I know rampant growth is better, but I'm not going to nominate staples, dang it. I will vote for rampant growth though if you nominate it (and I won't mind) because it's good and who wouldn't.

If you're not convinced by that stirring salesmanship, I don't know what card you'd vote for.

[aliciaofthevast]

We're doing ramp first? OK! Well first thing's first, let's give a yay to into the north & sol ring. Let's give a nay to that goose. That thing is wierd and I don't ever see myself wanting to pay 2 to be able to sacrifice something to net 1 mana? I can't understand the appeal.

For tonight's card, coming in at a cool $3 (thanks, Battlebond!) I nominate Skyshroud Claim! I like being able to search for two untapped duals.