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How would you say this list holds up when your opponents are also very aggressive?
Thank you!
Agreed!
Bruna is a fun commander. I've built mine as self-mill and try to get all of the Auras from the graveyard rather than hand. I find it fairly reliable, at least as long as I can protect Bruna before she becomes protected by the Auras.BlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑3 months agoI have played Bruna, Light of Alabaster in the past myself (a list I still update from time to time), and this thread makes me want to put together a voltron commander again.
It is rare for me to be in a pod where all the decks are fast and aggro, but where there are one or two opponents with aggro it can be quite fun (at least for me) to see who can race to lethal damage first. The deck does have enough tools to work around archetypes, like if they play Voltron I need to get the right Sword for colour protection, and if they go wide there is always Avacyn's transformation to reduce their numbers. If everyone is aggro the game probably won't last long, but that just means more time for more gamesBlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑3 months agoHow would you say this list holds up when your opponents are also very aggressive?
I have commented on these in the Exclusions, Alternatives & Considerations section, though it is kinda buried at the bottom there😅I agree that Forge & Frontier has card advantage potential, but without any top deck manipulation I would be hesitant to play it in the early to midgame, even though that could be useful for the extra lands. The deck has very few high mana value cards, but in my mind I'd hate to lose them. Plus fairly low land count as well. I would love this sword if it say until the end of your next turn. Admittedly that is all theory, and it would be worth trying out, see how it actually plays.PrimevalCommander wrote: ↑3 months agoCurious on your thoughts of Sword of Forge and Frontier, and potentially Sword of Hearth and Home as potential upgrades to some of the older swords. Forge and Frontier looks like solid card advantage for you over body and mind. Hearth and Home is more on the ramp side, but several of your utility dudes have ETB's that might be worth triggering again. I see these as potentially more useful than Body/Mind and War/Peace. Although War/Peace does shorten the clock, but not when you are commander damage-ing the table to death.
Sure
Thank you, it is really appreciated!Avacyn Believer wrote: ↑3 months agoSureI never thought about Kellan much, so could be interesting thought exercise.
Yeah, that is a good line of play if you suspect that the opponents won't remove Kellan right away and sets you up for the rest of the game nicely mana-wise. You can also go for Swiftfoot Boots if you want to play it more safely I suppose (unless you managed to get Mother/Giver of Runes down on turn 1, then the boots are less necessary).I agree with you about fast mana. I don't think you need it, not unless you are pushing for really fast games. I went that way because of Avacyn's CMC, and to get ahead of control decks (used to play against them often), but Kellan is low CMC and a tutor in the command zone, which provides plenty of opportunity for consistent ramp. I see you already got Sword of the Animist, and the Dowsing Dagger.
I think the Dagger would be my go to play because it curves out nicely: turn 2 tutor, turn 3 Kellan, turn 4 attack with the Dagger and hopefully flip it while causing 8 commander damage, not a bad deal. The Sword has the same line of play, but less damage and take longer to make the same amount of mana.
I'll stick with the Mirran Swords when I am able to put the list together in paper and see how well Kellan will get through. It is something I will have to experience in game. I did put Tarrian's Soulcleaver in the list to be able to give Kellan Vigilance for a relatively cheap cost if necessary, so he can also be a powerful blocker.I definitely would replace the sacrifice package, it doesn't fit with Kellan at all. Sunforger is probably where I'd focus my lines of play with Kellan, because it should be consistent with his tutor ability. I find the transform boardwipe useful to clear our blockers, but again, with tutor in the command zone, so easy to find evasion. I would probably look at some Auras, like Spirit Mantle, to make him unblockable, which would double up as good blocker if you can give him vigilance.
Trailblazer's Boots is not a bad choice, but it is conditional (even if most games will have nonbasic lands). I think because you have the tutor always available, you should be okay with just finding the right Mirran Sword to get protection from whatever colour blockers your target opponent is using. That way you get the evasion you want, plus value from the Sword, rather than wasting mana on the Boots just to be unblockable.
Oh, that is an interesting land! Never saw it before haha, Wizards is pumping out way too much cards and sets for me to memorize everything. Maybe I could play it instead of Rogue's Passage (don't think I want to cut more basics) - I think Passage is one of those lands which looks like a good fit for the deck at first glance, but will probably only be relevant in like 1/100 games.Sanctum of Eternity could be decent land to include, and other effects that bounce Kellan to your hand to re-cast the tutor without doing it from the command zone.
I have thought about sprinkling in some token synergy, but I don't think I want to run a card like Felidar Retreat or equipment that creates tokens like Andúril, Flame of the West on their own. When you go for the token route I think you should lean quite heavily into that strategy to gain value from doing so. The buff Kellan provides does synergise nicely with Esper Sentinel though. Inventory Management looks like a card that can cheat quite a bit of mana, but I think it is a bit... awkward? I don't know, I just see myself drawing it and not casting it for the entirety of a game. I think it's better in Avacyn. You play equipment in the turns prior to casting Avacyn, flash in Avacyn, cast Management to equip her at instant speed and go to town.I'd probably look for Equipment, or other hands, that make tokens in some easy and consistent way, to lean more into his second ability. Even 1/1 Spirits can be dangerous when they get +3 or more power, and that should be easily enough to do. That way you could deal with one opponent with commander damage, and another with regular damage. Top of my head there is Felidar Retreat, triggering on landfall to make 2/2 Cats.
Overall, I'd say with Kellan my primary strategy would be Sunforger, followed by making tokens and buff their power. The main risk with this kind of deck that comes to mind is the amount of tutoring you might end up doing, that could get boring.
Oh and I'd include Inventory Management. I haven't had a chance to test it out yet but it is a bonkers card for Equipment/Auras Voltron decks.
Not gonna lie, didn't even think of thatBlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑3 months agoYeah, that is a good line of play if you suspect that the opponents won't remove Kellan right away and sets you up for the rest of the game nicely mana-wise.
No argument there, though the Sanctum is from Commander 2019, but it has never been reprinted. I think I know of it because I have a copy, it came in the precon I bought. Looking at your list I'd be more tempted to swap it for Mistveil Plains, not sure I see the benefit of that land. Or honestly, even one of the fetch lands. You don't need this much colour fixing, majority of the deck is white or colourless, and you'll already be searching and shuffling your deck often enough.BlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑3 months agoOh, that is an interesting land! Never saw it before haha, Wizards is pumping out way too much cards and sets for me to memorize everything. Maybe I could play it instead of Rogue's Passage (don't think I want to cut more basics) - I think Passage is one of those lands which looks like a good fit for the deck at first glance, but will probably only be relevant in like 1/100 games.
That's fair.BlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑3 months agoI have thought about sprinkling in some token synergy, but I don't think I want to run a card like Felidar Retreat or equipment that creates tokens like Andúril, Flame of the West on their own.
I'd at least try it, especially since you can tutor for it through Sunforger, making it more reliable. In my mind its not really even about the early game, but more so in the late game where you might have bunch of Equipment on the field but not enough mana to Equip them all. This gives at least gives you the option to get around all that mana cost. And if you don't need it, easy card to discard for red draw spells.BlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑3 months agoInventory Management looks like a card that can cheat quite a bit of mana, but I think it is a bit... awkward? I don't know, I just see myself drawing it and not casting it for the entirety of a game. I think it's better in Avacyn. You play equipment in the turns prior to casting Avacyn, flash in Avacyn, cast Management to equip her at instant speed and go to town.
When I was goldfishing the deck I generally drew and tutored enough cards to turn him into a monster without having to cast him over and over again for the tutor half of his card, but that's goldfishing without any interaction of courseAvacyn Believer wrote: ↑3 months agoNot gonna lie, didn't even think of thatI was more thinking build up mana base and wanting Kellan to die so that I can cast the tutor again. Since he has double strike, and if you can do 6-8 commander damage by turn 4, then all you need is to make him power 7-8 in some later turn for lethal.
I put Mistveil Plains in the deck because I am not running the recursion package that you do. It can be tutored by a fetch and it can put valuable equipment (there are plenty of equipment tutors in the deck to find them again) and instants for Sunforger back into the deck. Granted, this is only relevant in games that go long, but I like having the option. I think I could take out one of the fetches for the Sanctum, sounds like a good idea!No argument there, though the Sanctum is from Commander 2019, but it has never been reprinted. I think I know of it because I have a copy, it came in the precon I bought. Looking at your list I'd be more tempted to swap it for Mistveil Plains, not sure I see the benefit of that land. Or honestly, even one of the fetch lands. You don't need this much colour fixing, majority of the deck is white or colourless, and you'll already be searching and shuffling your deck often enough.
That is a good point, perhaps I am judging it too roughly. And it's not like the deck runs that many colourless utility lands to begin with.On other hand I'd make a case that Rogue's Passage is an important land for any Voltron deck. Not because it will be relevant in every game, but because it is the last resort to get unblockable commander, which is harder to remove from the field than anything else. I like to have contingencies spread between different types of permanents.
That's true, it's more flexible than I deemed it to be at first glance. The split second makes it so that you can cast your commander and unless he gets countered, he'll be safe from removal when you try to equip him with your swords and stuff. Much to think aboutI'd at least try it, especially since you can tutor for it through Sunforger, making it more reliable. In my mind its not really even about the early game, but more so in the late game where you might have bunch of Equipment on the field but not enough mana to Equip them all. This gives at least gives you the option to get around all that mana cost. And if you don't need it, easy card to discard for red draw spells.
Most important thing to me is the Split Second, you can protect your commander against almost everything if you have the right Equipment on the field and your opponents can't counter it (in 99% of situations). It also makes for a good combat trick. You have your equipment on different creature (for example to make them unblockable), attack, and then before damage you can put all of it on Kellan, or whatever other creature. That's how I see playing it, rather than just thinking about saving mana.
Oh fair one, that makes sense, that it can be any card is good. I like that tutor synergy actually, might try it in some other deck of mineBlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑2 months agoI put Mistveil Plains in the deck because I am not running the recursion package that you do. It can be tutored by a fetch and it can put valuable equipment (there are plenty of equipment tutors in the deck to find them again) and instants for Sunforger back into the deck.
Welcome to the clubBlackbirdPlaysMTG wrote: ↑2 months agoI feel card slots are quite contested, so I'll have to see what to take out and what to put in.
Yeah, I have the same problem when updating my Sythis, Harvest's Hand enchantress deck. A card has to be really strong or flavourful to make the cut nowadaysAvacyn Believer wrote: ↑2 months agoWelcome to the clubI feel so pedantic sometime when I am evaluating cards from new sets that could fit into the Avacyn deck, but at this point I have to be since there no easy swaps anymore. These days I lean a lot towards 'does it feel good to play' over just what is strictly better.