The Community Deck Build Project v6.0

[toctheyounger]

Yea Defiance. I think the white iteration is better, but this is still quite flexible and a decent flip from our commander. Specifically, I like that Velo triggers on attack so we can clear the way with these for beating face instead of chump blocking. I also quite like that Defiance lets us choose who to wheel. We can choose ourselves if needed, or if someone has just dropped Demonic Tutor we can wreck them too. All the upside without Nekusar, the Mindrazer or Smothering Tithe breaking parity on it.

Yea to Bolt. I think it has less of a case than Path or Swords, but gives us options with faces, walkers or battles (if we're including recent spoilers). It's just versatile enough to get in.

I wonder if Thunder is a little overcosted. I know, we play for free from the top of deck, but that's not always gonna happen. I'm always going to prefer efficiency over 'add burn' when I'm hardcasting a Disenchant. I won't nay, but I'm not yea'ing it either.

[aliciaofthevast]

Okay you convinced me, I'll yay collective effort! Alongside orim's thunder and collective defiance.

[Dunharrow]

Yay Bolt

I will say nay to everything else. I feel like we are scraping the bottom of the barrel of RW interaction. 3 mana Flame Slash is so terrible I don't care if we can loot away our hand at the same time.

I'm not saying these cards can't be in the deck. But I feel very opposed to saying Yay to any of these when StP isn't in the deck yet. What's the thought process here? Start with our pet cards and then realize we left out the staples?

[Henlock]

Personally, I think that flexibility is more important than effectiveness with Velomachus. We don't have much control on what we're going to hit, save for some scries and putting something from hand on top of the deck with Brainstone. Of course there are better disenchants than Orim's Thunder, but I really appreciate the possibility it gives of blowing up some random artifact or enchantment we don't mind much to get rid of a creature. Compared it to Wear // Tear, we're paying one more for the possibility of dealing with one extra card type.

There's also the issue of Velo casts limiting our room for flexibility regarding some abilities. Overload, and rebound don't work with him. Cost reducing abilities like Convoke, afinity, delve, etc don't sit well with Velo either, as they increase mana value, as too do split cards. X costs won't work.on free casts, Even timing differences between sorceries and instants get diluted with him.

[RxPhantom]

Yay Bolt

I will say nay to everything else. I feel like we are scraping the bottom of the barrel of RW interaction. 3 mana Flame Slash is so terrible I don't care if we can loot away our hand at the same time.

I'm not saying these cards can't be in the deck. But I feel very opposed to saying Yay to any of these when StP isn't in the deck yet. What's the thought process here? Start with our pet cards and then realize we left out the staples?

We have, like, 14 interaction slots left. Nominate StP. I'll yay it. I'll yay it so hard.

I'll also take this time to say that when it comes to these decks, I'll almost always yay things that are cool, interesting, or seem like they'd create memorable plays/games.

Having said that, nay to Bolt. The ceiling is high, but the floor is really low. Yay to Orim's Thunder. I don't know if there are many things we'll be destroying that will make the damage part relevant, but it's a potential 2 for 1 that plays well with Velo's ability, so I'm yaying it.

This deck is kind of tricky to build. On one hand, the mana value on some of these spells matters less to me than versatility (yay to Defiance, almost forgot) since the plan is to rip them off the top for free, often without very much topdeck manipulation, but that doesn't mean I want to totally eschew efficiency. Modal spells seem pretty great with Velo, honestly.

[toctheyounger]

This deck is kind of tricky to build. On one hand, the mana value on some of these spells matters less to me than versatility (yay to Defiance, almost forgot) since the plan is to rip them off the top for free, often without very much topdeck manipulation, but that doesn't mean I want to totally eschew efficiency. Modal spells seem pretty great with Velo, honestly.

This so much. I'm used to aiming as spikey as my meager wallet can afford, but this deck wants to pull in the other direction. We can sort of have our cake and eat it too without sacrificing value to efficiency or vice versa, and I guess there's no reason not to just sit on the fence and try for the best of both worlds. There's very little to lose when it comes to most of these. I feel like we're pretty close to the mark when it comes to 'feels good both off the topdeck and the hand'.

[3drinks]

Lotta confirmations here, most notable of which is after wild ricochet has been tabling for days with no comment, I'm making the executive decision to cut it. It's clearly not getting there.

Wild Ricochet yay - 2 nay - 1
Collective Effort yay - 3 nay - 2
Orim's Thunder yay - 3 nay - 1
Lightning Bolt|sld yay - 4 nay - 1
Collective Defiance yay - 4 nay - 1

New turn cycle, so let's put @TheAmericanSpirit and @RxPhantom on the clock. We're at 5/15 interaction slots right now.

I will say nay to everything else. I feel like we are scraping the bottom of the barrel of RW interaction. 3 mana Flame Slash is so terrible I don't care if we can loot away our hand at the same time.

I'm not saying these cards can't be in the deck. But I feel very opposed to saying Yay to any of these when StP isn't in the deck yet. What's the thought process here? Start with our pet cards and then realize we left out the staples?

I'm not so sure I'd look at collective defiance as a flame slash strictly speaking as it very often will be so much more, though it is pretty weak when not escalated. But escalate spells are really good with the dragon since we can get the extra effects without paying full retail. Boros isn't really known for it's spellslinging abilities though and I always wondered why these colours got this dragon. Feels so much more Azorious, but I admittedly was pretty tuned out of Strix-totally-not-harry-potter-haven.

I don't really see why the hate in orim's thunder|apc. It's a classic, natural two-for-one in a colour combination that doesn't regularly get such a thing. I've never not liked drawing it in my experiences. Certainly much nicer than freakin decimate|ody.

As for nominations, can't go where players don't guide the deck. I can only do so much with my votes, others have just as much influence too.

[Dunharrow]

Orim's Thunder is better than I remembered. I always thought it burned the player, not a creature.
I think white has a lot of premium removal. Maybe 6-7 really good spells that should be in every RW deck. Probably 9-10 interaction spells if we consider wraths.
I don't really want Collective Effort in the deck and then we don't have room for Cleansing Nova
But that's where we are headed.

[3drinks]

I definitely voted against collective effort. But alas I'm only one vote and the majority seems to want it. So here we are. I'd say your interaction count is low in general, but especially low in a deck that can play more since we can hit them on our attack step. Kinda think we shouldn't lean too heavily into the dragon because the cost means it's not happening until late, even with treasures I don't anticipate this coming down before five - and you probably want to sandbag it because getting taxed out will be brutal.

[RxPhantom]

I want to protect Velo. Are things like Loran's Escape considered interaction for this part of the process? I'm gonna nominate Swords to Plowshares because it's awesome and I want @Dunharrow to be happy.

[TheAmericanSpirit]

I nominate Farewell. Modal means we can always get some value off the top with Velp, and with all modes engaged it's a damn nuke.

[RxPhantom]

Yay to Farewell despite thinking it's busted as hell.

[3drinks]

I'd imagine protection is interaction, yeah. It's interacting with removal.

[toctheyounger]

I don't really want Collective Effort in the deck and then we don't have room for Cleansing Nova

Remember we can always curate at the end of the list. If it's not fitting we can always replace with superior options if we really need to.

Yea Swords, thank you Rx. Yea Farewell, good card is good.

[aliciaofthevast]

Farewell and Swords to Plowshares are two of the easiest yays I've seen. Man those are so strong.

As for nominations, can't go where players don't guide the deck. I can only do so much with my votes, others have just as much influence too.

I love this honestly, it's such a powerful statement in just a couple sentences. 💖

[Dunharrow]

Yay farewell and stp

[Crazy Monkey]

Darn, I was distracted during an interesting discussion. I will go on record as supporting the cards that got voted in, the multi function nature of Collective Effort makes it particularly appealing. It's not the most efficient but that doesn't matter if it is free.

Yea Swords to Plowshares and Farewell. They're just good cards.

[Dunharrow]

Darn, I was distracted during an interesting discussion. I will go on record as supporting the cards that got voted in, the multi function nature of Collective Effort makes it particularly appealing. It's not the most efficient but that doesn't matter if it is free.

What about when it's not free?
And why is Collective Effort better than Angelic Edict if we are only gauging cards by how good they are for free?

[3drinks]

Well, Farewell and Plowshares have both been confirmed. That was an easy tally.

@Crazy Monkey and @toctheyounger are on the clock today.

What about when it's not free?
And why is Collective Effort better than Angelic Edict if we are only gauging cards by how good they are for free?

This is an important point. It appears a lot of decisions are being made on the assumption we will always have access to the dragon, and I don't believe that to be true. This is just part of why this is a tricky (re: interesting) commander to build for. We need to have spells that make iMPACT but that are still serviceable when we pay retail for them while setting up a board that enables us to slam our dragon down.

There's still a lot of slots to go, maybe it'll turn out to be the best thing ever we can't live without. It all depends on where the deck goes.

[toctheyounger]

I'm gonna nominate Tragic Arrogance. It's fine to hardcast, probably great to freecast too.

Otherwise it's pretty close behind Farewell as an excellent wipe. Lots of stuff is going to bite it, but you get to decide what. You can choose the same permanent twice if, say, one is both an artifact and a creature, so we get to quite favorably shape the remnants of the board. Gets around indestructible too.

[Henlock]

Yay to tragic arrogance. A wrath that leaves Velo behind looks good.

[aliciaofthevast]

There's a part of me that asks "why not Cataclysm?" and then I'm like "nice land wipe with your 7 drop, dork 🤣". Tragic arrogance is probably fine, I'll yay that!

[Crazy Monkey]

Yea Tragic Arrogance, that's a great hit.

I'll nominate Chandra's Ignition for interaction. I'm a sucker for inefficient interaction that gets much better with the commander.

[toctheyounger]

There's a part of me that asks "why not Cataclysm?" and then I'm like "nice land wipe with your 7 drop, dork 🤣". Tragic arrogance is probably fine, I'll yay that!

I did consider it but you really do need a pretty optimal landbase and tons of contingency to not wreck yourself with it.

I'll nominate Chandra's Ignition for interaction. I'm a sucker for inefficient interaction that gets much better with the commander.

Yeah I was gonna pick this. My only concern is it relates to power so it's not gonna do either thing perfectly in a vacuum. But I think in most cases we can consider it a board wipe with burn, rather than a genuine win condition as it would be in something like Korvold, Fae-Cursed King or Kresh the Bloodbraided. I'm still into it. Yea for me. Something about targeting Dragon's Rage Channeler after delirium triggers really hits nice to me too.

[Henlock]

Yay to Chandra's ignition. We even have access to stuff like Brash Taunter should we want to lean into that territory.