Heliod, Sun-Crowned - Life and Taxes

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darrenhabib
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Post by darrenhabib » 4 years ago

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Life and Taxes

Commander

Life-gain benefit creatures

Protection creatures

Graveyard recursion

Land destruction

Artifacts

Approximate Total Cost:



Adding to the ranks of two card combos from the commander zone, now we have Heliod, Sun-Crowned + Walking Ballista or Triskelion as a way to deal infinite damage and gain infinite life.

However after thinking about the various ways to assemble the combo via additional tutors and ways to protect it, I realized that I still had a lot of deck to figure out what to do with.

So I wanted to focus on Heliod, Sun-Crowned abilities in a more aggressive manner. I wanted to push a weenie/mid-range creature base and then use life-gain to bolster them so that they can pressure opponents in meaningful manner with the additional +1/+1 counters.

I've found hate-bear mono-white decks in the past to usually come up short of winning. The reason is that although they can slow-down what opponents can do, they don't really have the ability to finish the game in a timely manner before at least one opponent assembles what they want to do. Sure the hate-bear deck might muster up enough damage to kill at least one opponent, but finishing all the rest of the table more often than not just falls a little short.

However I now feel with a solid distribution of +1/+1 counters each and every turn via Heliod, Sun-Crowned and lots of ways to gain life, these hate-bear style creatures can actually provide enough pressure to finish off opponents.

Then to top it off there is a limited time-clock that opponents have to work against, as you can at any stage assemble the Walking Ballista combo.
There are some cards that can be used to search for Walking Ballista so you can find it fairly quickly; Enlightened Tutor, Recruiter of the Guard, Ranger of Eos, Ranger-Captain of Eos, Scrapyard Recombiner.

The main idea of the deck is to get a number of your life-gain and hate-bear creatures, and then you can give them lifelink via Heliod, Sun-Crowned 1w ability when attacking, and this way you can give +1/+1 counters divided as you wish among your creatures.
You could literally just keep putting the counters on each of your creatures, or you might stack them up onto a few of them so that they are more threatening in the face of larger blockers.
I think you want to divide the counters as evenly as possible however, so that targeted removal becomes less effective for your opponents.

Because of the nature of hate-bear and prision strategies you will encounter cards that conflict with each other in some manner.
Walking Ballista/Triskelion and Well of Lost Dreams unfortunately gets shut down by Stony Silence and Null Rod.
But with the focus of the deck being taxes and aggression and not really combo, you are very happy to trade off shutting down a lot of your opponents decks.

Return to the Ranks and Rest in Peace/Scavenger Grounds is a nonbo as well, but with literally only one card that looks to use your graveyard I feel this is fine to run the clash.

The hate-bears that prevent ETB effects (Hushbringer, Hushwing Gryff) will mean that some of the "soul sister" life-gain creatures will fail to trigger and also the search library creatures. However this is a fine trade-off against other decks that look to use ETB in much more disruptive/value ways.

This is a first draft, so as always if you have any ideas on how to improve on the deck or just combos I've clearly missed, I'm all ears.



If you wanted a build that is aimed around getting the Walking Ballista combo faster/more consistant then I've thought about what sort of changes I would make.

It would involve removing the artifact hate cards Null Rod and Stony Silence and then using Inventors' Fair as an additional way to search for Walking Ballista/Triskelion.
You need 3 artifacts on the battlefield for it to work, so there needs to be additional artifacts to support this idea.
Last edited by darrenhabib 3 years ago, edited 11 times in total.

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pokken
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Post by pokken » 4 years ago

Hm, good stuff here as usual. I'd consider cavalier of dawn as the best general purpose recursion for ballista slash trike, and a solid all around body too.

Land count feels a scoche low for not having any tithe effects, not even the bro flavor like oreskos explorer and boreas charger.. feels like a 35 or 36 to me.

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darrenhabib
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Post by darrenhabib » 4 years ago

pokken wrote:
4 years ago
Hm, good stuff here as usual. I'd consider cavalier of dawn as the best general purpose recursion for ballista slash trike, and a solid all around body too.

Land count feels a scoche low for not having any tithe effects, not even the bro flavor like oreskos explorer and boreas charger.. feels like a 35 or 36 to me.
I do consider Legion's Landing to be lands of sorts, but with Armageddon and Cataclysm I guess I'm being a bit stingy on the land count.
Also I'm not actually sure on the individual lands themselves. But thought I'd throw in a number of lands that could be relevant for "theory-crafting" purposes, but the end result will probably be that I replace a number of them with good old Plains.

I'll start off with these changes.


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Post by rogerandover » 4 years ago

Unexpectedly Absent belongs to every mono white control deck. Such a versetile card!
Argivian Find is also good at recuring your combo pieces.

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darrenhabib
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Post by darrenhabib » 4 years ago

rogerandover wrote:
4 years ago
Unexpectedly Absent belongs to every mono white control deck. Such a versetile card!
Argivian Find is also good at recuring your combo pieces.
Now that I think on Apostle's Blessing more, there isn't a major component that I'd want to protect "at-all-costs". I think I'd rather have Argivian Find that can get back some of the more disruptive enchantments, and of course the combo cards.

I'm not sure about Eerie Interlude either. I'm normally going to be tapping out for activating Heliod, Sun-Crowned giving creatures lifelink most turns, so holding up protection like this can be a bit of a set-back if opponents don't actually cast removal. Still happy to play Teferi's Protection just because it's a step up in protection.


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Post by SirGregarious » 4 years ago

Just saw this guy, super excited to start some brewing. I think running Stony Silence and Null Rod might be the wrong choice because it cuts you off from mana rocks, your only source of real ramp. You could consider Karn, the Great Creator instead because he won't shut off your combo.

Diamond Mare is another life gain creature.

Board the Weatherlight, Mystic Forge, Smuggler's Copter and Mask of Memory could be useful for some card draw.

Sevinne's Reclamation, Brought Back and Sun Titan are some notable recursion pieces I didn't see.

Scout's Warning lets you go off and instant speed with Triskelion/Ballista in hand and Heliod on board.

Giver of Runes is another copy of mom but it won't protect itself.

Gideon Blackblade is pretty nuts if you slow the game pace down.

Grasp of Fate and Darksteel Mutation are some good removal that I didn't see in your list.

Thorn of Amethyst and Grafdigger's Cage are some good hate pieces you could run.

For lands, Emergence Zone lets you go off at instant speed, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx will be good with all the devotion you're putting down, Inventors' Fair is huge in this deck because you can tutor up your combo pieces. I'm still waiting for the deck that I can put Serra's Sanctum in to, but I don't think this will be the one.

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darrenhabib
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Post by darrenhabib » 4 years ago

SirGregarious wrote:
4 years ago
Just saw this guy, super excited to start some brewing. I think running Stony Silence and Null Rod might be the wrong choice because it cuts you off from mana rocks, your only source of real ramp. You could consider Karn, the Great Creator instead because he won't shut off your combo.
If you want to lean on the combo, then there are a ton of different ways you could build/focus a deck around it. I went through a few different themes during theory-crafting, so I'll list some stuff that I thought about.

Being as mine is a hate-bear deck ultimately, the idea is that you are slowing the game down, rather than trying to bullet-out anything, so I'm specifically avoiding artifact mana in favor of hate-cards instead.
But this might be incorrect in the end, and it could be that I switch up Stony Silence and Null Rod for artifact mana.

Inventors' Fair does require a sizable threshold of artifacts in the build in order to turn it on. If you wanted to concentrate more on assembling the combo, then you could run a shell which is more artifact based.
There are some cards that can search for Inventors' Fair as well; Expedition Map and Weathered Wayfarer.

Eye of Ugin will also allow you to search for Walking Ballista/Triskelion. If you wanted the "Eldrazi" portion of the card to be more meaningful then I think All Is Dust, Eldrazi Displacer, Thought-Knot Seer, would be fine additions.

All these artifacts allow you to search for Walking Ballista/Triskelion in some manner;
Citanul Flute, Kuldotha Forgemaster, Mangara's Tome, Planar Bridge, Planar Portal, Ring of Three Wishes, Skyship Weatherlight.

However I think given the cost to cast and/or activate a lot of these that it's just overkill. But of these I do like Citanul Flute the best as you can tap it the turn you play it without investing more mana to search for Walking Ballista.
Plus you can search for a creature like Grand Abolisher if you suspect opponents are holding up disruption to try and stop you.

I have a Teshar, Ancestor's Apostle deck, and so couldn't help but think Teshar would be great as part of your 99 if you were to have a larger number of artifacts and still be running the hate-bears.

I thought about the Bomberman combo; Lion's Eye Diamond and Auriok Salvagers. The neat thing about Auriok Salvagers is that it can retrieve Walking Ballista if has gone to graveyard.

Also equipment can give you life gain; Umezawa's Jitte, Sword of Light and Shadow.
Plus card advantages with Skullclamp, Sword of the Animist, Mask of Memory, Sword of Fire and Ice. White obviously has a great backbone for equipment themes.
Sevinne's Reclamation, Brought Back and Sun Titan are some notable recursion pieces I didn't see.
I did look at a number of reanimation cards, but because they cannot bring back Walking Ballista (without dying), I decided that many are not worth it.

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Post by ISBPathfinder » 4 years ago

Well, I was crafting a list but I decided to abort on it. I figured I would just post what I had so far here because I don't actually intend to finish the build myself.

Keep in mind, this is a very rough list that was far from being complete and I was intending to not go infinite which is why there was no walking ball / triskillion. I don't know how useful any of this is given that its clearly not the direction you were going. I did think it was valid to question running Torpor Orb effects though given how much value there is in the soul sisters gameplan outside of going infinite.

Sorry if what I have isn't relevant here. What I was designing was more focused on triggering a bunch of lifegain triggers rather than comboing to beat down on people. It looked a bit weak to control concepts though which is part of why I bailed on it.



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darrenhabib
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Post by darrenhabib » 4 years ago

ISBPathfinder wrote:
4 years ago
Well, I was crafting a list but I decided to abort on it. I figured I would just post what I had so far here because I don't actually intend to finish the build myself.

Keep in mind, this is a very rough list that was far from being complete and I was intending to not go infinite which is why there was no walking ball / triskillion. I don't know how useful any of this is given that its clearly not the direction you were going. I did think it was valid to question running Torpor Orb effects though given how much value there is in the soul sisters gameplan outside of going infinite.

Sorry if what I have isn't relevant here. What I was designing was more focused on triggering a bunch of lifegain triggers rather than comboing to beat down on people. It looked a bit weak to control concepts though which is part of why I bailed on it.
I like the Resplendent Mentor. Sometimes you need to build up some of the creatures before they can attack.

Leonin Warleader also seems strong, as even if your 1/1s get killed, at least they can give +1/+1 counters with their lifelink.

Curse of the Forsaken is a cheap way to get multiple triggers as well.

You are probably right about the Torpor Orb effect creatures being a nuisance to the overall plan.


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