The Shattered Realm: Creative

User avatar
void_nothing
Look On My Sash...
Posts: 15310
Joined: 5 years ago
Answers: 126
Pronoun: he / him
Location: Tal Terig, Zendikar

Post by void_nothing » 3 years ago

Well, as the nominal Creative Director for the current collaborative set project I'm very happy to get the creative work started now that a set concept's been selected. Here is Krishnath's original writeup:
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
1. The Shattered Realm: A world wherein all land masses float, literally, in the sky. Think a cross between Serra's Realm and Zendikar and you wouldn't be far off the realms appearance. Obviously, the setting would have a lot of flying creatures, but also spiders and other creatures with reach. Higher up, the floating ground becomes more sparse, while further down it becomes denser. Natural light levels vary, with more light near the top and less near the bottom. Furthest down there is no natural light at all and terrible nightmarish creatures.
In no particular chronological order, our first priorities should be proper names for the plane and the set itself, an outline for the story of the set, and a "style guide" with native creature types, cultures, history, and other features of the world, and proper names that can be used.
Psst, check the second page of Custom Card Contests & Games! Because of the daily contests, a lot of games fall down to there.

The greatest (fake) pro wrestling on the internet - Collaborative Create-A-Booster - My random creations (updated regularly)

Important Facts: Colorless is not a color, Wastes is not a land type, Changeling is not a creature type

User avatar
Venedrex
Wait, we can have titles?
Posts: 1416
Joined: 3 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Venedrex » 3 years ago

One word: Phoenixes. :P
OK maybe more than one word. I think Phoenixes are awesome and they could use some love, and they fly! Might not work for this plane but I'm gonna throw them out here anyway lol.
Epicurean, EDH without Universes Beyond.

http://nxs.wf/np748831

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

Venedrex wrote:
3 years ago
One word: Phoenixes. :P
OK maybe more than one word. I think Phoenixes are awesome and they could use some love, and they fly! Might not work for this plane but I'm gonna throw them out here anyway lol.
I think one to three phoenixes would be grand, but the creature type doesn't really lend itself to large amounts of creatures.


As for other creatures:

Spiders however is a must. They would be perfect for a plane such as this, feeding on the abundance of flying creatures and spinning webs between the floating rocks/mountains/continents.

I think that each of the Iconics (Angel, Demon, Dragon, Hydra, Sphinx) should have at least one representative in the world. All but Hydras would lend themselves well to the world, so we can skip that one if need be. But if we flavor it properly it could still work (say by giving it reach to simulate climbing ability).


As for the sapient races, a few suggestions:

Humans are almost a given. Found in all colors of course. We could have a mix between wandering nomads that act as merchants between settlements, using flying mounts and traveling along webs to move their goods from place to place, and various settlements ranging from small encampments and villages to huge fortified cities.

I suggest we use Elves for Green, with the possibility of going into a secondary color. I know it is pretty basic to use elves as the "green race", but they are a fantasy staple for a reason, they are easy for people to recognize. Alternately we could use humanoid Cats as the Green race, although I suggest we steer away from Leonin, and base them on another large cat instead of lions. We could even have both. Alternately, for a curveball, we could go with a humanoid Canid of some sort, perhaps Wolf or Fox based?

Blue is more difficult to pin down, the world doesn't exactly lend itself to the aquatic races (merfolk, homarid, cephalid), so there aren't that many existing races to chose from. It's pretty much only Aven and/or Vedalken. Does anyone else have any ideas?

Black could be nearly anything. Zombies are likely to happen regardless, but they are usually depicted as mindless, so they aren't really suited as the black representative here. Personally I think that using vampires would steer us awfully close to Zendikar, something we should avoid. Perhaps humanoid Rats or Bats? Insects? Anyone else have suggestions here?

For Red there are some options, there is the classic standby of goblins of course. And while I think having Goblins in the world would be just fine, I feel we should have another races as the primary representative of red. The main three I can think of are either Viashino, Orcs, or Ogres,

White is simultaneously the easiest and the hardest to do, as humans are a given we can easily use them in white. I would like if we stayed clear of Kor though, due to the similarities with Zendikar. One possibility (aside from the obvious Aven, lol), is a race that was introduced at the same time as the Kor in Tempest block. The Solitari, while they were associated with the shadow in the Tempest block, like the Dauthi and Thalakos, neither of the races were originally shadow people, but got stuck there due to how Rath was built originally. That could also solve the blue and black sapient race problem by using those two races as well, and it would give the world something that would make it stand out.


Other general worldbuilding stuff:

One easy thing to give a world some flavor is to introduce a material native to said world, Rath had flowstone, Alara had Sangrite and Etherium, and Amonkhet had Lazotep, just to name a few, as such I suggest the following material to this world:

Floatstone: A type of igneous rock with the natural ability to, well, float in the air. It's exact coloration varies, but it tends towards blue, cyan, and purple hues.

It's not much, but it gives us a material to work with when creating cards, and it gives some nice flavor to the world.


Anyway, that is just some ideas of the top of my head.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
SecretInfiltrator
Posts: 5902
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: they / them
Location: The Shattered Realm

Post by SecretInfiltrator » 3 years ago

Spontaneous Thoughts:
  • I actually like "The Shattered Realm" as an epithet, so I suppose the setname should be "_<plane name>: The Shattered Realm_" similar to "_Ravnica: City of Guilds_".
  • It seems like a nice idea to expand upon the idea of being "shattered" by creating a sense of a nebulous pre-history where the realm was "whole" e. g. peoples that have been displaced by the change and maybe became nomadic and vice versa, maybe flying species rose to prominence, while there is a landbound species that has fallen from glory and are now resentful (and probably black-aligned).
  • As always when an idea contains phrases like "think Zendikar" or similar, there is the question of differentiating the two places. In this case it seems easy: Zendikar specifically is a world with no permanent settlements and constant danger due to the roil. In contrast we could aim for castles in the sky, merchants in blimps and drake-riding sky-knights/-couriers, floating magic schools etc. that speak of established infrastructure. #ashatteredrealm #notabrokenpeople

User avatar
SecretInfiltrator
Posts: 5902
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: they / them
Location: The Shattered Realm

Post by SecretInfiltrator » 3 years ago

I mention it further down, but think it is worth putting at the beginning of a post: How important is having artwork? I usually go crazy on the world-building and just don't bother with ever having artwork for my order of Griffin-riding Monkey Demon Knights, but that's a given only for my own sets. If we want to pimp out the set with artwork we might want to decide that early on before we get into too outlandish concepts.

Maybe we should just start out "dreaming big" anyway; I just want us to have that possible limitation in mind.
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
I think that each of the Iconics (Angel, Demon, Dragon, Hydra, Sphinx) should have at least one representative in the world. All but Hydras would lend themselves well to the world, so we can skip that one if need be. But if we flavor it properly it could still work (say by giving it reach to simulate climbing ability).
Love climbing Hydras. Green in general will be a toughie on the flying plane, so "predators with reach" can be a niche for them.
Blue is more difficult to pin down, the world doesn't exactly lend itself to the aquatic races (merfolk, homarid, cephalid), so there aren't that many existing races to chose from. It's pretty much only Aven and/or Vedalken. Does anyone else have any ideas?
I like the idea of blue getting a nonflying race, because blue is the color that would be best used for some kind of Artificers that use tools to overcome their disadvantage. In-MtG that would make me lean towards Vedalken, but if we need card illustrations that would mean a lot of Humans. : )
Black [...] Perhaps humanoid Rats or Bats? Insects? Anyone else have suggestions here?
Harpies/Avens would totally fly. I'd probably base it on the role of the black people in the world. I could see something with a Specter/Nazgul-aesthetic. I imagine there is some art to be found on black-clad ragged riders of magical beasts. Could be sapient undead. Though the wide range of art of shadow-creatures would totally allow us to use that aesthetic for Dauthi as well.
Floatstone: A type of igneous rock with the natural ability to, well, float in the air. It's exact coloration varies, but it tends towards blue, cyan, and purple hues.
That opens the can of why things float anyway and whether you can fall down and to what. I imagine Bespin here.

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

SecretInfiltrator wrote:
3 years ago
Spontaneous Thoughts:
  • I actually like "The Shattered Realm" as an epithet, so I suppose the setname should be "_<plane name>: The Shattered Realm_" similar to "_Ravnica: City of Guilds_".
  • It seems like a nice idea to expand upon the idea of being "shattered" by creating a sense of a nebulous pre-history where the realm was "whole" e. g. peoples that have been displaced by the change and maybe became nomadic and vice versa, maybe flying species rose to prominence, while there is a landbound species that has fallen from glory and are now resentful (and probably black-aligned).
  • As always when an idea contains phrases like "think Zendikar" or similar, there is the question of differentiating the two places. In this case it seems easy: Zendikar specifically is a world with no permanent settlements and constant danger due to the roil. In contrast we could aim for castles in the sky, merchants in blimps and drake-riding sky-knights/-couriers, floating magic schools etc. that speak of established infrastructure. #ashatteredrealm #notabrokenpeople
I agree. Imagine spider riding elves that *hate* flying races (like Aven or Bat people for example). I don't think it necessarily means a race has to be black aligned just because they are resentful of flying species. I don't feel being resentful is necessarily a black aligned trait. Black is more about being self serving and/or ambitious. One can be resentful and still think of what is best for the group.

Also castles in the sky/ flying cities and such seems perfect for the setting.

Edit:

Also, there should be a definite down, as I mentioned in my initial world concept for the voting portion, it gets darker the further down you go. There may or may not be a definite bottom down there in the dark, but since none have ever returned from the darkest areas, who is to say? So if you drop something, there is a definite possibility that you will never see that object again. This of course leads to people fastening things they don't want to lose to their person, purely from a pragmatic perspective. So that would definitely affect the art direction.

As for art, I am completely ambivalent towards it. I've never been good at finding specific art regardless, lol.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
folding_music
glitter pen on my mana crypt
Posts: 2351
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: they / them

Post by folding_music » 3 years ago

In a world where the land is unreliable and prone to float off, I'd wanna see plants that could become ambulatory, or at least specialize in getting moved about, like tumbleweeds, and dandelion clocks and thistles that are specialists at spreading seeds and thistledown. plants mostly have the imperative to be the one facing the sun? from the best position so they'd all be trying to get on the floatiest islands themselves!

and if all the land floats then what's below it has to be sea, right? so lots of seaweed, and animals who get mistaken for plants, like sea anemones and coral.

im endorsing lots of interesting plant life creatures! Saproling creatures would help distinguish from Zendikar, which has floating islands but no thallids activity

plus I love the idea of having more than the usual number of spiders in a set and lots of wild spiders prefer undergrowth. plants could be blue as well as green to demonstrate the kind of universal survivability that the sapient races discard - ubiquitous from weeds on the sea floor to hardy heather on the highest flying shards!

edit: hmm some of what I said about sea plants might not apply - looking over the brief more closely I get the impression there's no masses of water beneath the floating islands but rather that it's just a dark void? a bottomless pit? but that'll need its own subsistence life, too...

User avatar
SecretInfiltrator
Posts: 5902
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: they / them
Location: The Shattered Realm

Post by SecretInfiltrator » 3 years ago

The talk about spreading plant seeds is great, because it makes me think about the theme of "flying" as a more general "mobility" and I think we will have to find some more or at least broader thematic legs for the set to stand on.

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

I like the thing with the mobile plants/seeds, and saprolings a lot.

But here is a fun thing to note: Water is a necessity for life. No water, no life. At least not life in any way we could recognize. So logically, there must be some form of water on the plane. The largest pieces of floating rock could obviously have lakes, and even flowing water in the form of rivers and streams. In a setting such as this, waterfalls would be common of course. But there would be no real tectonic activity, no volcanoes or lava.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
Feyd_Ruin
Elder Vampire
Posts: 5478
Joined: 5 years ago
Answers: 3
Pronoun: he / him
Contact:

Post by Feyd_Ruin » 3 years ago

void_nothing wrote:
3 years ago
proper names for the plane
I also like ___: The Shattered Realm
The planar name could be almost anything, but seems like it should be picked after we get a cultural feel?
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
Floatstone: A type of igneous rock with the natural ability to, well, float in the air. It's exact coloration varies, but it tends towards blue, cyan, and purple hues.
I like it. Explains a lot, and gives a lot of opportunity for why things have flying, and how things that don't have flying can interact with the world.
I do wonder if Floatstone sounds too close to Flowstone?
But "float" really seals in the concept, better than Driftstone, Glidestone, etc.
void_nothing wrote:
3 years ago
story of the set
Did the realm get shattered and cause the Floatstone?
Or was the Floatstone already part of the plane?
Either way, what "shattered" it?
How long has it been shattered?
How adapted are the people to this environment?
What's the current story focus, the plot?
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
The Solitari, while they were associated with the shadow in the Tempest block, like the Dauthi and Thalakos, neither of the races were originally shadow people, but got stuck there due to how Rath was built originally. That could also solve the blue and black sapient race problem by using those two races as well, and it would give the world something that would make it stand out.
I like this idea and want to dive into their history for a second:
The Soltari, Thalakos, and Dauthi were races at war centuries ago on Dominaria—actually, it was the Soltari and Dauthi who were at war; the Thalakos were simply caught in the middle. During a climactic battle a portal opened and scooped nearly all of the three races into Rath. Such a massive portal was unstable, unfortunately, and the three races found themselves not in Rath, but in a shadowy non-corporeal realm between the two planes. These three races can see into Rath (and occasionally Dominaria) but cannot interact with it. They are trapped in a protoplasmic state, never aging, with only their enemies for company. In modern-day Rath, the Dauthi are insane and the Thalakos are starting the same slide, so only the Soltari have retained any measure of civilization. This they have achieved with strong oral traditions and a priesthood that propagates an unerring belief in a way back to the real world. This belief has given a few Soltari the power to step back into the real world, if only for a short time. Typically, these Soltari become esteemed emissaries, pivotal in attempting to contact other races who might be able to help them escape the maze of shadows that is their current existence.

In modern-day Dominaria, only the Dauthi are still known to exist (Shadow Rider from Weatherlight being one such example).
The Soltari, Dauthi, and Thalakos were perfectly normal sentient people, indigenous to Dominaria. The Rathi overlay trapped them in incorporal form, which drove them mad, gave the shadow mechanic, and warped their outward appearance. The "Soltari" and "Dauthi" that pops into mind when you think of them, is a story-driven alteration of their actual form. The Dauthi, in their natural form, look like Shadow Rider. (Still a bit odd, but not some improbable warped form)

So why don't we see them on other planes, etc? I'd assume WotC doesn't want to re-use them because they were so stylized the first time, and storyline love wasn't as wide spread back then, so if someone saw a present-day Soltari, they wouldn't know the history and simply ask "Where's the shadow?" This gives us the opportunity to do something entirely "normal" that WotC doesn't want to do, for reasons we can be ok with.

We could explore a trifecta of races that are known to exist but haven't really been explored yet. How are these races connected? What's their history?
It could also set the Plane apart from others, as well as tie into the structure of the world.
The Dauthi live in the lower levels, where light is scarce, the Soltari in the middle areas, and Thalakos live up high?

Thoughts?
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
spider riding elves
100% vote for this to be a thing.
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
due to the similarities with Zendikar
I think this is one of the Crux of our creative issues that needs to be consciously addressed:
How can we ensure this is distinctly different from Zendikar's skyclaves?
To the beaten, the broken, or the damned; the lost, and the wayward: wherever I may be, you will have a home.

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

Feyd_Ruin wrote:
3 years ago
The Soltari, Dauthi, and Thalakos were perfectly normal sentient people, indigenous to Dominaria. The Rathi overlay trapped them in incorporal form, which drove them mad, gave the shadow mechanic, and warped their outward appearance. The "Soltari" and "Dauthi" that pops into mind when you think of them, is a story-driven alteration of their actual form. The Dauthi, in their natural form, look like Shadow Rider. (Still a bit odd, but not some improbable warped form)

So why don't we see them on other planes, etc? I'd assume WotC doesn't want to re-use them because they were so stylized the first time, and storyline love wasn't as wide spread back then, so if someone saw a present-day Soltari, they wouldn't know the history and simply ask "Where's the shadow?" This gives us the opportunity to do something entirely "normal" that WotC doesn't want to do, for reasons we can be ok with.

We could explore a trifecta of races that are known to exist but haven't really been explored yet. How are these races connected? What's their history?
It could also set the Plane apart from others, as well as tie into the structure of the world.
The Dauthi live in the lower levels, where light is scarce, the Soltari in the middle areas, and Thalakos live up high?
In current continuity the Shadow Rider is no longer a Dauthi, while the creature type was once added to it, it has since been removed again. As such the backstory of the Soltari, Thalakos, and Dauthi can now be considered discontinuity. Currently, the stolen parts of Rath was stolen from other planes rather than Dominaria.
If the Thalakos is supposed to be caught in the middle of the conflict between the Soltari and Dauthi, it is probably better if we put the Thalakos in the middle instead of on the other side of the Soltari compared to the Dauthi.
Feyd_Ruin wrote:
3 years ago
think this is one of the Crux of our creative issues that needs to be consciously addressed:
How can we ensure this is distinctly different from Zendikar's skyclaves?
Well for one, the I was thinking more along the line of structures built on floating pieces of land instead of actual floating fortresses, but secondly, many of the settlements of this world are actually populated. It makes a big difference when the world, although shattered and floaty, isn't actually volatile.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
Feyd_Ruin
Elder Vampire
Posts: 5478
Joined: 5 years ago
Answers: 3
Pronoun: he / him
Contact:

Post by Feyd_Ruin » 3 years ago

Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
Currently, the stolen parts of Rath was stolen from other planes rather than Dominaria.
So then... this could be their homeworld? :o :o :o :o
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
structures built on floating pieces of land
Floating islands lashed together, with bridges between them.
Floating islands with crop fields on top, and various hanging fruit plants attached to the bottom.
I can dig this.

Edit:
We need something to call them rather than just "Floating Islands"
Floatstone __?
To the beaten, the broken, or the damned; the lost, and the wayward: wherever I may be, you will have a home.

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

Feyd_Ruin wrote:
3 years ago
So then... this could be their homeworld? :o :o :o :o
One of them at least. Kor and Vedalken exist on multiple worlds as well after all.
Feyd_Ruin wrote:
3 years ago
Floating islands lashed together, with bridges between them. I can dig that.
Exactly, and not all the bridges are built by people, some consist of the webs of giant spiders. Of course, there would also be those that are free floating, not lashed to anything.

The floating landmasses should also vary in size from tiny pebbles to mountains and some the size of nations, or even bigger. It gives us plenty to work with when it comes both to card crafting and world building.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
Venedrex
Wait, we can have titles?
Posts: 1416
Joined: 3 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Venedrex » 3 years ago

One way we could possibly separate this world from Zendikar could be by having some advanced technologies, such as airships and cities. Not sure if that is remotely where we want to go, because I understand just wanting to have a fantasy world with minimal tech, but it could be an option, especially if Veldalken were one of the creature types we wanted. However if we did I feel like it would be more wooden lower tech cities with a little bit of artifice, rather than metal and energized mega cities.

The discussion about the different creature types living on tiers of the world reminds me (in a good way) of the morlocks from the Time Machine by H.G Wells, which I think is pretty cool, as you have a shadowy offshoot of the species living below who are a stark contrast to the happy peaceful topside race.
Epicurean, EDH without Universes Beyond.

http://nxs.wf/np748831

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

Venedrex wrote:
3 years ago
One way we could possibly separate this world from Zendikar could be by having some advanced technologies, such as airships and cities. Not sure if that is remotely where we want to go, because I understand just wanting to have a fantasy world with minimal tech, but it could be an option, especially if Veldalken were one of the creature types we wanted. However if we did I feel like it would be more wooden lower tech cities with a little bit of artifice, rather than metal and energized mega cities.
Airships are cool. And the lack of volatile terrain (such as the roil from zendikar) makes it a logical technical adaption to how the world is. Airships and big cities doesn't mean advanced tech though, the basic principals of airship tech isn't actually all that advanced, and the only reason we didn't get hot air balloons and airships in the real world until we did, was simply because nobody thought of filling a balloon with hot air to make it float, even though we'd known about things like thermal updrafts for thousands of years. >.<
And for big cities, Rome is over 2000 years old, and both it, London, and Paris where huge massive cities already in the classical era and during the dark ages. Basic stonework architecture isn't that advanced technologically speaking, if it were, things like the Colosseum or the Pyramids would never have been built. That such architecture still looks impressive today has very little to do with how advanced it was.

But that does bring up an interesting question though: What technological level are we aiming for?
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
Venedrex
Wait, we can have titles?
Posts: 1416
Joined: 3 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Venedrex » 3 years ago

Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
Venedrex wrote:
3 years ago
One way we could possibly separate this world from Zendikar could be by having some advanced technologies, such as airships and cities. Not sure if that is remotely where we want to go, because I understand just wanting to have a fantasy world with minimal tech, but it could be an option, especially if Veldalken were one of the creature types we wanted. However if we did I feel like it would be more wooden lower tech cities with a little bit of artifice, rather than metal and energized mega cities.
Airships are cool. And the lack of volatile terrain (such as the roil from zendikar) makes it a logical technical adaption to how the world is. Airships and big cities doesn't mean advanced tech though, the basic principals of airship tech isn't actually all that advanced, and the only reason we didn't get hot air balloons and airships in the real world until we did, was simply because nobody thought of filling a balloon with hot air to make it float, even though we'd known about things like thermal updrafts for thousands of years. >.<
And for big cities, Rome is over 2000 years old, and both it, London, and Paris where huge massive cities already in the classical era and during the dark ages. Basic stonework architecture isn't that advanced technologically speaking, if it were, things like the Colosseum or the Pyramids would never have been built. That such architecture still looks impressive today has very little to do with how advanced it was.

But that does bring up an interesting question though: What technological level are we aiming for?
That is a good point for sure, they could definitely be made of stone or other materials. Having massive cities would certainly help keep this world distinct from Zendikar I think, and it makes sense for them to exist due to the lack of the Roil. Airships I think would be a lot of fun to have on cards, and if they were in the set, they would be cool to have as vehicles.
Epicurean, EDH without Universes Beyond.

http://nxs.wf/np748831

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

We shouldn't make airships to common though, people would need to have a reason to use flying mounts as well after all. :)

I think Airships (and Skyships similar to the Weatherlight), should have a place in the setting, but be relegated to those with considerable wealth or resources, while poorer folk rely on things like tamed drakes, griffins, pegasi, and similar winged creatures. A few exceptional badasses might even tame manticores or wyverns. :)

Most travel by the common folk would likely be along built bridges, or even abandoned (or not so abandoned) webs that span between various floating landmasses. After all, winged steeds can't carry that much comparatively to a landbound creature.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
Venedrex
Wait, we can have titles?
Posts: 1416
Joined: 3 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Venedrex » 3 years ago

Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
We shouldn't make airships to common though, people would need to have a reason to use flying mounts as well after all. :)

I think Airships (and Skyships similar to the Weatherlight), should have a place in the setting, but be relegated to those with considerable wealth or resources, while poorer folk rely on things like tamed drakes, griffins, pegasi, and similar winged creatures. A few exceptional badasses might even tame manticores or wyverns. :)

Most travel by the common folk would likely be along built bridges, or even abandoned (or not so abandoned) webs that span between various floating landmasses. After all, winged steeds can't carry that much comparatively to a landbound creature.
Yeah I like that alot, having the bridges and webs would be really cool on the cards, and it could give us flavor reasons for certain cards that will need to be in the set, such as removal spells. I can see there being a couple kill spells associated with "push someone off the bridge". That would also work for the threaten effects, where someone goes nuts and starts cutting the bridge or something with the tell tale glow in their eyes lol. :)

WInged mounts are awesome too, and would make great cards!

I also agree with what you said about Goblins, they'd be fine if we wanted, but I think that your right about using a different Red creature type. I kinda like the idea of Viashino or Orcs, but specifically Viashino because I feel like they'd be good at climbing and be nimble enough to be comfortable on floating landmasses, as the MTG wiki states: "The savage Viashino possess lean but muscular builds and can be agile, quick, and vicious when necessary." Whereas Goblins seem like they'd be falling off way too much to be believable as a main creature type that's not played for comic relief in my opinion. :)

I also 100% agree with spiders, and lots of them. This set is definitely going to have a ton of fliers, so I think you're spot on about having a lot of creatures with reach for green to drawn on to keep limited running smoothly. The visual of spiders clinging on to the sides and underbelly of massive floating formations is pretty sweet as well. I am a little bit of an arachnophobe, but I don't have issues with spiders on cards. Just as long as they're not crawling on me irl... :P
Epicurean, EDH without Universes Beyond.

http://nxs.wf/np748831

User avatar
folding_music
glitter pen on my mana crypt
Posts: 2351
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: they / them

Post by folding_music » 3 years ago

I like a lot of the ideas so far! I'd just like to say that if Viashino are on the plane, I could imagine them being motivated to sabotage the rich folks' skyships :3

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

You know, Viashino Raiders riding drakes and using gliders sounds freaking awesome.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
SecretInfiltrator
Posts: 5902
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: they / them
Location: The Shattered Realm

Post by SecretInfiltrator » 3 years ago

Venedrex wrote:
3 years ago
Whereas Goblins seem like they'd be falling off way too much to be believable as a main creature type that's not played for comic relief in my opinion. :)
I kinda want some Goblins that favor transportation by Flinging themselves with oversized slingshots to neighboring rocks.

I could imagine that the inhabitants differentiate between "Driftrocks" and "Steadfasts". Since sky-places are not anchored to a tectonic plate they may actually move relative to each other.
folding_music wrote:
3 years ago
I like a lot of the ideas so far! I'd just like to say that if Viashino are on the plane, I could imagine them being motivated to sabotage the rich folks' skyships :3
That's speciest! :P

Since Viashino are dragon-kin we could even have some hierarchy involving Viashino going through a life-cycle or special rite to grow wings.

---

Since I've been reminded of the vertical structure I like the idea of having no conclusive answer on what's exactly in the below (big ocean? more clouds?) but have the "deep sky" still be aesthetically based on the deep sea e. g. cloud-diving Serpent Horror creatures with Angler-fish features, flying Squids, bio-luminous floating Jellyfish etc.

What about having these light-shy creatures sometimes come up at night both feared and, at a distance, admired. That way there would be an opportunity to interact.

---

If the Soltari life way up high, we can pretend that their name is Soltari in reference to the sun. ; )

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

SecretInfiltrator wrote:
3 years ago
Venedrex wrote:
3 years ago
Whereas Goblins seem like they'd be falling off way too much to be believable as a main creature type that's not played for comic relief in my opinion. :)
I kinda want some Goblins that favor transportation by Flinging themselves with oversized slingshots to neighboring rocks.

I could imagine that the inhabitants differentiate between "Driftrocks" and "Steadfasts". Since sky-places are not anchored to a tectonic plate they may actually move relative to each other.
folding_music wrote:
3 years ago
I like a lot of the ideas so far! I'd just like to say that if Viashino are on the plane, I could imagine them being motivated to sabotage the rich folks' skyships :3
That's speciest! :P

Since Viashino are dragon-kin we could even have some hierarchy involving Viashino going through a life-cycle or special rite to grow wings.

---

Since I've been reminded of the vertical structure I like the idea of having no conclusive answer on what's exactly in the below (big ocean? more clouds?) but have the "deep sky" still be aesthetically based on the deep sea e. g. cloud-diving Serpent Horror creatures with Angler-fish features, flying Squids, bio-luminous floating Jellyfish etc.

What about having these light-shy creatures sometimes come up at night both feared and, at a distance, admired. That way there would be an opportunity to interact.

---

If the Soltari life way up high, we can pretend that their name is Soltari in reference to the sun. ; )
In before Goblin Balloon Brigade reprint in the set. :P

But I like the idea of some Viashino going through a ritual to become more dragon like. This could be shown in the set by some Viashino also having the dragon type and being bigger (and possibly meaner) than their peers.

I also really like the differentiation (yes, that is really a word, I looked it up.) between "driftrocks" and "steadfasts", it really adds to the flavor of the set.

The idea about the deep, or "abyssal" to use a term from marine biology, creatures occasionally drifting up from the deep dark areas, sometimes to feed (or other things), and basing them loosely on deep sea creatures is an excellent idea. As for what is down there, well, we don't really know, do we. That's part of the charm, it could be literal anything, a deep sea, an ancient horror, barren rock, a fallen god, a portal to another world, or even whatever it was that caused the world to shatter in the first place (unless of course it's always been shattered, which the inhabitants may not know or even realize).

But it also sounds to me like we've settled on Viashino being one of the primary sapient races.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
Feyd_Ruin
Elder Vampire
Posts: 5478
Joined: 5 years ago
Answers: 3
Pronoun: he / him
Contact:

Post by Feyd_Ruin » 3 years ago

SecretInfiltrator wrote:
3 years ago
I kinda want some Goblins that favor transportation by Flinging themselves with oversized slingshots to neighboring rocks.
OMG this. If we don't go with Goblins, then we should absolutely still have this with Kobolds or something. :rofl:
SecretInfiltrator wrote:
3 years ago
Since Viashino are dragon-kin we could even have some hierarchy involving Viashino going through a life-cycle or special rite to grow wings.
10/10 love these ideas.
I like the idea of it being a right of passage. Perhaps a magical, esoteric journey, where they either succeed and grow, or they die. Those who return become leaders in their tribe, and only the strongest choose to take the journey.
SecretInfiltrator wrote:
3 years ago
Since I've been reminded of the vertical structure I like the idea of having no conclusive answer on what's exactly in the below (big ocean? more clouds?) but have the "deep sky" still be aesthetically based on the deep sea e. g. cloud-diving Serpent Horror creatures with Angler-fish features, flying Squids, bio-luminous floating Jellyfish etc.

What about having these light-shy creatures sometimes come up at night both feared and, at a distance, admired. That way there would be an opportunity to interact.
I like the idea of leaving an unknown, and I especially love the idea of sky-serpents and sky-kraken coming up from the depths below.
If the Soltari life way up high, we can pretend that their name is Soltari in reference to the sun.
The more I think on it, the more I love the idea of this being the Soltari/Thalakos/Dauthi homeworld.
To the beaten, the broken, or the damned; the lost, and the wayward: wherever I may be, you will have a home.

User avatar
Krishnath
Mechanical Dragon
Posts: 3565
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia

Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

Feyd_Ruin wrote:
3 years ago
The more I think on it, the more I love the idea of this being the Soltari/Thalakos/Dauthi homeworld.
Is it settled then, we have four of the primary races (besides humans) accounted for?

White: Soltari
Blue: Thalakos
Black: Dauthi
Red: Viashino

Anyone opposed to this? Other suggestions?

Personally I still think we should go with Spider riding Elves for green, because the thought appeals to me. :)
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.

Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.

The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.

Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.

User avatar
Venedrex
Wait, we can have titles?
Posts: 1416
Joined: 3 years ago
Answers: 2
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Venedrex » 3 years ago

Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
Feyd_Ruin wrote:
3 years ago
The more I think on it, the more I love the idea of this being the Soltari/Thalakos/Dauthi homeworld.
Is it settled then, we have four of the primary races (besides humans) accounted for?

White: Soltari
Blue: Thalakos
Black: Dauthi
Red: Viashino

Anyone opposed to this? Other suggestions?

Personally I still think we should go with Spider riding Elves for green, because the thought appeals to me. :)
I'm game for it, but if we do opt for this, I believe (and it's not necessarily a bad thing) we will have to put some work into fleshing out the look, characteristic traits, and so on of these races, as we don't have a huge amount to go on at the moment.

So I think having these three species correspond to the three main levels of the world is brilliant, but in doing so we might have to spend more time on figuring out what they look like and behave, as compared to a more established creature type. Which is completely fine, just something to be aware of.

I do like the fact these three races are intertwined with each other and the plane, and I'm starting to think not having a race that flies like the Aven be one of the five major creature types makes things more exciting, with the bridges and mounts and so on. If flying is potentially dangerous (or a rite of passage for some Viashino) it could allow for more entertaining stories I feel.
Last edited by Venedrex 3 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
Epicurean, EDH without Universes Beyond.

http://nxs.wf/np748831

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic

Return to “Custom Cards”