[???] Oubliette

[Proteus]

Oubliette has been confirmed as a reprint in an upcoming product. Not sure which, but either Mystery Booster or Commander Legends seems the most likely possibility.

[Raptorchan]

That's a bold claim, so I guess we need some source for that

[Sharpened]

Rosewater's column today.

https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/a ... 2020-02-03

That's why it's not in Theros Beyond Death. I am happy to say we found a way to template it so it can fit on a card (that's the real reason we haven't done it for so long), and it is planned to be reprinted in an upcoming product.

[Dunharrow]

Can someone tell me why a weird Journey to Nowhere is so expensive and so highly sought out?

[Sharpened]

It's desirability is for pauper.
It's scarcity combined with the desirability creates the high price.

[void_nothing]

Gotta be Commander Legends - wouldn't be in a Standard product, but presumably is still in boosters so can be printed at common for the format that wants it.

[CalebLost]

Gotta be Commander Legends - wouldn't be in a Standard product, but presumably is still in boosters so can be printed at common for the format that wants it.

a change in rarity would not change the Pauper legality, but having Oubliette in limited at common can be a bit too much, Oblivion Ring effect and likes were almost always at uncommon. I see it coming back at uncommon would not hurt limited too much while keeping it available enough to tank the price and quench the pauper-thirst for it

[Proteus]

An off-color ability with a very wordy card, even with template changes? Even in a non-Standard set, I'd be amazed to see that again as a common.

It also occurred to me last night that another distressing possibility is that this appears in an upcoming Secret Lair.

[gilrad]

If it's being reprinted in a less-wordy form, could this hint toward an Oracle update?

Something like, instead of "exile X, note the number and type of counters on it", it could simply be "Exile X along with all counters on it" followed by "Return X and its counters".

So tawnos's Coffin's second ability might read:

"Exile target creature with its counters and all auras attached to it. When ~ leaves the battlefield or becomes untapped, return the exiled card with its counters to the battlefield under its owner's control. If you do, return the other cards to the battlefield under their owner's control attached to that permanent."

It might even suggest a possible mechanic for Ikora or later sets that involves counters that move between zones.

[Atraxian]

About the new wording, they already did something similar with Skullbriar
"Counters remain on Skullbriar as it moves to any zone other than a player's hand or library."

A wording on those lines would read like "Counters remain on exiled creature as it is exiled or returned to the battlefield."

[motleyslayer]

my buddy predicted that it would be reprinted before Modern Horizons. It seems like a much needed pauper reprint

[ilovesaprolings]

I bet that it's in the new secret lairs because two things are infinite: the universe and corporate greed

[Atraxian]

Thinking about the Ikoria leak about keyword counters and... What if Oubliette is actually in Ikoria?
The reasoning goes like this:
(speculation) if the keyword tokens work like Recycla-bird suggests they do, then Oubliette would hide away a creature from Ikoria keeping all the keyword counters put on it differently from how oblivion ring would do and also is an enchantment that gives you 2 devotion to black, making it a decent fit for Theros for the Standard environment.

I wouldn't put it past WotC to put it in Secret Lairs, but I really hope not.
Secret Lairs are ripe for the slippery slope of corporate greed and I think we will soon see the lairs rise in price and at the same time sporting cards that have no real available counterpart on the secondary market (like Oubliette, actually) and God forbid, new cards you can't get anywhere else.

[CalebLost]

Considering the strange spot of the ability in regard to the current color pie I can't see it in standard, my bet is Commander Legends (card is already legal there so no problem for the color pie) as an uncommon (set is still draft based, so reprint at common would unbalance limited but higher would not be enough to satisfy the pauper needs)

[Atraxian]

True, Oubliette is really offcolor in current standard.
Since Maro wrote that they templated that effect we might see it in white, then.
Either as a colorshift of the original or even as an instant blink trick that doesn't make your auras and counters fall off the creature.

[Guardman]

MaRo's article today has more information on Oubliette.

Mirage came and went, and R&D didn't give much thought to phasing (well, other than it inspired me to design flickering), but years later, Mark Gottlieb, who was the Rules Manager at the time, was trying to figure how to make the card Oubliette work in the rules.

Oubliette exiled creatures yet let them keep their stuff (aka counters and auras), but that wasn't how the rules of exiling worked. When a card gets exiled, it loses all the counters and auras. After much problem solving, Gottlieb found the solution to the problem. Have Oubliette phase out the creature. The phasing rules did exactly what the card needed, and phasing was already part of the rules. Problem solved.

Although it solved the problem at hand, something didn't sit right with Gottlieb. He realized that the rules in place for phasing were not the most intuitive. Pseudo-exiling that didn't work like exiling was kind of wonky. What if the phased-out creature didn't actually leave play? What if it was just treated like it was gone without it actually having to leave play? This would explain why things don't fall off of it and why "enters the battlefield" and "leaves the battlefield" effects don't work. The wording was pretty clean, and the ability became a lot more intuitive. Gottlieb worked to change how exactly phasing worked to make it more intuitive.

Basically it sounds like the fix for Oubliette is to give it rules text along the lines of:

"When Oubilette enters the battlefield, phase out target creature. When Oubilette leaves the battlefield, phase in the phased out creature tapped."

While close, phasing is technically a functional tweak, so it will be interesting to see how much they tweak Oubilette's final text. Also with phasing becoming deciduous, there is an unlikely, but possible chance that it won't be in the commander set, but Zendikar Rising, which would be something.

[user_938036]

Basically it sounds like the fix for Oubliette is to give it rules text along the lines of:

"When Oubilette enters the battlefield, phase out target creature. When Oubilette leaves the battlefield, phase in the phased out creature tapped."

While close, phasing is technically a functional tweak, so it will be interesting to see how much they tweak Oubilette's final text. Also with phasing becoming deciduous, there is an unlikely, but possible chance that it won't be in the commander set, but Zendikar Rising, which would be something.

The problem with it being in Zendikar Rising is it's not in black's pie right now. That makes it incredibly unlikely that it would show up in Zendikar Rising.

As for possible wordings, you will need text that keeps it from phasing in as it normally should. There are a few ways to do this.

"When Oubilette enters the battlefield, target creature phases out. It doesn't phase in as long as you control Oubilette." This is the cleanest example. It uses the built in return part of phasing to bring the creature back and very simply explains that the creature can't phase back in while Oubilette is in play.

"When Oubilette enters the battlefield, target creature phases out for as long as you control Oubliette." With text like this phasing would get an additional rule that says anything phased out for a duration doesn't phase in during the upkeep.

Or to keep the two separate triggers and the permaloss potential.

"When Oubilette enters the battlefield, target creature phases out. It doesn't phase in normally.
When Oubliette leaves the battlefield phase in the phased out creature." It has the same clean answer to how do you keep it form obeying the phase in at upkeep. Simply say it doesn't. But it extends it indefinitely to get the original functionality of two separate triggers causing it to leave and come back. I personally don't like this version because the permanent "exile/phase out" was never an intended feature but a bug of design technology at the time.

[CommanderMaster999]

They are actually reprinting it Not a fixed version and this year

So double masters or commander legends is when we will see it again

[Guardman]

@user_938036 Good catch on the text. I haven't seriously played with phasing since Mirage, so it's been a while for me with seriously interacting with phasing.

While likely double masters or commander legends, since it has been confirmed phasing is deciduous and that Oubliette's text will be errata'd so that it phases out the creature, there is an outside chance for it being reprinted in Zendikar. Also since phasing is so new to standard we really don't know where it goes into the color pie other than blue. Honestly given how they've been designing magic this year it wouldn't surprise me if the reprint is for standard given that it sounds like they want to lower how much blink is used and increase phasing as an alternative to exile.

[user_938036]

Also since phasing is so new to standard we really don't know where it goes into the color pie other than blue. Honestly given how they've been designing magic this year it wouldn't surprise me if the reprint is for standard given that it sounds like they want to lower how much blink is used and increase phasing as an alternative to exile.

Considering the context that they spoke about phasing it sounds like it will occasionally replace blink or flicker effects and will completely replace Banishing Light effects.

This assumes that as they said the reason to use phasing is because certain effects aren't meant to trigger leave and enter the battlefield abilities but currently have to due to past design principles. Instant flicker is likely to stay as you can't accomplish the same effect with phasing which is to dodge targets and trigger enter and leave effects.

That said we are likely to see phasing in almost exclusively blue and white

[Guardman]

That said we are likely to see phasing in almost exclusively blue and white

I would actually be surprised to see phasing in white. Both blue and white are the blink colors, phasing is already blue for sure, so it doesn't make much sense for it to be in white since it sounds like they want to differentiate it from blink. It's like the reason blue gets looting and red gets rummaging. I think it is more likely it is mono-blue or one of the other color gets it as a new form of psuedo-protection/type of removal.

[Krishnath]

That said we are likely to see phasing in almost exclusively blue and white

I would actually be surprised to see phasing in white. Both blue and white are the blink colors, phasing is already blue for sure, so it doesn't make much sense for it to be in white since it sounds like they want to differentiate it from blink. It's like the reason blue gets looting and red gets rummaging. I think it is more likely it is mono-blue or one of the other color gets it as a new form of psuedo-protection/type of removal.

Phasing is already in white thanks to Teferi's Protection. The main difference is how it is going to be used by the colors, blue is likely to use it more offensively, while white uses it more defensively.

Also, I would not be surprised to see it in other colors as well, particularly not if it is used to express something the color can already do (red for example, should be able to temporarily remove a creature the defending player controls or an artifact, as that is something the color can already do.)

As for Oubliette itself, I do not believe we will see it a standard legal set, even with the new "phasing" wording. I think the most likely place to see it will be Commander Legends, but it is possible it shows up in Double Masters (But I sincerely hope it doesn't.)

[CommanderMaster999]

That said we are likely to see phasing in almost exclusively blue and white

I would actually be surprised to see phasing in white. Both blue and white are the blink colors, phasing is already blue for sure, so it doesn't make much sense for it to be in white since it sounds like they want to differentiate it from blink. It's like the reason blue gets looting and red gets rummaging. I think it is more likely it is mono-blue or one of the other color gets it as a new form of psuedo-protection/type of removal.

Phasing is already in white thanks to Teferi's Protection. The main difference is how it is going to be used by the colors, blue is likely to use it more offensively, while white uses it more defensively.

Also, I would not be surprised to see it in other colors as well, particularly not if it is used to express something the color can already do (red for example, should be able to temporarily remove a creature the defending player controls or an artifact, as that is something the color can already do.)

As for Oubliette itself, I do not believe we will see it a standard legal set, even with the new "phasing" wording. I think the most likely place to see it will be Commander Legends, but it is possible it shows up in Double Masters (But I sincerely hope it doesn't.)

More likely double masters or commander legends for the oubliette reprint and reword of ability to phase out

[K4yr4h]

if they wont a real clean wording the functionality has to change a bit.

Target creatures phases out as long as Oubliette is in play

it enters play untapped, but in the next upkeep, not directly. but otherwises it messes with the rule of phase in/out timing and makes wording more complicated.

[Krishnath]

More likely double masters or commander legends for the oubliette reprint and reword of ability to phase out

Yes, that is what I said.