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That turn one tutor for land tax or skullclamp fixes a lot of stuff.
It really does. Makes mass reanimate lines a damn sight easier too.
Ain't nobody forcing me to attack, it's already the combat step and my stuff is turning sideways
Two copies of Invasion of Arcavios fell into my lap in the recent pre-release, so I might just give it a whirl despite my misgivings.pokken wrote: ↑1 year agoAin't nobody forcing me to attack, it's already the combat step and my stuff is turning sideways![]()
I think "winmore" is a very poor assessment of the card; there are not that many cards that instantly win for 10 mana and being able to crack someone for 7.
The things to take issue with are 1) cost, 2) feasibility of pushing 7 damage, and I think all of those are reasonable concerns.
I generally agree. My budget definitely doesn't stretch to Imp Seal, nor Demonic. That said I can see the price for Imp dropping; I think now that they've bit the bullet and reprinted it we're likely to see more of it, and it's price is mostly due to historical scarcity more than power. It is good, but not deserving of the current price. Demonic, too, hasn't seen print in a while, who knows? That one will drop a little then pick up again. It's every bit as good as it's price dictates.pzbw7z wrote: ↑1 year agoBudget considerations aside, I think Enlightened Tutor is inferior to Vampiric Tutor and Imperial Seal and those latter two should be run before ET. Of course, budget considerations are entirely valid.
It's a much closer thing with the higher-MV tutors, but I'd still probably slot Demonic Tutor in before E.T. or Mystical Tutor. That latter is also very much worth considering.
If one really wants to go hard, all of the cards mentioned here are very much in order plus a few more, possibly Diabolic Intent, and maybe Grim Tutor. Wishclaw Talisman is very much a possibility, but it should be used only to trigger a win-con.
Entomb and Buried Alive are also cards that we should run if we are going for a try-hard level or better.
With budget in mind, I really like Beseech the Queen; I don't think I've ever paid more than the three and I don't think the number-of-lands limit has ever been an issue for me. Diabolic Tutor is probably good enough for a budget build but Dark Petition just didn't seem to cut it in my build.
All that said, I'm not going anywhere near that hard with my build but I would like to add Diabolic Intent, I think. It is not really great in my Prosper where I have one - only sixteen creatures, and it should be much better in my Varina where I sometimes benefit from sacrificing creatures.
I don't think it belongs in my version, but I can see where it would fit. It's notable that Invasion of Arcavios picks up instants and sorceries from your graveyard. It's literally the first tutor to do precisely that. I've heard of some stupid infinite combo lines with Displacer Kitten (hey, we finally broke it guys!) and 2 ritual spells, but I think if you include it in Varina you've gotta really wanna build around it, make your lines work and streamline around it.
I'm sort of here. In my iteration of the build, it's not even a close consideration. I think there is a world where it does enough though, and it's interesting to consider. I think it'll definitely see play, maybe even prominently in Esper colors. It probably fits nicest into something like Aminatou, the Fateshifter, but it's possible it could be made to work here.pokken wrote: ↑1 year agoAin't nobody forcing me to attack, it's already the combat step and my stuff is turning sideways![]()
I think "winmore" is a very poor assessment of the card; there are not that many cards that instantly win for 10 mana and being able to crack someone for 7.
The things to take issue with are 1) cost, 2) feasibility of pushing 7 damage, and I think all of those are reasonable concerns.
"good board presence" = 7 power and one vulnerable opponent (which is basically...always. there's always someone vulnerable). Swarm intelligence costs 2 more mana and doesn't tutor or regrowth a spell. definite no. I think the main competition for the invasion is a card like Final Parting that can tutor for Gravecrawler and Phyrexian Altar in one go for example, or that alternative Entomb maybe?Reya wrote: ↑1 year agoBut you need a good board presence and an opponent that does not block your attack (a bunch of weaks zombies and Varina) (and another opponent can destroy the battle too). This scenario is even less realistic if we want to attack with tokens created by Varina because that means you almost goldfished to reach that point. Plus, we need to deal 7 damages, which is a non negligible amount if we consider that the opponent will does everything he can to stop you.
I definitely can't see a reason to play this card. Just cast one of our tutors and close the game with Varina digging ability is a far more realistic scenario. Most of the time casting an Intuition or a Demonic is enough to close the game quickly.
The Arcavios lines are beautiful for sure but I doubt you ever resolve this in a mid to high power table.
Maybe it's just better to cast Swarm Intelligence (or not ? because you don't tutor for your tutor but the effect is so much easier to get).
Or if we really want to run that particular Battle, what do we cut ? Kindred discovery could go out for this one card wincon ?
As soon as you resolve Invasion of Arcavios, you have a big red flag on your headpokken wrote: ↑1 year ago"doubt you ever resolve this in a mid to high power table" - what are they gonna do about it, counter it? Remove some creatures? They can do that same stuff to stop you winning with anything. Say you have Demonic Tutor and tutor for some wincon, what stops them from just countering that? What stops them from just countering your Living Death? I resolve 5 mana spells all the time, are you not? We would spend 4 mana for archaeomancer zombie, so paying 5 mana for tutor or regrowth + potential game winning doubling feels alright to me.
I keep Stairwell only because it is so much fun when it does work; it's almost certainly too unreliable to be included on merit. I sold both copies of Invasion of Arcavios that I pulled in the pre-release, so I guess I'm not testing that.pokken wrote: ↑1 year ago(I am thinking about cutting Tombstone Stairwell well for it myself, since that card has required too much setup and telegraphing for me lately)
Invasion has some nice sequencing advantages over other tutors. Mainly if you cast invasion and then crash they have to do something right then. They can't do like they do with other tutors and wait and interact after you try to cast what you tutored for.Reya wrote: ↑1 year agoAs soon as you resolve Invasion of Arcavios, you have a big red flag on your headEveryone will see that they need to stop you NOW. When you advance your gameplan with a single tutor, it's not so obvious that you will win just after or the next turn. It's not as telegraphied as Invasion of Arcavios. I think this is what makes me not really confidant about playing that card (and as you said, the 5 mana we need).
Absolutely, I'd love to see a reprint.
It's not the worst but I think rit's floor is so much lower, and it'd be plenty most of the time. Your bottleneck is gonna be U/W usually I think.
I'd run all three - Dark Ritual, Cabal Ritual and Culling the Weak - if I weren't quite so lazy.
Still one of my absolute favorite ways to win a game of commander, last time I dropped it I won before it got back to me lol. I think the card has merit even without an aristocrat as long as you can take advantage of the attack triggers on your turn. So many bodies to sac as well.pzbw7z wrote: ↑1 year agoI keep Stairwell only because it is so much fun when it does work; it's almost certainly too unreliable to be included on merit. I sold both copies of Invasion of Arcavios that I pulled in the pre-release, so I guess I'm not testing that.pokken wrote: ↑1 year ago(I am thinking about cutting Tombstone Stairwell well for it myself, since that card has required too much setup and telegraphing for me lately)![]()
Chain of Vapor is a card I added to my deck on Pokken's advice a while back and I don't think it will ever come out. It is cheap and insanely versatile. I cannot say enough good things about it.pokken wrote: ↑1 year agoIt hits rest in peace etc. it also lets you protect your altars. It's insanely versatile. I even won a game double garying with it once.RedCheese wrote: ↑1 year agoIs Chain of Vapor that good? Can't wrap my head around it been that much better than an Unsummon?
Probably the most common thing way I've used it is as a combo protector (bounce your altar when they try to kill it) but I've used it to bounce all kinds of stuff so I can win.
Hey there, the list in my signature is full of things that support Poxwalkers and all of their friends! Happy to help if you need. This has been my main zombie focus for a long time.Rframpt wrote: ↑1 year agoSo I have been looking at Poxwalkers and I have been thinking maybe I should cut it from my list. I am wondering if any of you have had some positive experience with it, and some suggestions as to have interesting cards to cast to trigger poxwalkers return to the battlefield
I agree, I have been actually discarding mass reanimate more than casting it lately. I seem to find combos our out-value the table much more frequently then I Mass-reanimate to win. I think you always want to have at least one that you can loop with though. I might drop zombie apocalypse for dread return, and have been considering for a long time, but I think my love of the card is clouding my judgement lol.
Living Death is where it's at for me. Functioning as both a board wipe as well as being non-conditional reanimation makes it top of the pile.I agree, I have been actually discarding mass reanimate more than casting it lately. I seem to find combos our out-value the table much more frequently then I Mass-reanimate to win. I think you always want to have at least one that you can loop with though. I might drop zombie apocalypse for dread return, and have been considering for a long time, but I think my love of the card is clouding my judgement lol.
I couldn't agree more. This card is never coming out of my deck! Also, probably the most attractive mana value out of the ones we generally use besides Balthor the Defiled.toctheyounger wrote: ↑1 year agoLiving Death is where it's at for me. Functioning as both a board wipe as well as being non-conditional reanimation makes it top of the pile.I agree, I have been actually discarding mass reanimate more than casting it lately. I seem to find combos our out-value the table much more frequently then I Mass-reanimate to win. I think you always want to have at least one that you can loop with though. I might drop zombie apocalypse for dread return, and have been considering for a long time, but I think my love of the card is clouding my judgement lol.
Can't take too much credit for this one because it's a CEDH allstar, but it feels perfect for Varina's aggro-combo gameplan, at least with my build.plaganegra wrote: ↑1 year agoChain of Vapor is a card I added to my deck on Pokken's advice a while back and I don't think it will ever come out. It is cheap and insanely versatile. I cannot say enough good things about it.