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Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 2:08 am
by caulkwrangler
Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Legendary Creature - Faerie Warrior (R)
Defender
Equipped creatures you control get +0/+1.
: Choose target Equipment you control. You may pay its equip cost. If you do, create a 0/0 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token, then attach that Equipment to it.
I have arms enough to fight the world.
Any thoughts welcome.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 2:29 am
by user_938036
First, I'm shocked "equip cost" is viable rules text.
Moving on, that sac trigger is surprisingly tricky. It needs to be a trigger but it needs an intervening if clause so thst it can actually function.
"When this permanent is not equipped, if it is not equipped, then sacrifice it."
You need the if because you are creating the token then equipping. Its trigger condition will be true the moment it is created. So you need the if clause so it checks when it resolves to see it its equipped.
RU: choose target equipment you control. You may pay X, where X is its equip cost. If you do create a 0/1 blue and red spirit artifact creature token with "When this permanent is not equipped, if it is not equipped, then sacrifice it." Then attach that equipment to it.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 2:37 am
by JovialJovian
I would say:
"When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it."
Fully, since we're acknowledging that Equip Cost is a viable value for an ability to query, I would phrase the ability thus:
XUR: Create a 0/1 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token with "When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it." and attach target equipment you control with equip cost X to that token.
The ability has a target, so you can't just pump out tokens, you need equipment to target, because it has only one target, it fizzles if the equipment gets removed, so you don't get the token when there's nothing to attach to it. So it delivers the exact same result, but is slightly more concise.
I am concerned that his 2nd ability may be too strong. It bypasses equip costs, and allows you to attach opponent's equipment to Kona.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 7:33 pm
by user_938036
JovialJovian wrote: ↑3 years ago
I would say:
"When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it."
As I mentioned this doesn't work. You create the token, its tigger condition is met. Then you equip the equipment. Then its tigger ability is put on the stack and you sacrifice the token. That is why you need an "If", so the game checks on trigger and resolution.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 7:46 pm
by JovialJovian
user_938036 wrote: ↑3 years ago
JovialJovian wrote: ↑3 years ago
I would say:
"When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it."
As I mentioned this doesn't work. You create the token, its tigger condition is met. Then you equip the equipment. Then its tigger ability is put on the stack and you sacrifice the token. That is why you need an "If", so the game checks on trigger and resolution.
Hm, but you can have it enter the battlefield with the equipment attached to it, can't you?
XUR: Create a 0/1 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token with "When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it." with target equipment you control with equip cost X attached to it.
or
XUR: Create a 0/1 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token with "When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it." As that token enters the battlefield, attach target equipment you control with equip cost X to it.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 8:42 pm
by caulkwrangler
user_938036 wrote: ↑3 years ago
First, I'm shocked "equip cost" is viable rules text.
Moving on, that sac trigger is surprisingly tricky. It needs to be a trigger but it needs an intervening if clause so thst it can actually function.
"When this permanent is not equipped, if it is not equipped, then sacrifice it."
You need the if because you are creating the token then equipping. Its trigger condition will be true the moment it is created. So you need the if clause so it checks when it resolves to see it its equipped.
RU: choose target equipment you control. You may pay X, where X is its equip cost. If you do create a 0/1 blue and red spirit artifact creature token with "When this permanent is not equipped, if it is not equipped, then sacrifice it." Then attach that equipment to it.
Thank you for your help on this. I'm actually surprised
Auriok Steelshaper is the only card to reference the term, it might be some space worth exploring. I made the change over to your wording, but I'm still open to other solutions. It's a shame that an ability that seems so obvious from a flavor POV is so hard to execute mechanically but so it goes.
JovialJovian wrote: ↑3 years ago
I would say:
"When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it."
Fully, since we're acknowledging that Equip Cost is a viable value for an ability to query, I would phrase the ability thus:
XUR: Create a 0/1 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token with "When this creature is not equipped, sacrifice it." and attach target equipment you control with equip cost X to that token.
The ability has a target, so you can't just pump out tokens, you need equipment to target, because it has only one target, it fizzles if the equipment gets removed, so you don't get the token when there's nothing to attach to it. So it delivers the exact same result, but is slightly more concise.
I am concerned that his 2nd ability may be too strong. It bypasses equip costs, and allows you to attach opponent's equipment to Kona.
The second ability is a more restricted
Magnetic Theft, it didn't seem overly powerful to me but maybe a little undercosted. Maybe I could bump it up to
?
EDIT: Decided to make the trigger exile rather than sacrifice, it feels more correct. Perhaps I should just make the tokens last until EoT or next upkeep? for cleanliness sake and to further tension between his two abilities.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:14 pm
by Legend
3{U/R}: Create a 0/1 blue or a 1/0 red Spirit creature token and attach target Equipment you control to it. The token gains, "When this creature isn't equipped, exile it."
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:51 pm
by JovialJovian
caulkwrangler wrote: ↑3 years ago
The second ability is a more restricted
Magnetic Theft, it didn't seem overly powerful to me but maybe a little undercosted. Maybe I could bump it up to
?
Ah, the difference is in the repeatability of the effect. Magnetic Theft is one and done, Kona can just do it over and over, even many times in the same turn. When you turn a spell effect into an ability, you usually need to add to it's cost or place some other limitation on it to keep it balanced. A
T is a common way of limiting an activated ability, as is restricting the times when the ability can be activated "any time you could activate a sorcery," or simply increasing the mana cost, or some combination of additions.
I would make it cost
1 more and limit it to only be activated during your turn, but that's personal preference, there are myriad small changes that could be made.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 12:16 am
by caulkwrangler
JovialJovian wrote: ↑3 years ago
caulkwrangler wrote: ↑3 years ago
The second ability is a more restricted
Magnetic Theft, it didn't seem overly powerful to me but maybe a little undercosted. Maybe I could bump it up to
?
Ah, the difference is in the repeatability of the effect. Magnetic Theft is one and done, Kona can just do it over and over, even many times in the same turn. When you turn a spell effect into an ability, you usually need to add to it's cost or place some other limitation on it to keep it balanced. A
T is a common way of limiting an activated ability, as is restricting the times when the ability can be activated "any time you could activate a sorcery," or simply increasing the mana cost, or some combination of additions.
I would make it cost
1 more and limit it to only be activated during your turn, but that's personal preference, there are myriad small changes that could be made.
Good points, thank you for the advice. Maybe something like this would be less worrisome (in a few ways):
Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Legendary Creature - Faerie Warrior
(R)
Defender
Equipped creatures you control get +0/+1.
: Choose target Equipment you control and pay
, where X is equal to its equip cost. Create a 0/0 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token, then attach that Equipment to it.
1/3
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 3:40 am
by user_938036
Looking over the possibilities, the ability as worded is confusing with colored equip costs or worse non-mana equip costs. Its an easy fix.
Choose target Equipment you control, you may pay its equip cost. If you do, create a 0/0 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token, attach that Equipment to it.
Dropping the sac trigger makes the ability a lot cleaner. The problem of having an anthem out and making lots of tokens doesn't seem like a problem in these colors.
Re: Koda, the Scrapping Iron
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:03 am
by caulkwrangler
user_938036 wrote: ↑3 years ago
Looking over the possibilities, the ability as worded is confusing with colored equip costs or worse non-mana equip costs. Its an easy fix.
Choose target Equipment you control, you may pay its equip cost. If you do, create a 0/0 blue and red Spirit artifact creature token, attach that Equipment to it.
Dropping the sac trigger makes the ability a lot cleaner. The problem of having an anthem out and making lots of tokens doesn't seem like a problem in these colors.
I agree on both points. Card updated.