rogerandover wrote: ↑4 years ago
White is definitely the most un-interesting mono-color IMO. The better ones leans towards combo (Teshar and New-Heliod), but I've built a control deck with 8,5 Tails which is pretty janky, but it can get pretty oppressive. It's MVP's are
Humility and
Sacred Mesa.
In blue I have
Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive, blue weenies. All the
Scroll Theif's you can play and loads of control-elements. It really fun to pilot, and if your board isn't disrupted it can take over games rather quickly. It plays a few extra turns spells, which can go infinite, so some might not look at it as casual (but then you just point at your commander).
There's also
Hakim, Loreweaver. I havn't played that much with the deck, but it's a rather unusual deck for blue - a voltron deck geared by auras.
I'm inclined to agree on mono-white not being interesting. My white decks have all been essentially 'card advantage tribal' with almost the whole deck dedicated to just trying to see more cards. My last white deck was the zombie oketra, but before that I ran 8.5 tails with the idea of his ability being a mana sink to troll people when I have no cards to play.
I have three decks dedicated to 'hit people, draw cards' and extra turns are a houserule ban in my group so Tesuko doesn't scratch an itch for me personally.
A friend of mine runs Hakim which puts him out of the running. A shame because he does something no other blue commander does.
Rorseph wrote: ↑4 years ago
I'd be remiss if I didn't plug
Thassa as a fun mono-blue commander. There's a link to my primer in my sig. I hesitate slightly, though, since she's pricey even on her own.
I'm currently brewing a
Jalira, Master Polymorphist deck that could serve as a more budget alternative to the above. It's been kind of fun in goldfishing, but it hasn't been played yet because covid-19. Hoping to convince some of my friends to start using XMage to reinstate game night, though!
In any case, I definitely recommend doing a mono-blue beatdown deck. It's fun and your friends probably won't hate you for playing it!
A friend of mine runs Thassa, which puts her out of the running. Jalira is a really cool idea, a general who makes the blue deck do something weird. I agree with blue beats, its a great way to power blue down relative to all the combo and synergy out there and frankly the blue beaters are the ones with evasion, protection or card advantage built in and therefore the best ones lol.
Rorseph wrote: ↑4 years ago
I'd be remiss if I didn't plug
Thassa as a fun mono-blue commander. There's a link to my primer in my sig. I hesitate slightly, though, since she's pricey even on her own.
I'm currently brewing a
Jalira, Master Polymorphist deck that could serve as a more budget alternative to the above. It's been kind of fun in goldfishing, but it hasn't been played yet because covid-19. Hoping to convince some of my friends to start using XMage to reinstate game night, though!
In any case, I definitely recommend doing a mono-blue beatdown deck. It's fun and your friends probably won't hate you for playing it!
Segrus wrote: ↑4 years ago
Rorseph wrote: ↑4 years ago
In any case, I definitely recommend doing a mono-blue beatdown deck. It's fun and your friends probably won't hate you for playing it!
I would suggest something similar. Another option for this is Wizard tribal with
Naban. Double up on stuff like
Master of Waves or
Gadwick. ISBPathfinder has a really good list for it
here.
As for mono White, I've been having a lot of fun with a
Zetalpa build. My goal in building the deck was to try to avoid using artifact ramp and instead ramp with cards like
Lotus Field,
Ancient Tomb, and
Scorched Ruins.
Thespian's Stage and
Vesuva helps in this too. I also try to take advantage of the double-faced cards that flip into lands. I suppose it doesn't exactly fix any of mono White's disadvantages, but I like playing it.
Gadwick seems incredibly boring. My tipping point with quitting my last white deck was when I realized that he would be a far better commander for that deck than any of the white generals. My problem with Naban is that tribal decks tend to build themselves a lot, which massively cuts the fun factor for me. I'd rather play him as a colourshifted general to run like mono-red wizards or something, so its not things I've seen before.
Zetalpa doesn't fix any of the problems white has, as you say. But man when that card hits the table it gives many of my decks a hard time, which is surprising for a 'dumb fatty'.
KMA_Again wrote: ↑4 years ago
It's very stereotypical, but
Talrand, Sky Summoner was one I played years ago. Swarms of drakes can get out of hand very quickly while you don't need to commit much to the board, and you can use the powerful blue token support like
Opposition and
Bident of Thassa. I still feel like he is a powerful choice compared to a lot of the new cards out there because he fits well with what blue wants to do anyways.
I did mono-blue control and everyone *hated* it, even when I ran no-counterspell control to derp it out a little. If I played Talrand I'd be actively weakening the deck to not play it as a control deck, which would feel bad. Probably won't work for me.
Dunharrow wrote: ↑4 years ago
I built one around
Kefnet, the Mindful. I like it a lot. Basically a high tide deck that wins by infinite mana combo to draw the deck and Blue Sun's Zenith my opponents (I still like this more than Lab Maniac or Jace or the Oracle).
Mono-white - honestly, I have no ideas. the new Heliod? Thalia?
I'm typically not into infinite combo or into commanders that are an outlet for infinite mana. Thanks for the suggestion though!
RedCheese wrote: ↑4 years ago
I made a Old Heliod mono white Tokens/enchantments deck. Nothing special but i really like it in its simplicity. Got a couple off wins with it suprisinglly.
My mono blue deck is helmed by Memnarch and its very nasty, even without the broken stuff. Stealing your opponent's cards makes you an instant archnemesis so won't recommend it.
Used to have a Sai deck. It was Thopter tribal so no storm sillyness.
I tried Heliod way back, thought it would work well but spending your turns buying 2/1s for 4 mana is just so weak compared to what everyone else is doing at that point in the game. Even skullclamp etc didn't make it worthwhile.
My group is too soft for Memnarch, would get hated out so bad lol.
Sinis wrote: ↑4 years ago
For mono-white, I wanna plug for
Bruna, the Fading Light. She's good for card advantage on account of reanimating, and has a great flying vigilant body. The meld option is pretty great, but it's only one part in a vast arsenal. Both toctheyounger and ISBPathfinder have excellent threads the deckbuilding forum for it.
For mono-blue, the one that's caught my fancy the most is
God-Eternal Kefnet. There is some obvious build-around options and top-of-deck shenanigans, but I think the choice of free spells can make it something unique and exciting.
I ran Kefnet as no-counterspell control with no turn spells either. Everyone *hated* it and targeted it or moaned when I played it. Couldn't think of another good way to run him except for maybe token spells, which is similar to something else I have.
I will take a look at Bruna. She seems bad, but white reanimation is something I haven't explored fully and getting the meld off would be badass.
toctheyounger wrote: ↑4 years ago
Sinis wrote: ↑4 years ago
For mono-white, I wanna plug for Bruna, the Fading Light. She's good for card advantage on account of reanimating, and has a great flying vigilant body. The meld option is pretty great, but it's only one part in a vast arsenal. Both toctheyounger and ISBPathfinder have excellent threads the deckbuilding forum for it.
Aw, stop it, you've contributed just as much to both threads! The way I see it they're just as much think tanks as they are spicy brews, it's the discussion that makes those threads worthwhile.
But yes, Bruna is excellent. She's definitely worth looking at.
Pros:
- Strong beater in the command zone
- Vigilance for defensive strats
- Reanimation on cast is super strong
- Relevant tribes give a lot of options for control
- Does things literally no other commander at present can (meld)
Cons:
Also for what it's worth (and I feel like a broken record saying it), ramping and drawing in mono white is not nearly as bad as the community thinks it is. Literally 9/10 games I will have more lands in play mid-game than any other player at the table. It's that reliable. You don't get as many options for burst mana, but that forces you to get lands from your deck into play, which significantly improves the quality of your draws anyway. I also find mono white quite fun to play too - you have to be relatively careful with your plays and treat your control options like a toolbox. You want to put the pinch on people but not to the point where you're an archenemy, so maintaining a delicate balance while still building threats become a challenge, and it's something that only the pilot can do. The tools are all there in the deck, but it's up to the individual how well that plays out.
I believe you for ramp, but you'll need to convince me on draw. I just don't see it. And this is coming from a diehard mono-red player - we have it nearly as bad as you do lol. I saw the Bruna thread already which put her on the radar, but after these two shout outs I'll definitely consider her more carefully.
NoNeedToBragoBoutIt wrote: ↑4 years ago
w is a tough cookie if you really want to build a
strong deck.
I think the most crucial thing is to manage expectations.
w can be great, but the commander options are far worse and less diverse than most colors. Given you put enough effort into it you'll only have to find out what to build.
I love my
Teshar, Ancestor's Apostle deck. But just like
God-Eternal Oketra,
Heliod, Sun-Crowned,
Sram, Senior Edificer there is more or less a single version of each of them to build, unless you conciously want to sacrifice a lot of deck strength.
Sure, you don't have all the ultra broken tools for it, but with plenty of great walkers and proliferate cards from WAR
Djeru, With Eyes Open might be underrated. Especially with loads of flickers and a good board wipe suite.
I more or less love everything about
Bruna, the Fading Light - aside from her CMC. I don't want to repeat what others have said, though.
On top of that, there are several solid Voltron options of different types with
Balan, Wandering Knight,
Danitha Capashen, Paragon,
Gisela, the Broken Blade,
Zetalpa, Primal Dawn and others.
u is laughably different. Plenty of "open" Commanders, an absurd card pool and so on. You rather should be concerned about not building an oppressive and uninspiring deck.
Thada Adel, Acquisitor has been mentioned and scales very well with your opponents' deck strength.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist can be anything you want and i'm always fond of creature-based, non-Wizard decks in this color.
Of course, you're gambling with
Braids, Conjurer Adept, but come on now, how great is she!?
Baral, Chief of Compliance and
Talrand, Sky Summoner require some discipline, not to build both of them inherently oppressive and non-responsive. But from
Talent of the Telepath,
Gather Specimens to
Long-Term Plans, there are just so many interesting toys for non-Spikes.
As a big fan of mono decks myself, i'm curious what you'll end up with!
I absolutely agree with all of this. Blue is hard to make interesting, white is hard to make strong. The 'good' white cards are monobuilds which is something I've been distinctly aware of when considering them, and which makes them super uninteresting. I'm not really big on voltron options in white or any colour, aggression is already an uphill battle without committing to commander damage too!
Seems like we are homing in on a couple of stand out options - Bruna, Thada, Jalira. Maybe Braids. I had ruled out Blue Braids as a friend of mine had played her extensively a few years back, but re-reading it she seems legit awesome.
No land-D allowed sadly. Not my rules, theirs. Same reason I can't run that Kamigawa winter orb thing. I'm all for it but the group says no.
OCPunisher wrote: ↑4 years ago
I've had a lot of success with
God-Eternal Oketra in mono-white. You can do lots of fun things with self-bouncing creatures, Soul Sisters, anthems, etc. It's certainly not the most absurdly powerful deck, but it can create a sizeable army.
Conversely, mono-blue has been an eternal struggle for me. I've tried to make
Urza work for months, but it's either way too strong or super watered-down, and there's no middle ground. None of the other mono-blue guys I've tried seem to work out either (Thada, Padeem, Sai, etc). If there's a better answer out there, I'd love to hear it...
I've tried Oketra, but it never seemed to click. Playing terrible creatures to get vanilla 4/4 worked way worse in practice than in theory. It could be my deckbuilding skill (I'm pretty trash) but I think other value decks just outpace her way too much. I'm more inclined to put Oketra in a white deck that likes creatures and then farm the triggers while doing something else.