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darrenhabib wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Wow "completed a dungeon" is such an amazing mechanic. You only need to spend the entire game trying to achieve it and you get incredible bonuses like Cloister Gargoyle as a 3/4 flyer for 2w and Gloom Stalker a 2/3 double striker for 2w. I'd say this mechanic will be banned in most formats.

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Or for most practical purposes, it will be un-playable, like the Level Up mechanic was.

The 'completed a dungeon' abilities aren't the treasure you're looking for - the real treasure is the friends you made along the way! (by which I mean the incremental dungeon rewards, like tokens / scry / card draw, and the big loot pile at the end of the dungeon)

....I expect it will end up faring pretty close to city's blessing - a primarily limited-focused mechanic, with a few actually good cards at rare/mythic that see play elsewhere. That does mean it's fairly unlikely that you'll be able to make a dedicated EDH deck, but I wouldn't be surprised if there were a Standard venture aggro deck built around completing Tomb of Annihilation as quickly as possible. The fact that it is parasitic makes it a bit harder to slide into a deck - any venturers that are playable in EDH will probably need to be able to be able to complete a dungeon by themselves via repeatable triggers. Shortcut Seeker doing so at common does suggest that the ability will be aggressively costed, at least.

Gamazson wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Or for most practical purposes, it will be un-playable, like the Level Up mechanic was.

Last time I played Lighthouse Chronologist I almost got banned from my LGS (kidding, but only kinda - people did NOT like that and I quickly felt bad for playing it).

I'd say let's withhold some judgment on the mechanic overall until we've seen all the cards that interact with it. At the very least, it seems like a pretty cute build-around, even if it ends up being a low-powered one.

We're going to have space marines in a year or two so, y'know, if this mechanic feels like a betrayal of the game you'll probably want to hold onto your butt pretty hard.

Eh, they printed %$#% mechanics that were almost labeled as the secondo coming of Jesus Christ. People wanted to change EDH rules just for learn. Eh eh. And now we get mad about dungeons? Which are basically sagas that advance with your permanents' triggered abilities?
In the end the mechanic will be printed on few cards and will be unplayable in EDH. Unless they really push it in the AFR commander precon, maybe putting some new dungeons while we are at it.

Even as much of an angry old man as I am, I don't think Dungeons are going to be that bad. I am leery of extras like them in general though, because if poorly handled they could become must-haves far quicker than cards that require slots.

BeneTleilax wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Even as much of an angry old man as I am, I don't think Dungeons are going to be that bad. I am leery of extras like them in general though, because if poorly handled they could become must-haves far quicker than cards that require slots.

To clarify, you don't need the dungeon cards to "do the dungeon" to my understanding. They're basically like tokens. If you gain control of someone else's card with this mechanic, you can just pull it up on your phone, use a dice, borrow theirs, whatever. I assume they'll be in the token slot in packs (though that's just speculation on my part).

DirkGently wrote: ↑

3 years ago

BeneTleilax wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Even as much of an angry old man as I am, I don't think Dungeons are going to be that bad. I am leery of extras like them in general though, because if poorly handled they could become must-haves far quicker than cards that require slots.

To clarify, you don't need the dungeon cards to "do the dungeon" to my understanding. They're basically like tokens. If you gain control of someone else's card with this mechanic, you can just pull it up on your phone, use a dice, borrow theirs, whatever. I assume they'll be in the token slot in packs (though that's just speculation on my part).

Ah. Then they're slightly gimmicky, I guess, but harmless. I don't think I'll run them anywhere, unless they print a really good support card for them that also fits perfectly into one of my existing decks.

To be clear, I'm not bothered by dungeons, they just seem like an inelegant version of contraptions. If they print something fun for Grismold, I might give them a look, but other than that, add 'em to the laundry list of mechanics and abilities that I'll have to squint at and ask to RTFC if I run across one in the wild.

I kinda like the dungeons because they mean that a crapload of the cards are going to be superparasitic and that's a good way to make these cards not that important outside of the set they're in, but who knows

pokken wrote: ↑

3 years ago

I kinda like the dungeons because they mean that a crapload of the cards are going to be superparasitic and that's a good way to make these cards not that important outside of the set they're in, but who knows

Anything that only works if you've completed a dungeon will probably be garbage outside of a dedicated dungeon commander, but I could imagine cards that do the dungeoning would be ok since the wizard lair has a decent payoff. But idk, as the + on a planeswalker it sure doesn't look very strong so far, so it may well end up being pretty underpowered.

It's cute to kinda have the mechanic do separate things in standard vs commander though - the 2 short dungeons are almost unplayable in commander whereas the long one is probably too slow for standard outside of control mirrors.

I can appreciate that they start outside the game and then are brought into the command zone. When I first saw them today I was curious how they were going to use zoning to get them into a playable place. Now they can just sit outside the game along with all of the Black Lotuses I've created with Garth while goldfishing. They never truly go away - they live in your heart forever.

I was/am iffy on the IP crossover, but I kinda dig the dungeon mechanic. It's not powerful, but it's interesting and potentially fun. I think if you have a blink deck why not put and etb dungeon creature in and go to town.

For a commander I can imagine a tap to enter the dungeon one over a Mana sink version. Maybe a landfall trigger?

DirkGently wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Gamazson wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Or for most practical purposes, it will be un-playable, like the Level Up mechanic was.

Last time I played Lighthouse Chronologist I almost got banned from my LGS (kidding, but only kinda - people did NOT like that and I quickly felt bad for playing it).

I'd say let's withhold some judgment on the mechanic overall until we've seen all the cards that interact with it. At the very least, it seems like a pretty cute build-around, even if it ends up being a low-powered one.

Fair enough, everything has an edge case, but I don't have high hopes for the mechanics longevity.

DirkGently wrote: ↑

3 years ago

We're going to have space marines in a year or two so, y'know, if this mechanic feels like a betrayal of the game you'll probably want to hold onto your butt pretty hard.

If they don't have a functional reprint of Despotic Scepter themed to an Imperial Guard Commissar, I'll riot lol.

Can someone link to the dungeon card please,also some of the card links are broken

dungeon delving cards make me think of the story cards in Mythos, they're sweet and gimmicky and only for ultra-casual play and I love them and it looks like they're the cards that'll be getting most of the showcase frames so they'll be buyable cheap. been de-emphasizing commander in my collection because it's primarily a format for squabbling and card sharking via hype videos, kinda more enjoying revamping some sixty card casual decks and planning out small casual variants, and "Future and Showcase frames only" is one i'm excited about, so the set's for me and not for you =P

Hermes_ wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Can someone link to the dungeon card please,also some of the card links are broken

Here is the mechanic article explaining how dungeons work: https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/a ... 2021-06-24

The dungeon mechanic and the cards that enable it don't seem likely to be particularly good in Commander, and I am 100% cool with this. Not everything is or should be about us, and I would much rather have a subset of cards published that is mediocre or even bad in out format than yet more too-pushed cards aimed at commander that break standard. EDH is better when the game as a whole is healthier.

Yes it's refreshing to see a set that's not excessively pandering to EDH. That being said it's bound to be packed with new legends so it's not like we're entirely forgotten.

Just a reminder that we had Strixhaven with learn as the previous standard set

Rumpy5897 wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Just a reminder that we had Strixhaven with learn as the previous standard set

don't remind me

The hot topic (this week at least, who can keep up with MTG drama) is that WOTC is pushing commander cards and ruining other constructed formats. Two sets with standard focused mechanics is nice

Agreed. Let Standard, Modern and Pioneer get some love. We will pick up the weird cards, the casual cards, the dollar rares, and I honestly hope little more. We gathered a better harvest gleaning their fields than reaping what has been sown for us.

So Dungeon is basically kinda an advantage that your opponent's can't really take from you but for you to utilize that advantage, you have to play what so far appear to be jank cards. As a The Ur-Dragon player I can identify with that...

duducrash wrote: ↑

3 years ago

The hot topic (this week at least, who can keep up with MTG drama) is that WOTC is pushing commander cards and ruining other constructed formats. Two sets with standard focused mechanics is nice

Yeah big pile of %$#%$#% spewed by people who know jackshit about commander.

I too am liking the low power feel of this set. Maybe they finally learned to back the %$#% off and just let us enjoy our jank instead of forcefeeding us what they think we want. Here's to hoping!