MTGNexus

Sporegorger_Dragon wrote: ↑

3 years ago

duducrash wrote: ↑

3 years ago

I mean, is Stinging Study really worse than Humiliate or Fracture? Shineshadow Snarl states that the Silverquill are corrupt, and it seems like their ultimate goal is to cause pain, suffering, and humiliation against their enemies.

It's all about the presentation and context, not the heinousness of the act.

A teenage Rakdos cultist shooting Boros guards with fire? Hilarious!

A teenage Rakdos cultist entering a school and setting kids on fire? That is in extremely poor taste at best, even if the actual act was only implied.

Stinging Study would still be uncomfortable even if there was no blood and there was only a bruise on the hand. And it's always been a real-life problem of people in power abusing vulnerable people under them that should be in their care, whether they be teen idols or gymnasts at a university.

I just think that's something that is inherently intrinsic to the BW color combination. Black is all about ambition and being power-hungry, and white is all about order and laws. When you combine those two together for an organization in a set, that organization isn't going to take good care of members it's supposed to be caring for.

We've seen it with the Orzhov, a corrupt church that collects taxes and lines their pockets while using slavery and torture. The cabal has been depicted in more black cards, but it certainly has some white characteristics. Black and White has a sacrifice theme, and sacrificing vulnerable people certainly isn't take care of them.

Sorin and Kaya are the closest things that we have to heroes that are black and white but they're more anti-heroes that have done disturbing things.

The other issue is black and white is harder to do as fantasy art that won't trigger people personally. As you said, most people haven't seen a loved one being burned alive by a dragon(red), being stomped by a tree(green), and many blue mechanics are so far into fantasy, like counterspells and returning creatures to their owners hands that it would be hard for someone to relate their past trama to. Black and White have angels and demons, but as institutions black and white represent the worst of humanity and therefore will trigger some people. This may be a part of the reason why Wizards has waited so long to do an enemy colored set again. Corrupt governments, universities, and religious organizations that have existed in our world are all Black and White.

I guess Silverquill could have been about necromancy and hanging out with ghosts, or it could have been about transforming yourself into an angel and/or a demon without having bullying or abuse from teachers.

kirkusjones wrote: ↑

3 years ago

illakunsaa wrote: ↑

3 years ago

It's just a card game guys. You don't have to take it so seriously.

It's a card game where the goal is to kill your opponent in any number of horrific ways. Whether electrocuting, immolating, mauling with any number of a variety of horrors, slowly bleeding them to death, chipping away at their sanity until they're left a drooling husk or giving them a particularly virulent plague.

Not to be rude, but I absolutely dont understand posts like this. Why are people being the feelings police. If I said I dont feel confortable with this act specificly its not up to other posters to come here and go "but actually". Its out of line.

If in the next set we have a domestic violence situation will people come out and defend because an elder dragon decimated an interdimentional plane before in the lore? When we draw the line on other people experiences and how they feel?

Veinwitch Coven looks doooope. Lookin forward to trying that out in Syggristocrats.

Yedora, Grave Gardener is the most interesting of the golgari/witherbloom deck to me. I guess it works with morphs? Wouldn't mind some incredibly detailed rules analysis from Bob on that one

702.36e seems to indicate you can flip it, at least.

EDIT: oop, although I also see "If a face-down creature loses its abilities, it can't be turned face up by paying its morph cost because it no longer has morph or a morph cost."

So I guess not?

DirkGently wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Yedora, Grave Gardener is the most interesting of the golgari/witherbloom deck to me. I guess it works with morphs? Wouldn't mind some incredibly detailed rules analysis from Bob on that one

It's a really interesting card. Sadly I think the most exciting thing to do with it is blink them with Felidar Guardian et al. There's probably a critical mass of those effects now and you could create some pretty nasty loops.

You can also Cloudstone Curio them back to hand which is, I know, surprise, someone broke Cloudstone Curio

pokken wrote: ↑

3 years ago

You can also Cloudstone Curio them back to hand which is, I know, surprise, someone broke Cloudstone Curio

Cloudstone curio is an overpriced card I hope they never ever reprint. Fewer of them around, the better.

But yeah it is kinda cute here, lol.

Aaaaand we have the final spoilers, this time for Witherbloom. Lots of stuff to enable lifegain decks, and some nice synergy cards too.

• Gyome, Master Chef looks fun. Every creature brings along a food token, which can be cashed in for indestructibility instead of life. However, it also turbocharges artifact synergies like Blinkmoth Urn. Not that BG has a ton of artifact synergies, but still worth noting. I guess Witch's Familiar is a card.
• Tivash, Gloom Summoner is mildly amusing, as a way to pump out demons in exchange for life. Doesn't look particularly powerful, but does work well with Disciple of Griselbrand effects.
• Yedora, Grave Gardener gets my Johnny senses tingling. Land creatures are affected by summoning sickness, so you can't get infinite mana with just Living Lands and a sac outlet, but definitely seems breakable.
• Ezzaroot Channeler is a very powerful cost reduction effect.
• Veinwitch Coven is a very powerful recursion engine.
• Blight Mound looks great. I'm always looking for more of this effect for Teysa, and a three mana enchantment is a bargain. Seems like a strong upgrade over Open the Graves.
• Pest Infestation is a scaling Naturalize effect, which looks solid.
• Revival Experiment can reanimate artifacts and enchantments, which is somewhat rare for BG. Not a ton of splashy things to reanimate in those colors, but if you're hitting multiple cards, it looks like a pile of value.
• Marshland Bloodcaster seems fair and reasonable. Yup, no other words to describe it.
• Witch's Clinic is an extremely efficient lifegain engine for voltron decks.
• Blossoming Bogbeast is another Pathbreaker Ibex effect.

pokken wrote: ↑

3 years ago

DirkGently wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Yedora, Grave Gardener is the most interesting of the golgari/witherbloom deck to me. I guess it works with morphs? Wouldn't mind some incredibly detailed rules analysis from Bob on that one

It's a really interesting card. Sadly I think the most exciting thing to do with it is blink them with Felidar Guardian et al. There's probably a critical mass of those effects now and you could create some pretty nasty loops.

You can also Cloudstone Curio them back to hand which is, I know, surprise, someone broke Cloudstone Curio

Kamahl, Fist of Krosa and Temur Sabertooth could achieve this. Add Nyxbloom Ancient to have the creature-as-a-land pay for itself.

With Living Lands effects and a sac outlet it goes infinite?

Not sure if Gyome, Master Chef/food could be a good deck, but thats never stopped me before.

While white is struggling to catch up with other colors in EDH, "other colors" had already invaded its realm and done things more interestingly. Life gain, removal, small yet efficient creatures... Somehow white is the only color that do their own stuff less effectively than others, and socially forbidden to do what they're good at, such as MLD.

Honestly? If white is ever going to thrive again in MtG, WotC needs to open new paths, like how red gets impulse draw. Or, at least their signature effects have to be a lot more powerful. Heavier taxing, cheaper massive protection, repeatable permanent retrieval, etc, maybe more Balance effects, but instead of catching up it brings everyone back to the basics.

EDIT: And while we're at it... If someone was traumatized by war, would it be rational for them to call War of the Sparks flawed simply because it triggered their war experience? I was bullied in school for years to the point of hating myself, but when I see these supposed "bullies" in MtG cards, all I could wonder is how bland the depiction is compare to the real thing. Creative products are suppose to incite certain aspects of their worlds and ours, WotC made the right decision to include bullying in Strixhaven, rather than making it a unreal wonderland.

White needs to TAKE things from other colors.
- Hopefully the Lorehold items will pop up more often in white. White has great recursion! So maybe give them self-mill or discard/draw and call them both "excavation." Then take those away from blue.
- I feel like we could have cheaper, reusable effects for specific card types like Militia Bugler or Board the Weatherlight as another "dig" angle. Take this away from green (Ancient Stirrings) who can outright draw cards anyway.

Anyway, I like Gyome, Master Chef on the offense: Use him to tap down blockers!

Serenade wrote: ↑

3 years ago

White needs to TAKE things from other colors.
- Hopefully the Lorehold items will pop up more often in white. White has great recursion! So maybe give them self-mill or discard/draw and call them both "excavation." Then take those away from blue.
- I feel like we could have cheaper, reusable effects for specific card types like Militia Bugler or Board the Weatherlight as another "dig" angle. Take this away from green (Ancient Stirrings) who can outright draw cards anyway.

Anyway, I like Gyome, Master Chef on the offense: Use him to tap down blockers!

I really wish that Hullbreacher or Opposition Agent were white. Blue and black already have so many advantages over white, but white is supposed to have the best hatebears. Now Aven Mindcensor and Alms Collector are outclassed.

Yedora, Grave Gardener got a lot of ramp potential.
Anything that can make Forest/lands into creatures has infinite loops available; Ambush Commander, Life and Limb, Living Lands, Living Plane, Nature's Revolt.
Combine with a sacrifice outlet for whatever infinite. They do have summoning sickness when they return to play so you can't tap for mana with these loops however.

I like that if you can turn a sacrifice land into a creature then you can get value off it. So if you used something like Nissa, Who Shakes the World [+1] on a fetchland you can sacrifice it and it'll return to play as a Forest.

Quirion Ranger and Scryb Ranger can be used as value engines.
Say use Sakura-Tribe Elder and then you return it to hand Quirion Ranger or Scryb Ranger to keep ramping each turn.
Caustic Caterpillar and Spore Frog being other examples of using each turn.

I like the new cards, but I'm a bit frustrated. I think it is one of the first times that they manage to leverage life gain in an interesting way, and it's not in white, the primary colour for life gain. It looks like this B/G life gain strategy will outclass pretty much anything a mono-white lifegain deck can do, which is sad.

Cyberium wrote: ↑

3 years ago

If white is ever going to thrive again in MtG, WotC needs to open new paths,

If white had a path, it was Journey to Nowhere, Path to Exile or Journey to Oblivion.

(sorry, but... don't want to miss the pun opportunity... )

Yedora plus Ambush Commander is fairly ridiculous :3 I kinda need a Yedora since I'm maintaining a forests-matter deck already. Might empty the graveyard and make Colfenor less useful but they can be treefolk friends and sometimes that's more important!

edit: Yedora's doubly amazing because it stops you from doing the simplest graveyard loops and flicker isn't a green thing so you can't, say, sacrifice Llanowar Druid an infinite number of times. but if a Selesnya deck with another commander eg Emiel tutors for Yedora then that actually makes infinite loops fairly trivial to achieve which means everyone should play Yedora mono-green rather than as a game a ruiner, right? =P

Serenade wrote: ↑

3 years ago

White needs to TAKE things from other colors.
- Hopefully the Lorehold items will pop up more often in white. White has great recursion! So maybe give them self-mill or discard/draw and call them both "excavation." Then take those away from blue.
- I feel like we could have cheaper, reusable effects for specific card types like Militia Bugler or Board the Weatherlight as another "dig" angle. Take this away from green (Ancient Stirrings) who can outright draw cards anyway.

Anyway, I like Gyome, Master Chef on the offense: Use him to tap down blockers!

Yes, I think historic-affinity is definite a great place to start. White values heritage, succession, artifact/enchantment, legends, so them being the historic color is prime.

And snow. We already see cards like Search for Glory.

Alright! Now that we've got the full spoiler for both the set and commander let's see what I'm excited about-

Felisa, Fang of Silverquill: a neat counter payoff and goes straight into Edgar vampires. I like having a reason to actually cast Edgar, and this is a smooth way to make those counters matter.

Gyome, Master Chef: the literal flavor here, I love it. Goes in to feed Korvold at bare minimum.

Losheel, Clockwork Scholar: I'm a bit sad that the card draw payoff for white is more of a "mono brown" effect but this card is still sweet.

Fain, the Broker: this card is basically designed for me. Sacrifice synergies? Artifact shenanigans? Ramp? All wrapped up in a durdly mana-sinkable package. Gimme.

Tivash, Gloom Summoner: this guy can make some big beats and his art is sweet.

Tempted by the Oriq: potentially nabs a bunch of goodies for little investment- lots of utility creatures and some powerful commanders at 3cmc or less.

Callous Bloodmage: without a doubt my favorite card in the set. Phyrexian Rager is a simple value card I always loved and this gives you that option, plus options for bodies/sacrifice fodder, plus the all-important option of nuking a problematic yard. This card is a huge role player for a utility slot.

Crackle with Power: hey, I love me a big dumb X spell and this slides right on into Neheb, the Eternal.

Fervent Mastery: similarly, like graveyard tutors and randomness, so this has several homes.

Extus, Oriq Overlord // Awaken the Blood Avatar: a sorcery in the command zone is neat, though I'm more excited just to have another value beater in my human tribal deck.

Selfless Glyphweaver // Deadly Vanity: bummed that he exiles himself, but this flexibility is real good.

Dramatic Finale: about the only card that hit the flavor I wanted for Silverquill- love the art and ready to find it a home.

No one:
Me: Oh, sweet, they made new art for my favorite red card, Volcanic Vision! And it works so well with that Prismari treasure cycle!

It seems like everyone's been trying to make Dragon's Approach into a deck unto itself like Disciple or jam it into dragon tribal, but I wonder if its best place is as a package strategy to slot into Neheb, the Eternal or Rakdos, Lord of Riots decks that can utilize its normal effect and also have ways to cast big fat dragons independent of its self-combo.

Cyberium wrote: ↑

3 years ago

Yes, I think historic-affinity is definite a great place to start. White values heritage, succession, artifact/enchantment, legends, so them being the historic color is prime.

Historic-affinity is a remarkably succinct way to describe what white should be.

White should definitely be the "historic matters" color.

White definitely feels the least unique effect. Other than taxing effects all other collors have creeped into white territory. Crank up taxes! Go full state on these fools

So uh, I guess Champions of Archery is a thing now?

ZenN wrote: ↑

3 years ago

So uh, I guess Champions of Archery is a thing now?

It's one of those heroes of the realm cards that aren't legal anywhere