Zedruu the Greatest of All Time
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- Posts: 33
- Joined: 2 years ago
- Pronoun: they / them
So I've been working with Parallax Wave, which is probably the most unpopular idea I've had so far. The problem is that the best combos involve turning it into a creature, but Opalescence makes way too many 2-3-card combos. Enter Starfield of Nyx. It turns everything into 4+ card combos by requiring 2-3 other enchantments.
It also has the benefit of bringing back enchantments from the graveyard, i.e., eye of the storm. Bonus if you discard eye of the storm to firestorm at an opponent's endstep. It helps that I removed Reliquary Tower just to speed up the turns and force me to play a tighter game.
I've upped the enchantment density in the deck, replacing some of the draw with Dictate of Kruphix, Tenuous Truce, Sorcerer `Class. I've also replaced Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker with Splinter Twin, because Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker draws too much ire. Splinter Twin allows all the same combos, but can also be a less-threatening value-card early game, e.g., put it on Vedalken Plotter.
BUT. if anybody has any other ideas for enchantments or things, I'm still looking. Adding back in Eye of the Storm Possibility Storm , and Mindmoil has been great, but they're mana-heavy and I'm now running light on creatures.
Lastly, Starfield of Nyx allows one of my favorite zedruu plays, where somebody casts targeted creature removal on an enchantment (or Theros god) and in response I donate a permanent, de-animating the creature and fizzling the spell.
Unrelated, but Archaeomancer's Map is nuts. Donating lands in response to opponents' ramp spells to lower your land count feels fantastic.
It also has the benefit of bringing back enchantments from the graveyard, i.e., eye of the storm. Bonus if you discard eye of the storm to firestorm at an opponent's endstep. It helps that I removed Reliquary Tower just to speed up the turns and force me to play a tighter game.
I've upped the enchantment density in the deck, replacing some of the draw with Dictate of Kruphix, Tenuous Truce, Sorcerer `Class. I've also replaced Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker with Splinter Twin, because Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker draws too much ire. Splinter Twin allows all the same combos, but can also be a less-threatening value-card early game, e.g., put it on Vedalken Plotter.
BUT. if anybody has any other ideas for enchantments or things, I'm still looking. Adding back in Eye of the Storm Possibility Storm , and Mindmoil has been great, but they're mana-heavy and I'm now running light on creatures.
Lastly, Starfield of Nyx allows one of my favorite zedruu plays, where somebody casts targeted creature removal on an enchantment (or Theros god) and in response I donate a permanent, de-animating the creature and fizzling the spell.
Unrelated, but Archaeomancer's Map is nuts. Donating lands in response to opponents' ramp spells to lower your land count feels fantastic.
Tags:
Not a bad idea tbh. For the exact same reasons I replaced Kiki-Jiki with Fable of the Mirror-Breaker // Reflection of Kiki-Jiki. Splinter Twin is more explosive and still retains the interaction between Cavalier of Dawn, Mind Over Matter and whatever artifact/enchantment in hand, while Fable is a bit more versatile (helps ramp, fixes hand, can copy different stuff) but it is telegraphed a mile away.ihatemaryfisher wrote: ↑1 year agoI've also replaced Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker with Splinter Twin, because Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker draws too much ire. Splinter Twin allows all the same combos, but can also be a less-threatening value-card early game, e.g., put it on Vedalken Plotter.
EDIT: Waaaait a minute! Splinter Twin can copy legendaries!!! That means it is possible to have interactions like Splinter Twin, Venser, Shaper Savant, Jeskai Ascendancy and any mana neutral/positive mana rock as a variation of the old Banishing Knack/Ascendancy combo for infinite Ascendancy looting triggers. Now I am more sold on Splinter Twin.
Last edited by Sefir 1 year ago, edited 1 time in total.
Zedruu the Greathearted 4-Card Combos Puzzlebox
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Thraximundar Zomblins
The Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Soul of Windgrace Loam BalanceThe Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Saclands
Phelddagrif Hippo Factory Lifegain
Riku of Two Reflections Dragon's Approach
Damia, Sage of Stone Casual Food Chain
I just had a strange scenario where I could mutate (with Lore Drakkis) a creature I owned but I did not control. What happens in that occasion? Is it me that gets the recursion effect from Lore Drakkis or its controller? Do I get to control the creature? Man, mutate is weird.....
Zedruu the Greathearted 4-Card Combos Puzzlebox
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Thraximundar Zomblins
The Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Soul of Windgrace Loam BalanceThe Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Saclands
Phelddagrif Hippo Factory Lifegain
Riku of Two Reflections Dragon's Approach
Damia, Sage of Stone Casual Food Chain
The controller of the creature gets the trigger and keeps the mutated creature, I believe.Sefir wrote: ↑1 year agoI just had a strange scenario where I could mutate (with Lore Drakkis) a creature I owned but I did not control. What happens in that occasion? Is it me that gets the recursion effect from Lore Drakkis or its controller? Do I get to control the creature? Man, mutate is weird.....
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
Me: "I will try to stay away from the Arcbond interactions for my next builds! I want to try some different stuff!"
Wizards: "Say no more!" First they print the awsome retro blueprints Precursor golem version and now this.
Phyrexian Vindicator
Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx is also very happy.
Wizards: "Say no more!" First they print the awsome retro blueprints Precursor golem version and now this.
Phyrexian Vindicator
Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx is also very happy.
Zedruu the Greathearted 4-Card Combos Puzzlebox
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Thraximundar Zomblins
The Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Soul of Windgrace Loam BalanceThe Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Saclands
Phelddagrif Hippo Factory Lifegain
Riku of Two Reflections Dragon's Approach
Damia, Sage of Stone Casual Food Chain
- jjjrrrgggnnn
- Posts: 30
- Joined: 3 years ago
- Pronoun: Unlisted
I was going to play a few games and make a mental note of how consistent it was to get four white pips.
On another note, I'll be testing out The Mycosynth Gardens, which seems like a low cost to potentially sneak a Howling Mine effect before your turn, make a copy of Mirror of Fate as required, mess with an opponents turn by turning it into another Knowledge Pool, amongst other things.
On another note, I'll be testing out The Mycosynth Gardens, which seems like a low cost to potentially sneak a Howling Mine effect before your turn, make a copy of Mirror of Fate as required, mess with an opponents turn by turning it into another Knowledge Pool, amongst other things.
Exactly this. I don't know if I have room for any of the big fancy toys in this set, but an untapped color fixing land that also does fun things is an easy fit.jjjrrrgggnnn wrote: ↑1 year agoOn another note, I'll be testing out The Mycosynth Gardens, which seems like a low cost.
I've also been wanting to get back to Paradox Haze, which leads back to Oath of Lieges, which also plays well with The Mycosynth Gardens.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
Then an extra mana rock can be beneficial and Liquimetal Torque will help with that. Easy to add to the deck too.tstorm823 wrote: ↑1 year agoExactly this. I don't know if I have room for any of the big fancy toys in this set, but an untapped color fixing land that also does fun things is an easy fit.jjjrrrgggnnn wrote: ↑1 year agoOn another note, I'll be testing out The Mycosynth Gardens, which seems like a low cost.
Zedruu the Greathearted 4-Card Combos Puzzlebox
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Thraximundar Zomblins
The Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Soul of Windgrace Loam BalanceThe Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Saclands
Phelddagrif Hippo Factory Lifegain
Riku of Two Reflections Dragon's Approach
Damia, Sage of Stone Casual Food Chain
I tried to go back in the therad to where we were comparing decklists to see what you had going with Liquimetal Torque, but the decklist is marked as private, so now you have to explain yourself!Sefir wrote: ↑1 year agoThen an extra mana rock can be beneficial and Liquimetal Torque will help with that. Easy to add to the deck too.
I agree entirely, Liquimetal Torque is an interesting card with a super high floor that is very easy to sneak in as a two mana ramp spell. But also, I only have like 3 cards that interact with the type change, and it's rather small effects like letting Saheeli copy an enchantment until end of turn. I wanna know, what silliness do you have going on?
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
Again? Freakin....tstorm823 wrote: ↑1 year agoI tried to go back in the therad to where we were comparing decklists to see what you had going with Liquimetal Torque, but the decklist is marked as private, so now you have to explain yourself!Sefir wrote: ↑1 year agoThen an extra mana rock can be beneficial and Liquimetal Torque will help with that. Easy to add to the deck too.
I agree entirely, Liquimetal Torque is an interesting card with a super high floor that is very easy to sneak in as a two mana ramp spell. But also, I only have like 3 cards that interact with the type change, and it's rather small effects like letting Saheeli copy an enchantment until end of turn. I wanna know, what silliness do you have going on?
Mtggoldfish makes the list private whenever I add something that is not legal yet (like the beforementioned The Mycosynth Gardens).
Has to be fixed now. My list is also accessible through the The Lucky Paper Commander Map.
Since I stopped playing both Opalescence and March of the Machines (the latter replaced by Rise and Shine, that allows me to both do the grand majority of combos March had, go for treasure beatdown and not be extremely evil to my equipment opponents in my local meta), Liquimetal Torque+Rise can help me animate enchantments or, even better, turn Saheeli, Sublime Artificer herself into a creature. From there, many things can happen. F.e. I can mutate Saheeli with Lore Drakkis and thus turn Mirrorweave into a mass removal spell (if I chose NOT to put Lore Drakkis in the front). Or again, mutate Saheeli with Lore Drakkis and create multiple copies of Saheeli (or any PW really, it just happens that I run only her in my current version) with Replication Technique (ONLY if I chose to put Lore Drakkis in the front). The Servos add on with 3 Saheelis in play, believe me. Or copy her with Sakashima the Impostor, use the Lore Saheelishima Drakis PW ability and then bounce it back at hand at the end of turn. Mind you, many of the above interactions may work slightly differently with March of the Machines instead of Rise and Shine. There are certainly fun stuff here to be uncovered. Especially if you are willing to experiment with many different PWs (Hi infinite and hasty Saheeli Rai creatures!). Or even different Mutate creatures (Hi Vadrok, Apex of Thunder!). Did I mention I am in love with Lore Drakkis? I am in love with Lore Drakkis. What an amazing creature. I have you to thank for that.
Another subtle interaction is helping Role Reversal (that I don't currently play). Would be fun to steal the best creature on the field for a treasure though.
Finally, I play a lot with treasures in my last builds. Torque makes my opponents sceptical in playing any non-Vandalblast mass artifact removal (like f.e. Farewell, since I will kill their best permanent too.
EDIT: In the battle between Rootha, Mercurial Artist and Narset's Reversal on "what Turnabout combo should I keep" (can't play both versions ofc, since Rootha+Reversal+Extra turn spell is infinite) Rootha won. However I liked Reversal as a spell, so Remand will do its best Reversal impression. So far I am very satisfied from it. It does most things Reversal does (bouncing back Mind's Desire, etc), has no 3-card infinites that I see, protects the board and finally saves my Bonus Round from being comboless by Bonus Round+Turnabout+Remand+Rootha infinite (draws the deck with the Remand card draw. I also have a variation with Mystic Retrieval instead of Rootha).
Last edited by Sefir 1 year ago, edited 3 times in total.
Zedruu the Greathearted 4-Card Combos Puzzlebox
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Thraximundar Zomblins
The Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Soul of Windgrace Loam BalanceThe Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Saclands
Phelddagrif Hippo Factory Lifegain
Riku of Two Reflections Dragon's Approach
Damia, Sage of Stone Casual Food Chain
Yup, you have my attention. Funny enough, I have yet to build a version that's stuck to Lore Drakkis for very long, but being able to incrementally turn literally any permanent into a Mirrorweave target sounds like a thing I want to do.Sefir wrote: ↑1 year agoSince I stopped playing both Opalescence and March of the Machines (the latter replaced by Rise and Shine, that allows me to both do the grand majority of combos March had, go for treasure beatdown and not be extremely evil to my equipment opponents in my local meta), Liquimetal Torque+Rise can help me animate enchantments or, even better, turn Saheeli, Sublime Artificer herself into a creature. From there, many things can happen. F.e. I can mutate Saheeli with Lore Drakkis and thus turn Mirrorweave into a mass removal spell (if I chose NOT to put Lore Drakkis in the front). Or again, mutate Saheeli with Lore Drakkis and create multiple copies of Saheeli (or any PW really, it just happens that I run only her in my current version) with Replication Technique (ONLY if I chose to put Lore Drakkis in the front). The Servos add on with 3 Saheelis in play, believe me. Or copy her with Sakashima the Impostor, use the Lore Saheelishima Drakis PW ability and then bounce it back at hand at the end of turn. Mind you, many of the above interactions may work slightly differently with March of the Machines instead of Rise and Shine. There are certainly fun stuff here to be uncovered. Especially if you are willing to experiment with many different PWs (Hi infinite and hasty Saheeli Rai creatures!). Or even different Mutate creatures (Hi Vadrok, Apex of Thunder!). Did I mention I am in love with Lore Drakkis? I am in love with Lore Drakkis. What an amazing creature. I have you to thank for that.
I took a quick look at what I'm doing, and if I go this direction, it may be time to make Tawnos, Urza's Apprentice shine. I can't play Strionic Resonator with Mind Over Matter because they combo together with Zedruu, but Tawnos can't copy Zedruu's trigger unless it's an artifact. And then Torque would be playing nice with Role Reversal, March of the Machines, Saheeli, Sublime Artificer, The Mycosynth Gardens, and Tawnos, Urza's Apprentice, which I'd say is more than enough. Upside, Tawnos is another legend that curves into Relic of Legends. Downside, Tawnos is another human that Lore Drakkis couldn't mutate onto. Upside, if I mutate Drakkis onto a golem and leave the golem in front, I can Tawnos the mutate trigger.
Counterpoint: where do I imagine getting 2 cuts into my deck for this? No idea.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
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- Posts: 33
- Joined: 2 years ago
- Pronoun: they / them
Kind of surprised I've never seen it mentioned, but has anybody tried out Zur's Weirding? In my hunt for enchantments, it seems like a good "turn the game upside down" card. The actual synergy is that everyone else's wincon is probably clearer than mine: e.g., everybody knows to pay 2 life to deny the Wort, the Raidmother player a Fireball, but nobody knows what the heck I'm planning on doing with Mirrorweave.
Also, I tried for like an hour to make Liquimetal Torque + March of the Machines + Parallax Wave into a 4-card combo, and the only solution I found was something like Anger to give creatures haste, which doesn't vibe with anything else in the deck.
Also, I tried for like an hour to make Liquimetal Torque + March of the Machines + Parallax Wave into a 4-card combo, and the only solution I found was something like Anger to give creatures haste, which doesn't vibe with anything else in the deck.
We'll, let me ask you a question: if someone sat across from you with Font of Mythos and Zyrs Weirding, how quickly would you attempt to murder them?ihatemaryfisher wrote: ↑1 year agoKind of surprised I've never seen it mentioned, but has anybody tried out Zur's Weirding? In my hunt for enchantments, it seems like a good "turn the game upside down" card. The actual synergy is that everyone else's wincon is probably clearer than mine: e.g., everybody knows to pay 2 life to deny the Wort, the Raidmother player a Fireball, but nobody knows what the heck I'm planning on doing with Mirrorweave.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
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- Posts: 33
- Joined: 2 years ago
- Pronoun: they / them
Yeahhh, I call this the Telepathy problem. Despite it hurting AND helping your opponents, they still hate it more than they like it.tstorm823 wrote: ↑1 year agoWe'll, let me ask you a question: if someone sat across from you with Font of Mythos and Zyrs Weirding, how quickly would you attempt to murder them?ihatemaryfisher wrote: ↑1 year agoKind of surprised I've never seen it mentioned, but has anybody tried out Zur's Weirding? In my hunt for enchantments, it seems like a good "turn the game upside down" card. The actual synergy is that everyone else's wincon is probably clearer than mine: e.g., everybody knows to pay 2 life to deny the Wort, the Raidmother player a Fireball, but nobody knows what the heck I'm planning on doing with Mirrorweave.
I could imagine it being poignant in a combo-heavy meta, where it becomes solely a combo-disruption piece that everyone uses, and nobody's equipped to take out one player quickly. Even in that case, it feels like a card I'd have to lecture everyone about why it's good for them. Frustrating
I'm beginning to think the right answer to this question is "both". I agree to the premise that we cannot have Rootha, Reversal, and Temporal Mastery, but I think the answer I'm looking for is to cut Temporal Mastery. I still want extra turns, but I can play conditional extra turns instead. I still really want to do Magosi, the Waterveil + Chance for Glory nonsense. (Side note: there is a 4-card combo to be found in Rootha + Reversal + Chance For Glory + any card that prevents me from losing the game on top of those cards fitting other combos, with the 5 card backup of the Magosi version of the combo).Sefir wrote: ↑1 year agoEDIT: In the battle between Rootha, Mercurial Artist and Narset's Reversal on "what Turnabout combo should I keep" (can't play both versions ofc, since Rootha+Reversal+Extra turn spell is infinite) Rootha won.
I believed I had hit a moment of true enlightenment, thinking this the perfect opportunity to Savor the Moment. It has the same sort of synergy with Magosi, where you can Magosi to filter away the downside, it doesn't go infinite with just Rootha and Narset's Reversal, and it's genuinely a decent card with a floor of "slightly overcosted but still acceptable blue explore". And it's pretty slick at instant speed too, taking the tapped turn before your regular turn instead of after. And it's easy to copy and recur while being fair to do so. And I had one more thought, that I could retain the infinite turns with Mirror of Fate by having Sphinx of the Second Sun to give me back an untap step. However, the comprehensive rules genuinely do not cover what happens if you play Savor with Sphinx out. Does "skip the untap step" mean just the first one, or does it skip every untap step? The official rules of the game have no explicit answer, and to my infinite disappointment, a rules manager presented this question decided arbitrarily that skipping all the untap steps is the answer. I don't mean "arbitrarily" as an insult, I just mean that the rules genuinely provide no answer to the question, there is no guidance or precedent, it is a completely open decision.
If that had worked, I'd be going full steam ahead with no hesitation. As it stands, I'll need to ponder more.
Edit: I forgot to mention why I want Rootha. Rootha, Mercurial Artist + Lore Drakkis is cracked. Playing 2 ultra-fringe uncommons and being cracked is fantastic.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
From Matt Tabak (former rules manager), specifically about this situation:
Chainer
(rebuild after Geth)
The conversation there is that Empty City Ruse is potentially a counter example for why Sphinx should work with Savor the Moment. Empty's text says "skip all combat phases", where Savor's says "skip the untap step", which could lead one to conclude that it should only skip the normal untap step, rather than all. The truth is that it's more akin to when early cards referenced "opponent", assuming only one opponent, and whether that translated to target opponent or each opponent required some oracle translations years later. For reference, Lifetap and Black Vise originally had similar text, but have oracle text such that one applies to one opponent and the other applies to all.
Nothing in the rules or card text answers the question, because savor just was not formatted to handle multiple untap steps, so the question goes to the rules manager to decide which interpretation best preserves the design intent of the cards, and he decided to skip all, which I only disagree with because it inconveniences me personally. 😖
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
Technically you don't need the Sphinx, you can still use Savor provided you have at least 12 mana to use, you can draw 3+cards/turn, and add Turnabout to the mix. Still a 5-card combo though. :/tstorm823 wrote: ↑1 year agoI believed I had hit a moment of true enlightenment, thinking this the perfect opportunity to Savor the Moment.......And I had one more thought, that I could retain the infinite turns with Mirror of Fate by having Sphinx of the Second Sun to give me back an untap step. ........
If that had worked, I'd be going full steam ahead with no hesitation. As it stands, I'll need to ponder more.
Yes, apart from the fact that it is another Turnabout combo variation (infinite mana, storm, etb triggers, etc), the fact you can generally copy any instant/sorcery AND recur it is amazing. Lore Drakkis is great with self-bouncing creatures. One more reason why Reversal needed to go, unfortunately.tstorm823 wrote: ↑1 year agoEdit: I forgot to mention why I want Rootha. Rootha, Mercurial Artist + Lore Drakkis is cracked. Playing 2 ultra-fringe uncommons and being cracked is fantastic.
Zedruu the Greathearted 4-Card Combos Puzzlebox
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Thraximundar Zomblins
The Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Soul of Windgrace Loam BalanceThe Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Saclands
Phelddagrif Hippo Factory Lifegain
Riku of Two Reflections Dragon's Approach
Damia, Sage of Stone Casual Food Chain
To be fair, given the nature of the combo, you can start without the Turnabout and effectively tutor it. Starting with Mirror of Fate, Rest in Peace, and Font of Mythos in play, and Savor the Moment in hand as the 4 cards, 12 mana goes deterministic. Activate Mirror before drawing for turn, redraw Mirror. Play Savor the Moment and Mirror of Fate for 8 mana. Reactivate Mirror, stacking Mirror, Savor, and Turnabout, since Turnabout was exiled by either Rest in Peace or Mirror of Fate by this point. Draw all 3 on the next turn, then cast Turnabout to untap. Loop established.
Similarly, Chance for Glory, Mirror of Fate, Rest in Peace, and Font of Mythos don't actually need to card that stops me from losing in hand to start. I can activate Mirror on my upkeep to exile the library and redraw Mirror, cast Chance for Glory (or even cast Chance for Glory and redraw both, as it's an instant) and Mirror again, then the second activation of Mirror can stack all 3 cards I need deterministically.
For the record, I'm leaning towards a Stifle effect as the last piece. There is a surprising number of triggered abilities already native to this deck that could be worth stifling: bounceland bounce triggers, other people casting spells from Knowledge Pool/Possibility Storm/Eye of the Storm, the return to play triggers on Vanish into Memory or Detention Sphere, or even just denying a threatening player cards from any of the Howling Mine variations.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
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- Posts: 33
- Joined: 2 years ago
- Pronoun: they / them
I added Trickbind and Discontinuity as hyperflexible effects to Stifle Chance for Glory's ability and deal with all sorts of threats.tstorm823 wrote: ↑1 year ago
For the record, I'm leaning towards a Stifle effect as the last piece. There is a surprising number of triggered abilities already native to this deck that could be worth stifling: bounceland bounce triggers, other people casting spells from Knowledge Pool/Possibility Storm/Eye of the Storm, the return to play triggers on Vanish into Memory or Detention Sphere, or even just denying a threatening player cards from any of the Howling Mine variations.
e.g., Trickbinding somebody comboing off with a Sensei's Divining Top.
I was also into a list with stifle/end the turn effects when I was testing Wormfang Manta. Sister of Silence is the only creature in our colors with such an effect. Can be bounced, copied, etc. Sundial of the Infinite is also very powerful, able to stop any kind of hate or any bad trigger. Works only in our turn though.
It is a shame Ertai Resurrected is in the wrong colors. He would have been amazing in such a role.
It is a shame Ertai Resurrected is in the wrong colors. He would have been amazing in such a role.
Zedruu the Greathearted 4-Card Combos Puzzlebox
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Gluntch, the Bestower Controlled Hug
Sliver Queen Enchantress
Dakkon Blackblade Miracles Control
Teneb, the Harvester Pestilence
Thraximundar Zomblins
The Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Soul of Windgrace Loam BalanceThe Omenkeel Vehicles
Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis Dredge
Minsc, Beloved Ranger Win(nie)s
Hans Eriksson Smash
Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Saclands
Phelddagrif Hippo Factory Lifegain
Riku of Two Reflections Dragon's Approach
Damia, Sage of Stone Casual Food Chain
I want Trickbind instinctively, but not in practice if I want to combo with Narset's Reversal or Rootha, Mercurial Artist. If not for those, that'd be my pick.ihatemaryfisher wrote: ↑1 year agoI added Trickbind and Discontinuity as hyperflexible effects to Stifle Chance for Glory's ability and deal with all sorts of threats.
e.g., Trickbinding somebody comboing off with a Sensei's Divining Top.
I didn't even know Sister of Silence existed. I definitely see myself on something costing 2 or less to ramp with bouncelands. Probably og stifle, except thats the version of this effect I don't actually own.Sefir wrote: ↑1 year agoI was also into a list with stifle/end the turn effects when I was testing Wormfang Manta. Sister of Silence is the only creature in our colors with such an effect. Can be bounced, copied, etc. Sundial of the Infinite is also very powerful, able to stop any kind of hate or any bad trigger. Works only in our turn though.
It is a shame Ertai Resurrected is in the wrong colors. He would have been amazing in such a role.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
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If it's unclear, I've been thinking about this deck even more than usual lately, and I had a buddy spend the weekend and got a bunch of testing in against him. That gave me a chance to test the version with Mind Over Matter, Displacer Kitten, and Lore Drakkis, give Rootha, Mercurial Artist and a proxy of The Mycosynth Gardens a couple tries to (successfully) prove their worth, and brainstorm other ideas, particularly for Magosi, the Waterveil. The result of all that is the list below, which to be completely honest has not played an actual game of magic yet, just goldfished.
I've talked about the new additions over the last few pages, but there's also a few returning veteran picks that are recontextualized by new cards.
Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper: starting with probably the least expected, Noyan Dar was in here for a while to let me make lands into creatures to go with March of the Machines and Opalescence, as well as a soft combo with Jeskai Ascendancy. The other major synergy at the time is Mirrorweave, which could make my army of lands big creatures with counters on top, or turn everyone else's creatures into non-creature lands, and then the rare but powerful 3-card trick of loading my lands with counters, then Mirrorweaving them into Crystalline Crawlers for a large influx of mana all at once.
With the addition of Narset's Reversal/Bonus Round or Leave // Chance/Lore Drakkis, Noyan Dar with Jeskai Ascendancy ascends to proper 4-card combo status, being able to cast instants on loop with Ascendency untapping my land creatures to pay for it. With Noyan Dar, I can turn Magosi into a creature, mutate Lore Drakkis onto it to recur either Savor the Moment or Chance for Glory, eat the conditional extra turn with Magosi, then take a full extra turn with Magosi returning itself and Lore Drakkis to hand. This loop still requires an untap mechanism, so it's a 5-card combo at best, but it's also one of the silliest things I've attempted, so I look forward to pulling it off. The other new land synergy worth mentioning is The Mycosynth Gardens, which after being loaded up with counters can transform itself into Walking Archive or Crystalline Crawler to use the counters. Other than that, Noyan Dar is a go wide strategy that works with Infinite Reflection and a legendary creature for Relic of Legends.
Vanish into Memory: both Mind Over Matter and Sea Gate Restoration have felt punishing at times when I let my hand dwindle, so I wanted to sneak another big draw spell back in. On top of all my old tricks, Vanish goes well with Noyan Dar for drawing a big pile of cards and discarding none, and it pairs with Stifle to exile a creature permanently and discard nothing as well.
Vedalken Orrery: Redundant with Leyline of Anticipation, but I've been wanting it back in since I started playing Sphinx of the Second Sun. It's also important for Rootha copying Turnabout. It lets me Savor the Moment before my real turn so that I can get the extra turn value without being tapped out for a round. It enables "fair Magosi", if I've got Orrery or Leyline and am just letting the table go around with my mana untapped and answers in hand, I can opt to skip my turn for 2 mana, and bank that turn for later when I'm ready to win.
Cursed Mirror: I just really like this card a lot. With Displacer Kitten, I can make Cursed Mirror + Cavalier of Dawn into the 4 card combo I always wanted by flickering Gilded Lotus. It's extra good with Crystalline Crawler, being really easy to net mana by casting with 3 colors and entering with haste. And then it sticks around as a mana rock for later.
In preparation to make the effort to update the first post of this thread, I have just a few pain points I want to address yet:
Lore Drakkis makes Rest in Peace awkward. Before Drakkis, my 4 cards that cared about the graveyard either weren't actually bothered (Time Spiral and Temporal Cascade) or were capable of removing RiP on their own (Leave // Chance and Cavalier of Dawn). This is the first card in recent memory to actually get blanked by RiP. I'm willing to accept this tension, as I do have 6 ways to clear the blockade, and Drakkis is equally awkward with Possibility Storm and Knowledge Pool, and it's not so different from March of the Machines giving Mirror of Fate summoning sickness, which I've lived with for like a decade.
I cut down to 34 lands again, cutting the red and white mythic double-faced lands, and while I'm hitting my land drops as well as I did before the double-faced lands existed, I kinda miss having Shatterskull Smashing // Shatterskull, the Hammer Pass to double fireball Swans of Bryn Argoll. So if there is one card looking in from the outside, that's the one.
With regards to the mana base, it's probably about time I fix it up. I've been playing with 3 piece cycles of the dual lands for however many years as though this is a jeskai deck, but the truth is that it's a blue deck splashing both red and white, and the biggest mana issue I hit is lacking blue mana. The fix here is for me to pick another type of dual land, and cut a couple boros lands for an azorius and an izzet instead.
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I've talked about the new additions over the last few pages, but there's also a few returning veteran picks that are recontextualized by new cards.
Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper: starting with probably the least expected, Noyan Dar was in here for a while to let me make lands into creatures to go with March of the Machines and Opalescence, as well as a soft combo with Jeskai Ascendancy. The other major synergy at the time is Mirrorweave, which could make my army of lands big creatures with counters on top, or turn everyone else's creatures into non-creature lands, and then the rare but powerful 3-card trick of loading my lands with counters, then Mirrorweaving them into Crystalline Crawlers for a large influx of mana all at once.
With the addition of Narset's Reversal/Bonus Round or Leave // Chance/Lore Drakkis, Noyan Dar with Jeskai Ascendancy ascends to proper 4-card combo status, being able to cast instants on loop with Ascendency untapping my land creatures to pay for it. With Noyan Dar, I can turn Magosi into a creature, mutate Lore Drakkis onto it to recur either Savor the Moment or Chance for Glory, eat the conditional extra turn with Magosi, then take a full extra turn with Magosi returning itself and Lore Drakkis to hand. This loop still requires an untap mechanism, so it's a 5-card combo at best, but it's also one of the silliest things I've attempted, so I look forward to pulling it off. The other new land synergy worth mentioning is The Mycosynth Gardens, which after being loaded up with counters can transform itself into Walking Archive or Crystalline Crawler to use the counters. Other than that, Noyan Dar is a go wide strategy that works with Infinite Reflection and a legendary creature for Relic of Legends.
Vanish into Memory: both Mind Over Matter and Sea Gate Restoration have felt punishing at times when I let my hand dwindle, so I wanted to sneak another big draw spell back in. On top of all my old tricks, Vanish goes well with Noyan Dar for drawing a big pile of cards and discarding none, and it pairs with Stifle to exile a creature permanently and discard nothing as well.
Vedalken Orrery: Redundant with Leyline of Anticipation, but I've been wanting it back in since I started playing Sphinx of the Second Sun. It's also important for Rootha copying Turnabout. It lets me Savor the Moment before my real turn so that I can get the extra turn value without being tapped out for a round. It enables "fair Magosi", if I've got Orrery or Leyline and am just letting the table go around with my mana untapped and answers in hand, I can opt to skip my turn for 2 mana, and bank that turn for later when I'm ready to win.
Cursed Mirror: I just really like this card a lot. With Displacer Kitten, I can make Cursed Mirror + Cavalier of Dawn into the 4 card combo I always wanted by flickering Gilded Lotus. It's extra good with Crystalline Crawler, being really easy to net mana by casting with 3 colors and entering with haste. And then it sticks around as a mana rock for later.
In preparation to make the effort to update the first post of this thread, I have just a few pain points I want to address yet:
Lore Drakkis makes Rest in Peace awkward. Before Drakkis, my 4 cards that cared about the graveyard either weren't actually bothered (Time Spiral and Temporal Cascade) or were capable of removing RiP on their own (Leave // Chance and Cavalier of Dawn). This is the first card in recent memory to actually get blanked by RiP. I'm willing to accept this tension, as I do have 6 ways to clear the blockade, and Drakkis is equally awkward with Possibility Storm and Knowledge Pool, and it's not so different from March of the Machines giving Mirror of Fate summoning sickness, which I've lived with for like a decade.
I cut down to 34 lands again, cutting the red and white mythic double-faced lands, and while I'm hitting my land drops as well as I did before the double-faced lands existed, I kinda miss having Shatterskull Smashing // Shatterskull, the Hammer Pass to double fireball Swans of Bryn Argoll. So if there is one card looking in from the outside, that's the one.
With regards to the mana base, it's probably about time I fix it up. I've been playing with 3 piece cycles of the dual lands for however many years as though this is a jeskai deck, but the truth is that it's a blue deck splashing both red and white, and the biggest mana issue I hit is lacking blue mana. The fix here is for me to pick another type of dual land, and cut a couple boros lands for an azorius and an izzet instead.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."