Henzie's Toolbox of Terror

yeti1069
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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

Retiring my Korvold deck, and pivoting to Henzie, and could use some feedback/input/help cutting cards (or adding overlooked stuff).

Henzie "Toolbox" Torre







Henzie's Toolbox of Terror

Commander

Artifacts

Lands

13 Forest (ust) 216
8 Mountain (ust) 215
12 Swamp (ust) 214
1 Blood Crypt (rna) 245
1 Bloodstained Mire (ktk) 230
1 Bojuka Bog (moc) 391
Approximate Total Cost:


My aims here are:
[*]Aggro
[*]Value
[*]Non-combo

I have to cut about 40 cards. That will come mostly from creatures, as my count there is excessive, obviously. Need to maintain some non-creature interaction, but will try to run a creature ahead of a noncreature when possible.

What looks superfluous? Weak?
Any obvious stuff I'm missing?
Last edited by yeti1069 10 months ago, edited 5 times in total.

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

(stream of consciousness rambling, very interesting deck)

What's the play pattern for Henzie? This is gonna sound weird but, is ramping Henzie out with mana dorks necessarily what you want to be doing? I was thinking that like, Henzie wants *big* mana so you can spam blitz a bunch of creatures and potentially recast Henzie after birthing podding/rushed rebirthing him into other creatures. Recasting Henzie 2-3 times might take more mana than manadorks can provide, and jamming him out on turn 2 into a sweeper might not be the best thing.

Maybe it'd be better to run only 2 cmc dorks that get cost reduced by Henzie so you can discount them out later and have a more resilient game. So cut all the birds/hierarch and try to get your sequencing to be like;

turn 1 tapped land or powerhouse 1 drop (stuff like Phyrexian Reclamation or Faithless Looting)
turn 2 ramp creature (or some Three Visits effects to fill it out)
turn 3 henzie + blitz a 2 drop
turn 4 go to nutsville

A lot of really fun Henzie effects like Crater Hellion / Massacre Girl type stuff are very anti-synergy with the 1 cmc mana dorks (because 1 cmc dorks make less mana per card)

The list of 2 cmc dudes that ramp I can think of; Primal Druid and Viridian Emissary might be fun too--better after henzie ofc.

In general I think that effects that pod Henzie are going to be superb as a ramp source as well, things like:
Birthing Pod Rushed Rebirth Eldritch Evolution

And Evolutionary Leap seems likely to be excellent in this deck too; you blitz a dude, leap it to draw a card and get a creature, etc. I really like that inclusion, and also Industrial Advancement! cool stuff.


The sequence of Imperial RecruiterDockside Extortionist for 1RR should end a lot of games if you went that route :P

I think Phyrexian Altar is also worth of inclusion with Ashnod's Altar -- anything you can do to turn your bodies into mana to cast more dudes and draw the cards early feels great.

Perilous Forays is likely to be exceptional endgame ramp too

Ohh, I really like Earthcraft and Cryptolith Rite and Song of Freyalise as ramp outlets -- if you can go:
-- play a dude, tap it for mana, sac it for card

re: interaction
I'm not sure you necessarily need to run a lot of non-creature interaction; just mix it up between activated abilities and etbs. I'd run stuff like Dire Fleet Daredevil and Dualcaster Mage shenanigans a lot too. Blitzing direfleet for R is just :chef's kiss:, and dualcaster discount is nice too.-

I'd play like universal stuff only -- Assassin's Trophy Chaos Warp and Beast Within -- because you can go way over the top of almost all creature effects, but you're gonna want to avoid probably graveyard hate and multispell hate, and combat step hate.


In general cards I think are cuttable are...anything expensive or that does not have cost reduction from Henzie.

Lightning Greaves seems pointless in this deck, if people kill Henzie "Toolbox" Torre that's fine for you, *especially* if you can sac him and reanimate him.

Oath of Ghouls / Oversold Cemetery feel like reasonable potential effects, since your blitz dudes come with a built in sac outlet -- Molten Primordial + Oversold Cemetery seems likely to end the game most of the time. especially if you have a sac outlet.

In general I think red's threaten effects on creatures are likely to be exceptional here, you're loaded with sac outlets and you are likely to be able to repeatedly cast them and draw cards off them dying.

Grave Pact effects are of course going to be mean.

Effects like Wake the Dead and then anything that mass jams creatures back in your hand are probably going to overperform too.

Dumb stuff like Empty the Catacombs or No Rest for the Wicked

I'm sure there are things I am not thinking of :P

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

pokken wrote:
10 months ago

stuff
Haven't played with Henzie at all yet, but I think the play pattern (with the dorks) is ramp into Henzie on 2, blitz a 4 mana creature on 3. Notably, there are a handful of 4 mana ramp creatures that should help get up to the bigger stuff the following turn.

I'm thinking I probably don't go out of my way to kill and recast Henzie, but he can provide extra value when he inevitably dies. Not sure if that's right, but I feel like what I want to be doing is blitzing 1 or 2 creatures out each turn, not recasting Henzie.

I used to run the creatures that get a land when they die in Meren, which has way more sac outlets, and doesn't care quite so much about the speed of the deck, and I felt like they were too slow/situational even there. Here, I don't actually have that many sac outlets (especially cheap ones), so these run the risk of not getting a land for too long.

Henzie only grants blitz to creatures CMC 4+. Can't blitz Recruiter or Dockside. Still, Docky should probably be in here.

I was hesitant about putting Greaves in, so they may get the axe when this actually gets assembled.

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

yeti1069 wrote:
10 months ago

Haven't played with Henzie at all yet, but I think the play pattern (with the dorks) is ramp into Henzie on 2, blitz a 4 mana creature on 3. Notably, there are a handful of 4 mana ramp creatures that should help get up to the bigger stuff the following turn.

I'm thinking I probably don't go out of my way to kill and recast Henzie, but he can provide extra value when he inevitably dies. Not sure if that's right, but I feel like what I want to be doing is blitzing 1 or 2 creatures out each turn, not recasting Henzie.

I used to run the creatures that get a land when they die in Meren, which has way more sac outlets, and doesn't care quite so much about the speed of the deck, and I felt like they were too slow/situational even there. Here, I don't actually have that many sac outlets (especially cheap ones), so these run the risk of not getting a land for too long.

Henzie only grants blitz to creatures CMC 4+. Can't blitz Recruiter or Dockside. Still, Docky should probably be in here.

I was hesitant about putting Greaves in, so they may get the axe when this actually gets assembled.
Oh dang, he doesn't give cheap creatures blitz? That makes mana dorks even worse, since you can't blitz them to draw a card. Should RTFM I should :) My eyes glazed over reading Blitz for the nth time. No idea why that abilityset gives me such glaze. And it makes the 2 cmc die-rampers really bad.

So with that in mind, I'm thinking dork into henzie into 4 drop feels like a really medium play pattern. That's stuff like Solemn Simulacrum I guess.

Gonna have to ruminate on that. I feel like leaving Henzie to swing in the breeze on turn 2 and then paying for that with having 10 mana dorks in your deck feels super unpleasant. Your turn 4 play of a 5 cmc dude had better be exceptional.

One thing that does spring to mind is Uncage the Menagerie for X=4 and Shared Summons are both going to be great.

I think the Oversold Cemetery / Phyrexian Reclamation soft lock stuff is probably going to be really good; where you like Massacre Girl or Crater Hellion every turn until people die of sadness.

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

I did just watch some gameplay with Henzie where Heartless Summoning did WORK. Not sure I want to take that penalty, but cost reducers definitely look like a good call. Goblin Anarchomancer benefits much of the deck. Not sure what else I'd run. There are the Monuments, but I don't think I want to spend 3 on the effect, and then they're kind of limited in their application.

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

Looking at cost reducers I'm seeing these options (am I missing any?):
Goblin Anarchomancer - applies to most of the deck including noncreatures (ramp/removal/setup), and helps pay for Henzie's commander tax, but excludes the small stuff that doesn't have a generic cost, colorless, or monoblack spells
Thunderscape Familiar - applies to most of the deck including noncreatures, and helps pay for Henzie's commander tax, but excludes the colorless and monored spells
Semblance Anvil - big discount for all my creatures for relatively cheap, but feels bad if it gets removed
Cloud Key - discount for all my creatures for relatively cheap
Heartless Summoning - big discount for all my creatures for cheap (cheapest!), but makes everyone smaller, and gets awkward with some of the 1-toughness creatures (would likely have to move away from dorks if playing this)
Conduit of Ruin - big discount for one creature/turn, but is itself expensive; tutors up a creature (currently only one in the maybes list)
Bard Class - significant discount (colored!) for most of my legendary creatures; some get a reduction of 1, some (including Henzie) get 2, but it costs to get there, and doesn't affect a lot of creatures in the deck
Defiler of Flesh - colored cost reducer with a decent effect, but can't target the blitzed creature; affects small number of creatures
Defiler of Instinct - colored cost reducer with a mediocre effect; affects moderate number of creatures
Defiler of Vigor - colored cost reducer with a strong effect, but can't boost the blitzed creature; affects largest number of creatures, including dorks
Ezzaroot Channeler - significant discount on its own, but can be pretty big with some support; comes down kind of late; can be used to put together big turns later
Gargos, Vicious Watcher - big discount, but not running enough hydras for it to be worthwhile (could change this?)
Goreclaw, Terror of Qal Sisma - significant discount for moderate cost, and has solid additional text
Bontu's Monument - discount for some creatures; decent secondary effect
Hazoret's Monument - discount for some creatures; decent secondary effect
Rhonas's Monument - discount for some creatures; strong secondary effect, but can't target the blitzed creature
Duskwatch Recruiter - awkward to get to the discount; decent front side effect
Marauding Raptor - discount for all my creatures for cheap cost; downside is slightly easier to work with than Heartless Summoning, since it allows window for activation, but kills even more stuff (actually beneficial in some cases)
Nylea, Keen-Eyed - discount for all my creatures on hard to remove piece with decent secondary text, a little on the high side CMC-wise
Shadow in the Warp - significant discount for 1 creature/turn; decent secondary text
Rakdos, Lord of Riots - potentially huge discount, but awkward to setup before combat
The Immortal Sun - discount for all my creatures; very good additional text, but comes late

Of these, I think the best are probably going to be: Goblin Anarchomancer, Thunderscape Familiar, Semblance Anvil, Cloud Key, Goreclaw, Marauding Raptor, Nylea. Can't realistically run all of these, so I'd probably be looking at Goblin, Familiar, Semblance, and Goreclaw. How does that look?

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

hmmm, I feel like personally I would rather ramp than reduce costs 1 -- so of those the only thing I like is Heartless Summoning. I think you will get spread too thin if you start trying to reduce costs, have good creatures to cast all the time, and then ramp into henzie, and have interaction and so on.

I'd consider some of the ones that reduce two or have other utility like Bard Class but definitely not Semblance Anvil which is card disadvantage and the second easiest thing to remove (artifacts are very vulnerable).

I think, like, philosophically, I would try to play endgame ramp effects I feel good about blitzing out. Stuff like Old Gnawbone and Ancient Copper Dragon are solid examples, but Cultivator Colossus is another one. I am sure there are a few other things. Blitzing Nyxbloom Ancient could be a pretty cool ritual effect in some instances, and Regal Behemoth might be OK if you're getting more discounts.

If you think about what these cost reducers are they are basically endgame ramp, since none of them curve into Henzie you're always going to have the tension of wanting to cast them before going off and then you have yet another setup turn.

So I guess I kinda also like the ones that curve into Henzie like Thunderscape Familiar, and Goblin Anarchomancer, those are *fine*. But not ramping into Henzie's first cast makes that awkward.

Those things are then vulnerable to removal, whereas if you just blitzed out things that ramped you got card draw for each one? I think that would be my shorthand: Endgame ramp should come from creatures you can blitz out :)

Oh, other ways to get endgame out of henzie might be to generate some Cascades, so creatures like Apex Devastator might be worth thinkin bout. Creatures that chain into other creatures are going to be really strong.

You can also think of Rise of the Dark Realms and Twilight's Call as end game ramp options, since your bin will likely be filled with big creatures

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

pokken wrote:
10 months ago
hmmm, I feel like personally I would rather ramp than reduce costs 1 -- so of those the only thing I like is Heartless Summoning. I think you will get spread too thin if you start trying to reduce costs, have good creatures to cast all the time, and then ramp into henzie, and have interaction and so on.

I'd consider some of the ones that reduce two or have other utility like Bard Class but definitely not Semblance Anvil which is card disadvantage and the second easiest thing to remove (artifacts are very vulnerable).

I think, like, philosophically, I would try to play endgame ramp effects I feel good about blitzing out. Stuff like Old Gnawbone and Ancient Copper Dragon are solid examples, but Cultivator Colossus is another one. I am sure there are a few other things. Blitzing Nyxbloom Ancient could be a pretty cool ritual effect in some instances, and Regal Behemoth might be OK if you're getting more discounts.

If you think about what these cost reducers are they are basically endgame ramp, since none of them curve into Henzie you're always going to have the tension of wanting to cast them before going off and then you have yet another setup turn.

So I guess I kinda also like the ones that curve into Henzie like Thunderscape Familiar, and Goblin Anarchomancer, those are *fine*. But not ramping into Henzie's first cast makes that awkward.

Those things are then vulnerable to removal, whereas if you just blitzed out things that ramped you got card draw for each one? I think that would be my shorthand: Endgame ramp should come from creatures you can blitz out :)

Oh, other ways to get endgame out of henzie might be to generate some Cascades, so creatures like Apex Devastator might be worth thinkin bout. Creatures that chain into other creatures are going to be really strong.

You can also think of Rise of the Dark Realms and Twilight's Call as end game ramp options, since your bin will likely be filled with big creatures
I don't know why the list here isn't auto-sorting (can click to do it), but Apex is on there for that reason, yeah. Both Etalis, Kodama, Ancient Brass, Emergent Woodwurm, and Giant Adephage all kind of chain into other stuff in one way or another. The options for granting cascade all basic mean taking a turn off blitzing to run out an enchantment of 5+ mana.

Heartless Summoning is the best reducer in terms of discount and cost, but the downside strikes me as being significant. Blitzing out big creatures feels like it becomes less significant when those big creatures aren't quite so big. That may not be the right call, if I'm blitzing 2-4/turn, but that's my initial thought. It also is a big nonbo with mana dorks and a few of the cards I'd want in the list. I think I'd start with the Goblin and the Kavu and see how they play.

In terms of "late game" or post-Henzie ramp, I have a few options there that are lower to the ground: Solemn, Primeval Herald (if it can attack, it's basically better than Solemn, but nonbos somewhat with Heartless), and Seedguide Ash. Cultivator Colossus was one I was looking at, but didn't want to buy until I have a better sense of the deck since it's kind of pricey, and Ancient Copper is out of budget for the time being. I was thinking about Old Gnawbone. I'd looked at Nyxbloom and Regal, but I'd need quite a bit of mana available for Nyxbloom to become a ritual (assuming just a discount of 1, it's 6 mana to blitz, and even if I'm at 7, I don't know that 3 more mana makes it worth losing it at EOT). Regal is in kind of the same boat. My assumption is that my creatures will rarely be sticking around past my end step, so creatures with effects that really want them to stick around for a while feel like they don't belong.

Semblance IS card disadvantage, yeah, but the hope/aim is to be churning through the deck pretty effectively with basically every creature at CMC4+ being a cantrip, and eventually going card positive on those with a few different pieces in the deck. It being vulnerable to removal (and being 2-for-1ed), is why I'm on the fence about it. I don't love that none of the reducers benefit the first drop of Henzie, but they probably replace mana dorks, so the 2-mana ones at least still curve nicely. I do think reducers will ultimately be more effective than straight ramp for having bigger turns, since they are effectively +2 or +3 mana vs the +1 from most ramp...if I'm actually dropping those 2+ creatures/turn.

Rise of the Dark Realms is a strong possibility IF I find that I'm often getting to the mana to cast it. If games are ending sooner, or I'm plateauing before I get to the mana cost for it, I'm not going to bother adding it in, but it could be strong here. I'm always a little hesitant about running symmetrical mass recursion without a fair amount of graveyard alongside to ensure I'm not getting blown out by my own spell, but it's a possibility with the card quality of my creatures here. Living Death is certainly an inclusion.

Still need to cut like 40 cards to get this playable.

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

before saying anything, I really really lik eGwenna, Eyes of Gaea that's a sweet inclusion. don't cut it even if it's bad curve and stuff.

Cut wise, I think;

Ruthlessly trim any creatures you can't blitz that don't accelerate your game meaningfully. non-blitzable enablers like Ayara, Widow of the Realm // Ayara, Furnace Queen feel MEH to me.

Ruthlessly trim blitz creatuers that don't:
1) Ramp
2) Draw cards
3) creature virtual of the above by extra combat steps

Ruthlessly trim >4 cmc creatures, since 4 is the magic spot for Henzie maximum value (4 → 3 is a bigger cost reduction than 5-4).

Ruthlessly trim anything that doesn't take maximum advantage of Henzie when he's been cast 3 times (so less than 3 generic mana is on the axe block)


Specific cards I think are really iffy:

Giant Adephage
Emergent Woodwurm
Wood Elves - 3 drops are the worst in this deck.
Daemogoth Woe-Eater feels cute.

Trim cute non-creature enablers
Sundial of the Infinite is *cute* and maybe situationally strong, but I think you should build with the idea that the creatures are going to die, to limit the requirement of Christmas miracles.
Shadow in the Warp you're really wanting to storm off and 3 is a bad cmc
Farseek and Rampant Growth are bad cards that are bad and don't fit with your ramp profile at all.
Victimize is expensive and bad
Find // Finality feels just meh, you can do this with a creature
Blasphemous Act is a great magic card, but I think you can find something synergistic that doesn't kill all your mana dorks
Damnation feels MEH.
Lurking Predators is just mindless goodstuff that requires you to tap out, pass the turn and then be archenemy for a turn cycle. it's like a more expensive bad version of Defense of the Heart which is already a bad card.
Journey to Eternity // Atzal, Cave of Eternity feels *okay* but fine to cut
Lightning Greaves is just nothingburger in this deck
Arcane Signet nothingburger, is that what you wanna be doing on turn 2?
Archon of Cruelty is strong but very slow and expensive for a double edict and blast for 6.


--

I'd give some thought to adding Renata, Called to the Hunt; she's a blitzable combo outlet with Woodfall Primus and Viscera Seer that synergizes fairly strongly with persist if you decide to usea bit more of that (Cauldron of Souls is an actually super strong enabler). With two henzie casts, a combo turn of B, GG, 3GGG feels super attainable.

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

I was just slashing and burning a bunch of stuff, and a lot of your suggestions aligned.

I'll try cutting a bunch of that stuff, but it seems almost blasphemous to me (pun somewhat intended) to cut the 2 mana ramp. It doesn't get my to Henzie, obviously, but does get me to the more expensive stuff.
I do think I need to have some board wipes in here, especially since I don't foresee maintaining much board presence. Open to better suggestions than Damnation, BAct, and Finality.

Victimize is an iffy cut. That card can be pretty bonkers, although I don't cheat fatties into the yard earlier like in a typical reanimator deck, so it may not be quite as good here. Still, 3 mana to return 2 creatures from the yard is very strong.

I was looking hard at Ayara, but I feel like having Fling (of sorts...CMC instead of power) on a stick is going to be decent here, the life gain could certainly be helpful, and the backside (which is a reasonable cost to get to) provides repeated reanimation, which should be welcome here. She might be awkward to get out, however.

I'm thinking I may drop Woodfall Primus for the time being, as 8 mana is a lot for the body/effect unless I have a combo piece available. Without tutors and only 1 (2 if including Renata) piece available, I don't see that coming up often enough.

I'd been thinking of Cauldron, but felt like 5 mana might be a bit much for the effect here. It would be quite strong, though, so it's a consideration.

Side note: I wish there was a better way to export from Moxfield to make a decklist here. Mox is so much easier to work with for editing/maintaining a list, but going back and forth here is annoying.

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

Looking at the 1-mana land enchants: Wild Growth and Utopia Sprawl either in addition to, or replacing a couple mana dorks. Utopia will depend upon how many actual forests I end up with in the deck. Thinking 2 shocks, 1 Triome, 7 fetches, X basics. Don't own any of the ABUR duals, and don't think I want to go deeper on ETB tapped lands than the single Triome.

Not sure what the right number is to make Utopia Sprawl worth running.
Also, if that goes in, Arbor Elf probably should too.

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

yeti1069 wrote:
10 months ago
Looking at the 1-mana land enchants: Wild Growth and Utopia Sprawl either in addition to, or replacing a couple mana dorks. Utopia will depend upon how many actual forests I end up with in the deck. Thinking 2 shocks, 1 Triome, 7 fetches, X basics. Don't own any of the ABUR duals, and don't think I want to go deeper on ETB tapped lands than the single Triome.

Not sure what the right number is to make Utopia Sprawl worth running.
Also, if that goes in, Arbor Elf probably should too.
The general rule of thumb I use is ~15 forests or forest analogues to run sprawl (so 10 fetches + 5 fetchable forests does it)

This deck should probably be close to 21 green sources and most of those should be forests, if you're looking to cast a mana dork on turn 1 most games.

I could be messing up the shorthand but those numbers have usually served me pretty well :P

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

pokken wrote:
10 months ago
yeti1069 wrote:
10 months ago
Looking at the 1-mana land enchants: Wild Growth and Utopia Sprawl either in addition to, or replacing a couple mana dorks. Utopia will depend upon how many actual forests I end up with in the deck. Thinking 2 shocks, 1 Triome, 7 fetches, X basics. Don't own any of the ABUR duals, and don't think I want to go deeper on ETB tapped lands than the single Triome.

Not sure what the right number is to make Utopia Sprawl worth running.
Also, if that goes in, Arbor Elf probably should too.
The general rule of thumb I use is ~15 forests or forest analogues to run sprawl (so 10 fetches + 5 fetchable forests does it)
Thanks. Then the question becomes, does that replace a dork (Llanowar Elves), a cost reducer (Thunderscape), or something else? And if I'm including those, does it make sense to also include Arbor Elf?

OR if I drop 2 dorks for 2 enchantments, would it make sense to go Heartless Summoning and just drop the rest of the dorks (and accept that sometimes my small number of x/1s just die immediately)?

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

I edited the decklist in the first post to reflect the current state of the list. Down to 104 cards. So need 4 more cuts (and may make some adjustments based on the enchantments decision).

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

It depends on how many 1 drop ramps you want, fundamentally. For me, I would replace a dork that only makes G, because I tend to not play those ever outside of mono-green since they don't fix mana. But I'm extra cranky about that stuff lol :) I like Wild Growth because it can be mana neutral, and Utopia Sprawl cos it fixes.

If you want maximal chance of hitting t2 henzie then you gotta cut another ramp source or another bomb/enabler.

Of the remaining creatures, Zopandrel, Hunger Dominus strikes me as fairly medium.

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

pokken wrote:
10 months ago
It depends on how many 1 drop ramps you want, fundamentally. For me, I would replace a dork that only makes G, because I tend to not play those ever outside of mono-green since they don't fix mana. But I'm extra cranky about that stuff lol :) I like Wild Growth because it can be mana neutral, and Utopia Sprawl cos it fixes.

If you want maximal chance of hitting t2 henzie then you gotta cut another ramp source or another bomb/enabler.

Of the remaining creatures, Zopandrel, Hunger Dominus strikes me as fairly medium.
I agree about Zopandrel, and feel the same way about Kogla and Yidaro, but I just got them and want to try them out. They're definitely on the chopping block for potential cuts.

I think cutting 2 dorks for the enchantment ramp is the right call.


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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

I don't mean to be a stickler but does your 100 cards include Henzie?

...ain't nothing worse than having to remember to make one more cut to include your commander:P

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

pokken wrote:
10 months ago
I don't mean to be a stickler but does your 100 cards include Henzie?

...ain't nothing worse than having to remember to make one more cut to include your commander:P
Evidently not. Good catch. Suggestions for the final cut?

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

Zopandrel still is my least favorite creature. Other than that, Victimize. I don't know that I Have cast that card in the last like..8 years :P

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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

pokken wrote:
10 months ago
Zopandrel still is my least favorite creature. Other than that, Victimize. I don't know that I Have cast that card in the last like..8 years :P
So...Moxfield is showing 100 cards, and the list here is showing 99, but I'm counting 101...so confused.

As for Victimize...I cast it all the time in Sefris, and cast it regularly in Korvold. I've looped it with Eternal Witness, Dockside, a sac outlet, and some tokens (not infinite, but that didn't matter). If I cast it in Sefris early (turn 2 is my earliest) it's basically GG. I don't understand how you're rating this card so low.

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Post by pokken » 10 months ago

yeti1069 wrote:
10 months ago
So...Moxfield is showing 100 cards, and the list here is showing 99, but I'm counting 101...so confused.

As for Victimize...I cast it all the time in Sefris, and cast it regularly in Korvold. I've looped it with Eternal Witness, Dockside, a sac outlet, and some tokens (not infinite, but that didn't matter). If I cast it in Sefris early (turn 2 is my earliest) it's basically GG. I don't understand how you're rating this card so low.
It just always feels to me like when I have it in my hand it rots because I'd rather do something else, but yeah it's pretty good with the loops for sure.

Wouldn't you rather cast a discounted blitz creature that does something similar? That's where I usually end up with it.

E-wit loops/Timeless wit loops seem fine I guess.

For me though, the combination of "i have a thing i don't care about or want to sacrifice, *and* two things I want to reanimate, *and* this is better than doing anything else in my hand" doesn't happen that much?

This deck does jam a lot more things in the yard though so maybe it'll be great?

yeti1069
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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

pokken wrote:
10 months ago
yeti1069 wrote:
10 months ago
So...Moxfield is showing 100 cards, and the list here is showing 99, but I'm counting 101...so confused.

As for Victimize...I cast it all the time in Sefris, and cast it regularly in Korvold. I've looped it with Eternal Witness, Dockside, a sac outlet, and some tokens (not infinite, but that didn't matter). If I cast it in Sefris early (turn 2 is my earliest) it's basically GG. I don't understand how you're rating this card so low.
It just always feels to me like when I have it in my hand it rots because I'd rather do something else, but yeah it's pretty good with the loops for sure.

Wouldn't you rather cast a discounted blitz creature that does something similar? That's where I usually end up with it.

E-wit loops/Timeless wit loops seem fine I guess.

For me though, the combination of "i have a thing i don't care about or want to sacrifice, *and* two things I want to reanimate, *and* this is better than doing anything else in my hand" doesn't happen that much?

This deck does jam a lot more things in the yard though so maybe it'll be great?
I suspect that I'll have plenty of big value in the yard, and stuff to sac (even a blitzed creature after combat). I don't think I've ever found Victimize to not be huge value.

yeti1069
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Post by yeti1069 » 10 months ago

Made some edits to the list, and finally got some games in.

Wow! This deck is silly. In the handful of games I've played, I've seen half of my deck or more in almost all of them (outside of 2 really %$#% games).

The play pattern for Henzie is pretty straight-forward, and while I'm not closing games out quickly, and can end up with a lot of triggers, it feels less durdly/more proactive than Korvold had. This deck also does more to slow opponents than my Korvold deck did, with plenty of removal stapled to creatures.

Victimize has been fantastic every time I've drawn it, including one play where I sacrificed something to Greater Good to pitch Ziatora, then played a mana dork as fodder for Victimize to bring back Ziatora and a Rampant Rejuvenator I had blitzed out the previous turn. Notably, with blitzing being the preferred way to play creatures, the ability to reanimate some cards to the battlefield after they go to the bin is valuable, as there are some bodies I actually want on board from turn to turn.

I think I need more graveyard hate, as I've had two games where I drew Living Death, but never cast it, because opponents had too much value in their yards. In one of those games, the Chatterfang player had several combo pieces (that I had been removing) in the yard, and would have had an infinite combo as soon as everything came in.

Zopandrel has been pretty decent, and has helped close out the game a few times. A highlight was blitzing it out along with an Ancient Brass Dragon, swinging the latter in for 14 damage in the air, then sacrificing it to the Disciple of Bolas it reanimated to draw 14 cards and gain 14 life. Still, this is likely to get cut for something else.

Kogla and Yidaro has felt underwhelming. I've never wanted to Pod for it, and have looked at it in hand and felt underwhelmed a few times. It would almost certainly be better as Kogla, the Titan Ape to fight, swing, and remove an artifact or enchantment, rather than having to decide whether I want to fight or remove a permanent. That said, it having 1 more toughness was relevant in the last game I played, where it fought a 6/6 and survived to swing the next turn. Still, 4 mana to Naturalize is a lot, even if it is virtually uncounterable and a cantrip.

Apex Devastator I've only seen once...and it was put into play by Gamekeeper. That felt bad, although someone wasted a piece of removal on it, so there was that.

Ilharg, the Raze-Boar has been surprisingly underwhelming. I think I've just ended up getting it in situations where I either need the card draw from blitz, or had creatures with attack triggers, or had Zopandrel, and I didn't want the creature Ilharg would drop to miss out on the doubling. Will give it some more time, but may end up cutting this.

Rise of the Dark Realms is being strongly considered, as I've gotten to the requisite mana every game, and it doesn't come with the inherent vulnerability of Living Death.

As far as board wipes go, I've had Blasphemous Act come up a few times, but have only cast it once, as I've often had the strongest board. I've cast Massacre Girl once, and it did its thing. Had the one player try to play around it by removing all the x/1s before she came in, but they forgot that I had two blitzers (including MG) that were going to die at EOT to trigger her again anyway. BA feels like it's necessary just in case, but will get played less often here than in some of my other decks, I think.

Have not missed mana rocks at all!
Have not really missed having more sacrifice outlets.
Have not really missed Garruk's Uprising (all my copies were in other decks and I didn't get around to proxying) nor The Great Henge (ditto).

Goreclaw, Terror of Qal Sisma, Junji, the Midnight Sky, Combustible Gearhulk, Homura, Human Ascendant // Homura's Essence, Kodama of the East Tree, and Treeshaker Chimera have all performed better than I'd hoped. Goreclaw in particular has both been a solid hard cast, and an incredible blitz on later turns to snowball into big plays--of real note was its helping me hard cast Mikaeus. Plus, the boost and trample have been very relevant.

Junji has facilitated many big plays, and helps establish a board state.

Gearhulk has been great in my Osgir deck, where I almost prefer the mill. Here, I basically always want the draw, BUT the mill can be very dangerous. Have gotten the draw here more often than expected out of fear, made more relevant by pressuring life totals already.

Homura really boosts the rest of the deck, and turns even my dorks and Henzie into actual threats, while also ensuring the rest of my team is connecting for real damage.

Kodama is NUTS (as everyone knows). Here, it feels even more so, since most of what I'm casting is discounted. I initially thought I'd rarely want to blitz it, but I have a couple times now. Like Junji and Mikaeus it helps build board presence, and helps get the non-blitzes pieces into play without sacrificing tempo.

Treeshaker I used as a single-player board wipe on back-to-back turns (thanks Chainer!), and drew 8 cards off of it.

Chromaticus
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Post by Chromaticus » 10 months ago

I gave away my Henzie "Toolbox" Torre deck to a friend that has since moved away. Heartless Summoning always did work whenever it showed up, and I loved playing Kokusho, the Evening Star for the nostalgia.

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