Unreleased and New Card Discussion

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ZenN
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Post by ZenN » 9 months ago

When I use DFCs, I always just use the appropriate checklist card, and then keep the actual card in a clear Dragonshield, in the box of tokens I keep with my decks (which are all also in clear Dragonshields, with two tokens per sleeve back to back, except the few that are themselves double faced).
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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 9 months ago

Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
So the new Vorinclex is kinda neat. Although I guess its most likely use is planeswalker nonsense. Probably nothing that actually interests me but I'm at least glad he's not as all-purpose obnoxious as the old one.

Boast looks like a pretty...uh....ugly mechanic to me. Hopefully it plays better than it reads because it reads like crap. I guess you chain a bunch of boasts together to pump up their power? Or you just have one random ball lightning or something with high power to get the chain going? Idk, I'm not sold yet.

The other leaks look fine I guess, the one-per-name is definitely a major restriction on the saga but it might make it more interesting. And blessings of frost confirms we've got snow back again. Didn't see that one coming tbh.
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Post by ilovesaprolings » 9 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
9 months ago
Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
So the new Vorinclex is kinda neat. Although I guess its most likely use is planeswalker nonsense. Probably nothing that actually interests me but I'm at least glad he's not as all-purpose obnoxious as the old one.
Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
watch out as i kill you with cumulative upkeep and Nine Lives

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Post by BeneTleilax » 9 months ago

Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
I'm hoping in light of this and the return of Poison that we'll get a poison deck that isn't blistering voltron aggro. Phyrexian Swarmlord always felt like the kind of bad rare that should have a place in casual EDH.
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benjameenbear
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Post by benjameenbear » 9 months ago

Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
Maybe we'll finally figure out who's the leader of the Phyrexians. I can see the new Vorinclex as a kind of Vanguard leader, similar to what Phyrexia did with via Tsabo Tavoc and Dominaria during the Invasion block. I also like that the Praetor cycle looks like it will follow a one-sided benefit for its controller and an opposite effect for all opponents, similar to what they did with the original Praetor cycle.

And, maybe if we're SUPER lucky, we'll finally get a 5CC Phyrexian legend. Atraxa is hella cool, but I'd rather have something a little more innocuous as the Commander so I can create the Ultimate Phyrexian Primer to complement my Yawgmoth Primer.

Can't wait to see if Jin-Gitaxias is back...

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Post by JWK » 9 months ago

Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
Obviously Vorinclex's presence in this set is a teaser of things to come. With Bolas and the Eldrazi off the table for awhile, we are going back to the modern version of the game's original big bads, the Phyrexians. Is Vorinclex a scout or part of an advance wave for a multiversal invasion? Will we get a new Atraxa card? Where do Ashiok (who learned of the Phyrexians from Elspeth's nightmares) and Tezzeret fit into all this? Time will tell, I suppose.
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Serenade
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Post by Serenade » 9 months ago

Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
TOSKI, YES! Can't wait for the inevitable, ineffable Phyrexian squirrels upcoming. =P
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Post by BeneTleilax » 9 months ago

Oh hey, harder to answer Edric. Four drops that draw you cards the turn they are cast should not be both uncounterable and indestructible.
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Mookie
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Post by Mookie » 9 months ago

Toski, Bearer of Secrets looks adorable. Huzzah for the legendary squirrel!

Indestructible + can't be countered is certainly interesting, but in the command zone I would say Edric, Spymaster of Trest is significantly stronger, mostly due to access to blue mana. Green has way less evasion available (no Flying Men), which makes the card draw less consistent. Still, I assume there are some interesting ways to take advantage of the indestructibility.... although as a 1/1 with no evasion, voltron seems unlikely. Lure effects could be fun though.

Toski does look better in the 99, but there is also a lot more competition there - beyond Edric, you also need to compete with Keeper of Fables, Ohran Frostfang, Coastal Piracy, and a few others. Hard to say whether being indestructible makes it harder to kill than an enchantment. Still, being a creature is a big upside for some decks - I'm currently running Edric in my Animar deck, and would certainly consider making the swap there due to Toski having one less color pip.... plus having an indestructible draw engine seems pretty useful.

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Serenade
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Post by Serenade » 9 months ago

Keeper has that "one or more" phrasing, so I think Toski will replace it except in Cat decks.

I always liked the little green dudes in Edric (which are almost all worse than the blue ones) and wished I could build a deck around them. This is maybe the best option to lead it!
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Post by MAGUSZANIN » 9 months ago

Just being able to wrath, swing in, and draw an extra card makes this thing super valuable.

Great Design, I'll take a couple for various decks and I'll get good use out of it.

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Post by 3drinks » 9 months ago

Waiting for that deranged hermit spike in 3...2...1...

edit: I see I'm too late on that one. Damn it, r/mtgfinance sharks..............
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Post by BeneTleilax » 9 months ago

I think y'all are underestimating the power of his Indestructible. Wraths have always been the main weakness of Edric, and coming out ahead on all the popular wraths save Merciless Eviction and Toxic Deluge is a major advantage. Not to mention, in green, 4 drops easily come down turn 3. You have less evasion, but I think the resilience to wraths allows Toski to go in a much wider tokenswarm strategy that pushes through defenses on sheer numbers.
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Serenade
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Post by Serenade » 9 months ago

Yeah, they need to cut back on abilities.
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JWK
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Post by JWK » 9 months ago

Serenade wrote:
9 months ago
Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
TOSKI, YES! Can't wait for the inevitable, ineffable Phyrexian squirrels upcoming. =P
Unofficial Spoiler Discussion
They need to make Phyrexian Squirrel Nest. Just like the original, but when you tap it, it makes a 1/1 squirrel horror with infect.
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Serenade
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Post by Serenade » 9 months ago

Just saw the alt art on Toski (I didn't like that border on anything until now), and does THAT SQUIRREL HAVE A ROBOT CLAW?! This set is pretty metal.
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Post by Wallycaine » 9 months ago

Serenade wrote:
9 months ago
Just saw the alt art on Toski (I didn't like that border on anything until now), and does THAT SQUIRREL HAVE A ROBOT CLAW?! This set is pretty metal.
Yep! It's more a basic prothesis than a robot hand, but it's definitely there. It's on the normal art as well, but harder to see at card size. You can see it pretty well on the full size art, though:

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Post by NZB2323 » 9 months ago

BeneTleilax wrote:
9 months ago
I think y'all are underestimating the power of his Indestructible. Wraths have always been the main weakness of Edric, and coming out ahead on all the popular wraths save Merciless Eviction and Toxic Deluge is a major advantage. Not to mention, in green, 4 drops easily come down turn 3. You have less evasion, but I think the resilience to wraths allows Toski to go in a much wider tokenswarm strategy that pushes through defenses on sheer numbers.
Blue can counter wraths, and there's plenty of cards that indestructible doesn't help against:
Also if a player plays a wrath Toski is the only one to survive, and Edric comes down on turn 2 most games.

Additionally extra turns is sick in Edric.

Furthermore, Edric is political and encourages your opponents to attack each other.
Last edited by NZB2323 9 months ago, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by RxPhantom » 9 months ago

How big is Toski, Bearer of Secrets, and who braids his hair? And why is it braided? Did Toski request it, or did some god or demigod take it to Kaldheim Petco? I demand a legendary squirrel groomer!
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ISBPathfinder
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Post by ISBPathfinder » 9 months ago

So, the squirrel is cool but I really wish it did something...... a little more squirrel tribal related than just like random beaters related. It also reminds me a little too much of Edric, Spymaster of Trest for my liking. Granted, you lose a lot of good flyers, counter magic, and extra turns but it still looks suspiciously like Edric to me.
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Post by Wallycaine » 9 months ago

ISBPathfinder wrote:
9 months ago
So, the squirrel is cool but I really wish it did something...... a little more squirrel tribal related than just like random beaters related. It also reminds me a little too much of Edric, Spymaster of Trest for my liking. Granted, you lose a lot of good flyers, counter magic, and extra turns but it still looks suspiciously like Edric to me.
At this point, it'd be very difficult to get a squirrel tribal card into standard, since there's almost no other squirrels being printed. Combine that with the fact that Norse Mythology has a specific squirrel they're referencing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ratatoskr) that's associated with secrets, and giving it a mass curiosity effect makes the most sense from a design perspective. If/when squirrels being back in black border is an established enough thing that they can print multiples in most sets through the year, that's when I'd expect them to tackle making a Squirrel Tribal commander.

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Post by ilovesaprolings » 9 months ago

ISBPathfinder wrote:
9 months ago
So, the squirrel is cool but I really wish it did something...... a little more squirrel tribal related than just like random beaters related.
It's super synergic with tokens. I don't think they could have done a better "squirrel" effect without making it extremely parasitic

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Post by Toshi » 8 months ago

As a seasoned Edric, Spymaster of Trest player, i find the comparison to be ludicrous.
If the argument is, that you're "only losing Extra Turn Spells, Counters, 20+ great evasive 1 Drops etc", read that sentence again, slowly.
Now, in another timeline, where Toski, Bearer of Secrets and Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive were to partner, it would've been a cool, casual alternative pairing to the brokenness that Edric allows. But since they never will, Toski is a solid green draw engine, in a pool of solid green draw engines... i would run Ohran Frostfang over it anytime. With blue in the mix Reconnaissance Mission, Coastal Piracy, Bident of Thassa and possibly Kindred Discovery are plenty to consider not running it at all.

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Post by pokken » 8 months ago

NoNeedToBragoBoutIt wrote:
8 months ago
As a seasoned Edric, Spymaster of Trest player, i find the comparison to be ludicrous.
If the argument is, that you're "only losing Extra Turn Spells, Counters, 20+ great evasive 1 Drops etc", read that sentence again, slowly.
Now, in another timeline, where Toski, Bearer of Secrets and Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive were to partner, it would've been a cool, casual alternative pairing to the brokenness that Edric allows. But since they never will, Toski is a solid green draw engine, in a pool of solid green draw engines... i would run Ohran Frostfang over it anytime. With blue in the mix Reconnaissance Mission, Coastal Piracy, Bident of Thassa and possibly Kindred Discovery are plenty to consider not running it at all.
As a card I think you're underrating it. Indestructible is a hellofa keyword and being on an uncounterable creature you can gsz chord or survival for is great. It's cheaper than frostfang and less pip restrictive.

This would be my first pick for this effect in any creature deck. Recon and piracy can't attack the guy with no blockers to draw a card. They buns in comparison

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Post by Wallycaine » 8 months ago

pokken wrote:
8 months ago
NoNeedToBragoBoutIt wrote:
8 months ago
As a seasoned Edric, Spymaster of Trest player, i find the comparison to be ludicrous.
If the argument is, that you're "only losing Extra Turn Spells, Counters, 20+ great evasive 1 Drops etc", read that sentence again, slowly.
Now, in another timeline, where Toski, Bearer of Secrets and Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive were to partner, it would've been a cool, casual alternative pairing to the brokenness that Edric allows. But since they never will, Toski is a solid green draw engine, in a pool of solid green draw engines... i would run Ohran Frostfang over it anytime. With blue in the mix Reconnaissance Mission, Coastal Piracy, Bident of Thassa and possibly Kindred Discovery are plenty to consider not running it at all.
As a card I think you're underrating it. Indestructible is a hellofa keyword and being on an uncounterable creature you can gsz chord or survival for is great. It's cheaper than frostfang and less pip restrictive.

This would be my first pick for this effect in any creature deck. Recon and piracy can't attack the guy with no blockers to draw a card. They buns in comparison
I think there's a fair argument to run Ohran Frostfang first, as that deathtouch is a great way to get extra value or get through on attacks you shouldn't, for only 1 mana more. I do agree that this is probably worth running over the various enchantment versions, with the possible exception of Kindred Discovery in a tribal deck.

That said, I do agree that the comparison to Edric in the command zone isn't a favorable one to Toski. I think Toski's stronger in the 99, and can probably make for a fun Edric-lite if you want to take him in that direction, but in general the decks aren't really going to be comparable. Edric's colors are just much stronger for the effect.

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