Unreleased and New Card Discussion

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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 7 months ago

UnfulfilledDesires wrote:
7 months ago
You don't need two bouncelands. With Amulet of Vigor on the battlefield, if you play Gruul Turf, two abilities trigger. You put the return a land trigger on the bottom of the stack & resolve Amulet's untap first. Before resolving the return trigger, you tap Turf for mana. In this scenario, each land drop equals RG.

If I didn't want to make the most out of bad cards, I wouldn't play casual EDH!
Ah, yes, that's correct. I'm dumb. Although considering the utility of braingeyser-with-extra-steps goes down the more colors you add (blue and black are probably straight out since they can draw so much more efficiently so you've gotta be in naya or less, and honestly even green will almost always have more powerful options without loads of synergy) it's still nearly a 3-card combo. And idk how often you'd want to run amulet outside of landfall decks.

I can appreciate wanting to make use of bad cards - I guess the question of which bad cards are worthy of making the most of is a matter of personal preference. This one doesn't do anything for me, personally.

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Post by Atraxian » 7 months ago

A little late to the party, but I love how Skyclave Relic is a strictly better Darksteel Ingot.
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JWK
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Post by JWK » 7 months ago

BeneTleilax wrote:
7 months ago
Well, Scute Swarm goes quite handily into most Ashaya lists, I imagine. If nothing else, it's absurd ramp.
That card makes me chuckle. It's not actually good, but it's pretty fun.
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tstorm823
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Post by tstorm823 » 7 months ago

Oh Glasspool Mimic, you're so... so modular! *swoons*
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Post by ilovesaprolings » 7 months ago

tstorm823 wrote:
7 months ago
Oh Glasspool Mimic, you're so... so modular! *swoons*
Make me wish they put the "except it's a pirate in addition to its other types" clause on Protean Raider.

By the way, Lithoform Engine is the best thing that happened to the format since years, and not because of the card itself, but because finally they are printing some copy tokens!
Last edited by ilovesaprolings 7 months ago, edited 1 time in total.

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tstorm823
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Post by tstorm823 » 7 months ago

ilovesaprolings wrote:
7 months ago
Make me wish they put the "except it's a pirate in addition to its other types" clause on Protean Raider.
You know what's funny? Sakashima the Impostor is a clone that is also a rogue, and while it keeps its name instead of its creature types, it's the rare clone that has power and toughness so you can just cast it blank, so we actually have two cards in the "rogue clone tribal" pile.
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Post by Mookie » 7 months ago

Ancient Greenwarden seems like a very potent landfall enabler. Hard to say exactly how it compares to Ramunap Excavator and Crucible of Worlds, but I'm not going to complain about some additional redundancy. Unlike those, Greenwarden can also function as a beater, which is sort of nice. On the other hand, it's also significantly more expensive. Hmmm... Still, I've enjoyed Greenwarden of Murasa as a beefier Eternal Witness, so it does have a good pedigree.

Agadeem's Awakening is the black member of the untapped cycle. Hard to evaluate. If you're casting it for a small number, it looks pretty bad - four mana to reanimate a 1-drop or five mana for a 1-drop and a 2-drop is underwhelming. On the other hand, if you're at the point in the lategame where you have 8+ mana available and don't need to play extra lands anymore, this looks significantly better. As with the others, low opportunity cost, etc.

Glasspool Mimic does look quite good. I've considered Mirror Image in the past, but shied away due to it being a bit situational. Having an alternate mode when I don't have anything worth copying makes it look a lot better.

Felidar Retreat is a very solid anthem / token producer / landfall payoff. Like Retreat to Emeria, but waaaaaay better.

Shadow's Verdict is... interesting. I don't think it's good, since killing big things is important, but could be interesting tech for some metas if there are lots of tokens running around. Seems more like a Standard card though.

Grakmaw, Skyclave Ravager looks cute. Grows big and leaves a friend behind when it dies. Seems like a solid inclusion for +1/+1 counter decks.

Skyclave Shade is.... not the Bloodghast reprint I was hoping for. Alas.

Scute Swarm is also adorable, because exponential growth is fair and reasonable.

Ondu Inversion is a potent Planar Cleansing variant. Hour of Revelation is probably still the best of these, but flexibility is good.

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Sagharri
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Post by Sagharri » 7 months ago

Scute Swarm looks like awesome base for mutate :halo: (and yes, I found confirmation that copies will keep all mutated abilities).

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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 7 months ago

Sagharri wrote:
7 months ago
Scute Swarm looks like awesome base for mutate :halo: (and yes, I found confirmation that copies will keep all mutated abilities).
I suspect that's why almost all the mutate creatures just grant more "when this mutates" abilities, which doesn't really do anything with copying except granting more P/T.

But it is pretty gnarly with Parcelbeast.

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Post by Hawk » 7 months ago

Ancient Greenwarden causes The Gitrog Monster to do some heavy breathing. I don't know if I want more big ol' six-drops in the deck but man is that thing a stoopid amount of power and value on one card.

Lithoform Engine seems just generally awesome in a lot of decks. Great in Daretti as a Rings of Brighthearth effect that is also a Mirari in the rare times I need it and also also a sort of crazy Bramble Sovereign/Mirrorworks effect if I want to just make a lot of Wurmcoil Engines or make multiple Darksteel Forges and Caged Suns. Also could do work in Sevinne, the Chronoclasm since it's both a Strionic Resonator and a Mirari on a single card (oh and sometimes you just need to make more Guttersnipes or Sun Titans...or Burning Vengeances...). That it copies permanents is especially nutty, as I don't think we have a "Copy Enchantment" effect like that anywhere in Magic's long history. This card is going to be freaking everywhere.

Forsaken Monument is also very good in Daretti. "Goes infinite with Basalt Monolith" is a meme now but it does, and also just generally makes rocks better and gains a bunch of random incidental life.

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Post by BounceBurnBuff » 7 months ago

Ancient Greenwarden is honestly one great example of modern design I find so repetitive and boring. "Panharmonicon, but for X mechanic". We've had Teysa, Nightmare Shepherd (in a different manner), Yarok, Naban, Sanctum of All. Whilst a couple of those are for more janky themes, Landfall was far from a mundane mechanic that needed the boost. I look forward to glaring at every Tatyova/Omnath/Yarok/etc player that resolves this.

And now to demonstrate my hypocrisy, I look forward to making Lithoform Engine perform as a poor-man's Paradox Engine by copying Dramatic Reversal forever.

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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 7 months ago

BounceBurnBuff wrote:
7 months ago
Ancient Greenwarden is honestly one great example of modern design I find so repetitive and boring. "Panharmonicon, but for X mechanic".
I will be utterly unsurprised when we see triple panharmonicon, given their new enthusiasm for triplers. Honestly as soon as I think about it, I'm pretty sure it's an inevitability.

Also not a fan of greenwarden...but it does cost 6 and it's a creature. Could be worse?

I feel like I'm frequently happy about the rares in a set, and anxious about the mythics. Confounding Conundrum? Great! Luminarch Aspirant? Wonderful! Verazol, the Forking Stream? Splendid!

....

Ashaya, Soul of the Wild? Moraug, Fury of Akoum? Omnath, Locus of Creation? Ugh....time to rationalize how these probably won't make the format THAT much worse...

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Post by BounceBurnBuff » 7 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
7 months ago
Ashaya, Soul of the Wild? Moraug, Fury of Akoum? Omnath, Locus of Creation? Ugh....time to rationalize how these probably won't make the format THAT much worse...
Ah yes, more "answer me or lose" cards to worry about in the command zone. I was getting worried about the dry spell of Golos and Korvold lately.

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Post by ISBPathfinder » 7 months ago

DirkGently wrote:
7 months ago
Ashaya, Soul of the Wild? Moraug, Fury of Akoum? Omnath, Locus of Creation? Ugh....time to rationalize how these probably won't make the format THAT much worse...
I feel like there are already so many green ramp / overrun strategies that Ashaya, Soul of the Wild is far from unique. Its true that its a slightly new spin on it but its still going to be a go wide ramp deck that probably relies on overrun effects. I am not sure if its really significantly better than what we already have for commanders for these type of decks but I don't really feel like it suddenly ups the power of what we currently have.

Moraug, Fury of Akoum - I keep getting the impression that he is better in the 99 than he is as the commander. I often look at GR decks due to the ramp factor of green and its ability to tutor for creatures. I think it will probably be fine as a commander but I think he will be stronger in a deck than at the helm.

Omnath, Locus of Creation - ok, yea this one could be annoying. There haven't been that many lands commanders if you look through what we have I would say there were maybe like 3 popular options and most of them were just because there weren't that many options. On the upside, lands.deck tends to be expensive so we might not see it everywhere just given that. I think it can still be pulled off on a budget but if you want to max it out it involves maxing out the fetchlands which tends to be the limiting factor for lands.deck which often makes budget lists a lot less effective. This one could be annoying but I also think it will be limited by being lands.deck.
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Post by Wallycaine » 7 months ago

I'll be honest, I don't really see what's scary about Omnath, Locus of Creation. Like, best case scenario, he drains everyone for 4 and makes some mana? And then he's done for the turn, and would like if you'd just stop playing lands so you can start again next turn. That doesn't seem like a "kill on sight" commander to me.

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Post by BounceBurnBuff » 7 months ago

Wallycaine wrote:
7 months ago
I'll be honest, I don't really see what's scary about Omnath, Locus of Creation. Like, best case scenario, he drains everyone for 4 and makes some mana? And then he's done for the turn, and would like if you'd just stop playing lands so you can start again next turn. That doesn't seem like a "kill on sight" commander to me.
I'd probably look at the amount of flickering available to and rethink that whole "done for the turn" angle. I am certain that spending your off of a fetchland to do something as simple as Cloudshift into a reset of Omnath would be the way to go.

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Post by Wallycaine » 7 months ago

BounceBurnBuff wrote:
7 months ago
Wallycaine wrote:
7 months ago
I'll be honest, I don't really see what's scary about Omnath, Locus of Creation. Like, best case scenario, he drains everyone for 4 and makes some mana? And then he's done for the turn, and would like if you'd just stop playing lands so you can start again next turn. That doesn't seem like a "kill on sight" commander to me.
I'd probably look at the amount of flickering available to and rethink that whole "done for the turn" angle. I am certain that spending your off of a fetchland to do something as simple as Cloudshift into a reset of Omnath would be the way to go.
At which point you've cycled a card to get a chance to... drain for 4 again and make some mana? Like, I can see the use case, but it feels like it's something cool, not the oppressive monster it seems to be hyped up to be.

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Post by tstorm823 » 7 months ago

Why are you talking about flicker resetting? The real monsters will fill the deck with extra turns.
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Post by BounceBurnBuff » 7 months ago

tstorm823 wrote:
7 months ago
Why are you talking about flicker resetting? The real monsters will fill the deck with extra turns.
Draw a card, with the White spent you have your Nexus of Fate mana if turns are your thing, even then its in 4c too. Win however you wish from it.

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Post by Hawk » 7 months ago

I'm trying to scheme out what the silliest thing one can do with Verazol, the Forking Stream + Sea Gate Stormcaller. If you Verazol a kicked Stormcaller, you've spent 5UU and the next instant or sorcery of CMC 2 or less that you cast gets copied four times. Level 0 is to just follow that up with like Preordain or Nature's Lore to draw five or ramp five, which is fine (and there are any number of similar effects you can run for redundancy). Bounce is also fine - five Vapor Snag or Echoing Truth should clear the deck, but even better would be Snap to basically refund all the mana you spent and then some. The dream is to somehow cheat out a Ancestral Vision to draw 15, but that feels close to impossible to engineer a situation for (I can't think of a way offhand to be able to cast Vision that doesn't first require one to cast a different instant/sorcery or doesn't get gummed up by needing to cast Stormcaller first).

A few ways to double-up are Explore or Growth Spiral - you get to draw a ton and then also ramp a ton. Crop Rotation could also be interesting since you only sac one land and get to tutor for five. And Contentious Plan is worth mentioning since it makes Verazol bigger than where you started from, ticks up any other counters, and draws five.

The spiciest thing is probably more kicker cards - I think you can just straight up win the game with a kicked Maddening Cacophony afterwards. That's expensive but should delete everyone's decks or close to it. Blink of an Eye and Into the Roil are also "best of both worlds" since you get to bounce five, draw five (maybe make it six with Verazol).

I salivate at the thought of tossing a Twinning Staff in there - you end up with three Stormcallers and then get seven copies of your spell!

I am sure there is some sort of arbitrarily large shenanigan with Dramatic Reversal but this is already a dumb combo and that feels even more win-more.

Anything I missed?

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Post by ilovesaprolings » 7 months ago

tstorm823 wrote:
7 months ago
Why are you talking about flicker resetting? The real monsters will fill the deck with extra turns.
I don't think new Omnath is needed to break extra turns

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Post by NZB2323 » 7 months ago

Nullpriest of Oblivion has great versatility. It's going into my cleric tribal and Edgar Markov deck.
EDH
WUBrg Morophon, the infinite Kavu
Rwb Ghen, Prison Weaver
Rwb Kaalia, Angel tribal
Rwb Edgar, low curve
Wb Tymna/Ravos cleric tribal
WG Captain Sisay land destruction
Ur Niv-Mizzet, Parun
Ug Edric pauper
Bg Sarulf peasant
B Marrow-Gnawer, rat colony

Pauper
U Delver
B ETB creatures
G elves

I don’t play modern anymore.

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Post by Hawk » 7 months ago

NZB2323 wrote:
7 months ago
Nullpriest of Oblivion has great versatility. It's going into my cleric tribal and Edgar Markov deck.
Yeah, a few days ago there was discussion of Malakir Blood-Priest in Edgar and the consensus was probably no - draining for 1 or 2 wasn't good enough on an otherwise vanilla 2/1. Nullpriest is a definite yes though; two great keywords that go great together and even greater with various lords (especially Stromkirk Captain and Rakish Heir), and unlike a lot of Edgar's swarm it isn't a dead draw lategame thanks to its strong kicker. I imagine that the versatility of this makes it an easy swap if one is running Bloodline Necromancer; the reanimator effect is one more and the body is smaller, but the keywords and optionality of casting it turn 2 is really good.

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Post by materpillar » 7 months ago

Charix, the Raging Isle is awesome. It's a leviathan crab which is baller. The art is sweet. To top it all off it looks like it has the potential to be strong but I'm not exactly sure how? Curious, curious. There's got to be some really dumb, weird voltron combos with this thing.

Phenax, God of Deception aside.

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Post by Airi » 7 months ago

I'm excited for Anowon, the Ruin Thief. I think I'll shift Yuriko over to him. He's not nearly as good, but being less backbreaking is a positive in addition to getting to use all of the cute rogue and mill cards I've been sitting on. :love:
RGW Marath [PR] |WUBRG Jodah | WUBRG Najeela | GB Dina
WBG Tayam | BGU Otrimi the Ever-Cute | UW Yorion | RW Zirda | UR Veyran

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