I honestly have no idea. If they don't do enemy tangos in zendikar I'll probably riot
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Kavu Enthusiast Flavor Police Officer
- Posts: 35
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It feels like the card designers were having a competition this set for how many legendary creatures that formed two card infinite mana combos they could sneak into the set. So far it's at least three, and two of them are with monolith and monolith adjacent rocks.Krishnath wrote: ↑4 years agoYes. That's crazy powerful. Now I want to make a new Simic deck with Kinnan as the commander,
Last edited by Kavu Enthusiast 4 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
[float=right]60 Card Casual:
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Grandeur
Charmed I'm Sure
Quad Kor
Snow Tribal (Editing)
Why Did it Have to be Snakes
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Aluren You In
I.Drink.Your.Milkshake
Houses of the Holy
The Floor is LAVA!
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Entmoot (Titania)
Clockwork (Artifacts)
Glass Cage of Emotion
Baby Got Back
Build a Wizard Workshop
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This is pretty normal, IMO - the more playable the front half of the card is, the more the cycling cost usually is (while overpriced / weaker / more situational cards usually have lower cycling costs). See Akroma's Vengeance and Sweltering Suns.
I mean, you could use that logic to criticize every card.
"I just don't know who decided that predatory Impetus better cost 5 mana or it'll break Magic."
Current Decks
Morophon, the infinite Kavu Eowyn, human tribal Legolas, voltron control Tymna/Ravos cleric tribal Neheb, Chicago Bulls tribal Edric pauper
Retired Decks
Edgar Markov Kaalia, angel board wipes Ghen, prison Captain Sisay Nymris, draw go Sarulf, voltron control Niv-Mizzet, combo Winota Sidisi, Zombie Tribal
Morophon, the infinite Kavu Eowyn, human tribal Legolas, voltron control Tymna/Ravos cleric tribal Neheb, Chicago Bulls tribal Edric pauper
Retired Decks
Edgar Markov Kaalia, angel board wipes Ghen, prison Captain Sisay Nymris, draw go Sarulf, voltron control Niv-Mizzet, combo Winota Sidisi, Zombie Tribal
- MeowZeDung
- Posts: 1117
- Joined: 4 years ago
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An overcosted uncommon green aura is not the same as a cycle of rare lands, a category of card that is almost universally anticipated and valued every set.NZB2323 wrote: ↑4 years agoI mean, you could use that logic to criticize every card.
"I just don't know who decided that predatory Impetus better cost 5 mana or it'll break Magic."
Apples and oranges.
Kykar primer and other active decks (click!)
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DirkGently My wins are unconditional
- Posts: 4540
- Joined: 4 years ago
- Pronoun: he / him
Someone who realized they'd be strictly better than bicycle lands? Their only downside relative to bicycles for an entire additional land type is that 1 extra to cycle.
Mind you, I would have preferred bicycles for the flexibility in terms of where they can be included, but whaddyagonnado.
I wonder if there's any chance we'll get bicycles in an uncommon slot? Probably too much to hope for. That'd be sick though.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
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DirkGently My wins are unconditional
- Posts: 4540
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- Pronoun: he / him
Whelp, bonders' enclave is probably the card I'm most interested in playing in my existing decks thus far. Took long enough, Phelddagrif really wasn't getting anything this release, in C20 or Ikoria.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
I don't think the same logic applies to every card. Many are appropriately costed. Many are under costed.NZB2323 wrote: ↑4 years agoI mean, you could use that logic to criticize every card.
"I just don't know who decided that predatory Impetus better cost 5 mana or it'll break Magic."
These I find overcosted.
The difference between 3 mana to cycle and 2 is probably like 50 fold in terms of how rarely these will be cycled which is way out of line with the power difference.DirkGently wrote: ↑4 years agoSomeone who realized they'd be strictly better than bicycle lands? Their only downside relative to bicycles for an entire additional land type is that 1 extra to cycle.
I'd have costed them as w/g w/b hybrid (for the abzan one for example since white is the center of the wedge cost of the ultimatum).
When was the last time we got a new cycle of rare lands that are better than these? The Amonkhet rare lands cost 2 to cycle but tap for 2 colors instead of 3.MeowZeDung wrote: ↑4 years agoAn overcosted uncommon green aura is not the same as a cycle of rare lands, a category of card that is almost universally anticipated and valued every set.NZB2323 wrote: ↑4 years agoI mean, you could use that logic to criticize every card.
"I just don't know who decided that predatory Impetus better cost 5 mana or it'll break Magic."
Apples and oranges.
Current Decks
Morophon, the infinite Kavu Eowyn, human tribal Legolas, voltron control Tymna/Ravos cleric tribal Neheb, Chicago Bulls tribal Edric pauper
Retired Decks
Edgar Markov Kaalia, angel board wipes Ghen, prison Captain Sisay Nymris, draw go Sarulf, voltron control Niv-Mizzet, combo Winota Sidisi, Zombie Tribal
Morophon, the infinite Kavu Eowyn, human tribal Legolas, voltron control Tymna/Ravos cleric tribal Neheb, Chicago Bulls tribal Edric pauper
Retired Decks
Edgar Markov Kaalia, angel board wipes Ghen, prison Captain Sisay Nymris, draw go Sarulf, voltron control Niv-Mizzet, combo Winota Sidisi, Zombie Tribal
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DirkGently My wins are unconditional
- Posts: 4540
- Joined: 4 years ago
- Pronoun: he / him
I guess it depends how you play, but I'd say 50x is hyperbolic to the point of parody. Often I'm cycling bicycles when I've flooded out, and the difference in that case isn't such a big one.pokken wrote: ↑4 years agoThe difference between 3 mana to cycle and 2 is probably like 50 fold in terms of how rarely these will be cycled which is way out of line with the power difference.
I'd have costed them as w/g w/b hybrid (for the abzan one for example since white is the center of the wedge cost of the ultimatum).
They're strictly better as fetch targets, so honestly a significant power de-bump in the cycling department seems pretty reasonable. With cheaper cycling it'd kind of incentivize you not to fetch it.
I mean people run untyped trilands up until their mana base is pretty pimped out. These are much, much stronger than those - even without any cycling whatsoever.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan
Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
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Krishnath Mechanical Dragon
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Well, the Triome lands certainly explains why WotC won't reprint the fetches in standard legal sets.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.
Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.
Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.
Hot take: these would be more impactful than the bicycle lands without the cycling at all.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
- darrenhabib
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- MeowZeDung
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You can't think in terms of just commander, because wotc sure can't when they release a set. Since amonkhet have been shocks and scry temples. Standard players eagerly anticipate the rare land cycles, like I said. Commander players do too, and it is disappointing when they are lackluster. Now, I don't think the triomes are lackluster myself, I was just challenging your "apply this logic equally to uncommon auras and rare lands" assertion is all.NZB2323 wrote: ↑4 years agoWhen was the last time we got a new cycle of rare lands that are better than these? The Amonkhet rare lands cost 2 to cycle but tap for 2 colors instead of 3.MeowZeDung wrote: ↑4 years agoAn overcosted uncommon green aura is not the same as a cycle of rare lands, a category of card that is almost universally anticipated and valued every set.NZB2323 wrote: ↑4 years ago
I mean, you could use that logic to criticize every card.
"I just don't know who decided that predatory Impetus better cost 5 mana or it'll break Magic."
Apples and oranges.
Also since amonkhet have been the battlebond lands, Vista, fabled passage, etc if your going to look at it from a commander only standpoint.
Kykar primer and other active decks (click!)
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folding_music glitter pen on my mana crypt
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the Triomes are neat, slow and don't shuffle teh deck, probably the perfect power level. hope they maintain a reasonable price point like Temples do. I was really hoping for an aggressive five-colour land, though - I have no idea how you'd play a fast Ikoria-based deck without something like City of Brass??
(apropos of nothing, I really resent Prismatic Vista and Fabled Passage, cos they are not marvellously better than yr basic Evolving Wilds, but they'll be at the back of yr mind forever and they cost a million dollars each. Boo to these lands!)
(apropos of nothing, I really resent Prismatic Vista and Fabled Passage, cos they are not marvellously better than yr basic Evolving Wilds, but they'll be at the back of yr mind forever and they cost a million dollars each. Boo to these lands!)
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That bonder's enclave will become a staple
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Krishnath Mechanical Dragon
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- Pronoun: he / him
- Location: A cave somewhere in Scandinavia
I must agree with the sentiment that they are lackluster, they are a direct upgrade from the Tarkir trilands, and they are played a considerable amount as although they enter the battlefield tapped, they also tap for three different colors. The Triome lands also has the bonus of being easily fetchable. They are going to get played a lot in three, four, and five color commander decks. They also have the bonus of not being a dead draw if you get them in the late game where you have a lot of mana, as you can simply get rid of them for a new card.MeowZeDung wrote: ↑4 years agoYou can't think in terms of just commander, because wotc sure can't when they release a set. Since amonkhet have been shocks and scry temples. Standard players eagerly anticipate the rare land cycles, like I said. Commander players do too, and it is disappointing when they are lackluster. Now, I don't think the triomes are lackluster myself, I was just challenging your "apply this logic equally to uncommon auras and rare lands" assertion is all.
Also since amonkhet have been the battlebond lands, Vista, fabled passage, etc if your going to look at it from a commander only standpoint.
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.
Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
The Commander Legacy Project, Come say hello and give your thoughts.
Like to read? Love books and want to recommend one to your fellow forum users? Go here.
-
Kavu Enthusiast Flavor Police Officer
- Posts: 35
- Joined: 4 years ago
- Pronoun: Unlisted
- Location: New England
So because I heard some rumblings about the Jeskai ultimatum being mistranslated as 5 to any target instead of 5 to a player, creature and walker I thought I'd give the Japanese an actual hard look since that is suppose to be my second language (some cards like that have a few too many inane kanjis that tend to make me pass on trying). Several of the kanji are beyond my level, but the katakana and hiragana are always straightforward; particularly when the former is just being used for romanji versions of English words like is the case on many proper nouns for came objects on MtG cards. They act as sign posts that help tell you whats happening even if your kanji knowledge isn't deep enough.
I think I can see where the confusion is happening and why. The life gain part and the hand part are written roughly as we would see it written in English. Basically 'you draw 5 cards' and 'that/target player gains 5 life'. In between those sentences it says the 'card name' deals 5 damage to the target' (I'm pretty sure, 'Ni' is a pointer for the verb and 'sono X' is 'the/that thing'). But the target selection for the card in Japanese happens in the first sentence before the rest of the card actions. It basically says '1 person, 1 creature, 1 planeswalker, 1 player': here's where I think the confusion is happening for people who have just a passing understanding of romanji written in katakana and not much else...there's a 'ka' particle between these targets, which is basically an 'or' particle in English, if it were an 'and' it would be 'to'. I'm pretty sure that the Japanese language just has issues structuring the actions of the cards the same way English does and explicitly calls out each of your target options and then tells you what game actions the game takes against those targets next. It's not the first time a sentence in Japanese was worded weird from the perspective of an English speaker and it won't be the last.
Also....I saw multiple translations from actual Japanese people that said 5 to any 1 target so yeah, probably not mistranslated. Probably. Believe me since this is definitely something I'm going to slot into at least 1 deck I definitely wish it were a little better (an instant, or had the damage and life game tuned to be on par with draw 5 (you'd have to probably deal 10 (or deal damage equal to your hand size or something) and gain 10+ or something)) but I'm pretty sure they just specifically tooled this ultimatum to be a step below the others for whatever reason.
Anyway, thanks for listening to my Ted Talk
I think I can see where the confusion is happening and why. The life gain part and the hand part are written roughly as we would see it written in English. Basically 'you draw 5 cards' and 'that/target player gains 5 life'. In between those sentences it says the 'card name' deals 5 damage to the target' (I'm pretty sure, 'Ni' is a pointer for the verb and 'sono X' is 'the/that thing'). But the target selection for the card in Japanese happens in the first sentence before the rest of the card actions. It basically says '1 person, 1 creature, 1 planeswalker, 1 player': here's where I think the confusion is happening for people who have just a passing understanding of romanji written in katakana and not much else...there's a 'ka' particle between these targets, which is basically an 'or' particle in English, if it were an 'and' it would be 'to'. I'm pretty sure that the Japanese language just has issues structuring the actions of the cards the same way English does and explicitly calls out each of your target options and then tells you what game actions the game takes against those targets next. It's not the first time a sentence in Japanese was worded weird from the perspective of an English speaker and it won't be the last.
Also....I saw multiple translations from actual Japanese people that said 5 to any 1 target so yeah, probably not mistranslated. Probably. Believe me since this is definitely something I'm going to slot into at least 1 deck I definitely wish it were a little better (an instant, or had the damage and life game tuned to be on par with draw 5 (you'd have to probably deal 10 (or deal damage equal to your hand size or something) and gain 10+ or something)) but I'm pretty sure they just specifically tooled this ultimatum to be a step below the others for whatever reason.
Anyway, thanks for listening to my Ted Talk
[float=right]60 Card Casual:
Kavus
Grandeur
Charmed I'm Sure
Quad Kor
Snow Tribal (Editing)
Why Did it Have to be Snakes
[/float][float=left]EDH:
Aluren You In
I.Drink.Your.Milkshake
Houses of the Holy
The Floor is LAVA!
It's Good to be the Queen
Entmoot (Titania)
Clockwork (Artifacts)
Glass Cage of Emotion
Baby Got Back
Build a Wizard Workshop
[/float]
Hey, the rug ultimatum is bad too, woo! 2/5 are trash, 1/5 is medium and 2/5 busted. Coulda been worse.
Mythos of Illuna is pretty solid. Clone target permanent, but optionally better, and only really sad because it's got that 3-color identity keeping it out of most cloning and token-centric decks.
Zedruu: "This deck is not only able to go crazy - it also needs to do so."
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Kavu Enthusiast Flavor Police Officer
- Posts: 35
- Joined: 4 years ago
- Pronoun: Unlisted
- Location: New England
I'm going to have to disagree on 'trash'. A 'free cast any permanents in the top 5 cards of your library and put the rest in your hand' isn't garbage at all. I think the only one from this series that fell under the bar of being in the same ballpark as the rest is the Jeskai one. All 4 of the rest of the effects can be game winning on cast, just with more or less game presence and setup required of the player. Clearly the BUG one is the dumb 'lol I win out of no-where with no previous board state' sort of spell that most people hate games ending with and is too much. One sided board wipe or mass graveyard res require you have a board or a GY, but they are going to completely end games when played in the decks they belong in.
It's similar with the RUG ultimatum, it will require some *actual* set up to abuse, but it's *very* abusable to get to cast up to 5 free permanent cards off the top of your deck; especially in a format like EDH with huge game ending permanents and lots of tutors that put stuff on the top of your deck. I'm perfectly ok with requiring a player jump through a hoop to get a really powerful effect, but it's really not something I would call 'bad' unless I was letting the outlier that is the BUG ultimatum skew my grading.
I think an honest objective tally of the cards would be more that the RUG/RWB/WGB ultimatums are all strong effects cards that are going to be kept somewhat in check by requiring setup on the part of the player....with the RWU ultimatum being a super weak outlier for the cycle and the BUG ultimatum being a super busted outlier for the cycle.
[float=right]60 Card Casual:
Kavus
Grandeur
Charmed I'm Sure
Quad Kor
Snow Tribal (Editing)
Why Did it Have to be Snakes
[/float][float=left]EDH:
Aluren You In
I.Drink.Your.Milkshake
Houses of the Holy
The Floor is LAVA!
It's Good to be the Queen
Entmoot (Titania)
Clockwork (Artifacts)
Glass Cage of Emotion
Baby Got Back
Build a Wizard Workshop
[/float]
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Kavu Enthusiast Flavor Police Officer
- Posts: 35
- Joined: 4 years ago
- Pronoun: Unlisted
- Location: New England
True, but it is pretty much perfect for my Yasova deck so that's cool.tstorm823 wrote: ↑4 years agoMythos of Illuna is pretty solid. Clone target permanent, but optionally better, and only really sad because it's got that 3-color identity keeping it out of most cloning and token-centric decks.
[float=right]60 Card Casual:
Kavus
Grandeur
Charmed I'm Sure
Quad Kor
Snow Tribal (Editing)
Why Did it Have to be Snakes
[/float][float=left]EDH:
Aluren You In
I.Drink.Your.Milkshake
Houses of the Holy
The Floor is LAVA!
It's Good to be the Queen
Entmoot (Titania)
Clockwork (Artifacts)
Glass Cage of Emotion
Baby Got Back
Build a Wizard Workshop
[/float]