Ghired, Conclave Exile - Triple Dipping Naya Lards

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Rumpy5897
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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

None of the attack trigger beef interacts well with myriad, as it's a single copy of the beef that enters combat and does the swinging.

I'll give Toski a try some point soon then. I am up to 10 draw pieces, which decreases the urgency of further expansion. I feel I've got a pretty good balance between the various modules, even if I'm a bit leery toward some individual representatives of said modules.
 
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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

The whole thing that I was unhappy about for a while, and then largely resolved in the SNC update, is that for attack trigger beef to do its thing, said beef needs to enter the attack step and actually swing at someone. Myriad triggers on attack. The tokens it makes never actually see themselves attacking, just like with the Ghired populate.

As a practical example, assume Kalonian Hydra wearing a Blade of Selves, plus a Ghired. Swing time, triggers - myriad, Ghired populate, Hydra counter multiplication, in that order. Start resolving the stack. Two temporary Hydras fall out. One permanent Hydra falls out. None of them get attack triggers as the moment has passed and they only got made during the attack. The sole Hydra counter multiplication goes off, and the end result is four 8/8 tramplers (two of those temporary).

Compare to Hydra plus Cabaretti Confluence. Three temporary hasty Hydras get made main one, swing time, four Hydra counter multiplications, end result - four 64/64 tramplers. Add Ghired for a fifth 64/64.
 
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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

Ok, gotcha. I was puzzled because you were talking about that in your intro to the comments on the creatures with myriad, but none of those creatures cares about the attack triggers, and there really only are 2 creatures in your deck now that care about attack triggers. Myriad should work pretty well otherwise.

Firbolg Flutist looks interesting. It's functionally 4 bodies for 6 mana, which is pretty good. I won a game recently thanks to Hate Mirage giving me 2 bodies for 4 mana (and those bodies being 6/6s when my biggest was a 5/5, increasing Boomgoat's output considerably). Being a creature that can be copied may give it the spot even though the CMC is higher.

Duke Ulder Ravengard not only is a body copier, but also a haste enabler, which is pretty nice, but 6 mana for the effect...I suppose that's similar to paying full freight at once for Blade of Selves.

Legion Loyalty is a dumb card. If it were a creature, I'd consider putting it in over Craterhoof, but as an enchantment, I don't think so.

Battle Angels of Tyr is NUTS. 12 power with evasion for 4 mana that ALSO ramps, draws, and gains life?! On top of that, if you populate a Battle Angel, that token has Myriad, so you get more on the next combat as well...

Let's say BAT and Flameshadow w/ Ghired out and ready to party. Drop BAT, and copy. Swing in combat, each BAT makes 2 copies, and Ghired populates a copy. That's 28 damage swinging for +. Next turn, you have the original BAT and your populated copy, which is another 28 damage. The following turn you have 3 of them to start, and each makes 2 copies, so that's 10 BATs, or 40 damage.

Not as explosive as the Goat, but it looks decent. And that's ignoring the draw, treasure, and life gain. As long as you aren't "on the throne" for each of those, you get the benefit of each of those until you get on the throne. In all likelihood, you make 0-3 treasure, draw 0-3 cards, and gain 0-3 life in one combat, regardless of the number of BATs you have, since the trigger keeps checking and you're probably only down (if at all) a little. Don't think I'd run this here: in most cases, this deck should be ahead of everyone on lands, and will probably be ahead on life once the damage from the army is dealt. The card draw is nice, but it's usually only going to be 1 card at best.

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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

Made a misplay tonight (but still won). Had a decent board, Heroic Intervention and Chord of Calling in hand with the ability to cast for x=6. Opponent cast Blasphemous Act, and instead of Chord --> Vigor, I cast HI. Then Chord for Combat Celebrant.

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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

I'm debating whether I want to replace Blade of Selves with Duke Ulder Ravengard. If I haven't had Blade in play already, giving something myriad costs the same (2 to play, 4 to equip vs 6CMC to cast Duke), but Duke also gives the target haste, which can be relevant. Blade is a little harder to remove, but it can be cumbersome to spend the mana equipping, and tempo for a turn can get messed up if the target gets removed.

I also want to try Firbolg Flutist, maybe Githzerai Monk, and I got Saryth finally to try out on your recommendation.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

I like the fact Blade responds to Enlightened Tutor, it's nice to have a copier within that card's reach. The resilience you bring up is also a nontrivial upside. That said, your observation about haste on the Duke is actually a solid gameplay perk. Can set him down early and make two extra Rhinos a turn until a beatstick is ready to be deployed, and then it jumps out of nowhere in multiples and applies immediate pressure. It might well be correct to run both in your deck - myriad is very powerful in the absence of attack triggers, and I think you're not quite as committed to those as I am.

I still think that you're going to love Saryth. Copy stuff in peace, deathtouch on attackers, incidental ramp if adding the one-drop auras. She's been a very welcome presence in here, and I face less interaction than you.
 
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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

So, I got one game in with some of the changes. The only new card to show up was Saryth. The deathtouch was pretty relevant, but I was at a table with a very aggressive werewolves deck, someone with a Simic deck with a huge creature and not much else going on (a little control, but not very good at using it), and...I don't recall who the last player was running. Anyway, werewolves came out hard and fast, and became archenemy fairly quickly. I built up a bit and sent quite a bit of damage their way, and they were cracking back at me when they could, but I held a couple Rhinos back every turn as blockers. I had one turn with Eladamri's Call in hand and some mana to spend, but no way to grant haste, and not enough mana to cast whatever I got and copy it with Flameshadow (at least for anything that would be impactful enough). Hit werewolves hard, and played a Knight of Autumn and copied it to removal a couple key enchantments from werewolves, gain 4 life, and leave behind another blocker. But the Simic player decided that I had become the real threat and swung his giant creature my way to kill me.

The big creature was a werewolf that had P/T=cards in everyone's hands, vigilance, and trample. If I'd been paying attention to how big it was, I would have realized that the right play would have been tutoring for Firbolg Flutist, casting it to steal that, then swinging with myriad on it, and making a copy with Ghired. It was something like a 20/20, so I would have had 4 of those, with deathtouch, plus a handful of Rhinos. Would have been enough to knock out werewolves and the Simic player.

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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

Just had a strong start in a 3 player game, with lethal for both opponents on the board AND two layers of protection for my board...then got shut out by basically infinite Fogs from Knight-Captain of Eos that kept getting reanimated or copied. Only drew one piece of removal and it got countered by the other player. This is a situation where Terror of the Peaks would have been MVP, but never got him.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

DMU has some cool stuff in it, but none of it is going to make it to my list. Cadric, Soul Kindler has a weird Flameshadow Conjuring lite going on for legends only, which could be used to get two perma-Ghireds if sequenced ahead of Ghired, or nothing if sequenced later :P The deck is not well equipped to make use of Plaza of Heroes. The commander is near the top of the curve, while the early turns appreciate mana flexibility to juggle between appropriate ramp and support measures. Also, once going, the deck is largely tap-out and I cannot see myself making much use of that last ability. Threats Undetected is an interesting card that's probably more fit for less on-rails decks than this one, as your opponents have the final say in the matter. You can technically force through a beatstick or a copier by getting three representatives of the category, but then the opponent just gives you the two worst ones and you end up with less bang for your buck. Well, or arguably still decent bang for your buck if interacted with. Assess as appropriate for your setting :P I'm also happy that they made another bare-bones typed land cycle, though running these should be done carefully to avoid clunking out on important turns.

Silverback Elder is a disgusting card, but not for us - it only starts doing stuff at the point where we're more less curved out, and none of the stuff explicitly helps us with our game plan. Resolute Reinforcements is the best body-based extra 1/1 swarmer yet, but we don't care :P Yavimaya Steelcrusher is red's Qasali Pridemage, but we care even less :P I don't really feel that the DMU Selesnya archetype of go-wide tokens lends itself particularly well to being included here. King Darien XLVIII does a lot, but nothing that relevant to our strategy. Queen Allenal of Ruadach could make some extra chumps to help against crackback, I guess?

Another piece of anti-fog tech would be Questing Beast, and it could double as anti-superfriends too. Not a terrible idea if a meta calls for it.
 
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Post by Lazess » 1 year ago

Hi Rumpy, this is my first comment on mtgnexus! I am following your Ghired build for over a year now and im always super hyped for new sets and new cards. I wanted to ask you if you could possibly help me with deckbuilding with my Ghired Deck. :grin:

I try to move a little parallel to your Ghired deck. I love the Idea of making temporary copies into making them permanent with ghired. Before i found your Primer i simply played regular token makers and populated them. Was no fun since the "red" aspect which makes Ghired special as populate Commander was kinda wasted.

However, mine is on a budget that I don't want to go much over. My ramp, carddraw and the "initial token makers" are almost the same as yours. But unfortunately i can't afford the cards in the beatsticks section besides Thunderfoot Baloth, Quartzwood Crasher and Angel of Destiny. As replacement for the cards that i cant afford, i use Armada Wurm, Giant adaphage and rampaging baloths, but as you can imagine... they are BY FAR not game winning cards like your beatsticks. They can't even be called beatsicks..

So my first Question: could you tell me any budget beatstick alternatives for aurelia, pathbreaker, kalonian?

Also, I often have the problem that I either don't draw Beatsticks or I don't draw "Initial Token Makers". Most likely because I only have one tutor in the deck (which is eladamri's Call and that just because i found it in booster) since the others are to much money for me right now.

What would you do to compensate for that? Should I play more beatsticks and cards that make me first gen tokens?

Sorry for bad english i hope you can understand what im trying to say. :)

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

Hello and welcome :) glad to hear that you're also interested in the modular take on Ghired.

Beatstick wise, the best options not already in the deck are Archangel of Thune and Terror of the Peaks, which are both even more expensive than the Kalonian Hydra you're missing :P What makes a truly outstanding Ghired beatstick is a creature that disproportionately benefits from having multiple copies of itself around, which is not a super common thing. I think your best bet would be Avenger of Zendikar, who scales quite well (more plants, fatter plants). I ran him for some time, but took him out as he was too slow for what I was trying to do. After that I would honestly go with Giant Adephage as he gets out of control on his own, given enough time. Yeah, he's not great, but it is the best we've got :P

The good news Aurelia wise is that she's not a true beatstick per se. She's listed in that category as you can technically copy her, and if you do then she can do a combo kill on the table (board state permitting). However, I've done that a single digit number of times since the possibility entered the list. She is still good though, as the extra combat is nice. You can get that benefit with Karlach, Fury of Avernus for a fraction of the cost. You'll be fine running that as a replacement.

Tutor wise, it's not the easiest to find budget ones. They are a coveted piece of utility that is often very expensive as a result. I'm not sure what your budget limitations are, but Chord of Calling is $7 at the time of writing, and Green Sun's Zenith is $10 and slowly trending down thanks to a recent reprint. Chord in particular would be nice as GSZ currently does not get copiers, as all the Kikis are not green. That said, there is one budget tutor that would work here quite nicely - Fierce Empath. You've got Thunderfoot Baloth (and possibly others) as a beatstick, you've got Mirage Phalanx as a copier, that's all the major bases covered. Things get kind of dicey after that. Mwonvuli Beast Tracker can get Quartzwood Crasher and Giant Adephage, which can kickstart the show themselves and do okay without a copier. You could consider Shared Summons as it pulls two creatures, but at a somewhat heavy cost of five mana.

That said, you are not locked into running the same exact proportions of everything as I am. Ghired is a rather flexible commander, as evidenced by other users posting their decks in the thread from time to time. I take a look, I acknowledge the decks look fine, and that I prefer my somewhat more narrow beef copying plan :P Here are some options to consider:
  • The very first thing that you can consider putting spare slots toward is ramp and draw. The easiest way to have fun in EDH is to do things during a game, and having an appropriate density of ramp and draw in your deck makes this be the case. Thankfully we've seen way too many of those effects printed into green in recent years, so you should have an easy time getting enough for your deck to run smoothly.
  • Another thing to consider is that my deck is very removal light. There are plenty of interaction spells you could add to have a more back and forth game on your hands, and if you go for ETB creatures then you can potentially copy them with Ghired for extra value. Cavalier of Dawn is the prime guy for this.
  • One of the regulars in here has had a decent degree of success running Firbolg Flutist/Hate Mirage to copy other people's stuff, with the copies subsequently becoming permanent additions to your board via Ghired. Would that work well in your group?
  • There are a few creatures that I don't run because they aren't fun for my opponents, but you could consider them if your group is more resilient to this sort of stuff. Archon of Valor's Reach can severely trip up opposing strategies by blocking entire classes of spells. Serra's Emissary is an incredibly powerful card on both offence and defence. Yosei, the Morning Star can lock up the board in your favour if deployed and copied at just the right time.
  • I've been musing on True Conviction for a while, but ultimately did not go for it as it doesn't really directly do anything with the beef copying plan. Githzerai Monk is similar to a card I used to run to clear the path, but even better as you can potentially cast it during an opponent's turn now.
Hopefully this helps a bit, and we can continue thinking about stuff. Maybe some of the other posters will hop in with their own experiences too ;)
 
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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

If you have enough land ramp spells, Rampaging Baloths could be quite decent in multiples. Avenger of Zendikar is probably slightly better, but they're comparable, I think.

I've definitely leaned more into strong utility creatures (removal and such) for copying, which isn't nearly as explosive/game ending as going purely for beef, as Rumpy does, but it helps weather hate into a longer game.

Either way, the deck definitely suffers from "wrong half" syndrome, where you need multiple pieces to get off the ground, but never get both/all the pieces you need of the different parts: sometimes you get copiers without worthwhile stuff to copy (that sucks). Sometimes you get beef without copiers (not as bad, but slow).

The trouble I've been having lately is the deck comes out swinging pretty fast, but often not quite fast enough to kill the table before someone finds an answer (and I haven't had a mass protection in hand for those answers in a while), and gets targeted HARD. Some of that is warranted, while some of that is poor threat assessment as someone else is laying low and building up to an unassailable win that's harder to interact with. Part of that is also somewhat corner-case matchups where I run into someone who can Fog me every turn.

True Conviction has been something I've debated for a while as well, but never pulled the trigger on it, since I didn't want to add yet another pricey (mana wise) enchantment that doesn't necessarily do something on its own. The upside is that it's pretty decent with just the rhino plan, but if the deck is stumbling at all, it's not going to help, even if it does speed the clock up for when the deck is working.

Archon of Valor's Reach was pretty solid when i was running it. If I couldn't copy it immediately, I'd usually choose sorcery, to hold off board wipes. If I could make a copy immediately, the first to enter chooses instant, and the second chooses sorcery to shut out interaction.

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Post by Naota481 » 1 year ago

Tangent: saw some folks discussing fable of the mirror-breaker, don't remember if you dissected this card. Populatable shaman token that ramps 3>5, free faithless looting and turns into a bootleg kiki with no haste. the value seems decent... Would you cut a 3 mana rock for this or am I looking at it from a wrong angle... maybe the no haste makes it useles, idk

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

I'm not that keen on the card as it takes forever to get that bootleg Kiki from it. Completing the beef + copier pairing out of nowhere and immediately threatening impactful combat is a good way to keep the opposition uncertain, and the saga just sits there, telegraphed as hell, and when it flips the Kiki is summoning sick to top it off. I also tend to like to lead with the beef if able, as following with a copier tends to lead to more attack triggers/bodies in combat/general pressure applied at once. This card would probably feel okay played on curve, and then literally no other time after that. I may be wrong though, the card is doing well, as evidenced by its price tag. If you are running three-drop rocks then it might not be the worst of ideas to see how this fares in that slot due to the ramp aspect you picked up. I have been happy with the performance of my 1+2-drop ramp suite though, would recommend.

Thanks for the nudge by the way, I really need to get the 40K/UNF notes transferred to my write-ups. Ghired-wise, I had some hopes due to squad. In practice nothing really manages to clear the bar though. Space Marine Devastator is an option for the more controlling decks, but is rather pricey for what he brings to the table. Ultramarines Honour Guard is like a knockoff Thunderfoot Baloth, think I'll just keep the one I already have. In terms of non-squad things, Bloodthirster is so close but yet so far. If it untapped all creatures then it would be an immediate shoe-in. However, in that case, it would likely be a wildly powerful card at the more casual side of things, so it's probably for the best it's worded as is. Deathleaper, Terror Weapon is a cute card, but Blade Historian is a thing already. It's also a little funny how the set brought us Archangel of Thune at home with Thunderwolf Cavalry on top of the Baloth riff. Atalan Jackal is a cute card, but is likely to run out of relevance rather quickly due to its puny body.

By the way, in a recent game, I actually tutored Saryth so I could copy my fat in peace and then offer crazy damage (the opposition had a number of pretty big guys who could thin my board out pretty well otherwise). Getting tutored for is a pretty good sign :P
 
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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

BRO notes are... nonexistent. Not a single card really caught my eye during spoiler season. The closest would be Cityscape Leveler, and that's not that close as I feel we've got a bunch of better options for accomplishing this sort of thing already.
 
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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

Feel like I recall us talking Craterhoof vs the Goat a while back, and had a game tonight to illustrate:

Had out Rionya, Ghired, and 1 rhino. Suspended land ramp went off on upkeep, and I top-decked Chord of Calling. I tapped mana and the rhino to get X=8 for Craterhoof, which got copied 3 times by Rionya, and once by Ghired on the attack.

That was +4/+4 from the initial Craterhoof, 3x (+7/+7) off of Rionya copies, then +8/+8 from populated copy, or +33/+33 to everyone except the 3 Rionya copies (which missed the first +4/+4, which makes them +29/+29) and the last Craterhoof (which got only +8/+8). So, I swung with R (33), G (33), C1 (33), C2 (29), C3 (29), C4 (29), C5 (8) = 224 (including the base powers for everyone).

With the Goat instead, I would have had 3 copies that swung granting +4/+4, +8/+8, and +16/+16. The original wouldn't have haste, and the populated copy can't trigger. So that's R (31), G(30), PB1 (31), PB2 (31), PB3 (31), PB4 (31) = 185 damage.

In any case, they threw up a Teferi's Protection, hoping to find an answer, but didn't, which meant on my following turn, I was going to make 2 Craterhoof tokens (top-decked a Nature's Lore) for light's out.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

So in summary they both win the game in that situation, one costs six, one costs eight. Got it. :P

Hoof's main drawback is costing eight mana. He doesn't curve naturally like all the tier one beefslabs do, and his scaling isn't even that crazy. That said, the fact he's got haste and the payoff is ETB are both nice. I'd put him in the second tier of beatsticks, with some that got forced out of the list over time and putative utility options like Terror of the Peaks. A reasonable consideration, especially in less all-eggs-one-basket lists that pay more attention to Rhinos with beef copying being secondary. This is a lot better than Angel of Destiny in a deck like that.

I actually had a somewhat unusual Ghired game lately which I feel merits documenting. A friend put together Vhal, Candlekeep Researcher with Raised by Giants, and as it turns out powering out a super quick 10/10 vigilant voltron applies wicked good incidental pressure on top of whatever mana laundering nonsense he actually wanted to do. As such, I was stuck on the defensive and trying to stabilise. An early Eternal Witness was used to guarantee enough land drops to get out Kiki, who would then grant me chump prowess and allow me to start working on my game plan. However, the deck started barfing various threatening artifacts/enchantments, so I burned a Chord on Duergar Hedge-Mage and copied that instead. My setup got disrupted when a Cityscape Leveler came out and ate the Kiki, but thankfully I was able to grab the One with the Multiverse to leave him rather empty handed. At this point his board was more congested than mine, and my chump factory was gone, so I ripped a Blasphemous Act and finally deployed Ghired into the rubble. Vhal came back out shortly, so I converted Enlightened Tutor into Dolmen Gate in the interest of being able to swing. The old issue of chump production returned, which I solved by chasing out Mirage Phalanx to make an extra Ghired each turn. Plus hey, the surplus 4/4 wasn't that bad either. At this point the guy scooped it up. A rather atypical game, loads of removal, almost like a control deck. I guess the deck can technically perform like that on account of possessing those cards in the 99 :P
 
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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

Sounds like a nail-biter of a game! Games like that are why I've leaned into some of the less pure-beats and more utility-beats stuff. A little less so now, but my old group had TONS of interaction and major threats, so steamrolling over them almost never worked.

8 mana is a lot, but as a curve-topper, I like having it as an option. The Ibex is in the deck, too, but there are situations where Crater gets there, and Pathbreaker doesn't. If the mana is available, Craterhoof is almost always the better top deck, too, while Pathbreaker needs haste, a copier, or a full turn cycle to do anything.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

Yeah, it's got upsides, and works as a curve topper a little akin to what I used to do with the goodstuff legendary angels. It feels kind of weird to consider it in a deck that isn't focused on going wide due to its classical infamous application.

I'm curious if there are ways to provide the deck with more early stable ramp, as Ghired sure loves Sol Ring. Do we have enough draw power to support the Moxes? Would Gamble be too risky?
 
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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

Rumpy5897 wrote:
1 year ago
Yeah, it's got upsides, and works as a curve topper a little akin to what I used to do with the goodstuff legendary angels. It feels kind of weird to consider it in a deck that isn't focused on going wide due to its classical infamous application.

I'm curious if there are ways to provide the deck with more early stable ramp, as Ghired sure loves Sol Ring. Do we have enough draw power to support the Moxes? Would Gamble be too risky?
There's Dockside, which incidentally is a great target for copying.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

Dockside is a respectable form of ramp, but very far from the "consistent fast ramp right out of the starting hand that enables a T3 Ghired followed by a beatstick and copier" sequence I'm looking for here :P
 
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Post by Rumpy5897 » 1 year ago

I've gestated on ONE for a while now and am still unsure how to proceed. A time-honoured tradition is to air thoughts in the primer, as that helps iron out the details. Especially here, where I've got the highest likelihood of someone actually chiming in :P
  • Mondrak, Glory Dominus is the obvious all-star card of the set for the deck, as four-cost doublers have been amazing in here. Thing is, it's a support piece. The doublers don't actually do anything to help out with the beef copying plan, and as such their desired critical mass is likely lower than members of the main categories. As such, does this actually go in? If so, over what?
  • Skyhunter Strike Force doesn't look like much, but proceeds to engage Beastmaster Ascension and Stalwart Pathlighter in a bizarre game of rock-paper-scissors. The Skyhunter feels better than the Ascension as it confers a +2/+2 or +3/+3 pump immediately, helping the deck over the very hump that the various combat protection pieces are supposed to. Thing is, that's not a ton of pump, and Pathlighter just flat-out guarantees survival (and provides gross main two wiping possibilities). But then all the pump is gone, and Ascension is a good backup line in the event of being stuck on the Rhino plan. Cycle complete! It also doesn't help that both Skyhunter and Pathlighter never do anything for the new token, complicating the situation further. Vigor also kind of enters the equation as fulfilling a similar role.
  • Everything else is more secondary. Clever Concealment is a great card, but not for this deck - we're quite tap-out, and not heavy on white-aligned bodies that will be randomly kicking around to convoke this. Hexplate Wallbreaker is nice as it technically survives creature wipes, but Karlach, Fury of Avernus is more immediate in returns. Tempo is often superior to resilience here. Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines feels like she'd make a good include in a Rhino-focused build, which presumably has a bit of flicker going on. The Torpor Orb hatebear element is going to be quite potent at helping slow the game down a bit. Nahiri, the Unforgiving seemed like an interesting future option before I realised I was misreading the 0 as "less than or equal to". A world where we're rocking all five-cost beatsticks and can use this as a surprise recursive double-up is feasible. A world where we're on four-costs and lower, quite a bit less so.
So yeah, I'm not sure what to do here. I'm starting to reconsider Pathligher, as asymmetric wiping is a pretty decent way to remain the aggressor through the mid game. Credit where credit is due, Ascension coming online over a couple of combats has occasionally led to Rhinos getting me back into games I had no business getting back into. Surprisingly, Mondrak is a puzzler though. I quite like the existing doublers being enchantments, as it ensures there's something around to aid in rebuilding in the event of getting stopped. One could argue that Mondrak shields to an extent, and can eat some doomed Rhinos in the event of getting caught out. But there's only so much indestructibility helps with, and that's another mana to try to work into sequencing. Anyone got anything? :P
 
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yeti1069
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Post by yeti1069 » 1 year ago

I haven't looked too much at the set, so I'll just comment on your thoughts.

I think the two questions regarding Mondrak are: do you see more creature exile or enchantment removal, and do you have any way to copy legendary creatures (and have them not die to state based immediately)? If the first is a close call, and the answer to the second is 'yes' I think Mondrak replaces Anointed Procession. A body is generally better than not a body here where we want to be swinging, and if you can copy Mondrak, things will get pretty silly.

Skyhunter looks interesting. Similar to the above, I think Skyhunter's higher ceiling than Beastmaster Ascension, and possibility of having an impact immediately is valuable. Again, this can be copied, and multiple instances of melee stack. It not applying to Ghired attacking copies is a real downside though. So I don't know if it necessarily gets the nod over Beastmaster.

Stalwart isn't that different from Frontline Medic, and I don't see that getting played much or discussed. If you're considering Stalwart, I think you'd go with Frontline first anyway, since it's a significantly better card outside of very defensive, boardwipe heavy decks that happen to run a variety of utility creatures of different sizes (read: not this deck).

Clever Concealment I'm interested to try. I've cast Chord of Calling often enough to say that finding a way to keep up 4 mana worth of creatures and lands is certainly doable to avoid a blowout. That said, I think it comes down to what kind of sweepers you're seeing more often: mass destroy/damage/targeted or mass exile/bounce? Against the former, I think Heroic Intervention wins out most of the time, while against the latter...HI still probably is ahead since it can be used proactively to save attackers and still put damage through.

If you're going for extra combats, I'd thinking one of the creatures without a "first combat of the turn" clause would be stronger, to allow for the possibility of multiple combats. Otherwise, may as well just use one of the better extra combat spells, or Aggravated Assault (+Nature's Will if you want to combo out).

Nahiri being 0 mana after spending 4 the first time for the ability is pretty good. It does kind of suck that you'd have to +1 once or twice in order to get any of the real beef with the ability. Otherwise, this is back in Feldon territory if the effect is desirable.

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