Could Historic make the move to paper tournaments?

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mosskirin
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Post by mosskirin » 4 years ago

Consider the following points:
  • Pauper started as a purely online format, and then migrated to paper
  • Historic fills an organic need/desire for players for a non-rotating format, but at a cheaper cost than Modern. Frontier arose organically and actually got some play for awhile. Just imagine if it was officially supported by WotC.
  • Also, many Modern players are currently dissatisfied with the format since it's extremely linear. Historic could be a good fresh start.
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Post by idSurge » 4 years ago

Probably, in about 5 years or so.

Frontier was not 'organic' it was a construct from some big shop in Japan. It's like if SCG invented a format to move a lot of bulk.
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Post by motleyslayer » 4 years ago

I feel that the biggest/most important factor that could lead to "historic" becoming a paper format is the ever growing dissatisfaction with modern as a format, mostly due to how degenerate it is at this point in time. I won't even go into how out of control the prices of many staples in the format are such as fetchlands and whatnot.

Historic allows WotC to address both issues. a lack of the more expensive staples will at least be a temporary solution to the price problem and provides a fresh start to the degeneracy in a sense

so a TLDR I can see them making a paper historic format could come at any time

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Post by Sojourner Dusk » 4 years ago

I don't see Historic migrating to paper for a few different reasons, not the least of which would be a dearth of building options. Right now, it wouldn't even have a card pool equivalent to Extended at its leanest moments.

It is being created primarily to keep the whales currently pouring funds into Arena from flinging their collective feces at the notion that the money they spent on Ixalan, Rivals, Dominaria, and M19 packs wasn't completely in vain. Because Standard is a rotating format, the logistics of trading/selling cards that are no longer useful works for paper. Arena has no trading options (which is why wildcards exist). Arena has no secondary market.

Come Oct 4th, when all those bits and bytes of the aforementioned sets expire due to rotation, we'll see how well Arena weathers the grousing as Historic attempts to put a band-aid on a amputation.
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idSurge
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Post by idSurge » 4 years ago

motleyslayer wrote:
4 years ago
so a TLDR I can see them making a paper historic format could come at any time
Its far too shallow, it wouldnt last under 'official status' pressure. The first broken deck would wipe out any kind of diversity and lead to a price jump (just as Frontier did btw) on 'format staples' as people fear missing out on the cards when cheap.

I do agree though, Moderns costs are out of control.
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Post by motleyslayer » 4 years ago

idSurge wrote:
4 years ago
motleyslayer wrote:
4 years ago
so a TLDR I can see them making a paper historic format could come at any time
Its far too shallow, it wouldnt last under 'official status' pressure. The first broken deck would wipe out any kind of diversity and lead to a price jump (just as Frontier did btw) on 'format staples' as people fear missing out on the cards when cheap.

I do agree though, Moderns costs are out of control.

I feel that's something that they should consider when announcing a new format, how easily the format could be warped early on. At this point, I don't know what the best starting point would be either. But I guess they'll wanna avoid fetches being in the format

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Post by Mookie » 4 years ago

It's not impossible that Historic gets transferred into paper. I would definitely believe that there is demand for a new non-rotating format, and having WotC / Arena support would give it a significant push that Frontier never had access to. Not having access to fetches / Faithless Looting / Ancient Stirrings / (insert other modern staple that people complain about here) would also give it a distinct identity from Modern. Especially fetches - including them was one of the biggest mistakes Frontier had, IMO.

One question to answer would be whether Historic keeps its starting point at Kaladesh (which may be a poor choice, given the power level of that set and all its associated bannings), or if more prior sets are added in. I've seen Magic Origins suggested as a good starting point for a new format.

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Post by motleyslayer » 4 years ago

The more that I think of it, the more I actually like the idea of making Historic a paper format too.

At this point, making a new format might be easier than trying to fix Modern. They've had to ban so many different combos in the past year and Midrange is starting to be viable again in the form of Jund being okay

if they were gonna start somewhere, I'd say either Amonkhet block. That leaves the Kaladesh out, which is probably for the better. It also gives us a few different dual lands but no way to fetch them, so it gives interesting deckbuilding decisions in how many shocks vs cycle lands to use

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Post by wildfire393 » 4 years ago

Historic isn't even actually a format yet, since we haven't hit rotation and won't for another 2 months. I could definitely see it coming to paper, however.

As far as concerns of the format being broken too quickly, do note that the current standard is exceptionally diverse and fairly well balanced, and Historic is literally that self-same standard (with Rampaging Ferocidons legal, for whatever that's worth).

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Post by rickster » 4 years ago

I was thinking this format was going to cripple modern. But with all the %$#% anti-consumer stuff they're trying to pull on Arena, it seems like it'll be brawl 2.0.

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