Yawgmoth, Father of Machines: Suicide (AKA Blood-Storm) Mono-Black Control

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benjameenbear
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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

I'll be doing a formal set review in a little bit. Real life events, including getting laid off from my job, took over my life for a bit but I think I'm able to have some time to be back in these forums.

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Post by lyonhaert » 4 years ago

Sorry to hear that, mate. I got laid off for the first time a couple years ago and it was rough, so I empathize.
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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

Thanks [mention]lyonhaert[/mention]. I'm still on a hiatus of sorts from MTG until I can find full-time work, but I've been keeping tabs on the new cards and spoilers. I've been able to play a few games and Yawgmoth has done very well in them, as long as he's not Pithing Needled, Cursed Totem, or Linvala, Keeper of Silenced. After a few games, I think I need to find a slot for Exsanguinate, since mass life-gain is so crucial to this deck's core strategy.

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Post by Supersprite » 4 years ago

But what about tombstone stairwell and bridge from below? Both are amazing with a aristocrat effect.

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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

[mention]Supersprite[/mention] because Aristocrat effects don't do enough to actually warrant deckspace. If you've played with Yawgmoth, I think you've discovered that you want to gain life in big packets instead of increments. The large jumps in life-gain are more valuable for explosive turns, which is what Yawgmoth is all about. The Stairwell is a great choice for your deck but giving away free bodies to my opponents hasn't worked out for me as being selfish.

Also, I got a full-time offer of employment! So I'll be back to being an active participant on these forums again. I've got a lot to catch up on for sure, so give me a bit of time to digest everything and I'll hopefully get back to everyone shortly!

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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

Set review for Return to Theros below!

Set Review for Return to Theros
  • Erebos, Bleak-Hearted - it's another draw engine in the deck that triggers on any creature dying, which happens a WHOLE lot in this deck. I think he's definitely worth trying out to help supplement Yawgmoth's draw ability while also providing another way to sacrifice creatures in the deck.
  • Erebos's Intervention - this card is simply wonderful. It's Board control stapled to lifegain or an excellent way to hate on 'yards. I'm picking up several copies of this card straightaway and I recommend you do so too.
  • Drag to the Underworld - another removal spell that cleanly destroys any creature, it's a decent budget alternative.
  • Nyx Lotus - would actually be pretty good in this deck. My devotion count, on average, is around the 5-6 mark at any point in a game (I've been able to play some games finally!) and this Lotus does good work in our permanent based deck. I definitely think that this card deserves a solid amount of testing.
All said, there's isn't anything that's really going to make my list besides the Intervention and the Lotus.

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Post by toctheyounger » 4 years ago

benjameenbear wrote:
4 years ago
Set review for Return to Theros below!

Set Review for Return to Theros
  • Erebos, Bleak-Hearted - it's another draw engine in the deck that triggers on any creature dying, which happens a WHOLE lot in this deck. I think he's definitely worth trying out to help supplement Yawgmoth's draw ability while also providing another way to sacrifice creatures in the deck.
  • Erebos's Intervention - this card is simply wonderful. It's Board control stapled to lifegain or an excellent way to hate on 'yards. I'm picking up several copies of this card straightaway and I recommend you do so too.
  • Drag to the Underworld - another removal spell that cleanly destroys any creature, it's a decent budget alternative.
  • Nyx Lotus - would actually be pretty good in this deck. My devotion count, on average, is around the 5-6 mark at any point in a game (I've been able to play some games finally!) and this Lotus does good work in our permanent based deck. I definitely think that this card deserves a solid amount of testing.
All said, there's isn't anything that's really going to make my list besides the Intervention and the Lotus.
Not worried about Lotus entering tapped? It really puts a damper on how good I think it is, personally.

What are your thoughts on Woe Strider? Personally I'd prefer Viscera Seer for a lower CMC, but it brings it's own fodder at least, and has some resilience. You could always run both, too.
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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

I think that with the sheer amount of permanents available to the deck that the Lotus will always have value. Often times, there is at least ONE enchantment that has 2-3 devotion to black on my battlefield and, oftentimes, it's more likely that I have 5-6 devotion. I think the Lotus is a winner for this deck, personally.

I like Woe Strider a lot, actually. Free sac outlets are a rare thing in MTG and I'm glad they decided to print one, especially one that brings its one fodder too. I do think it's redundant to Yawgmoth, so I would be looking at the Strider as a token generator for Yawgmoth, and it's pretty decent as is. Good look for catching it!

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Post by Supersprite » 4 years ago

What the actual hell?

No talk about nightmare dude? Cant rememeber his name correctly but the one that exiles a dead creature then returns it as a 1/1 with the same abilities? This means every %$#% creature u sack returns to sac another day. ETB effects? Crazy. Like sengir autocrat nets you 8 draws???

I picked some up and i figure its a black edh staple from now on!

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Post by Supersprite » 4 years ago

Nightmare shepherd i mean. Ability optional too.

Some hidden gems:

Also lots of u play bontus monument- wich is fair. But i play oketras monument. Im all about creating that storm.

Another hidden gem is call the bloodline. 1 mana to make a 1/1 lifelink? Lifelink is relevant but alsi 1 mana 1 life to draw another one makes a infinite storm more likely to go troufh your deck. I really want to setup looong turns where i get to make stuff happen.

Ok 1 more: oathsworn vampire 1b with recurrance if you gained life. Well if you dooo dwcide to play bontus monument this reads b, sac draw a card with tawg then do it again. And again. Fun times.

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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

Supersprite wrote:
4 years ago
Nightmare shepherd i mean. Ability optional too.

Some hidden gems:

Also lots of u play bontus monument- wich is fair. But i play oketras monument. Im all about creating that storm.

Another hidden gem is call the bloodline. 1 mana to make a 1/1 lifelink? Lifelink is relevant but alsi 1 mana 1 life to draw another one makes a infinite storm more likely to go troufh your deck. I really want to setup looong turns where i get to make stuff happen.

Ok 1 more: oathsworn vampire 1b with recurrance if you gained life. Well if you dooo dwcide to play bontus monument this reads b, sac draw a card with tawg then do it again. And again. Fun times.
See? Reading is tech. I totally thought that that Nightmare Shepherd was a must trigger, not a may. With this being the case, this card massively goes up in value since repeating ETB abilities (of which there are 16 ish in my list) is VERY good. Thanks for pointing this out, [mention]Supersprite[/mention].

Oathsworn Vampire is definitely some good tech if you have a lot of instances of little life gain in your deck. I've personally found that I prefer to gain life in big chunks over the course of a turn. Yawgmoth lends himself to very explosive turns, and I've found that I prefer gaining life in large chunks from ETB abilities.

However, I will also testify that Blood Artist might make the deck again. I was playing against a jank 5 color Kenrith deck that was playing Syr Konrad, the Grim and, with his ability (since he checked EVERY creature dying, not just my own), I was able to kill 3 of the 6 players that I was playing with. So maybe having an Artist effect that triggers off of EVERY creature dying might be worth it.

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Post by Supersprite » 4 years ago

Well oathsworn only needs a enabler like blood artist or vindictive vampire to be sacable and recurrable, nice lil card.

I found this deck to be very strong actually, i play 41 creatures!!!! and have found that the draw is too easy, i draw like 4 cards a turn and keep creatures open to sac in theirs. They mostly dont remove yawg because ill get my draws anyway..

Its just sac with skill and dig for the win, in my case liliana dreadhorde, sorin markov bolas citadel and\ or a drain effect. Its even good in 1 vs 1 i noticed!
And i dont even play money cards no demonic or vampiric tutors and just 33 swamps as lands! Wait till ill add infect. Ill share my budget list later on.
Of course it misses staples like entomb reanimate living death etc but its fun and goes of relentlessly. I play it like a storm deck, fun.

https://www.nedermagic.nl/deck_item.asp?deckid=146691 cheers

Did i ever told you guys that oketras monument is better then bontus monument??? Tokens all the way please!

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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

Nice list. I appreciate the fact that you're all-in on Yawgmoth's ability. Have you ever come up against Pithing Needle, Cursed Totem, or Linvala, Keeper of Silence? They suck, and it doesn't look like you have any way to deal with Artifacts at all. What has been your experience with this?

I'll be editing the OP list soon with some updates. I've rediscovered Precursor Golem and I like it better in the deck than some other cards. I've also played this deck and made some upgrades to it for Phyrexian flavored cards, so I'll need to get busy!

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Post by lyonhaert » 4 years ago

benjameenbear wrote:
4 years ago
Have you ever come up against Pithing Needle, Cursed Totem, or Linvala, Keeper of Silence? They suck, and it doesn't look like you have any way to deal with Artifacts at all.
When they use these against you, they deserve to be punished with Oblivion Stone. :grin:
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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

Good idea! It can also represent Yawgmoth using the stonechargers during his war with the Alliance. And I do kinda need an additional wrath effect that hits artifacts and enchantments.

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Post by Supersprite » 4 years ago

Well, mono black has few enchantment or artifact hate.
I adjusted my list, played about 10 games and figured i needed more speed.
You could run blast zone, pithing needle, ugin the ineffable or something. I like blast zone, its essentialy free and takes a land spot without come intoplay tapped! Ugin is nice because he makes creatures too wich turn into extra card advantage when you sack them to yawgmoth.

I also upped the number of boardwhipes since people can drop huge things fast in edh and sometimes you dont have enough removal+saccers too keep control.

Dropped the whole reanimate package because ill go extra small and fast for now.

https://www.nedermagic.nl/deck_item.asp?deckid=143892

Im missing some obvious inclusions like demonic tutor, entomb, mana crypt. I do have a yawgmoths will but it isnt in right for yawgmoth since were not trying to combo that way, we want to draw new stuff fast not dig for old treasure

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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

@Supersprite
Yup, I'm playing Blast Zone and Ugin, the Ineffable in the Primer list and they both have performed very well for me.

I have Yawgmoth's Will in the deck for flavor reasons but as an additional way to recur key enchantments, planeswalkers, and artifacts. It might be my playgroup, but artifacts and enchantments die A LOT and I pretty much always want a Grave Pact in play.

Have you considered Smothering Abomination for your list? It's really quite a fantastic card that I'm trying to add back in. Double-drawing off Yawgmoth's ability is delightful and it doesn't cost life to do so. It's also fairly budget, I believe.

Also, you could add in more mana ramp effects to get on the table faster. I will also take a moment to swear by Culling the Weak to all Yawgmoth users. Adding bbbb has enabled some super powerful turns for me and it's a complete flavor win too. Adding in Charcoal Diamond, Coldsteel Heart, and other mana rocks will help ensure that you get a consistent T3 Yawgmoth while also enabling longer combo turns.

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Post by Supersprite » 4 years ago

Yes i have considered abomination, but it seems to be win more at 4 mana. It does nothing with a empty board and only performs when you have a setup.
I traded it 4 nightmare shepherd wich is amazing. Not only can you sac things 2 times it also protects against boardwhipes(wich become very one sided! Imagine having shepherd put then casting toxic deluge then get all your stuff back as 1/1s keeping the engine intact whoaaaa) And removal of yawgmoth.

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Post by benjameenbear » 4 years ago

Fair point. I'll have to tutor for the Shepherd, since I haven't drawn him lately, and give him a go.

I've also made some updates to my decklist to reflect some personal changes and to improve on the Phyrexia flavor.

In: Oblivion Stone, Meteor Golem, Spine of Ish Sah, Batterskull

Out: Razaketh, the Foulblooded, Overseer of the Damned, Precursor Golem, Erebos's Intervention

There might be a few more changes, but I'll need to go through my decklist again and see how it matches up with the OP.

O-Stone, Meteor Golem, and Spine are added in because I REALLY need to be able to deal with utility Enchantments and Artifacts. Batterskull creates a body and equips nicely to any creature to regain mass amounts of life back. I didn't do my research on Precursor Golem and found that it had a Mirran watermark, so it had to go. Razaketh was definitely win-more and the Intervention didn't do as much as I had hoped it would. Overseer is a sad day, because it spawns more tokens, but I needed more all-purpose removal since this deck is QUITE good at killing creatures and spawning bodies.

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Post by benjameenbear » 3 years ago

Very nice reprint with fitting flavor text with Grim Tutor. That was a sorely needed reprint and the art looks fantastic.

Massacre Wurm is also being reprinted, which should make it easier on the wallet. And the new Solemn Simulacrum art looks pretty sinister, so I'll be getting a copy of it to replace the Sad Robot art I currently have.

Interested to see what else gets printed in this set. It's definitely an interesting Core Set, make no mistake.

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Post by benjameenbear » 3 years ago

M21 review:
  • Grim Tutor - man, the art is stunning for this card. I wouldn't fault anyone for getting a copy for that reason alone. And it's a cheap CMC unconditional tutor.
  • Massacre Wurm - an excellent Phyrexian reprint. Clearly, someone at WOTC is compleated.
  • Solemn Simulacrum - the new art looks great.
Otherwise, not much here.

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Post by benjameenbear » 3 years ago

Noticed that my opening hands were more land lite than I enjoy. I cut Spine of Ish Sah for a Swamp to make opening hands a little more palatable and the Spine was turning out to be redundant.

Also, I'm contemplating the removal of Bolas's Citadel + Aetherflux Reservoir + Sensei's Divining Top from the deck. I've had it so often in hand but never put the pieces in play and it's not exactly Phyrexian in flavor. I'll probably include the package in the OP and Primer but vary my paper list with the omission of this combo for a little while and see how it tests. I'll be adding in K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth, Army of the Damned, and Hangarback Walker to increase flavor in the deck and add more Token generators.

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Post by benjameenbear » 3 years ago

I've noticed, in the few games that I've been able to play, that I don't miss the exclusion of the Sensei's Citadel combo in the deck. I usually tutor for Mikaeus and am able to utilize him effectively enough that I still don't need to go infinite in order to win. I'm contemplating on making the change permanent and maybe replace Army of the Damned for Blightsteel Colossus since it recently got reprinted and is super Phyrexian.

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Post by benjameenbear » 3 years ago

While the full set review won't be coming until the full set is out, there are definitely a few cards that look decent enough to test out.
  • Nullpriest of Oblivion - looks interesting because it can be sac fodder if necessary, a semi-evasive Lifelinker to help replenish our life total, or another Reanimate effect to get more value from spent creatures. I like it, from my first impression, but I don't know if I can justify its inclusion from a theme perspective. This deck is VERY tight as is, in that regard.
  • Coveted Prize - yay, Yawgmoth's a Cleric! Boo, there are basically NO other Party members that could help reduce this card's cost to an attractive level. Diabolic Tutor is more consistent and cheaper.
  • Taborax, Hope's Demise - this is a very interesting card for this deck. It should be able to grow quite substantially and it provides Card Advantage when Yawgmoth dies (which is often). I won't say that it's an auto-include, but it has certainly caught my eye.
  • Malakir Rebirth - this isn't a terrible flip card for this deck, in that being able to recur a creature to Yawgmoth's ability and squeeze some more ETB action is attractive. The opportunity cost is pretty low as well, since it can be a land when needed.
  • Feed the Swarm - finally, targeted Enchantment removal in Black. I'll find room for this card somehow...
  • Relic Vial - conveniently, Yawgmoth is a Cleric! This helps to recover our life total and synergizes with the core strategy of sacrificing creatures to draw cards. I think this card is decent, but is sub-par when compared to Bastion of Remembrance which actually produces a body alongside its life recovery effect.

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Post by benjameenbear » 3 years ago

Wow. I LOVE the new Phyrexian cards that are being printed and will have to critically reevaluate every single card for maximal synergy, power, and Vorthos. I can't wait to do a full set review.

Tevesh Szat looks particularly awesome for this deck since it produces tokens, functions as another Yawgmoth card draw effect, and has an incredible ultimate that is actually worthwhile to charge up or proliferate into.

Wotc is becoming compleated...

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