Sidisi, Brood Tyrant - Zombie Horde and Shenanigans

[WWolfe]

Hordewing Skaab clears the problem I had with Eternal Skylord which was that Skylord only gave our tokens flying whereas Skaab gives all our zombies flying. Seems pertinent for the Zombie build at least.

Wilhelt, the Rotcleaver seems like a pretty easy auto include unless it plays much more than it looks.

[NZB2323]

What do you guys think of Glimpse the Unthinkable in this deck?

[WWolfe]

I don't really like it. 10 cards is too much at one time IMO. No matter how many creature cards you hit during that 10 you only get one zombie token. I like to keep my mills to 3 or less.

[WWolfe]

I may have to stop playing my optimized deck for a while, I'm constantly the target even when there's more powerful decks at the table because people have seen it pop off so many times.

[DementedKirby]

I may have to stop playing my optimized deck for a while, I'm constantly the target even when there's more powerful decks at the table because people have seen it pop off so many times.

That can happen, unfortunately. Even though the deck isn't inherently broken in terms of expensive/powerful cards. It's just that the deck is such a well-oiled machine. It's very hard not to be amazed (or frightened) when it goes off.

[DementedKirby]

Here's my review for Innistrad Crimson Vow:

• Geralf, Visionary Stitcher - Giving flying to our zombies is really just a bonus since we have better ways of making our zombies unblockable. But being able to sacrifice another nontoken creature (which we can later reanimate) in order to create a beefy zombie is definitely something to consider for the zombie build.
• Necroduality - 100% going in the Zombie Build, no question, no need to explain further. This card is ridiculous.
• Overcharged Amalgam - Another counterspell on a body? Sign me up! This can go in any version (except the Budget Build, naturally).
• Scattered Thoughts - Although I tend to avoid adding too many noncreature cards to a deck, this seems decent enough for the Budget Build if any other similar card becomes a bit pricier over time.
• Archghoul of Thraben - Another amazing card for the Zombie Build since it has so many actual zombie cards in it. Being able to either draw a zombie card or self-mill whenever a zombie dies is amazing. Especially when we can sacrifice zombies at will in order to dig through our deck and fill our graveyard. Amazing!
• Headless Rider - Since this cares about nontoken zombies, it goes amazing in the Zombie Build since you can recur Gravecrawler infinitely many times when you have the combo online. So if you're unable to kill the table with the life loss effects, you can get infinitely many zombie tokens, that can then be sacrificed to Phyrexian Altar for infinite mana. So the ceiling is game over and the floor is pure value. This card is insanely good.
• Undead Butler - Self-mill on a body with a potential to recover a creature card from the graveyard? Definitley worth including if the price if right.
• Grolnok, the Omnivore - It's a huge gambit to have this in a graveyard matters deck like this one since your milled cards are essentially exiled. However, it is a good way to protect your mill cards from opponents' own graveyard exile effects. That being said, I'd rather risk it for the biscuit and be able to reanimate things for cheaper than simply being able to cast them from exile if they had a croak counter on them.

[WWolfe]

The zombie tribal build definitely got some new toys in this set. Unfortunately the main build really didn't get any help...not that it needs it.

[DementedKirby]

The zombie tribal build definitely got some new toys in this set. Unfortunately the main build really didn't get any help...not that it needs it.

Yeah, but in part I'm a bit grateful for that since it's always so impossibly difficult to find cuts in the Main Build if there were any goodies. Right now the only cut I made was swapping out Blex, Vexing Pest // Search for Blex for Overcharged Amalgam since it's another counterspell on a body. And quite the counterspell at that since it's strictly better than Mystic Snake and Frilled Mystic. So that was a definite shoe-in. But apart from that, no other changes.

[NZB2323]

Last night I won a game off of Zombie Apocalypse. 3 of the creatures it brought back were Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Fleshbag Marauder, and Mikaeus, the Unhallowed. Gary made each opponent lose 20 life upon entering, then I sacrificed Gary to Fleshbag Marauder, and it came back to make each opponent lose another 20 life because of Mikaeus.

[DementedKirby]

Last night I won a game off of Zombie Apocalypse. 3 of the creatures it brought back were Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Fleshbag Marauder, and Mikaeus, the Unhallowed. Gary made each opponent lose 20 life upon entering, then I sacrificed Gary to Fleshbag Marauder, and it came back to make each opponent lose another 20 life because of Mikaeus.

Oof!! Now that's a spicy win!

[NZB2323]

Last night I won a game off of Zombie Apocalypse. 3 of the creatures it brought back were Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Fleshbag Marauder, and Mikaeus, the Unhallowed. Gary made each opponent lose 20 life upon entering, then I sacrificed Gary to Fleshbag Marauder, and it came back to make each opponent lose another 20 life because of Mikaeus.

Oof!! Now that's a spicy win!

I'm really loving all the different ways this deck can win. Tonight I won by discarding Wonder to Lotleth Troll for a lethal flying strike.

[Kiltacular Jim]

I'm having a ton of fun messing with your Sidisi takes! I'm curious if you have a current list for the zombie version that takes into accounts the recent sets? Mostly for the cuts you've made, really -- such a tight list.

[DementedKirby]

I'm having a ton of fun messing with your Sidisi takes! I'm curious if you have a current list for the zombie version that takes into accounts the recent sets? Mostly for the cuts you've made, really -- such a tight list.

Hey! Sorry for the late reply; I was on vacation for the holidays.

I have yet to update the Zombie Build. But that's something I do have on the agenda. I might get around to it in a couple of weeks since I doubt zombies are going to be a featured tribe in Neon Dynasty. So I can really analyze it. And yeah, as you well put it, making cuts to this deck - regardless of the version - is incredibly difficult...

[DementedKirby]

Here's my review for Kamigawa Neon Dynasty:

• Boseiju, Who Endures - The chasest card of the set, this one provides the conundrum of whether or not it takes up a land slot in the deck or not. Since we're milling ourselves quite often, we're inevitably losing lands. However, since we can play lands from the graveyard, it doesn't matter if we channel this, dregde it, or play it, it'll still be a land. So it's definitely worth a slot, which I'm more inclined to use a land slot for.
• Colossal Skyturtle - It's two spells on a body which is great since we want as many creature cards in the deck as possible. We can either use it as a recovery spell or use it as a bounce spell. It can then be reanimated as a 6/5 flyer with ward 2. Definitely worth considering. Should 100% go in the Budget Build.
• Mirrorshell Crab - Another creature with channel, which is amazing for being a spell on a body. This one can also hit abilities as well as spells, which is amazing. It's also a 5/7 with ward 3 when reanimated. Definitely worth considering. Should 100% go in the Budget Build.
• Otawara, Soaring City - This is the only one of the 3 channel lands I'm on the fence for. The deck is already running enough nonbasic lands (there's only one of each basic land in it). That being said, it is slight removal similar to Boseiju and the logic for including it is the same.
• Shigeki, Jukai Visionary - It essentially costs 2GG and tapping to consistently use it over the course of 2 turns each time, but you are self-milling yourself for up to 4 cards if you fail to find a land. It's 100% going in the Main Build. Especially since you can channel him and recover some cards to hand as a mana sink, too.
• Spring-Leaf Avenger - While we'd rather reanimate creatures than recover them to our hand, this ninja is actually amazing since we can get back channel lands, channel creatures, and any other permanent we might want. It doesn't have evasion but with the Filth + Urborg combo, it's going to be unblockable anyways.
• Takenuma, Abandoned Mire - 100% going in the deck. No question. It should be painfully obvious why. And it takes up a land slot, so we keep all of the deck's ratios the same.

[WWolfe]

Curious to see your thoughts on the new set.

[wyre6330]

So I follow your Moxfield page and saw that you added Angel of Suffering. I am pretty sure she activates with pain lands. Any thought about putting those back in?

[DementedKirby]

So I follow your Moxfield page and saw that you added Angel of Suffering. I am pretty sure she activates with pain lands. Any thought about putting those back in?

That's a very good point. That's something I can definitely consider. I'd have to see which lands to cut for them. Maybe I'll put swap them back with the opponent lands, since that was the original swap in the first place.

[DementedKirby]

Here's my review for Streets of New Capenna:

• Angel of Suffering - 100% going in the deck. This card is absolutely insane. Although we still lose life to strict life loss effects, anything that's damage will be doing us a favor. This card is ridiculously good here!
• Cemetery Tampering - Although a noncreature card, this could still potentially go in the Budget Build since it self-mills 3 cards during our upkeep (a great number to self-mill here) and you're more than likely going to meet the hideaway requirements. It's not an auto-include, but definitely worth considering.
• Sanguine Spy - You can essentially surveil 1 by pay 1 and sacrificing a zombie token, turning them into possibly more zombies. This is a bit risky though, since the odds won't be 100% unless you've been manipulating the top of your library. You can also draw a card more often than not with its final ability. It has potential.
• Evolving Door - This card is pretty interesting because we can sacrifice zombie tokens to it to tutor for 2-colored creatures in the deck, which are plentiful. It is an artifact, though, so it would have to perform impressively well in order to make the cut. But this one is definitely worth testing since we can get things like Havengul Lich, The Gitrog Monster, etc. with it.
• Vivien on the Hunt - While I've since taken out Prime Speaker Vannifar and her lines out of the deck, Vivien has a similar Birthing Pod effect as her +2 ability, which is great. Her +1 ability is amazing in the deck since we self-mill 5 and then can put one of those creatures into our hand if we'd rather cast it than reanimate it. Her -1 is pretty useful still but we'd rather be using her 1st 2 abilities. Space is tight for noncreature cards (especially ones that cost 6 mana) but she's definitely worth testing.

[DementedKirby]

Here's my review for New Capenna Commander:

• Dogged Detective - It surveils when it enters the battlefield and then it can potentially return from the graveyard to your hand. Not necessarily a bad card, considering that we can use it as sacrifice fodder. But there are already so many good cards in the deck that it's not worth swapping out anything for it. Maybe the Budget Build?
• Lethal Scheme - This instant has the potential to be absolutely free thanks to the black zombie tokens we'll undoubtedly have. While it is an instant, we can also potentially loot once 4 times. I don't know if I'd include it, though, considering it's not a creature spell and the slots for noncreature spells in the deck is pretty tight.
• Writ of Return - Very interesting in that it's a repeatable way to reanimate creatures from the graveyard. We'd simply have to connect with combat damage. While the deck doesn't have many ways of granting evasion, it's not a bad card to consider.
• Threefold Signal - Just going to mention that this one is pretty interesting for nothing else than to copy Sidisi herself for paying an extra 3 when casting her. Her copy enters the battlefield first, self-milling three and then the original enters the battlefield. We can then choose to keep the original or the copy and then self-mill 3 again regardless the choice. So it's interesting, to say the least.

[WWolfe]

I can't decide what to take out for Angel of Suffering. I'm trying to stay on curve so replace a 5 drop with it. I'm leaning towards Final Parting but am not sure.

[DementedKirby]

I can't decide what to take out for Angel of Suffering. I'm trying to stay on curve so replace a 5 drop with it. I'm leaning towards Final Parting but am not sure.

Whoa, whoa, whoa! I would never take out Final Parting. That card alone sets up Filth + Urborg.

[WWolfe]

Valid point, I'm thinking about Tortured Existence for it. I put it in as a placeholder for Wrenn and Seven but I've yet to acquire one. I forgot about that until I was just thumbing through my deck.

I'm also going to be adding Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet back in. My meta has gone board wipe happy for some reason lately.

[DementedKirby]

Valid point, I'm thinking about Tortured Existence for it. I put it in as a placeholder for Wrenn and Seven but I've yet to acquire one. I forgot about that until I was just thumbing through my deck.

I'm also going to be adding Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet back in. My meta has gone board wipe happy for some reason lately.

Whew! Yeah, those sound more reasonable, lol.

[KitsuLeif]

I've been considering coming back to Sidisi for a while now, but Angel of Suffering completely tipped me over the edge. I have to make cuts from like 5-6 other decks to build Sidisi once again (and since I only got one copy of Kozilek and Ulamog I'm considering putting only one in Sidisi and leaving the other in another deck), but I think it will be worth it.
You say you have cut Vannifar and her lines from your deck, but the current decklist still features her. I'd love to see an updated version of it.

[WWolfe]

I think the link to his Moxfield deck list is somewhere in this thread.

(I would find the link and post it but I'm doing this from a smartphone so not the easiest task to accomplish that on)