Rakdos, Rip Their Face Off

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Tevesh
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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

I don't play Rakdos very often because he's very swingy; he durdles or dominates. And when he dominates, he shuts other players completely out of the game. He gets ported over because of how long I've had the deck and unique take on it. Instead of playing Eldrazi or efficient fatties, I play things that lock other players out of the game. The idea is that if I can stick my fatty, I can win the game and the best way to do that is to protect them. Each of these creatures has innate ways to protect themselves or my board. This is why I gave the deck the nickname 'Staxdos' because Rakdos wants to deny opponents resources, very much like Stax.
Staxdos

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Tevesh
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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

First update at Nexus for my boy, Rakdos:
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Pirates don't matter to the deck, but you would be surprised by how often I get knocked out because a flyer retaliated. Trebuchet brings Reach and that should protect my face for one swing which sort of matters when my deck is designed to do as much damage as possible.
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shermanido37
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Post by shermanido37 » 4 years ago

Nice to see you joining the fray. I almost thought you retired the deck!
How has Neheb turned out for you? He looks a bit conditional to me. I'm also surprised you run 4 Mana Neheb instead of 5 Mana Neheb.

I'm taking a longer look at Rankle for your deck. He can force discard and sac while hitting for 3 as soon as he arrives. That is pretty stax in my book.

Obligatory first shout-out to my unloved boy Underworld Cerberus in the new thread. I could definitely see him being run instead of the red Gearhulk.

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

shermanido37 wrote:
4 years ago
Nice to see you joining the fray. I almost thought you retired the deck!
How has Neheb turned out for you? He looks a bit conditional to me. I'm also surprised you run 4 Mana Neheb instead of 5 Mana Neheb.

I'm taking a longer look at Rankle for your deck. He can force discard and sac while hitting for 3 as soon as he arrives. That is pretty stax in my book.

Obligatory first shout-out to my unloved boy Underworld Cerberus in the new thread. I could definitely see him being run instead of the red Gearhulk.
Nah, couldn't do that to my first EDH deck. Looking back at my first builds, it is pretty embarrassing.

Not sure how Neheb, Dreadhorde Champion would work out. He's hasn't been drawn yet. I put him in to help me Rummage and give me Red mana to fuel either expensive spells, pay for Red or just help me recast Rakdos second main with his Trample. I don't play this deck often, as it it pretty mean but I get a good laugh at a lot of players who have no clue what's about to happen. I haven't been playing in the wild, per se, recently so I'm going to change that as my regular opponents are on the ball with a noggin on their shoulders. That means Rakdos would make a more common appearance as there's only so many times leading lambs to the slaughter is fun.

You do raise a good point about Rankle; perhaps he could replace my Stronghold Rats but they're in because they enable Rakdos on Turn 4 and deny opponents resources. He looks good, but I don't want to spend $11 CAD on a lark.

Combustible Gearhulk is there to draw me cards. Underworld Cereberus would fulfill a different slot and considering the various reanimation chains this deck can pull off, I'd rather not hose myself accidentally.

I decided to increase the mean in my deck as I'm facing regular, intelligent players who are good to play against to hone my decks:
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Vampiric Tutor is just being removed to go into another deck; I might be building something actually competitive. I've been looking for more ways to protect Rakdos, and maybe ways to deal with crackbacks from the table, so bad Mike makes an appearance. He'll destroy Humans, buff my team and gives them Undying. 6/6s in the sky are becoming more and more common, so Rakdos is having a harder time punching in without trading.

Captain Kirk seems like serious dirty pool. Turning my life total into mana, combined with Rakdos' natural reduction should make for some silly plays. Overseer staxes my opponent by killing a Creature, but another way to make an opponent's resources irrelevant is massively outvaluing them which I think Kirk here can do.

Kothophed has made me die a few times from things dying, just a wee bit of Aristrocrats vibe from the pod and Koth is sweating. Vilis seems absurd, especially since my opponents will probably hurt me on their turn, leaving with a massive grip to unleash on my turn without worrying about Discard. I also see Vilis and Kirk have a beautiful friendship, plus Vilis also plays nice with Razaketh, the Foulblooded who is already my biggest combo chain enabler.
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Post by shermanido37 » 4 years ago

I feel like Krrik is too risky. Your deck is already not the best at defense and with hardly any ways to gain life. Gaining real value from him is 4+ life for each creature which can be surprisingly taxing, not to mention that getting him out properly probably means you're already down 8 life before you can pay anything else. Not to mention he does nothing for all your red and colorless cards.

Mikaeus is definitely a powerhouse, and protection definitely feels like something this deck needs. I also recommend Soul of New Phyrexia, since it's reducable to 0 through Rakdos, protects your entire board, is a big fattie with evasion, and is activatable from the yard in case you discard it.

Another thought - what do you think of more cheating fatties into play? Stuff like Sneak Attack, Illharg, the Raze Boar, Mimic Vat, Cauldron Dance... There's a bunch of them. Sneak and the Boar feel the best.

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

shermanido37 wrote:
4 years ago
I feel like Krrik is too risky. Your deck is already not the best at defense and with hardly any ways to gain life. Gaining real value from him is 4+ life for each creature which can be surprisingly taxing, not to mention that getting him out properly probably means you're already down 8 life before you can pay anything else. Not to mention he does nothing for all your red and colorless cards.

Mikaeus is definitely a powerhouse, and protection definitely feels like something this deck needs. I also recommend Soul of New Phyrexia, since it's reducable to 0 through Rakdos, protects your entire board, is a big fattie with evasion, and is activatable from the yard in case you discard it.

Another thought - what do you think of more cheating fatties into play? Stuff like Sneak Attack, Illharg, the Raze Boar, Mimic Vat, Cauldron Dance... There's a bunch of them. Sneak and the Boar feel the best.
Kirk isn't there to gain me life but help me push through my nonsense lockdowns. With him, he can effectively let me push through Razaketh, the Foulblooded with fetching, casting and saccing Creatures until my board overpowers my opponent. There's not much many decks can do in the face of Void Winnower, Nullstone Gargoyle and Sire of Insanity plus whatever else I have on the board. Or just go for some infinite life combo with Razaketh fetching Gary and Chainer, Dementia Master, if I have enough life.

In no world do I have 5 open mana to activate Soul of New Phyrexia. If I have five open mana, I've lost.

Sneak Attack effects are pretty good, but I think I'll pass on them. Introducing that would fundamentally change the way the deck operates and I like Rakdos as is.

Anyway, just a minor upgrade:
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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

I think this is the cheapest the Whisperer will ever get:
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Belzenlock leaves because his draw was very hit or miss; he would greedily eat my life total for too much or he would actually draw maybe two or three cards and then stop. Doom Whisperer pays the same amount of life but at will to manipulate the top of my library to guarantee what I want to draw. Whisperer can do that every turn. Otherwise, same body and the Flample keyword but the Whisperer is even more pushed by being a five drop. That is something that can easily make sure I get my 6th land, get in and allow me to recast Rakdos.

Apparently I'm at 101 so I'm cutting the Rats as they seem to be the most cuttable thing in the deck to get me to a legal deck size.

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Post by shermanido37 » 4 years ago

I actually like Retreat to Hagra less than the rats. Drain 1 is cute but inessential, and is only 1 lifeloss more than the rats. The rats do need to wait a round, but they cost 1 less which is important, and every time they hit you get a 3 for 1 trade on your worst card. Even better if you're hellbent.

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

shermanido37 wrote:
4 years ago
I actually like Retreat to Hagra less than the rats. Drain 1 is cute but inessential, and is only 1 lifeloss more than the rats. The rats do need to wait a round, but they cost 1 less which is important, and every time they hit you get a 3 for 1 trade on your worst card. Even better if you're hellbent.
You raise a great point:
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I'm putting the Rats back in because of the reasons shermanido37 lists, plus it can be used as fodder for Razaketh, the Foulblooded or Tortured Existence.

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

Better pain:
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The deck needs to make sure it hits its land drops, digs for more threats and other possible enablers once the board gets wrathed. Stormfist Crusader fills this and comes down as early as Turn 2, making sure I have extra draws and enables to cast Rakdos without even turning sideways. Unfortunately, giving people the cards and the Rat's taking them away lead to an awkward push. I've decided to make sure if I'm going the Discard route, it should hit hard or not at all. Myojin of Night's Reach and Sire of Insanity keep me ahead while ripping the cards out from my opponent's hands. Rats bite the bullet.

The Spawn of Mayhem has evasion and does OK in the enabling department. Its' Spectacle ability is effectively nonexistant and as it stands, the Spawn is the least interesting card doing what its doing at the 4 CMC slot. The Giant gives me a lot more hurt when it turns sideways; up to 9 to power out free Artisan of Kozilek and other absurdities. If I need to draw, it also offers me that as well. All this and that isn't even having the Giant connect. I've got the sneaking suspicion that this Giant is going to overperform in a lot of different aggressive decks.

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

Interacting and fixing:
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I was a little surprised to find out that I don't have an Urborg in this deck. I was reminded when I saw it's price surge which makes me sad. I dissembled a few retired decks and pulled scraps from them. Urborg is damned helpful with my more recent changes to include a few more Triple Black pips.

I wanted more interaction in my deck. Usually, the Archfiend was nice but wasn't mean enough for the deck. Sure, making people Sacrifice down to two is good and all, but I rather hammer away their whole board if I can help it. This allows me to get my men in and Force of Despair is free.

Another Demon that was nice was the Sower of Discord. It was nice to tie two people together; however, I found that it didn't really help me win. Considering how often my Creatures need to be countered and killed, I think Living Death is a reasonable addition. Sure, I can't reduce it's mana cost but if Rakdos is out on board, I don't need to cast it. If he isn't, then five mana isn't a big deal considering I get to five the turn after Rakdos hits the board and my yard is usually filled with big nasties.

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

Shifting gears:
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A few years ago, when I just started getting back into Magic and EDH, my Rakdos deck would've been inappropriate to play. It hit hard and fast and semi-reliably. That's not the case so much anymore; the deck has only gotten more reliable but the floor of mid-tier battlecruiser Magic has risen rapidly. So, as Rakdos is no longer as efficient at fighting the table as other Commanders at higher tier play and the pushed, card advantage monstrosities that Wizards has been churning out as of late has me realizing that Rakdos might be fine with swimming in the middle of the ocean. With that in mind, I've cut my mana denial of Keldon Firebombers and put in more interaction to keep Rakdos alive with Supernatural Stamina.

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Post by shermanido37 » 4 years ago

That seems pretty narrow. You already have Sheoldred, Artisan of Kozilek, Mikaeus and Chainer as consistency, I don't see the benefit of slamming a bad combat trick for the sole purpose of keeping your commander alive. Wouldn't you rather have Lightning Greaves?

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

shermanido37 wrote:
4 years ago
That seems pretty narrow. You already have Sheoldred, Artisan of Kozilek, Mikaeus and Chainer as consistency, I don't see the benefit of slamming a bad combat trick for the sole purpose of keeping your commander alive. Wouldn't you rather have Lightning Greaves?
It's to keep Rakdos alive after a Wrath.

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Post by plushpenguin » 4 years ago

I would generally consider such an effect worse than something that gives straight hexproof, but this is basically the best that black gets. Red has redirect effects which can also work against spot removal and counterspells, but may have other downsides.

As decks get faster, protecting your critical turn becomes ever more important. For example, I plan around spot removal in Xenagod, using both the red 1 mana anti-blue options, Veil of Summer, and Vines of Vastwood to protect my critical turn. This turn is my first attack and often the most important attack, as it can either set up future turns or straight up remove a player before they can go off.

The permanents do stuff turn after turn, but are often too expensive to be relevant when you need the effect most. Hard casting Sheoldred is really not where this deck wants to be if at all possible.

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Post by Tevesh » 4 years ago

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I realized that as fun as Rakdos' third incarnation is, he isn't really what I would want to run this deck. Dread deters current and future Creatures people and Fear gets in as good as Flying ever did. While I can't tutor Dread with Blood Speaker I didn't do that with Showstopper anyway. I hope the extra Black pip isn't going to be too much, I find most of my land composition to be a Swamp and Duals.

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Post by Tevesh » 3 years ago

I was one mana short which made me re-evaluate the manabase:
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I was one mana or two life short when I had Cap'n Kirk out to go off. That made me look for any improvements. I realized that I didn't have a big mana land for a deck that probably wouldn't say no to lots of mana; no way Jose regarding Cabal Coffers but Nykthos could fit. I don't want to cut any colour making sources because of the imperative to get RRBB on Turn 4 for Rakdos. I realized that one of my supposed colour makers was a big fat lie: Shadowblood Ridge. I've gotta pay for the privilege of coloured mana and I was sent on a PSTD spiral of the amount of times remembering not wanting that stupid Red mana but wanted all-in on Black. Well, I'm not cutting any true coloured sources with this swap and Nykthos will help me power out lots of Black mana with all of the Black pips this deck runs to help me cast my even bigger, meaner men.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 3 years ago

I guess Nykthos should be okay. It appears to be the only actually colourless land in your mana base, so just like I don't just auto-die with Reliquary Tower in Feather you can probably absorb a single useless land in your Rakdos build-up.

Nice to see you still going strong with this deck. Are any of your builds disassembly immune enough to consider primering out?
 
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Post by Tevesh » 3 years ago

Rumpy5897 wrote:
3 years ago
I guess Nykthos should be okay. It appears to be the only actually colourless land in your mana base, so just like I don't just auto-die with Reliquary Tower in Feather you can probably absorb a single useless land in your Rakdos build-up.

Nice to see you still going strong with this deck. Are any of your builds disassembly immune enough to consider primering out?
Sure, I'm very fond of Rakdos, Ruric Thar and Marchesa but I'm not sure I'd want to spend my energies into turning any of them into a Primer. I made the attempt a few years ago on Sally and just didn't want to try after the feedback I got. I also continually tinker, it's probably my favourite part of EDH, so I'm not too sure I'd want to spend time writing up a piece or collection only to have it be made obsolete by the increasing power level that Wizards is pouring into EDH. My Marchesa is a good example; each set there seems to be a card just tailor made for her. It's hard to keep a deck interesting and original when Wizards just keeps tossing these obvious slowballs. Like the Dryad of the Ilysian Grove; I saw that and immediately bought like six copies - I knew it's a card that just goes in every Green deck. I'd be all over those free spells as well but the ones I'm interested in are ranging from $20 to $50 which is hard to justify even without the coronavirus killing my ability to make income.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 3 years ago

For what it's worth, the committee is an ever-evolving body, and I took the opportunity to apply when the forum jumped ship to Nexus. It feels different these days than it did back when I created my notions of the process back on Sally, there are some internal procedures in place to make the thing feel like someone's just proofreading your thread. I may be biased as I'm part of the other side of the barricade these days though, but the applicants do seem largely happy. We've had some folks pop by with second primers after their first ones went through, which seems promising.

Huh, I honestly didn't notice that much EDH power creep. Might be because it's not targeted at any of my decks. They've been doing a pretty good job of printing relatively niche cards, so I guess those niches just align better with what you're doing. What sort of non-Dryad stuff are they cramming down your throat? That said, the free spells are a good example of something that looks like it's going to be omnipresent, yet doesn't end up being. I pull very few punches when building, and the only one I went for is the blue one as it is admittedly dumb as hell. The black one could see some play in decks without access to white or blue, but that's about it really.

Crap, I'm super sorry to hear about the coronavirus situation. Things are weird with the world coming to a standstill. Hopefully there's some sensible system in place to keep folks afloat in your neck of the woods?
 
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Post by Tevesh » 3 years ago

Rumpy5897 wrote:
3 years ago
For what it's worth, the committee is an ever-evolving body, and I took the opportunity to apply when the forum jumped ship to Nexus. It feels different these days than it did back when I created my notions of the process back on Sally, there are some internal procedures in place to make the thing feel like someone's just proofreading your thread. I may be biased as I'm part of the other side of the barricade these days though, but the applicants do seem largely happy. We've had some folks pop by with second primers after their first ones went through, which seems promising.

Huh, I honestly didn't notice that much EDH power creep. Might be because it's not targeted at any of my decks. They've been doing a pretty good job of printing relatively niche cards, so I guess those niches just align better with what you're doing. What sort of non-Dryad stuff are they cramming down your throat? That said, the free spells are a good example of something that looks like it's going to be omnipresent, yet doesn't end up being. I pull very few punches when building, and the only one I went for is the blue one as it is admittedly dumb as hell. The black one could see some play in decks without access to white or blue, but that's about it really.

Crap, I'm super sorry to hear about the coronavirus situation. Things are weird with the world coming to a standstill. Hopefully there's some sensible system in place to keep folks afloat in your neck of the woods?
Maybe I'll consider Primering in the future, but I've got a bunch of my own projects to do, including trying to get financial relief through the government.

I just find a lot of the cards Wizards has been putting out to have been lazily straight forward and obvious. For example, while the five new Ultimatums are particular dumb, nothing made me roll my eyes more than Whirlwind of Thought - this is the type of card that should go in every Jeskai Spellslinger. This would be far more interesting if it was more restricted or was given a different colour combination - Jeskai already wants to cast Noncreatures and everybody likes drawing cards. Marchesa's releases have been the most 'obvious' to me, with each new release making me make room for the new cards. I'm already doing a fairly niche strategy and making it playable by banking off of Marchesa's inherent brokenness.

I understand Wizards has to sell packs but it's been getting insultingly straight forward for a while now. I'm finding it hard to do something unique. I get annoyed when someone says 'This is my X deck' and I can guess within 95% of what's in the deck based off of the Commander. That isn't your deck, that's you just cribbing notes off of your mate and passing it off as your own work. While the homogeneous of the format is due to the prevalence of information through EDHRec and the followers of the various Cults of Personalities, I can't find faults for people being unable to think for themselves. Critical thinking is not required to play this game and others don't have the time to design but still want to compete. My issue is having Wizards just print boring, obvious cards and this has been aggravating me for awhile.

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shermanido37
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Post by shermanido37 » 3 years ago

An example of a broken EDH card is Fiend Artisan. It's pretty clear that if your golgari deck is running creatures, this guy should be slotted in.
It is getting to be somewhat of a problem, with netdecking and copying other peoples' lists, but I think that has existed for a while now. People always asked other people for advice, many times copying what the internet said without understanding the point behind it - to me the main difference is that there are more people playing the format, so there is more such content everywhere, so it's so easily accessible to not think about what to slot in your deck and have other people do it for you.
My opinion is that the meta can be a huge factor in that. If you just copy a random Urza list with obnoxious artifact shenanigans, people can cry about it, or they can play Kataki, War's Wage or other artifact answers. Then it's up to you if you let it stay that way, or you want to spice it up so that these cards don't spell the end for you. Then you and your meta continue playing around each other and looking for different strategies, and that's where creativity can start breeding.

Back to your list, though, I'm not sure I 100% agree with you. True, more conventional strategies have been getting a lot of goodies, but there have been some good cards for you, like Glint-Horn Buccaneer. The way I see it, it's just that recent sets have really been hating on black, and your deck really seems to suffer from that. Plus, if you're not in the Khans color identities, you didn't really benefit from the cards like Whirlwind of Thought or the Trilands.

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Tevesh
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Post by Tevesh » 3 years ago

I played a lot with friends as restrictions have been lifted; not enough to go to a LGS but over at a home to sling some cards. I lost because I didn't see far ahead enough.

This was a pretty brutal game, coming down to the wire. I got an early lead as no one had answered Rakdos, so I was able to get a Tectonic Giant down and Myojin of Night's Reach. The player with the highest win rate was who I held priority at the end of his draw step to use Myojin, making the table lose their hands. Perhaps I should have killed someone else but he was the one I wanted to make sure was gone. I got two swings with the Tec Giant and I'm impressed: he let me dig four cards deep for good stuff until he was answered. The second card I held until the end of my turn was Bedevil and I used that incorrectly.

One of the players was using Neheb, the Eternal and his playstyle is akin to a chimp with a hand grenade. He pulls the pin and doesn't care where the grenade goes off. Realizing he couldn't win, he was fine with making us all draw. He had a Fire Servant out and used Pyromancer's Goggles on an Earthquake with X being 11. He was at twenty, so I thought to use the Bedevil on the Fire Servant because I saw his intention of killing everybody with 44 damage. So, I halfed his damage by killing his Servant and he died on the second Earthquake. If I just took a moment, I would've realized that he would've died to the first Quake and I didn't need to spend my Bedevil on his Fire Servant - I could use it instead on one of the surviving Flyers an opponent had. I did lose a lot of guys but the bulk of my danger comes from my team of Flyers.

I ended up having to trade one of them, so I couldn't attack in with Rakdos to reduce costs and use Razaketh, the Foulblooded to set up a game winning combo chain. I was short one mana from being able to fetch and use Gray Merchant of Asphodel and that's after using Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx to power out big old Razzie from 5 Devotion: Rakdos and Necropotence. While I'm wracking my brain for a reliable way to generate extra mana, such as, Molten Slagheap, the real answer is making sure I don't see his intention and not reality. A lesson is taking a moment to see if someone's intention aligns with the actual consequences. The times when you can catch someone out with an onboard trick makes you feel like a genius.

Overall, I'm pleased with how Rakdos has been performing. Though it is in an awkward position: it can overwhelm if left unanswered, can combo off with an infinite if left unmolested but the deck folds to any sort of dedicated interaction. I don't quite know what pod makes for it to be a good sport in.

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Tevesh
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Post by Tevesh » 3 years ago

Spoils of survival:
Changes 07/25/20
Approximate Total Cost:

With Ikra-Tymna biting the dust, I'm reallocating some of their cards. I'm going to experiment with Mindblade Render, I think being able to smooth over early draws will help. Tunneling Geopede has failed to fire more than once, so I think of it as my worst Enabler for Rakdos. I don't think I'll be keeping Mindblade but it's just something I'm trying.

As the deck speeds up, I don't have time to play these bulky disruptive Enchantments. They don't have their cost reduced by Rakdos, so I really feel their cost and some decks who I still need to kill can ignore their requirements. In their stead comes Vampiric Tutor to fetch whatever I want and Animate Dead to bring back my big boys.

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Post by Tevesh » 3 years ago

Rakdos wanna go vroom:
Changes 09/24/20
Approximate Total Cost:

Phyrexian Arena is too slow for EDH and especially for this deck, which is a strange Aggro-Control-Combo hybrid. I play fatties who have scary words on them, that's the Aggro and Control elements. If I ever get a Tutor and sufficient mana, I can proceed to go Infinite through a Sac-Fetch chain. This means that Rakdos is getting a fair amount of slapback as people know they need to step on the gas and kill me before I go off. There have been plenty of lost games where if I only had one more turn, I would've won. My hope is Darkness provides that.

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