Purphoros, Bronze Blooded - The Creature Cannon

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toctheyounger
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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

Sinis wrote:
3 years ago
Hey @toctheyounger; I've been playing my version of this semi-frequently, and had a question about one of the subthemes in the deck, or maybe just a set of synergies: Tectonic Reformation, Ox of Agonas, Neheb, Dreadhorde Champion, Bedlam Reveler, Chandra, Flamecaller and Cavalier of Flame.

How have these cards worked out for you? They clearly all work together (or rather, they all work with Cavalier, and I suppose an Ox escapee). Do you find Neheb to do much work? I find that I don't often have many cards to discard to Neheb for mana/new cards. Do you find Ox/Reveler impactful enough at discard/draw 3?
Honestly, we're back in semi-quarantine and work has been pretty full on. I've had time enough to browse forums but not enough to play, so most of the feedback to follow is relatively historical, so to speak.

Some of these are better than others. Chandra, Flamecaller, Ox of Agonas and Bedlam Reveler are the weakest of the lot. The discard/draw 3 is fine, but ultimately it's a stop gap until something more efficient for draw comes along. Which given how good an actual wheel is, I''m not expecting any time soon. Chandra at least nets you a card which isn't nothing, but ultimately with all 3 you're really only using them when your hand needs more quality to it, or you need specific things in hand that you don't have at present. They're reasonable, not optimal, and generally it's a case of weighing up when the time is right to play them out, because it isn't always a good time.

Tectonic Reformation I've found really good, personally. It's a really cheap way to get more fat in hand, and in most cases when you have more than one land drop per turn or more than 6-7 lands in play, and lands in hand are predominantly surplus anyway, so it's fine to filter them away for cheap. I guess it could seem risky, but you do have absolute control over how many lands you keep and toss so you can take it as far as you'd like.

Neheb, Dreadhorde Champion and Cavalier of Flame are opportunistic beaters more than anything. I like that Neheb gives me further resource to use later into the turn, and I like that that's optional. I'm happy just to swing with him regardless, knowing that his trigger is a 'may'. Do I always find these triggers useful? No, but when they are they're worth having. As far as Cavalier of Flame's death trigger, it's not something I intentionally play into, but then again there's a few wheel effects here anyway, so it can sting a little even if I don't. A cherry on top, really.

Ultimately, the fact that the best of these are optional, and optional to scale, is what keeps them in the deck. Being able to sculpt a hand is nice. If there were more wheel variants to hand (to recall I believe the only ones I'm missing are Runehorn Hellkite and Wheel of Fortune) I'd probably trim these down from the lowest hanging fruit upwards, but I'm relatively happy with them for the moment.
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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

So it's been a while since I updated here, and I'm pretty sure there's more to add - I've expanded my rocks and got a few more bits on the way to add, nothing absolutely stellar (although I do have my eye on Moraug, Fury of Akoum - card is nuts, and gives you as many attack phases as basics in your deck with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker and Solemn Simulacrum in play), but I did get a game in today and it was just as fun as the last time I played.

Played a semi-casual against Rayami, First of the Fallen, Grumgully, the Generous and Xyris, the Writhing Storm. I hit Sol Ring into Arcane Signet and Everflowing Chalice first turn, and got running super quick. Played some pieces out and the Snake deck was running sort of a hug style group draw for obvious reasons. A couple turns in I drew into Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker and it for some reason stayed in play. I swing into Rayami with Dragon Mage and top up hand, and I've drawn into Terror of the Peaks, Zealous Conscripts and Reforge the Soul.

By this time Xyris has landed Purphoros, God of the Forge so we're dead unless something changes anyway. I've got Fires of Invention in play, so I freecast Zealous Conscripts targeting Xyris, the Writhing Storm, and the board is tapped out. I use Puprh's last ability to sneak in Terror of the Peaks, use Kiki to copy Dragon Mage, freecast Reforge the Soul for 7, netting me 21 snakes and 21 points of damage from Terror. Move to combat, swing with 2 Dragon Mages for two more wheel triggers which nets me 42 more snakes and 42 more damage to clean up the table. Fun game.

It's been really nice to see more rocks in the deck for early work, Terror of the Peaks continues to be absolutely bonkers, and Xyris did it to itself, and the rest of the table, no regrets. That card is honestly pretty gross to play against. It's just too strong to enjoy, so I relished this :cool:
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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

Well, it's been a long-ass time between updates, but this one is pretty worth it:


So, yeah, lots more firepower added with this one. Really nice to get a copy of the volcano in here, as I've been looking for ages (someone obviously traded a playset to my LGS for Expeditions with Zendikar 3: Electric Boogaloo), and a few more options in utility lands. Valakut Awakening // Valakut Stoneforge I side-eyed for a long time before pulling the trigger on it, but I figure the opportunity cost for it to be valuable is so low that it might as well be in the list for hand filtering, and doing that at instant speed is great.

The creature changeouts are virtually all strict upgrades. Will I miss the looter creatures? For card draw, yes, but otherwise in general no. Especially when stuff like Moraug, Fury of Akoum and Scourge of the Throne are hitting the list. Bosh, Iron Golem I think is maybe a little weird to have in the list, but direct damage is nice and he's easy enough to swap out if it doesn't work out for him.

Really the only card I'm a little wary to lose is Seething Song, purely because it's been pretty good for doing more than just playing out a commander or a board-warping thing with no followup. But hey, I'm keeping an eye on Bosh, so it might make the list again.

I've had no actual game play for a little while past parenthood, but I'll try to get something in soon now that I've managed to tweak the list. These should be pretty fun changes, so I'm looking forward to it.
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Post by cheonice » 3 years ago

Looks really fun!

Have you considered Jeska's Will. Sure, it's more of a lategame card, but a potent card "draw" nontheless.
Some of the "draw lands" like War Room could be useful, too.

There are some more options for doubling your creatures, but they are rather expensive: Minion Reflector, God-Pharaoh's Gift. Guild Feud could be fun, too, but again, is really expensive...

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
Looks really fun!

Have you considered Jeska's Will. Sure, it's more of a lategame card, but a potent card "draw" nontheless.
Some of the "draw lands" like War Room could be useful, too.

There are some more options for doubling your creatures, but they are rather expensive: Minion Reflector, God-Pharaoh's Gift. Guild Feud could be fun, too, but again, is really expensive...
Deck is a blast, I highly recommend giving it a whirl. Lots of fun no matter the outcome, and whatever fatties you decide make the cut.

I hadn't really considered Jeska's Will, but I haven't really had a ton of play recently, so I want to get in a few games before I decide I need any more card advantage. I did get a copy of War Room, so this is probably a decent place for it.

I did consider running Mirror March but decided it was too hard to bank on any value from it. Pretty sure I also looked at God-Pharaoh's Gift and I really like the card. I think it might be worth looking at a few more variants in that respect, it's just at that point where its tough to find room to cut anything now.
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Post by cheonice » 3 years ago

toctheyounger wrote:
3 years ago
Deck is a blast, I highly recommend giving it a whirl. Lots of fun no matter the outcome, and whatever fatties you decide make the cut.
I will! I'm looking for a mono-R commander since I dismantled Daretti years ago! And Purphy looks exactly like the one I was looking for: Broad applications, no solved build, fun for the table, splashy plays.

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
toctheyounger wrote:
3 years ago
Deck is a blast, I highly recommend giving it a whirl. Lots of fun no matter the outcome, and whatever fatties you decide make the cut.
I will! I'm looking for a mono-R commander since I dismantled Daretti years ago! And Purphy looks exactly like the one I was looking for: Broad applications, no solved build, fun for the table, splashy plays.
You are in the right place, good sir.
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Post by cheonice » 3 years ago

Oh yes, I am. Purphoros is indeed a blast!
I played two games last night and it was incredibly fun to hold back the dragons, drop some blockers and then swing in for the win. Sneak Attack is still an unfair card.

Some thoughts:
  • The deck needs some sac-outlets to get rid of the stolen creatures (Zealous Conscripts et al). I'm not sure, if Goblin Bombardment is the right call or if I should focus on lands.
  • Purphoros is the key piece, maybe I should add Seething Song? You were unsure about your cut, too, weren't you?
  • Again: This REALLY is a fun deck.^^
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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
Oh yes, I am. Purphoros is indeed a blast!
I played two games last night and it was incredibly fun to hold back the dragons, drop some blockers and then swing in for the win. Sneak Attack is still an unfair card.

Some thoughts:
  • The deck needs some sac-outlets to get rid of the stolen creatures (Zealous Conscripts et al). I'm not sure, if Goblin Bombardment is the right call or if I should focus on lands.
  • Purphoros is the key piece, maybe I should add Seething Song? You were unsure about your cut, too, weren't you?
  • Again: This REALLY is a fun deck.^^
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Glad you're enjoying it! I'm honestly a bit sad that Purph got lost in the Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath hype, I just think he's a lot of fun.

Your thoughts:
- Yes, a sacrifice outlet or two would be reasonable; High Market would probably do just fine, or you could add an altar or Bombardment if you see fit. The other option is to just not give them back. Sundial doesn't quite work the same way unfortunately; it ends the ability that gives you control of the creature itself, so it returns to the owners control as it would have anyway.
- Seething Song seems reasonable. Personally I've found Mana Geyser more profitable in most instances, but there is a degree of variance with it so I can understand not wanting to go there.
- Really glad you're enjoying Purph. Honestly, I love the commander, and I love how fun and flexible he is in terms of putting together a list.

I do have a couple of minor additions and cuts coming up, just getting spare time to get cards in hand is a little tough right at the minute. Haven't seen anything yet from Kaldheim thats a must add, but you never know.
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Post by cheonice » 3 years ago

toctheyounger wrote:
3 years ago
Glad you're enjoying it! I'm honestly a bit sad that Purph got lost in the Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath hype, I just think he's a lot of fun.

Your thoughts:
- Yes, a sacrifice outlet or two would be reasonable; High Market would probably do just fine, or you could add an altar or Bombardment if you see fit. The other option is to just not give them back. Sundial doesn't quite work the same way unfortunately; it ends the ability that gives you control of the creature itself, so it returns to the owners control as it would have anyway.
- Seething Song seems reasonable. Personally I've found Mana Geyser more profitable in most instances, but there is a degree of variance with it so I can understand not wanting to go there.
- Really glad you're enjoying Purph. Honestly, I love the commander, and I love how fun and flexible he is in terms of putting together a list.

I do have a couple of minor additions and cuts coming up, just getting spare time to get cards in hand is a little tough right at the minute. Haven't seen anything yet from Kaldheim thats a must add, but you never know.
Yep, I'm really glad that Kaldheim's Simic legend is just a giant snake and no Uro.

- Oh, i totally forgot about the interactions with blink! Good point!
- Seething Song vs. Mana Geyser: Isn't it more important to get Purphy online earlier than to have THE GREATEST TURN sometime in the future? Jeska's Will does a similar job.

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
Yep, I'm really glad that Kaldheim's Simic legend is just a giant snake and no Uro.
I think it'll be pretty awful to play against nonetheless, tbh. Simic can ramp for days, and this thing gives you a serpent every turn, not every one of your turns. In edh I think the plan would be to get it in play ASAP, get a token doubler and just tap down everyone's stuff to protect yourself, if not just use Stasis and Winter Orb to lock the game down entirely. Sounds disgusting to me. Like, sure, it's an expensive creature, but in every other way its just as gross as anything else Simic in the last few releases.
- Oh, i totally forgot about the interactions with blink! Good point!
Ideally it'd be cool to add a few more blinkers, but there aren't many, and most of them are u/w.
cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
- Seething Song vs. Mana Geyser: Isn't it more important to get Purphy online earlier than to have THE GREATEST TURN sometime in the future? Jeska's Will does a similar job.
Yes, the earlier the better, but I've also found that it pays to be able to cast him and use him either same turn, or hold up enough through the turn cycle to be able to sneak something in when needed. The thing is, you can get him into play as soon as you like, but chances are he remains a god and not a creature, so he can't block for you. Also, he does tend to be a lodestone for counters and removal, such as exists that can remove a god. So I've found Geyser doing better for just making hay while the sun shines, if that makes sense. It scales really nicely to a multiplayer format, and often by the time you've got a couple of rocks and lands in play you can cast it turn 3 or so and have it resolve for fairly close to double digits worth of mana, which is pretty excellent. Ideally I'd think running both would be fine, too, I just wanted to maximise the fat in my build.
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Post by cheonice » 3 years ago

toctheyounger wrote:
3 years ago
cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
Yep, I'm really glad that Kaldheim's Simic legend is just a giant snake and no Uro.
I think it'll be pretty awful to play against nonetheless, tbh. Simic can ramp for days, and this thing gives you a serpent every turn, not every one of your turns. In edh I think the plan would be to get it in play ASAP, get a token doubler and just tap down everyone's stuff to protect yourself, if not just use Stasis and Winter Orb to lock the game down entirely. Sounds disgusting to me. Like, sure, it's an expensive creature, but in every other way its just as gross as anything else Simic in the last few releases.
Alas... but fortunately it doesn't enter the battlefield on turn two like Kinnan, Bonder Prodigy.
toctheyounger wrote:
3 years ago
cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
- Seething Song vs. Mana Geyser: Isn't it more important to get Purphy online earlier than to have THE GREATEST TURN sometime in the future? Jeska's Will does a similar job.
Yes, the earlier the better, but I've also found that it pays to be able to cast him and use him either same turn, or hold up enough through the turn cycle to be able to sneak something in when needed. The thing is, you can get him into play as soon as you like, but chances are he remains a god and not a creature, so he can't block for you. Also, he does tend to be a lodestone for counters and removal, such as exists that can remove a god. So I've found Geyser doing better for just making hay while the sun shines, if that makes sense. It scales really nicely to a multiplayer format, and often by the time you've got a couple of rocks and lands in play you can cast it turn 3 or so and have it resolve for fairly close to double digits worth of mana, which is pretty excellent. Ideally I'd think running both would be fine, too, I just wanted to maximise the fat in my build.
Yep, sounds about right. Thanks for your insight's, I will test Mana Geyser! And thanks a lot for your help!

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
Alas... but fortunately it doesn't enter the battlefield on turn two like Kinnan, Bonder Prodigy.
Ugh. I have nothing but ill sentiment for that garbage card. ug these days is like playing the game on easy mode. For a CMC of 2, you get easy infinite mana and a way to use it from the command zone. Truly stupid.
cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
Yep, sounds about right. Thanks for your insight's, I will test Mana Geyser! And thanks a lot for your help!
Happy to help. To be honest, there's no reason not to run both, really, if you have the space.
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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

I finally got a chance to get in and grab my orders!


A pretty small update - Relic gives a little more burst on early game mana and recovery mana if and when it's needed. War Room is nice repeatable draw, and Toralf, God of Fury // Toralf's Hammer is pretty disgusting at the best of times. Here, with all of the damage multiplication variants, it will flatten boardstates with ease. Even without, there's plenty of stuff that throws damage around in the list, so he will help do that more, and synergises really nicely with Basilisk Collar.

The cuts are relatively insignificant. Arcane Signet is kind of wasted in a mono-colour deck and Hammerfist Giant was fine, but more of a placeholder for some high-damage bomb. Not sad to see it go, and I'm pretty happy to have Thor join the crew.

Fingers crossed I can get some game time in soon!
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Post by cheonice » 3 years ago

Relic vs Signet seems like the right call. Ramping from 3 to 5 should be more important than from 2 to 4.
Uhh, Toralf is a gorgeous and disgusting idea! Boardwipe Galore!

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

cheonice wrote:
3 years ago
Relic vs Signet seems like the right call. Ramping from 3 to 5 should be more important than from 2 to 4.
Uhh, Toralf is a gorgeous and disgusting idea! Boardwipe Galore!
Yeah, signet is just obviously better in a non-mono deck. Whether Relic is strictly better or not is neither here nor there, being able to ramp for 2 every other turn is worth it. And yeah, I expect that Toralf, God of Fury // Toralf's Hammer will just be disgusting. There's enough damage being thrown about by....like, most of the list tbh that he's just going to nuke the board state.
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Post by toctheyounger » 2 years ago

It's been a while between LGS visits again, but here we are:


Orrery is kind of a try-out here. It could be awful, but it could be pretty good too. It gives me what I need in land drops and hand refill, so it could be fine. I guess it's just whether or not it benefits my opponents more than me. And Gauntlet seems reasonable as another mana doubler.

Bosh always felt wrong to me in the list, he just fell flat. And Warstorm is an effect I already have on Terror of the Peaks. It's still a very good card, so I'd be happy to slot it back in if Orrery ends up sucking.
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Post by cheonice » 2 years ago

I'm not to sure about Ghirapur Orrery. The card seems risky at best and devastating at worst. Tell me, how that worked out for you!

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Post by toctheyounger » 2 years ago

cheonice wrote:
2 years ago
I'm not to sure about Ghirapur Orrery. The card seems risky at best and devastating at worst. Tell me, how that worked out for you!
There's a chance it is but it also does two things the deck wants. An extra land drop per turn and hand refill instead of top decking. Its not fantastic that you share that but it might work. It might also stupendous backfire so...here's hoping I guess.
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Post by Chromaticus » 2 years ago

What does everyone think about the tinkering goblin package of Goblin Welder Goblin Engineer and Daretti, Scrap Savant ?

I've got most of the artifact guys in the original list, plus Ruin Grinder Phyrexian Triniform and Triplicate Titan .

Haven't played with the deck, but I'm building a list now!

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Post by toctheyounger » 2 years ago

Chromaticus wrote:
2 years ago
What does everyone think about the tinkering goblin package of Goblin Welder Goblin Engineer and Daretti, Scrap Savant ?

I've got most of the artifact guys in the original list, plus Ruin Grinder Phyrexian Triniform and Triplicate Titan .

Haven't played with the deck, but I'm building a list now!
Grinder definitely seems worth it, and I really like Engineer for grabbing tech to keep stuff in play like Conjurer's Closet or what have you. They represent quite a good way to save some mana turn to turn as well. It'd also be nice to have something other than Feldon of the Third Path to allow reanimation too.

I'm not sure i see the Titan or Triniform as really worth it in all honesty. I think they both a fairly average Wurmcoil impression. I'd possibly consider Ancient Stone Idol for a similar effect purely because it has the alternate cost of next to free if we catch grief on the crackback.

I think Daretti might be a pinch too, purely just for being a little too situational and slow, and a little lacking in synergy. I can't copy it, reanimate it or double its abilities so it's just not paying as much of its way.

I like Welder and engineer though, between those and Grinder I think you're probably onto something there. I also like that Grinder is repeatable relatively easily. That's card draw we don't have a ton of other ways. I like these adds and will probably pick em up myself. I've also got Walking Atlas coming to the list shortly too. Early game extra labd drops and its synergistic with Welder effects even though it doesn't say its an artifact (it got errata'd).
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Post by Chromaticus » 2 years ago

FYI playing this deck in historic brawl is absolutely delicious.

The mana rocks suck, but the life total being just a little lower makes your fatty's lethal off a Purphoros, Bronze-Blooded only board in TONS of situation.

Hilarious to beat up on the try-hard Omnath, Locus of Creation and Kinnan, Bonder Prodigy decks with your Angrath's Marauders and Red Dragons.

I also discovered Delina, Wild Mage through this, and that card is BONKERS here. Better than everything but Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker in that class, and 1/4 of the time, better than that!

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Post by toctheyounger » 2 years ago

Chromaticus wrote:
2 years ago
FYI playing this deck in historic brawl is absolutely delicious.

The mana rocks suck, but the life total being just a little lower makes your fatty's lethal off a Purphoros, Bronze-Blooded only board in TONS of situation.

Hilarious to beat up on the try-hard Omnath, Locus of Creation and Kinnan, Bonder Prodigy decks with your Angrath's Marauders and Red Dragons.

I also discovered Delina, Wild Mage through this, and that card is BONKERS here. Better than everything but Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker in that class, and 1/4 of the time, better than that!
Ooh! I'm definitely gonna have to grab a copy for my build, that seems super spicy.
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Post by toctheyounger » 2 years ago

Another round of updates - small round, but meaningful I think:


These all feel like upgrades. Welder has been discussed, there's enough artifact here to act as a second Feldon of the Third Path and to really spam triggers like Wurmcoil Engine and Myr Battlesphere and so forth. Torque and Mirror are both utility rocks that enter untapped, and have various usages. Torque allows me to make sure I have something to weld if I really need to, and Mirror makes a great weld target and Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker target on its ETB. It should be fun if nothing else. Atlas seems bare minimum a sideways step if not an upgrade to Solemn Simulacrum, it should allow me to be more efficient in land dropping, and just to get more out of wheel effects, which the deck has kind of all over the place now. Speaking of which, Ruin Grinder is nice. Should be an excellent addition.

There's still more to add - the suggestion earlier of Delina, Wild Mage is a very good one, and eventually I might even track down a Goblin Engineer. I think that one is definitely less useful than its predecessor, but regardless, redundancy is nice, and it will have some uses here and there.
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Post by Chromaticus » 2 years ago

Mirage Phalanx makes the cut in my list! Would love another big Timmy red card sometime soon - but these clones are nice in the meantime!

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