The Inquisition Here We Go! Tymna & Tevesh Cleric Tribal

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 3 years ago

***Updated with card types and actual lands in the deck, but somehow coming up 1 card short...have to go back through list***

Here's the rough decklist so far. I think the game plan will be playing out some cheap creatures followed by Tymna with hopefully 1-3 open attacks for some early draw. Drop Tevesh for further protection or card advantage as needed. Draw into something that generates real advantage (like Orah, Karlov, Ayli, etc...), and either control the board enough to put lethal damage through fairly, or draw into a combo.

Combos right now are:
Leonin Relic-Warder + Animate Dead + free sac outlet + something for value (could be infinite mana, life, tokens, drain or draw)
Mirror Entity + Rotlung Reanimator + Phyrexian Altar (infinite 2/2 zombie tokens, turned into clerics) + something for value
Fiend Hunter + Angel of Glory's Rise + free sac outlet (infinite humans entering and leaving the battlefield + potentially cleric reanimation triggers from Orah)

I feel like I could use a couple more (free) sac outlets on creatures, but there aren't any clerics for that, and the deck is already bloated, otherwise I'd be looking at some humans like Cartel Aristocrat or something with more value.
Also think think the deck needs Lightning Greaves, and probably Mangara, the Diplomat, and maybe Zulaport Cutthroat.
Also need to add Living Death and Smothering Tithe probably.

How does this look? Suggestions for cuts and includes appreciated!

Cleric Tribal Pile

Approximate Total Cost:

I'll update with the actual lands later.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 3 years ago

Cards I'm looking at including:

Anything else that looks like it should be in here?
Any recommended cuts?

Thinking Twilight Prophet for Mangara.

Post by **benjameenbear** » 3 years ago

I think the list looks pretty solid as is. You've got some great card draw in the Command Zone, you've got a pretty solid density of removal effects, and you can easily swarm an unsuspecting board with your tokens or recursion strategies. The only thing I'd recommend adding is Razaketh, the Foulblooded because you'll have a ton of bodies to sac to him for tutor effects. It will be a powerful late-game target for you to look towards.

Depending on your playgroup, Archaeomancer's Map can be a bit of a hit or miss. I played my Osgir deck recently and pulled it out and I was only able to get the trigger once over the course of the game. It was kinda meh for me. However, if you're playing against anything with g than I think it's really solid. That's my feedback.

I think that Twilight Prophet is a pretty great card for your deck but Mangara could just as easily come in. Or you could cut Goldnight Commander? I don't know, the Commander is really good with Tevesh's first ability. Honestly, cuts for your decklist are tough. Personally, I would cut Speaker of the Heavens because it's not as powerful a token producing effect compared to others in your list.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 3 years ago

Thanks for the feedback. In games so far, I've almost always been at least a land behind someone, and even just 1 drop from the map would be valuable, as would fetching up the two plains to hit drops, or even just shuffling while Bolas 's Citadel is out.

Twilight I've never tutored for, and have only played it out once, with one trigger. I do like the card, but Mangara looks like he's going to do more and do it basically right away.

Goldnight hasn't done too much so far, as every time Ive wanted to get him out, I've been board wiped, so he wouldn't do much, but I had one situation where he probably could have won the game through combat damage, but I also had a combo and just played that. My thinking for him was that he can buff the team by probably +3/+3 at least for a big swing, but everyone stays under Dusk and Retribution. Maybe trying to do too much. The other point in his favor (by my thinking) is he would help get through attackers to trigger Tymna by making blocking unattractive.

Speaker may be on the block, yeah. Haven't tutored for him, and haven't activated him yet. Last two times he came out, I didn't have enough life anyway.

NZB2323 · Post by **NZB2323** » 3 years ago

I think you should consider adding these cards:

You can play Beloved Chaplain turn 2, Tymna turn 3 and the Chaplain will connect to allow you to draw a card.

Selfless Spirit is another evasive creature who can be played the turn before Tymna who can protect your board.

Doubtless One is a big fatty with lifelink.

Starlit Sanctum is a free sacrifice outlet for your clerics.

Arena Rector and Academy Rector can give you great value with a sacrifice outlet.

Glorious Protector is an amazing answer to Cyclonic Rift, as well as other board wipes. It's also an evasive creature for Tymna, and you can potentially sacrifice the angel and bring it back.

Skemfar Shadowsage can be played, sacrificed, and brought back.

Battletide Alchemist can shut down not only aggro strategies, but also damage from Niv-Mizzet, Parun, Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow, Brago, King Eternal, and if you have enough clerics in play even bigger commanders like Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder and Gishath, Sun's Avatar.

Despark I like a lot more than Utter End. You're going to be wanting to play creatures to get triggers off of your commanders. At what point in the game are you going to be comfortable leaving 4 mana open during your opponent's turns?

Flawless Maneuver and Deadly Rollick are really good with partner commanders because you only need 1 in play to cast those spells for free.

Smothering Tithe is a great card, especially for an Orzhov deck that always wants more mana.

True Conviction and Sorin Markov can end the game, especially when used together.

Elspeth, Knight-Errant can be played the turn after Tymna, making her a 5/5 flying lifelink commander.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 3 years ago

Some of those I have considered, but what to cut for them?

NZB2323 · Post by **NZB2323** » 3 years ago

yeti1069 wrote: ↑
3 years ago
Some of those I have considered, but what to cut for them?

I would definitely cut 3 drops. You play more 3 drops(20) than any other CMC and Tymna cost 3 mana.

In addition, lowering your curve allows you to play your spells faster, and I'm guessing you never have enough mana to play all your spells, since you have to cast 2 commanders, pay commander tax to recast both, get card advantage from both, and don't run a lot of ramp.

I'd cut some of the spells that cost more mana:

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 3 years ago

Razaketh I always want to run, but end up cutting him due to CMC.

Utter End ill probably swap for Anguished Unmaking, but I wouldn't replace them with Despark. That goes into my decks after the other two--the low cost is great, but the restriction is problematic.

Bastion I might swap for Zulaport.
Martyr's Cause is RIDICULOUS here. Never getting cut.
Pious Evangel is on the chopping block, along with Doomed Necromancer maybe. I want to see how he runs after I get Greaves in here.
Bishop of Rebirth has been solid, and Angel of Destiny is a win con.

As for being able to cast spells, the deck tends to bottleneck cards in hand, yeah, until Urborg/Coffers or Nikthos come down.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 3 years ago

Considering these includes and cuts:

06/09/20

CUTS

1 Speaker of the Heavens

1 Pious Evangel

1 Twilight Prophet

1 Bishop of Rebirth

1 Utter End

1 Bastion of Remembrance

1 Tithe

1 Doomed Necromancer

ADDS

1 Zulaport Cutthroat

1 Archaeomancer's Map

1 Lightning Greaves

1 Mangara, the Diplomat

1 Anguished Unmaking

1 Smothering Tithe

1 False Prophet

1 Talisman of Hierarchy

Approximate Total Cost:

This is a net increase in CMC which I'm not thrilled with, but I want to try the Map and it looks like a functional swap with Tithe, although Tithe has helped with some land-light opening hands. Twilight Prophet having flying was relevant in my last game, but the draw effect on it was slow. Hoping Mangara will be a better fit.

I've gotten Doomed Necromancer a few times and have never activated him. Lightning Greaves might make it more relevant, but it was either this or Devout Chaplain, which I HAVE used, and feel will benefit even more from Greaves.

Bishop has been good, but it can be a bit slow. May want to bring it back in.

I also wanted to fit Cartel Aristocrat (or another cheap free sac outlet) and Selfless Spirit, but not sure what else I would cut. I suspect I'll be wanting a sac outlet or two with the inclusion of False Prophet. We'll see.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 2 years ago

Made some updates.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 2 years ago

Some game play observations over about a dozen games and notes on cuts.

The deck has been incredibly resilient. Typically starts by playing out some creatures on 1 or 2, dropping Tymna and hitting an open opponent to draw a card or to for the early turns to start getting ahead on cards. Tevesh comes out when no one has anything on the board, when I have enough stuff to protect him (especially if Martyr's Cause is available--it's BONKERS here!), or when I have things to sac and need cards. Board wipes haven't been too big a deal, since I have some decent reanimation options, and forms of card advantage in the command zone. Have combo'ed off once, and been stopped mid-combo once (but recovered to win otherwise), and have closed out a few games with aristocrats effects or combat.

Bolas's Citadel is even better than expected, since I can end up netting 1 or more life per creature cast to either discount the life loss or even net positive on it (especially since most of the deck is 3 mana or less). The two commanders have been able to help draw past lands stuck on top a bit, but I'd be interested in including something to do this more reliably. Sensei's Top is a possibility, though I'm not including the combo for it.

Mirror Entity has put in some WORK! I've had two games I closed out thanks to it + big mana from Coffers or Nykthos where I was pumping my team up to 12/12s or 15/15s, but even without the huge mana, sinking 5 or 6 into it would be worth it in some situations, I think. I've also used it two times for 0 to turn all my creatures (including a stack of thrulls) into clerics and sac my board, drawing a bunch of cards with Taborax. I have not been able to combo off yet, but I think I actually had a turn where I had all the pieces, but didn't realize. Still won the next turn with a combination of Entity, Rotlung, and some aristocrats effects. Also need to keep any eye out for turns where I can probably use these pieces together even without Phyrexian Altar to kill off the table with mana available, rather than waiting for infinite.

Could probably use something similar to Cover of Darkness for redundancy in unblockability. Not sure what that would be, yet.

Cards with effects have been slow, and largely go unused. I've activated Devout Chaplain 2 or 3 times, and it felt worth while, but have had it show up in as many games where I either didn't cast it, or had it but couldn't use it. Priest of Forgotten Gods hasn't shown up at all yet, and is on the chopping block as well, but am holding off to see if it ends up being valuable enough to keep. Lightning Greaves coming in could help these. Doomed Necromancer and the Evangel both get cut, because I've never activated them. The Chaplain in particular doesn't have a good replacement as far as I'm aware, since the ETB or sac variants of clerics only hit enchantments.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 1 year ago

Well...like so many of my decks, this is struggling to find a table. In most mid-power games it proves to have too much draw and too much recursion (nothing stays dead for long!), but it doesn't proceed to an endgame fast enough for high-powered tables.

I've also been itching to put OG Teysa back together with some of the new token goodies that have come out lately, so this deck may get taken apart, or downgraded significantly. Certainly, I had a table get kind of salty when I played Bolas's Citadel, especially when they realized that between Tymna, Tevesh, a fetchland, and Pyre of Heroes, I could go through a LOT of my deck with life gain on the field. Weenie clerics (and some very strong backup) FTW! I don't really want to take it apart, since there are some clerics I'm enjoying playing and likely wouldn't be running otherwise, but need to make room for other decks.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 1 year ago

Just had an interesting conclusion to the game.

Had in play Goldnight Commander, Voice of the Blessed (x2), Soul Warden, some other creatures, and the ability to make something like 20 mana. I also had Demon's Disciple in my graveyard.

Cast Teshar, Ancestor's Apostle, and proceeded to cast a handful of cheap artifacts and legendary creatures, including Teysa, Orzhov Scion. What this amounted to was every historic spell I cast brought back Disciple, forcing a sac, sending itself to the bin, making a spirit, triggering Goldnight twice (Demon and spirit) or thrice (for the legendary creatures), and growing the Voices 3 or 4 times as well. I think I was able to do this 6 times, which gave my whole team something like +18/+18, AND made the Voices enormous on their own with upwards of 15 counters on each of them. This, on top of virtually wiping the opposing boards!

I had been debating dropping Teshar since I don't run any combos with it, but DAMN! That was a crazy explosive turn. If not for this, I think I just had enough to kill one player and hurt the Jodah player badly before he swung a huge army of legendaries at me, each sporting something like +11/+11 before his turn, and with a few having trample.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 1 year ago

Also, have to make some updates here with new cards that have been added, and some new ones that are being considered.

Also considering removing some of the non-cleric creatures to lean more into the tribal theme, which will hopefully bring the power level of the deck down a tad, so I can play it at more tables and not feel like I'm just stomping everyone. If anyone is looking...what cards would you cut to fit in some more cleric tribal pieces and reduce power level a bit? Particularly through the lens of my wanting to rebuild a Teysa aristocrats/tokens deck?

As good as they are, the following are some considerations for cuts based on the above:
[*]Serra Ascendant - great card, plays into the lifegain and human-tribal sub-themes and works great with Tymna, but is otherwise just a good stuff card
[*]Knight of the White Orchid - mana fixing/ramp in Orzhov (some slightly better options exist now, but don't think any are clerics), but only fits the human sub-theme
[*]Zulaport Cutthroat - a wincon alongside some of the combo options, and tons of value, but otherwise only fits the human sub-theme
[*]Karlov of the Ghost Council - not a cleric or a human, but does fit the life gain sub-theme, and had been wanting to play this guy for a long time
[*]Kambal, Consul of Allocation - not a cleric, but helps keep some other decks in check, and provides some lifegain value, but otherwise only fits the human and lifegain sub-themes
[*]General Kudro of Drannith - not a cleric, but provides some much needed graveyard hate; otherwise only fits the human sub-theme
[*]Teysa, Orzhov Scion - not a cleric, but is removal and a sac outlet, and turns Tevesh's tokens into better tokens, as well as having numerous strong interactions, but otherwise only fits the human sub-theme
[*]Bolas's Citadel - super strong card that interacts well with all the lifegain, but not actually needed given how many cards the deck tends to draw
[*]Animate Dead - great card, but here primarily as a wincon combo (even if it gets used for value half the time); also strong when paired with Hall of Heliod's Generosity
[*]Angel of Glory's Rise - not a cleric, but a very strong reanimation piece with all the humans in the deck. If that number were to drop, Angel might get cut, especially if I'm taking out pieces that combo with it

Could also change out Tevesh Szat and replace it with Ramos or another partner. There are a couple that make Tymna better, but none of the others are clerics.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 1 year ago

Possible adds:

Any clerics I'm missing from the main list or this list that seem a glaring omission?

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 1 year ago

Made some changes to the deck to lean more cleric-tribal, dropped a lot of the secondary stuff (only non-cleric now is Karlov), and a lot of the non-creatures. Will update later, but wanted to share a hilarious end to a game last night.

Long and grindy (2+ hours) and one opponent looked to activate Krenko, Mob Boss to make 30+ goblins with a life total in the 20s. In response, I sacrificed a 3-mana cleric while I had Orah out, to reanimate Suture Priest. One player down. Then I sacrificed Mangara to bring back Sin Collector (this card always puts in so much work, by the way!) to try and strip interaction from the last player's hand, which forced a Cyclonic Rift. No problem. I sacrificed some more guys to get Sin Collector in before the Rift just to see what they had, and stripped away their one piece of interaction available.

On my turn, I cast Edgewalker, Elas il-Kor, Sadistic Pilgrim, Suture Priest, a few more clerics, and Mirror Entity. Then cast the Haunting Voyage and activated Mirror Entity for 0 with it on the stack. That dinged the remaining opponent for 7 of their 13 or so life, reanimated my graveyard (admittedly not super stocked, but more than enough) to finish them off.

This was another game where Tevesh acted as a distraction, galvanizing the table into throwing resources at him, which I turned away with Martyr's Cause for a while. The end of the game made me want to consider Orah again for the commander slot, but the draw from Tymna and hijinks from Tevesh preclude making that swap every time I consider it.

yeti1069 · Post by **yeti1069** » 11 months ago

Battletide Alchemist + Command the Dreadhorde: prevent damage from Command equal to the number of clerics you end up with on the battlefield! Just did this for 24 CMC worth of creatures, ended up with 12, so only took 12 damage! SO GOOD! With the life gain clerics that came in, I also ended up going life positive by 15.

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