Kykar, Wind's Fury - Spellslinger Tokens

[tstorm823]

I wouldn't say Purphoros is just better than Tremors here. Tremors costs less and is a noncreature spell.

[MeowZeDung]

And it doesn't draw as much hate.

I think there's an inverse relationship between how competitive a meta is and the value of tremors over Purph.

[gsgfdf]

I think you underestimate how powerful indestructible in a non creature permanent is. Only Chaos Warp and the three exile effects are viable answers for Purphoros, God of the Forge since he will never be a creature under normal circumstances.
He is so powerful that I broke my no-creatures-other-than-Kykar rule for him! He is always the first card I Gamble for if I don't need a specific answer.

[MeowZeDung]

Yeah, the indestructible is big game for sure. However, usually if I'm dropping tremors I intend to win or eliminate a player on the spot, so the cheaper cmc can definitely matter, and instant speed "destroy" enchantment removal is already not something people always have in hand. Purph, on the other hand can be dropped as a value damage machine gun at any time, and even if opponents can't get him, they'll come after you and the rest of your gameplan hard.

It's also just a feel bad, oppressive, win button card a la Aetherflux Reservoir in my opinion while tremors is more of a "I've gotta win through parity or end this long game sometime" win button card. I don't begrudge anyone Purph > tremors though. I think the difference is more marginal than we think, but he definitely is better on numerous axes aside from the creature typeline and cmc.

[WizardMN]

I think you underestimate how powerful indestructible in a non creature permanent is. Only Chaos Warp and the three exile effects are viable answers for Purphoros, God of the Forge since he will never be a creature under normal circumstances.
He is so powerful that I broke my no-creatures-other-than-Kykar rule for him! He is always the first card I Gamble for if I don't need a specific answer.

Him and Ephara are my two "creatures" in my deck. I sort of fudged that restriction a little because Purphoros can't be a creature in my deck and Ephara requires nearly all my W/U permanents to do so.

I think @tstorm823's comment about the curve, and triggering Kykar, is important, but even then I have felt that Purphoros is just better in nearly every situation. The hate it can draw could be a concern though. As you say, it is hard to deal with so the most effect way of getting rid of Purphoros for a number of colors is just kill the player who has it.

@MeowZeDung
I sort of forgot about Tragic Arrogance and even Flood of Tears. Flood is tough since it doesn't count tokens so it is probably most often just going to be a Devastation Tide. I know you and EBrock run more permanents than I do, but it would be something worth watching for to see if you often get to put something back down. But I think I do like Arrogance over Time Wipe. They do keep their best creature unfortunately, but it does allow others to be removed. And deals with Indestructible Gods if they have another enchantment.

[MeowZeDung]

@WizardMN With Tragic Arrogance you get to pick the creature they keep, so unless they're voltron they never keep their best one. It's a heckuva good underplayed wipe.

Flood of Tears would definitely be interesting. I think I'd usually just slam kykar back down before i start rebuilding. I think my list can get there on permanents though. I just don't feel the need for another wipe at the moment.

[WizardMN]

@WizardMN With Tragic Arrogance you get to pick the creature they keep, so unless they're voltron they never keep their best one. It's a heckuva good underplayed wipe.

I even knew that and still said that they keep their best creature That is certainly what stands out to me and since we can't play the cheaper Mythos of Snapdax, Arrogance is fine. I should look at my list to see if I can find space for it. Getting rid of more than just creatures, even if we do get rid of all of our creatures beyond a token producer (and maybe losing an enchantment or two depending on the board) seems like a reasonable "reset" button.

[gsgfdf]

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Yeah, the indestructible is big game for sure. However, usually if I'm dropping tremors I intend to win or eliminate a player on the spot, so the cheaper cmc can definitely matter, and instant speed "destroy" enchantment removal is already not something people always have in hand. Purph, on the other hand can be dropped as a value damage machine gun at any time, and even if opponents can't get him, they'll come after you and the rest of your gameplan hard.

It's also just a feel bad, oppressive, win button card a la Aetherflux Reservoir in my opinion while tremors is more of a "I've gotta win through parity or end this long game sometime" win button card. I don't begrudge anyone Purph > tremors though. I think the difference is more marginal than we think, but he definitely is better on numerous axes aside from the creature typeline and cmc.

I absolutely agree with the above, you are basically signaling to everyone that you will win in a few turns if they don't do something. I believe that Impact Tremors has the same effect, if your deck needs one you should probably run both. I just think that if I had to choose I would go with Purph every single time.

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I think you underestimate how powerful indestructible in a non creature permanent is. Only Chaos Warp and the three exile effects are viable answers for Purphoros, God of the Forge since he will never be a creature under normal circumstances.
He is so powerful that I broke my no-creatures-other-than-Kykar rule for him! He is always the first card I Gamble for if I don't need a specific answer.

Him and Ephara are my two "creatures" in my deck. I sort of fudged that restriction a little because Purphoros can't be a creature in my deck and Ephara requires nearly all my W/U permanents to do so.

I think @tstorm823's comment about the curve, and triggering Kykar, is important, but even then I have felt that Purphoros is just better in nearly every situation. The hate it can draw could be a concern though. As you say, it is hard to deal with so the most effect way of getting rid of Purphoros for a number of colors is just kill the player who has it.

@MeowZeDung
I sort of forgot about Tragic Arrogance and even Flood of Tears. Flood is tough since it doesn't count tokens so it is probably most often just going to be a Devastation Tide. I know you and EBrock run more permanents than I do, but it would be something worth watching for to see if you often get to put something back down. But I think I do like Arrogance over Time Wipe. They do keep their best creature unfortunately, but it does allow others to be removed. And deals with Indestructible Gods if they have another enchantment.

What I don't like about Tragic Arrogance is the chance of failure against non creature permanents. Unless your opponent is running a dedicated artifact/enchantment/superfriends deck, they usually only have one of those. An opponent can have a board with Sol Ring, Smothering Tithe,Narset, Parter of Veils and a few creatures and you will only be able to answer their creatures.
I run Austere Command instead, with the most common choice being creatures cmc > and either artifacts or enchantments.


On a different note, I want your opinion on Jace, Architect of Thought. His -2 is a really good effect but that leaves him with only 2 loyalty and he can die from a slight breeze. I try to run a version of each different planeswalker character and I was thinking of replacing him with Jace, Wielder of Mysteries. Any thoughts on that?

[WizardMN]

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I think you underestimate how powerful indestructible in a non creature permanent is. Only Chaos Warp and the three exile effects are viable answers for Purphoros, God of the Forge since he will never be a creature under normal circumstances.
He is so powerful that I broke my no-creatures-other-than-Kykar rule for him! He is always the first card I Gamble for if I don't need a specific answer.

Him and Ephara are my two "creatures" in my deck. I sort of fudged that restriction a little because Purphoros can't be a creature in my deck and Ephara requires nearly all my W/U permanents to do so.

I think @tstorm823's comment about the curve, and triggering Kykar, is important, but even then I have felt that Purphoros is just better in nearly every situation. The hate it can draw could be a concern though. As you say, it is hard to deal with so the most effect way of getting rid of Purphoros for a number of colors is just kill the player who has it.

@MeowZeDung
I sort of forgot about Tragic Arrogance and even Flood of Tears. Flood is tough since it doesn't count tokens so it is probably most often just going to be a Devastation Tide. I know you and EBrock run more permanents than I do, but it would be something worth watching for to see if you often get to put something back down. But I think I do like Arrogance over Time Wipe. They do keep their best creature unfortunately, but it does allow others to be removed. And deals with Indestructible Gods if they have another enchantment.

What I don't like about Tragic Arrogance is the chance of failure against non creature permanents. Unless your opponent is running a dedicated artifact/enchantment/superfriends deck, they usually only have one of those. An opponent can have a board with Sol Ring, Smothering Tithe,Narset, Parter of Veils and a few creatures and you will only be able to answer their creatures.
I run Austere Command instead, with the most common choice being creatures cmc > and either artifacts or enchantments.

Which is fine. I don't personally run Command just due to being 6 mana (though enough discussions have occurred about it that I am not completely against it). My thought behind Arrogance though is potentially replacing a creature sweeper. That is, the initial discussion was around Time Wipe when Meow brought up Arrogance. And even if Arrogance does not except to creatures for the most part, it is still almost as good as Time Wipe. And the ceiling is much higher. So, risking a slightly lower floor for a higher ceiling might be worth slotting in instead of something like Time Wipe. For my list, I think it ends up making more sense than Cleansing Nova.

On a different note, I want your opinion on Jace, Architect of Thought. His -2 is a really good effect but that leaves him with only 2 loyalty and he can die from a slight breeze. I try to run a version of each different planeswalker character and I was thinking of replacing him with Jace, Wielder of Mysteries. Any thoughts on that?

I have found planeswalkers (that aren't Saheeli, Sublime Artificer) to be really tough to figure out. I like Architect and have played him in other decks. But, as you mentioned, he dies to a stiff breeze and gives a worse Fact or Fiction. I might just be more inclined to running FoF over it.

Repeatable card draw is good so I think I would prefer Wielder of Mysteries over Architect. In honesty though, I would rather stick to cheaper draw spells even if they are one offs. If you go with either one, I would be interested to see how they work. As some discussions here and in my own thread have shown, almost no planeswalker beyond Saheeli really ever survives in the list. I have Jace, Mirror Mage as my only other walker right now and he is serviceable but his best interaction is when Teferi's Ageless Insight is on the board. So he is already a "flex" slot in the list.

My main issue with Walkers in this deck is that they just take too much to protect. We likely have enough tokens to do it, especially with other token producers, but I find it is too many resources to spend on keeping something alive that "only" draws me one card per turn. I want my tokens to live so I can use them to end the game so spending them on protecting Jace ends up being almost too high a cost.

With the other token producers you can run, it might not seem as high a cost because you potentially have more tokens to throw away,

[MeowZeDung]

Re: Tragic Arrogance, wizard nailed it. Slightly lower floor, but a ceiling in the stratosphere.

Re: walkers. Sigh. Again wizard is spot on. I want them to work, but they are really... weird with kykar in my experience. It's as if the deck is wanting to operate on sheer velocity of cards and mana, mana and cards, and then you invest in a PW and *screeeeeeeech* suddenly you're on this incremental value plan that takes resources you protect and you end up saying to yourself, "I'd rather be quad spelling on my opponent's end step".

A mini FoF every few turns sounds great, sure. But think of the setup. Jace is in Kykar's spot on the curve, so he's your t4 play at the earliest, and thus not well protected. In my experience the deck goldfishes a turn 6-7 win on average, and I don't see jace t4 → -2 → +1 → -2 being integral to such proactive gameplay, and since we care about actual games instead of goldfishing it's even less exciting.

It's the same issue I have with Assemble the Legion (gosh I want this card to get there so bad). If you get it out early and it doesn't get messed with, you're still probably looking at only 10-15 1/1 non-evasive soldiers for your 5 mana, which sounds fine. Let me introduce you to a card that will do better than that (and faster) for half the cost.

Maybe a simpler way to phrase it is that the deck functions best by maximizing synergy rather than goodstuff. That leads to the next point: I totally think there's a kykar proliferate deck to be built with a PW suite and stuff like AtL, Chasm Skulker, Hangarback Walker, Spawning Pit, Call for Unity, Cathars' Crusade, etc. This would move you away from the incremental advantage gameplan that suffers in multiplayer and onto an explosive strategy. I'd have my eye on Narset of the Ancient Way, Narset Transcendent, Teferi, Hero of Dominaria, Chandra, Torch of Defiance, and Chandra, Flamecaller since they offer opportunities for velocity, keeping cards and mana flowing, and/or spicy ults.

Check out @darrenhabib's Will and Rowan Kenrith primer. One of that decks big goals is multiple Rowan emblems. THAT'S the sort of nonsense I think kykar PWs would need. Also, some time ago in this thread darren wrote a bit about how he would approach kykar superfriends.

[gsgfdf]

I must admit I never evaluated Tragic Arrogance as a Wrath with upside, I always lumped it together with Austere Command and Cleansing Nova as a tool to hard reset the board. Your points makes me want to try it, maybe replace Supreme Verdict for a few games.

As far as planeswalkers go, it's mostly a gimmick I am trying too hard to make work. I like the ones, I just got Chandra, Torch of Defiance and Elspeth and Tezz are here to stay, Jace will probably get replaced next time I make any changes to the deck, I must admit that WizardMN's Ephara, God of the Polis is a sweet interaction that I somehow missed.

[MeowZeDung]

To clarify, I wasn't poo poo-ing the choice to include walkers. I've done it myself. Do what you enjoy, of course. I just got frustrated with the tension they introduced to the deck, personally.

[gsgfdf]

Don't worry, I like the different perspectives I get from these discussions. I have experienced the same frustation with them and I now treat them as expendable assets that I am happy to use just once.

If only I could get my hands on a Teferi, Master of Time, that's a card I am almost certain can pull its weight!

[MeowZeDung]

Don't worry, I like the different perspectives I get from these discussions. I have experienced the same frustation with them and I now treat them as expendable assets that I am happy to use just once.

If only I could get my hands on a Teferi, Master of Time, that's a card I am almost certain can pull its weight!

Ha! Funny you mention it. Last night my boy and I did an m21 sealed as a Christmas gift and I opened a foil Teferi. I immediately thought to myself, "am I going to make myself look like a total hypocrite and immediately slam this in kykar?" Lol. I don't think I actually will, at least not yet, but he does get around the incremental issue by being able to activate 4 times a turnset.

Oh, and fwiw, my son crushed me multiple times with a WG counters deck with Basri Ket, Conclave Mentor, Basri's Solidarity and assorted good commons. My guy Teferi only got out there once when it was probably too late, and thus my UR sweet deck with Kinetic Augurs, Riddleform, Goblin Wizardry, etc was a flop. Darn kids.

[MeowZeDung]

Tibalt's Trickery

So, hear me out:

-Cast a derpy cheap cantrip, resolve cast triggers
-With said cantrip on the stack, cast trickery targeting the cantrip, resolve cast triggers
-Resolve trickery by milling 1-3 cards (I'll take an Anger or Sevinne's Reclamation plz deck, K thx bye) then cascading into a spell, resolve MOAR cast triggers

I'm not saying it's good. I'm saying it's sweet. It might also be good sometimes. A floor of getting 2-3 cast triggers and some self-mill for 2-5ish mana isn't awful, the ceiling of trading a Faithless Looting for a Kindred Discovery or The Locust God is great, and the meme value of cascading into something like Mirrorweave or Sakashima the Impostor is at a premium.

Then there's the use case scenario where it just straight up shuts down an opponent's game winning combo and gives them a consolation prize.

TL;DR - we're getting a Sunforger fetchable 2 cmc counterspell with potential for shenanigans both offensively and defensively. It's pretty likely I give this one a whirl.

Edit: Open the Omenpaths could be a thing too. Ok. No more until the full spoiler, then I'll just write a full Kykar review for Kaldheim.

[EBrock]

yeah Tibalt's Trickery sounds like it would be really synergistic. I like this add. I'm not sure how I feel about Ravenform yet. I feel like the foretell cost is nice, but, the casting cost is a little high to be only creatures and artifacts. Exiling in blue is nice though. Plus, the bird they get is easily blockable by a spirit.

I finally pulled the trigger and ordered the shocklands, Fellwar Stone, and the azorius talisman for my deck. The mana is going to be so smooth.

[MeowZeDung]

Ravenform being sorcery speed really hurts it. For 3 cmc the effect is a better Generous Gift... except that timing. And Sunforger compatibility I suppose. I don't see foretell happening much since we already pack enough cheap ways to use up mana early on. That said, exile is definitely nice.

Grats on the mana! I hate that lands price people out of smoother gameplay (give us reprints wotc, you butts, reprints!), but it really feels different after you upgrade. Just adding two fetches, Fabled Passage, and Land Tax has been so noticeable in my games. Etb untap duals is big game too, so enjoy!

[MeowZeDung]

Time for a Kaldheim review. Here's all the cards that catch my eye and at least land in the massive amorphous pile of "cards that could be good in Kykar", some notable few of which I might test:

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• Clarion Spirit - This is great if you are running a spirit tribal build since you don't mind including a creature thanks to its type. I don't think it's good enough for a non-tribal build though since I don't generally cast spells equally across all players' turns, but rather in response as needed or in one big stormy flurry of spells. Plus, the deck really doesn't have issues with mana, so the incremental advantage with some extra spirit mana isn't a huge payoff and you probably run this guy just for the creatures with a relevant type.
  
  
• Divine Gambit - If it was an instant and I'd probably go for it. It's a risk along similar lines as Chaos Warp, but if you catch an opponent with only 1-3 cards in hand you are somewhat likely to polymorph their commander or huge threat into a land.
  
  
• Halvar, God of Battle // Sword of the Realms - Just what the doctor ordered for a voltron build, but not the droid I'm looking for in my spellslinger list. I especially like the return to hand clause on the equipment half to dodge commander tax, or if you already have a ton of gear on the battlefield you can run out Halvar and cheat some equip costs.
  
  
• Search for Glory - A tutor for Talrand, Sky Summoner, Saheeli, Sublime Artificer, The Locust God, Sakashima the Impostor, and Hall of Heliod's Generosity, plus it opens up shenanigans with snow permanents and sagas (maybe something like The Mirari Conjecture). This one is a likely candidate for testing since it's basically another Idyllic Tutor that fills some other roles.
  
  
• Starnheim Unleashed - I'm not a huge fan of foretell for Commander, but this one seems like it could be a good way to turn some spirits into bigger threats. I don't see any reason I would ever not use the foretell mode though, and being a sorcery really hurts this card. Probably won't ever play it, but it is at least notable.
  
  
• Alrund, God of the Cosmos - I like this guy as a card draw engine (probably naming lands or instants most of the time) and the bird half as a cheap early game play to set up some powerful draw steps, but I don't think either half is good enough to justify a creature slot and the flexibility of both combined doesn't help it that much.
  
  
• Alrund's Epiphany - An extra turn spell that also makes evasive tokens has my attention, but at that mana cost I think I'd rather just run Karn's Temporal Sundering with the aforementioned Search for Glory.
  
  
• Behold the Multiverse - A while back I was mulling over which other strictly worse Fact or Fictions to include in the list (if any) and while I ultimately settled on Chemister's Insight, I did consider Glimmer of Genius for the scry. Swapping out the energy for the foretell mana installment plan is definitely an improvement. I still don't think it's better than Chemister's Insight for my list currently, but scrying before drawing is definitely sweet.
  
  
• Cosima, God of the Voyage - What a fun card. I think there is definitely a Kykar brew centered around landfall and stuff like Felidar Retreat and Moraug, Fury of Akoum that Cosima would be great in. The crew 1 vehicle mode is a way to draw into lands and get some card advantage that way too. Fun, but not good enough for my current list methinks.
  
  
• Giant's Amulet - I won't say it's good, but I will say it's interesting. I wouldn't mind permanent based noncreature protection for Kykar that is also quite cheap and can bring a relevant body into the mix if you topdeck it later on. I'm not on it yet unless my meta gets more hateful toward Kykar or I find that I'm getting fewer opportunities to turn it sideways anyhow, but I think it's a shoe in for voltron/equipment Kykar builds.
  
  
• Graven Lore - I don't run enough basics to make a switch to snow basics all that meaningful, and I'm not interested in the new etb tapped snow duals, but if anyone out there is running a basic heavy version of kykar for budget reasons or what have you, consider using snow basics and running this thing. Honestly, 5 mana draw 3 and instant speed isn't terrible even without the scry. Unfortunately, not being terrible isn't good enough, the double blue pips are restrictive, and for a bigger draw spell I'd rather just go for Pull from Tomorrow or one of the delve draw spells.
  
  
• Karfell Harbringer - A dork that makes colored mana in our most desirable color and could also be relevant if I ever decide to run something like Relic Amulet is intriguing. It's not much better than Vodalian Arcanist though, and this is EDH for Pete's sake. Maybe if it ramped into Kykar I'd consider it more closely.
  
  
• Mystic Reflection - Yes, yeeesssssssss. Get in mah belleh! I love this card. Cheap, instant speed, the foretell could be useful, and it doesn't need much setup apart from a good non-legendary creature to have my next token become. This format, being commander, does not lack good options for that "requirement".
  
  
• Ravenform - Discussed in a previous post. Despite being an impersonation of Generous Gift, I don't think it gets there.
  
  
• Dual Strike - Intriguing because of the foretell "discount", but not really any better than your average copy spell.
  
  
• Frost Bite - I really hate snow permanent restrictions because they warp formats (see Arcum's Astrolabe), and I've already established that's unlikely to happen with this deck, but I wanted to call this out just because I love the card and its design. The name, art, and flavor text just kill me. Well done design team, well done.
  
  
• Open the Omenpaths - I'm down a bit more on this card than I was at first. The pump is just a bad Burn Bright, and the restriction to creatures and enchantments on the ritual is probably a dealbreaker since 1) it makes the instant speed void and 2) this card would be at its best on a big storm turn where I could get another cast trigger then turn some spirits into blue and white mana for cantrips and more spells. Restricting its usefulness to only when I have a creature or enchantment in hand is no bueno. I'll probably just keep it on the bench until I get a wild hair someday and want to try an enchantress build.
  
  
• Seize the Spoils - I ask myself if a treasure is enough better than a 1/1 for me to play Honor the God-Pharaoh and the answer is still no. If the build changes over time to be more artifact or graveyard/discard/loot centered then maybe, but in the latter case it still probably doesn't beat out Thrill of Possibility and Cathartic Reunion. Rielle, the Everwise and Squee, Goblin Nabob can keep this one.
  
  
• Tibalt's Trickery - Discussed in a previous post. I like doing silly things in Commander, and this seems to fit the bill just fine for Kykar. I'll take it.
  
  
• Forging the Tyrite Sword - Oh how I wish chapter 3 was chapter 2 and they did something else for chapter 3 on this card. Nevertheless, it is a cast trigger that refunds most of its CMC in mana of any color AND it fetches target Sunforger or Skullclamp. . . just at a snail's pace. Sigh. It's a no from me dawg, but if I ever do an artifact, proliferate, or voltron build for Kykar it will certainly make the cut.
  
  
• The Raven's Warning - UGH! Another noncreature spell that comes so close to being value city but is ruined by one line of text. Has anyone ever enjoyed playing against a Fae of Wishes // Granted effect? Why do they print these things. Rawr.
  
  
• Showdown of the Skalds - At least all parts of this one are useful for us, but I don't think it's quite useful or unconditional enough. It clashes with Kykar on the curve, so I'm probably not casting it until turn 4+ at which point the prospect of getting lucky and "drawing" 1-2 lands and 1-3 spells off of this thing isn't incredible. Again, it feels like this is for the voltron build that values dumping a bunch of counters on Kykar. With stuff like this and the giant-type payoffs, Kaldheim is being awfully good to Brion Stoutarm eh?
  
  
• Vega, the Watcher - Combos admirably with Underworld Breach, but I'm not running it except in a spirit tribal variant.
  
  
• Bloodline Pretender - If only it had some sort of invasion. Alas, it does not, and I don't have an easy way to give it any. Again, a goody for kykar spirit tribal beats.
  
  
• Cosmos Elixir - This card certainly makes a case for including stuff like Soul Warden, Soul's Attendant, Jeskai Charm, Honor the Fallen, Erebos's Intervention, etc., but not a strong enough case since we already get enough card draw faster and cheaper than this and if we didn't, there's actual factual Rhystic Study. I do, however, appreciate WotC throwing mono white this bone.
  
  
• Maskwood Nexus - A noncreature permanent that allows Kykar to eat any token for mana and also serves as a mana sink, albeit a cruddy one. It's a shame that the ability requires a tap, otherwise this would be fantastic wrath insurance. As it is though, I'll need to be convinced it's worth it without also having Kindred Discovery in the mix.
  
  
• Raiders' Karve - Is Kykar interested in a sailing career? It's got a big enough wingspan to crew this bad boy, and mana ramp is good I hear. The boat dies pretty easy though, and while having top deck information before firing off a cantrip is nice, I don't think this quite merits an inclusion over something more reliable like a Sword of the Animist.
  
  
• Axgard Armory, Gates of Istfell - The manabase is already tight enough and these effects are just a wee bit too expensive IMO. They are notable though.
  
  
• Hengegate Pathway // Mistgate Pathway - I suppose I could run this over one of the various red duals in the deck that sometimes enter tapped like Needle Spires or Clifftop Retreat. I don't think I'd be gaining much, if anything, though.

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Whew, that was a lot. I'm pretty medium on this set in general and for Kykar specifically.

TL;DR - I'm probably throwing Mystic Reflection, Search for Glory, and Tibalt's Trickery in the deck.

A few non-Kaldheim notes: I did mention previously that I'm probably going to angle toward some more "free" spells in the deck since they play out so wonderfully. What do you all think of Springleaf Drum? I gotta say, I enjoy the idea of getting two mana from a single spirit once per turn cycle. I'm also giving Pore Over the Pages a look as a way to turn three spirits into a "free" draw two then loot one. I don't know if I'm willing to go deep enough on this to include Unwind and Rewind, but I'd be lying if I said I hadn't thought about it... Last, and probably least, I'm at least intrigued by the idea of Leyline Tyrant making my spirits the bestest widdle chump attackers and blockers in the world and somehow I missed it when going over ZNR. Thoughts?

EDIT: So, I thought they were done spoiling stuff??? Is there supplemental product coming out with Kaldheim or am I just an idiot and jumped the gun? I just saw this new red legend that should definitely be part of this review:

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"Birgi, God of Tales" {2}{R}
Legendary Creature — God

Whenever you cast a spell, add {R}. Until end of turn, you don't lose this mana as steps or phases end.

You may activate boast abilities of creatures you control twice per turn instead of once per turn.

3/3
"Harnfel, Horn of Abundance" {4}{R}
Legendary Artifact

Discard a card: Exile the top two cards of your library. You may play those cards this turn.

She basically feeds the big storm turns with more mana or more cards (while filling the bin for breach!). I dig it. It's too bad that she specifies "you don't lose *this* mana as steps or phases end" rather than all red mana like with Leyline Tyrant. The horn side is probably better as a result.

[RxPhantom]

I just wanted to drop in and share a card that you may or may not have tried in the past but is doing a lot of work for me: Insult // Injury. It's won a couple games on the spot and has KO'd several individual players. Whether it's doubling token damage or juicing up a Jaya's Immolating Inferno, or even getting copied to quadruple damage, I can't see myself taking it out.

[MeowZeDung]

I just wanted to drop in and share a card that you may or may not have tried in the past but is doing a lot of work for me: Insult // Injury. It's won a couple games on the spot and has KO'd several individual players. Whether it's doubling token damage or juicing up a Jaya's Immolating Inferno, or even getting copied to quadruple damage, I can't see myself taking it out.

I had briefly considered it before as essentially a cheaper Flying Crane Technique or Akim, the Soaring Wind on offense. Things I really like about Insult // Injury are: 1) it plays incredibly well with Jeskai Ascendancy and Cathars' Crusade since you're pumping with the cast trigger and doubling the damage with the resolution, 2) it gives two cast triggers for one card, 3) it only costs red mana, 4) it can make a Boros Charm + Underworld Breach machine gun lethal in a hurry. Two things I don't like are that the damage doesn't stack with multiple casts - if I'm understanding the wording correctly - so breaching insult over and over does nothing as opposed to say, Haze of Rage, and it can't be nabbed with Sunforger.

You're right about it being a utility all-star that fits in a spellslinger shell though. I'm not quite high enough on it to include at the moment, but it certainly would be a great inclusion. I'm glad you're having success with it!

[RxPhantom]

Buuuuuuut it does stack. It's doubled every time. Cast it once: doubled. Twice: quadrupled. Thrice: octupled. Breach it all you want, my dude.

EDIT:

From Scryfall:

If you cast two Insults in one turn, damage dealt by sources you control this turn will be multiplied by 4. If you cast three Insults, it will be multiplied by 8, and so on. How rude.
(2017-04-18)

[MeowZeDung]

Buuuuuuut it does stack. It's doubled every time. Cast it once: doubled. Twice: quadrupled. Thrice: octupled. Breach it all you want, my dude.

EDIT:

From Scryfall:

If you cast two Insults in one turn, damage dealt by sources you control this turn will be multiplied by 4. If you cast three Insults, it will be multiplied by 8, and so on. How rude.
(2017-04-18)

Faaaaaaaaaaaascinating. . .

I had no idea. I'm happy to be wrong in this case. I am going to have to strongly consider running it now. My only reservation given this new tasty bit of information is that I'm only truly abusing it with breach, and that card already doesn't have any trouble winning as the deck stands now. Setting up a big ol' nasty Expansion // Explosion or Electrodominance is still a thing though, and fishing Insult // Injury back out of the yard with Mystic Retrieval a couple of times can also be worthwhile by turning my 1/1s into 8/8s effectively.

Paging @WizardMN. Did you know that this card worked this way?

[WizardMN]

Sure. Its the same as having Furnace of Rath and Fiery Emancipation on the field at the same time. Actually, Jeska, Thrice Reborn seems to be a popular topic for this same thing (activate her, let her die/flicker her/something, recast her, activate her again). Just because it is a replacement effect set up as part of a spell resolving, doesn't mean you can't stack them as you would static effects generating replacement effects

It is an interesting piece of tech, especially if you can cast it twice in one turn or copy it. I am not sure my build can benefit from it as yours can but it does seem like a pretty reasonable way to really alpha strike the entire table.

[MeowZeDung]

I am not sure my build can benefit from it as yours can but it does seem like a pretty reasonable way to really alpha strike the entire table.

I thought you might be interested in it precisely because you are creatureless, but then again you don't have the recursion pieces like breach/retrieval IIRC. It's kind of blowing my mind that I never realized that card's effect stacked. I play it in cube all the time too.

[WizardMN]

I won't discard it out of hand entirely. It, combined with Jeskai Ascendency or some other pump effects, may be enough. But the lack of recursion, for the most part, is why I was thinking it might not be enough. At least it is something to think about though.