Yuriko Stax-Turns

Strix
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Post by Strix » 4 months ago

Hey all! I've been playing this deck for roughly a year now and it has gone through several drastic changes and iterations. I'm posting it to hopefully get some constructive feedback. I greatly appreciate any and all ideas/suggestions as I'm sure you guys can pick up on things I can't quite see in the list. Please read the F.A.Q. section in the link too. I own the deck in paper form so its very important to me to get the list running as good as it can be. Cheers :D

https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/yuriko- ... 1563504931
(I like tapped out because I'm trash at BBCode and also I like their "playtest" system)
Last edited by Strix 4 months ago, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Kemev » 4 months ago

I don't really get this list. How does it win?

I'm not sold on aggressive mulligans as being a key to victory either. Usually at my tables, it's not that different from playing other formats... once you get down to a 5-card hand, you're probably not winning that game. I can see it making sense if you're all-in on a particular combo, but I don't see one in this deck.

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Post by HoffOccultist » 4 months ago

You've got this tagged cEDH, so I'm going to assume you're playing at a high power level.

With that in mind, you've got some issues to keep up at that level. Most notably, I think your creature base is problematic. You've only got a single one of the unblockable 1-drops available. You should be running the full suite instead of just creatures that have some form of evasion (you'll end up wanting a couple of these, but you need to be discerning about which ones. I prefer Mothdust Changeling, Cabal Therapist, Siren Stormtamer, and Mausoleum Wanderer to round out that group). You also don't have Tetsuko Umezawa. Even though she costs 2, making a huge chunk of your team (including Yuriko) unblockable is a big game.

I'm also not sure you want creatures that aren't ninjas that cost more than 1--even the changelings at 2+ CMC aren't providing enough bang for your buck. You also are missing a couple decent ninjas. Sakashima's Student is pretty decent, and Ingenious Infiltrator is great. I like Mist-Syndicate Naga and Fallen Shinobi, but they're more debatable. A case can be made for Throat Slitter depending on your meta. The clone effects that don't legend rule are cute--but I'd argue they're not good enough. Sure, extra Yuriko triggers are good, but paying 4 mana to get them is not good. The only creature that isn't a ninja that costs 3 or more in your list that I'd consider keeping is the Street Wraith (I don't personally run it, instead choosing to run Shriekmaw, but that's a personal preference).

Your spells could also stand to have some different choices in them. Obviously the big mana spells are nice to hit off Yuriko, but you're never going to cast any of them that are 6+ cmc unless they also have cost reduction abilities on them: Temporal Trespass and Temporal Mastery are decent enough, but Beacon, Expropriate, Time Stretch, Part the Waterveil, and Karn's Temporal Sundering probably aren't doing you much (full disclosure: I run Karn's because I am too lazy to pick up a Temporal Mastery). Nexus is fine to include, being an instant makes up for the cost to a certain extent. Some of these spells can be replaced by some other Delve spells that are actually decent--they have the higher CMC for Yuriko triggers, but also have a reasonable chance to be cast in a game. Murderous Cut, Dig Through Time, and Treasure Cruise are the more obvious choices, and I also think that Rite of Undoing, Death Rattle, and Set Adrift could have arguments made for one or more of them. Another great spell that is missing from your list is Snuff Out. 4 cmc, but free to cast. There's also some split cards worth considering that you don't have. Commit/Memory is expensive for the Commit half (4 cmc) but has an ability that can be relevant in a pinch. Connive/Concoct is less likely to be good. Discovery/Dispersal has a solid back-end in Dispersal, and Far/Away isn't godawful either.

Lastly, the Stax. Damping Sphere is a pretty good stax piece, though maybe a little worse without Engine in the format. Cursed Totem, Null Rod, and Grafdigger's Cage are all fantastic. But aside from Tangle Wire--which I think is probably one of the worse pieces of stax for a deck like this to try to break parity on--there's not much slowing your opponents down that much. I think Static Orb and Winter Orb are definite includes, as you should be able to both function on fewer lands as well as cast spells for cheap with cost reducers and free spells. Sphere of Resistance, Thorn of Amethyst, and Trinisphere could also be considered (I run Sphere and Trinisphere in addition to the two Orbs). Also, even with Null Rod in the deck, no Divining Top? Card is very good in Yuriko. Also also, Mox Amber over Mox Diamond? Not sure I agree with that, even with the light land count (maybe Chrome Mox would be better than either, though I use Chrome and Diamond).
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Post by plushpenguin » 4 months ago

I would agree on not being sold on Tangle Wire. I'm okay with cards that shut down activated abilities, but our curve is very low to the ground and we generally can't afford to tap down stuff and maintain tempo.

I would run Chrome in this deck. Not having diamond is fine given its price point, but I would definitely run chrome if your artifact count is light enough.

From my experiences, Amber is fine, but I find Chrome to be better.

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Post by Strix » 4 months ago

Thanks for the suggestions guys, it means a lot. I've poured way too much money into this than I should have, feels good to fine tune to this degree. Some great suggestions so far! I'm aware of most of the suggestions stated so far and have playtested about 70% of them, so theres definitely a reason behind their cuts, so bare with me while I try to write out my thoughts behind them.
Kemev wrote:
4 months ago
I don't really get this list. How does it win?

I'm not sold on aggressive mulligans as being a key to victory either. Usually at my tables, it's not that different from playing other formats... once you get down to a 5-card hand, you're probably not winning that game. I can see it making sense if you're all-in on a particular combo, but I don't see one in this deck.
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It wins pretty much how Edric wins. No need for arcane adaptation shenanigans; simply drop 1 and 2 cmc ninjas, attack the combo player or the player who attack/tapped out and chain turns while staxing. Its getting wins turn 5 average (which is slow ofcourse, which is why it holds counterspells up and has a light stax package to get us there). As for aggressive mulligans, it always aims to have a blue and a black mana source and a 1 drop creature in opening hand, but having, say, a null rod, chains of mephistopheles or cursed totem for example can sway whether a hand is worth keeping. I guess, keeping hands based on what you're opposing can make for some powerful starts.

HoffOccultist wrote:
4 months ago
You've got this tagged cEDH, so I'm going to assume you're playing at a high power level.

With that in mind, you've got some issues to keep up at that level. Most notably, I think your creature base is problematic. You've only got a single one of the unblockable 1-drops available. You should be running the full suite instead of just creatures that have some form of evasion (you'll end up wanting a couple of these, but you need to be discerning about which ones. I prefer Mothdust Changeling, Cabal Therapist, Siren Stormtamer, and Mausoleum Wanderer to round out that group). You also don't have Tetsuko Umezawa. Even though she costs 2, making a huge chunk of your team (including Yuriko) unblockable is a big game.

I'm also not sure you want creatures that aren't ninjas that cost more than 1--even the changelings at 2+ CMC aren't providing enough bang for your buck. You also are missing a couple decent ninjas. Sakashima's Student is pretty decent, and Ingenious Infiltrator is great. I like Mist-Syndicate Naga and Fallen Shinobi, but they're more debatable. A case can be made for Throat Slitter depending on your meta. The clone effects that don't legend rule are cute--but I'd argue they're not good enough. Sure, extra Yuriko triggers are good, but paying 4 mana to get them is not good. The only creature that isn't a ninja that costs 3 or more in your list that I'd consider keeping is the Street Wraith (I don't personally run it, instead choosing to run Shriekmaw, but that's a personal preference).

Your spells could also stand to have some different choices in them. Obviously the big mana spells are nice to hit off Yuriko, but you're never going to cast any of them that are 6+ cmc unless they also have cost reduction abilities on them: Temporal Trespass and Temporal Mastery are decent enough, but Beacon, Expropriate, Time Stretch, Part the Waterveil, and Karn's Temporal Sundering probably aren't doing you much (full disclosure: I run Karn's because I am too lazy to pick up a Temporal Mastery). Nexus is fine to include, being an instant makes up for the cost to a certain extent. Some of these spells can be replaced by some other Delve spells that are actually decent--they have the higher CMC for Yuriko triggers, but also have a reasonable chance to be cast in a game. Murderous Cut, Dig Through Time, and Treasure Cruise are the more obvious choices, and I also think that Rite of Undoing, Death Rattle, and Set Adrift could have arguments made for one or more of them. Another great spell that is missing from your list is Snuff Out. 4 cmc, but free to cast. There's also some split cards worth considering that you don't have. Commit/Memory is expensive for the Commit half (4 cmc) but has an ability that can be relevant in a pinch. Connive/Concoct is less likely to be good. Discovery/Dispersal has a solid back-end in Dispersal, and Far/Away isn't godawful either.

Lastly, the Stax. Damping Sphere is a pretty good stax piece, though maybe a little worse without Engine in the format. Cursed Totem, Null Rod, and Grafdigger's Cage are all fantastic. But aside from Tangle Wire--which I think is probably one of the worse pieces of stax for a deck like this to try to break parity on--there's not much slowing your opponents down that much. I think Static Orb and Winter Orb are definite includes, as you should be able to both function on fewer lands as well as cast spells for cheap with cost reducers and free spells. Sphere of Resistance, Thorn of Amethyst, and Trinisphere could also be considered (I run Sphere and Trinisphere in addition to the two Orbs). Also, even with Null Rod in the deck, no Divining Top? Card is very good in Yuriko. Also also, Mox Amber over Mox Diamond? Not sure I agree with that, even with the light land count (maybe Chrome Mox would be better than either, though I use Chrome and Diamond).
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I'm finding this build focuses on dropping 1 and 2 drop ninjas more efficient than dropping 1 drop unblockables and relying on arcane adaptation et al., I guess in the tables im sitting at opponents have either attacked (like tymna BS), tapped their dorks for mana or are simply open because they have combo/control in their hand. One thing I wanted to focus on this build was rather than run all the hack enchantments to change to ninjas, run removal to clear the path. Please remember; Yuriko just needs one opponent to be open and thats it for the whole table to go down. Sakashima's student was actually a very recent cut, and I only cut it because it was too slow for what it does. That being said though, its easily in the top 5 "cards that almost made it". I haven't tested ingenious infiltrator, but I'm already discarding down to handsize each turn starting from turn two, so I imagine its a bit winmore. I'd preferably put the wheel package back in if I was in need of more card draw I reckon.

I think Mist-Syndicate and Fallen Shinobi are too costly for how little they bring to the table, but I guess the more staxing/controlling list may be interested in them. "Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive" is always something I feel like I'm going to have throw into the list if I ever come across a table where no one is open or I cant make someone open for attack, maybe if I'm VSing three aggro/stax decks. I'm finding with force of negation, force of will, misdirection, commandeer and now maybe chrome mox (it was actually my most recent cut, which was more of a test tbh) going back in I always pitch the high CMC turns and what not if its not mid-game. I'm finding Tutor-turn-land drop-Tutor-Turn-land drop means I get there very quick. The deck is Turn-chaining to 40+ damage sometimes turn 4, but mostly 5. I've deliberately included 0 delve cards other than temporal trespass so that its always 3cmc for the most part, just a deck building rule thats served me well so far.

Snuff out is an excellent suggestion, may consider putting it back in. Just frustrated me that it couldn't hit Tymna, gitrog, zur and tasigur (annoyed me way more than it should haha). I took out some of the split spells as they felt very overcosted for their effects, and that downside outweighed their CMCs. I found dropping a tangle wire straight after Yuriko worked wonders... I got several turns to just draw and do mass damage. It goes along the same principle as static orb (also an extremely recent cut I made to test the deck without it) in that if we slow the game down it essentially is maximizing the amount of swings we get in. I took my mox diamond out as I found I was never able to use it. 28 land count is making it hard pressed to abuse it. As far as chrome mox is concerned, yeah, im putting it back in.


plushpenguin wrote:
4 months ago
I would agree on not being sold on Tangle Wire. I'm okay with cards that shut down activated abilities, but our curve is very low to the ground and we generally can't afford to tap down stuff and maintain tempo.

I would run Chrome in this deck. Not having diamond is fine given its price point, but I would definitely run chrome if your artifact count is light enough.

From my experiences, Amber is fine, but I find Chrome to be better.
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Tangle wire has been putting in work for me. Dropping it straight after Yuriko has enabled me to Fill my hand and get like 15 damage off or so before the game starts back up again. Its also allowed me to push into the mid game a little easier and makes 5cmc turn spells very realistically castable. Also has been ensuring there is always someone free to attack. As for chrome mox, yeah, definitely putting it back in. I can honestly say I missed it.

Closing thoughts

Cards I'm most wanting to put in asap:
-chrome mox
-static orb
-ravenous trap
-faerie macabre

Cards I'm wanting to try because a bit more evasion cant hurt (thoughts?)
-smoke shroud
-windcaller aven (might be cute for just one blue mana, draw a card; make ninja get through)

Depending what gets released in C19 and Throne of Eldraine, I may put the wheel package back in (and probably rocks too if the wheel package is in). Such an exciting time for commander in general with all these shiny new toys to play with!

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Post by HoffOccultist » 4 months ago

Strix wrote:
4 months ago
Thanks for the suggestions guys, it means a lot. I've poured way too much money into this than I should have, feels good to fine tune to this degree. Some great suggestions so far! I'm aware of most of the suggestions stated so far and have playtested about 70% of them, so theres definitely a reason behind their cuts, so bare with me while I try to write out my thoughts behind them.
Based on your responses, I have a follow-up question: what sorts of decks are you playing against in your meta? Because a lot of your choices you explain do not match my experiences (and the experiences of others who have worked with Yuriko) in a full cEDH meta at all, and the couple cards you mention thinking about adding at the end of your post kinda confirm that in my mind.
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Post by plushpenguin » 4 months ago

I cut all the 2cmc rocks even in my version that is not geared for cedh. They just feel very clunky.

I also wouldn't run any wheels. If your gameplan is going accordingly, you shouldn't be going super low on cards.

I'm thinking cards like Arcane Laboratory may be more fitting.

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Post by Strix » 4 months ago

HoffOccultist wrote:
4 months ago
Strix wrote:
4 months ago
Thanks for the suggestions guys, it means a lot. I've poured way too much money into this than I should have, feels good to fine tune to this degree. Some great suggestions so far! I'm aware of most of the suggestions stated so far and have playtested about 70% of them, so theres definitely a reason behind their cuts, so bare with me while I try to write out my thoughts behind them.
Based on your responses, I have a follow-up question: what sorts of decks are you playing against in your meta? Because a lot of your choices you explain do not match my experiences (and the experiences of others who have worked with Yuriko) in a full cEDH meta at all, and the couple cards you mention thinking about adding at the end of your post kinda confirm that in my mind.
I've played againt a very wide range of decks over the year I've been playing this deck. I'd say the commanders I've faced the most are Teferi, temporal archmage, Yisan, the wanderer Bard and Prossh, skyraider of kher, but only because thats what my friends play. But I go to my LGS regularly and come across varied commanders. One thing that has definitely been screwing me over as of late is graveyard based decks, as I took out faerie macabre and have been regretting it ever since. Not sure what you mean by that last part about your experiences?

plushpenguin wrote:
4 months ago
I cut all the 2cmc rocks even in my version that is not geared for cedh. They just feel very clunky.

I also wouldn't run any wheels. If your gameplan is going accordingly, you shouldn't be going super low on cards.

I'm thinking cards like Arcane Laboratory may be more fitting.
I found the 2cmc rocks that tapped for color amazing when I had wheels still in, namebly dimir signet, fellwar stone and talisman of dominance. Honestly, arcane signet is an amazing step in the right direction... maybe another decent rock or two and I'll ditch the null rod and chuck in all these great rocks and then put the wheel package back in.

Edit: Love your list Plush. My list is a little unorthodox as it is trying to be as competitive as it can be within the rules of focusing on 1 and 2 drop ninjas with removal, rather than hacking all 1 drops to become ninjas. Also noticed a big difference between our lists was I'm not running top, mainly because I'm running sage of epityr, sage owl, spire owl, brainstorm, scroll rack, lim-dul's vault, mystical tutor, vampiric tutor, imperial seal and personal tutor so whenever I played top it just sat there doing nothing and then I either won or lost by turn 5 without even using it. I imagine top Is great in super stax heavy versions of Yuriko or in metas with loads of removal to face. I have a question; how do you find insidious dreams? I ran the card for about a month roughly 7 months ago. I got to cast it three times in total in the month I tested it and once it instant-won the game for me, but the other two it got countered and I practically lost the game as nearly my whole hand got discarded. I imagine its great to use and then wheel if it gets countered? What are you're thoughts? I just got such a salty taste in my mouth after it making me lose the game twice haha.

Update on what I'm currently playtesting to figure out cuts/adds:
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Potential Additions in testing:

+Chrome mox (this one was iffy. After playtesting without for a month, can confirm deck is better with than without)

+faerie Macabre (not too shabby. Its no Extirpate, but we need a grave-hate card back in (probably will need more)

+static orb (we cant break parity on this, but the fact it cripples dorks/rocks etc and slows the game so we get more combat steps in is great. Also slows the game down so those big turn spells are more castable. Going back in the decklist)

Probable Cuts:

-banehound (I love the haste, but with spectral sailor getting released and through playtesting, I feel like we need it less somewhat. The fact we got 1 drop and 2 drop ninjas everywhere, this is less needed than ever.

-baleful strix (seems to be doing more harm than good. More often than not this isn't preferable to have in hand and am never happy to see it when drawn. Sucks, because its my favourite card of all time.)

-Time Stretch. Now that all the rocks and wheels to spam those rocks was removed, time stretch is a lot less castable. For now (well, atleast for as long as the rocks are removed) we'll remove this as its not feasibly castable with the decklist as it is now.



On a side note: Crossing fingers we get a bunch of arcane signet rocks of the same level so that I have an excuse to chuck the wheel package and rocks back in. Also, I'm realising my list is barely hurt by orb of dreams... Should I playtest it? Seems perfect for this list except for the fetches really but its a non-issue by turn 2/3 when orb is out with Yuriko at the same time.

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Post by Strix » 4 months ago

UPDATE: July 28th

Made several changes. Some logical, some through suggestions. Changes are somewhat permanent, but everything is in testing always. Will Copy/Paste the changes and brief reasoning here from the tapped out page:

Banehound > Chrome mox

Banehound was probably the most lackluster 1-drop. It was most useful against matchups that wiped Yuriko often, but the only tables that wiped Yuriko often were punching up, not down. Commanders that aren't threatened by Yuriko's clock are what we are trying to build toward playing against and banehound was just slowing us down in those matchups.

Baleful Strix
> Static orb

Baleful strix was there to make opponents swing at each other (in a pillowforty way), essentially lowering our clock, whilst drawing cards. The problem is we're drawing too many cards as is and baleful strix isn't really contributing to our clock enough for 2 mana. In its place, static orb – which this deck loves to play with because we run no dorks or full suite of ramp – will draw us more cards in the long run through combat triggers and will allow for much more potent damage overall.

Sakashima the impostor > Dream cache

Paying four mana for Sakashima's effect is a bit much. Its great, its just that a 4 mana spell should attempt to win the game much harder than what Sakashima facilitates. By the time we cast sakashima, lets just say there is 3 ninjas already on the field because of there being 9 targets 2cmc or less in the deck (rare, but happens from time to time). Looking at that math, we're essentially going to get an extra 3 yuriko triggers when we slap him down. The average CMC in this deck is 3.3, With lands being almost 1 in 3 chance of being a trigger, that means we will do roughly 7 extra damage for playing him (and drawing 3 more cards I guess). Instead, we could have dream Cached and put two cards on top, which will be atleast 10 damage.

Spark Double > Insidious Dreams

This is just a matter of efficiency. Insidious dreams can genuinely end the game, albeit doing so in an extremely risky way. Now that we're running Boseiju and some more counterspell support, running this seems more feasible.

Time Stretch > mission briefing

The last time I cast time stretch was in the end-game, when I was running rocks with wheels. Now that fast mana and mana ramp in general has been removed in favour for reducing our clock on aggro, time stretch is borderline uncastable. Sure we got lots of ways to pitch it, but it would be better if we ran a way to flashback a capture of jingzhou, temporal manipulation, walk the aeons or time warp. Bonus points for being able to double top-deck tutor, counterspell, etc

Phyrexian tower > Boseiju, who shelters all

Phyrexian Tower was almost always tapping for colorless. This list just doesn't provide the fodder needed to constantly be getting double black mana from it. Replacing this with Boseiju is Ideal as boseiju facilitates a more secure Extra-turn chaining game plan as well as makes Insideous Dreams not a glass-cannon by turning it into a Steel-cannon.

Spire owl > Faerie Seer

Sure, it doesn't dig as deep, but helping enable a turn 2 yuriko whilst also setting it up to do greater damage for that turn 2 attack is great. Basically trading a better mid-game for a better early game.

Tangle wire > Arcane laboratory

Tangle wire is great until you realise it's a trigger that can be responded to and everyone with a deck built with a competitive mindset will just use their mana at instant speed. This especially will get Yuriko removed if we drop it after playing yuriko. Arcane laboratory is just better in that it stops many combos straight up, where as tangle wire does not.

Sage owl > faerie Macabre

Sage owl is not as required as we draw too many cards for it to be an efficient 2 drop. With 1-drops like sage of Epityr and faerie seer its hard to warrant its inclusion. Faerie macabre will provide that turn 0+ grave removal that the deck feels like its needing right now against those graveyard themed decks.

Coastal Breach > Snuff out

With so many tutors in the deck, we dont really need a third board-bounce for nonland permanents. Cyclonic rift and devastation tide are easily tutorable and with snapcaster/briefing we have no issues utilizing them again easily. The mass bounce is less potent now that wheels are taken out. Snuff out simply should have been in a long time ago. Sure, it only hits non-black creatures, but it hits a plethora of problem creatures not in black. It also costs zero to cast which is gravy.


On a Side note: Removed the Cedh Tag from the OP. Hoffoccultist is right and I dont believe Yuriko can ever be cEDH, just fringe (for now, we need more changeling outcasts and time warps to be printed if Yuriko is to be taken seriously). I've always viewed competitive EDH as a mindframe rather than an exclusive club of "is" and "isnt's", but I suppose thats more deserving of a "competitive" tag rather than a cEDH one. Changed it accordingly.

Keep the suggestions coming!

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Post by Strix » 2 months ago

Made many changes. For simplicity's sake, I'll just post the "changelog" section here with the updates:

September 10th, 2019

Many changes abroad! I have been playtesting roughly 17 cards this last 7 weeks and have played roughly 40 games according to my logs. Below are the changes I am more than happy to make and provide a brief reason as to why these changes are taking place. Feel free to ask questions or comment on the thought process.

fourth bridge prowler > curtain's call

fourth bridge prowler was a tough one to cut, but ultimately we had too many 1 drop creatures and needed a bit more "oomph" to our mid/end game. This build still needs the spot removal, so in its place we have changed it to Curtain's call, as it removes any two creatures (not just a 1/1 chump blocker), at instant speed, for just 3 mana. It flips for 7 to boot! The main problem with fourth bridge prowler was this; its primary purpose was to take out little 1/1s or a 2/2 that blocked yuriko for turn, but the problem was against decks who brought out 1/1s normally did so en masse, therefore fourth bridge prowler would be swamped in targets it just couldn't handle. Ultimately Curtain's call can now take out the player sitting behind a big target or two.

devastation tide > coastal breach

This change was a matter of honesty; I was never tutoring or Brainstorm/dream cache this for its miracle cost and I couldn't figure out why it was the case. Upon realizing the fact that topdeck tutors were primarily used for big damage and not for miracles, I made the switch. Devastation tide almost always cost 5, because whenever i had a topdeck tutor or brainstorm/cache/rack I'd use them offensively so that I actually have a chance of winning. We play such an aggressive deck, its opponents who board wipe, not us. Also, now that we have a few more staxy permanents coming into the game its going to be them desperately board wiping, not us. Coastal breach was just a smart switch, as it pretty much costs 1 mana less to cast, but flips for 7 instead of 5.

Spectral Sailor > Oppression

Again, the build had too many 1 drops. Spectral sailor was amazing when oppression dropped, but ultimately we have chosen to cut it for oppression itself in the end, as spectral sailor was one of the only 1 drop creatures in the deck that when drawn in the late game was a major disappointment. Giving Yuriko flash was genuinely not necessary as people never really removed yuriko as to do so is incur major card/mana disadvantage, hence why just playing her at sorcery speed is more than okay.

As for oppression, I found it to be very pod dependant. Against many decks, oppression was straight up nuts, as to remove it itself, you first had to discard a card. Also, the more you could play, the more you couldn't play... Unlike bottomless pit (which I was also testing), oppression made it so you could not climb out of its effects with card draw. 7 cards in hand became 3, which became 0. All bottomless pit did was make it so black/blue players would cast card draw and be largely unaffected. On the flip side, decks that were in black abused oppression to some degree for reanimation. Obviously this is a bad card against things like gitrog/kess for example, but for the most part when this put everyone into topdeck mode (roughly 3 turn cycles past playing it) it was yuriko who always came out on top; everyone was playing 1 card a turn and we would draw, play that card and then attack with yuriko, draw, and then play that card also, burying our opponents in advantage.

Aminatou's Augury > damping matrix

Aminatou's Augury was one of those cards that felt great when it worked, but really sucked when it didnt. First of all, the card is RNG. We ran the card as it helped with extra-turn chaining for the most part, atleast, thats what the theory was. We run 11 extra turn spells, so the theory was that when we cast this, theres a 10% chance each one of those 8 cards it reveals was an extra turn. In general this felt like it revealed an extra turn spell about 40% of the time, which seemed to be somewhat correct as probability calculators put it at 43% chance for one of those 8 cards to be a turn spell. The problem? It never worked out that way... Yuriko would tutor and then cast for a turn spell or two before we chained into the 8 mana to Augury. By the time we cast it, the probability was like 30% of revealing a turn spell. If it didnt reveal a turn spell, in general, so many slots were just not ideal (revealing things like little ninjas for 8 mana just sucks). In hindsight, removing this card because it has only a 30% chance to give an extra turn, while having roughly a 20% chance to epic fail and cost you the game was the right choice.

As for damping matrix, this was a major one. Damping matrix just shuts off soooo many things and it is deceptively powerful. Notable commander's it affects are things like Thrasios infinite mana outlet, Najeela battlephase outlet, Gitrog's plethora of discard outlets, Urza's infinite mana outlet, Yisan's tutoring outlet, Anje's Filtering, Breya's infinite outlet, Godo's helm equip cost (all equipment are affected too!), Tsigur's infinite mana outlet and even things like shutting off grim monolith and basalt monolith from going infinite. It does turn off sensei's divining top (just another reason why we dont run it) and scroll rack, but we still run scroll rack in the list as it genuinely ends the game, unlike top.

strip mine > homeward path

We run enough creatures that maze of ith is not an issue. We run a small enough list of creatures so that we're not terribly affected by tabernacle (we welcome it, it clears our other opponents boards so we can seek victory) and then games dont go long enough for gaea's cradle to be abused enough. Glacial chasm is the only real threat to our win condition, but even then its not to big of a deal as we can stax out instead of playing aggressively when this happens and just let them burn through cumulative upkeep costs. Overall, strip mine always felt unneeded. Yuriko in general really does suffer from being stolen and cards like gilded drake and legacy's allure are cEDH staples in many builds. We run a plethora of spot removal so we can always destroy a stolen yuriko, but in the instance we dont have any, homeward path kicks in. Overall this change makes us much more resistant to one of Yuriko's only weaknesses; stealy.

spellstutter sprite > flusterstorm

Spellstutter sprite is one of those cards you love to love. Its a flying yuriko enabler with flash that counters like 20% of all spells in cEDH decklists, sounds like a perfect fit right? Not necessarily. The problem with this card is it has the same issue as 2cmc rocks in Yuriko; it's clunky. The way Yuriko is cEDH is that she comes down turn two, creating a real clock, so spellstutter sprite is never cast until turn 3. The problem with this is that on turn 3, everyone has already played their mystic remoras, sol rings, carpet of flowers etc etc. and spellstutter wishes it was something more general purpose. It can do cool things like counter 2/3 cmc cards in the mid/late game as we run 7 faeries (changelings), but in practice you always just wish it was a generic counterspell. Enter flusterstorm. This card was initially take out because of its low cmc, but there has been too many times where I wish this was back in. After playtesting it for 7 weeks, I can confirm it should have never been taken out. It just saves your skin way too easily, even if its cmc is a boon in Yuriko.

island > underground river

island > mana confluence

island > city of brass

Overall, we run 5 lands that can fetch for islands, whilst we had 8 actual islands in the deck. sounds great in theory but games just dont go long enough to worry about running out of targets. We have reduced the number of basic islands to 3 (we also have underground sea and watery grave in here) so now there are 5 targets for 5 fetches. Reducing the number of basic lands we have, we are more affected by blood moon and back to basics type effects, but just make sure if you're sitting across from commanders that run those, cracking for an island instead of an underground seal may be ideal. Overall these changes help to smooth out turn 2 Yuriko drops as there is more color options here.

Strix
Posts: 8
Joined: 4 months ago
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Post by Strix » 2 months ago

Another small update. Here is the 22/9/19 updated description:

Now that Throne of Eldraine is released, Mystic Sanctuary looks to be a straight up upgrade to this Stax-Turns build. A few more cards like Gingerbrute will be playtested but i cant see them being much more relevant than say Banehound . Currently, the list was running a plethora of dual-colored lands. To support the newly released bomb Mystic Sanctuary , removing the newly added Underground River , Mana Confluence and City of Brass back for Island s (x3) and then switching out River of Tears for Mystic Sanctuary will be necessary. Will be playtesting these changes tirelessly, but making this change straight off the cuff seems logical. By the end of the month I should have 30+ games or so with it and will make amendments if necessary.

Mana Confluence > Island

City of Brass
> Island

Underground Rive
r > Island

River of Tears
> Mystic Sanctuary

This month, I have tried several cards to see if they fit into the build in September 2019. Only a few made it. Overall, these changes were a long time coming and while I will miss these cards, it is all in pursuit of using cards more castable, more reliable and more crippling.

Expropriate
> Mental Misstep

I can't remember the last time I cast expropriate. It is always being discarded or pitched for things like Force of will. It was in the deck as a "what if we actually reach the endgame in a game that goes long?" type of role, kinda like a mini-draco. The deck ramps surpisingly well off of a few extra turn cards, but even then we aren't really reaching 9 mana before we end the game or lose. Fundamentally we never can cast it, hence, it was time to remove it. There has been a looming feeling that the deck could do with a bit more early game control also, and through testing this month, mental misstep is going back in the list after 6 months of being out. Misstep only hits like 20% of most cedh lists, however it does ensure winning counterspell wars as well as shutting down early-game explosive plays that get out of hand.

Dream Cache
> Sensei's Divining Top

Dream cache has been all-star when it worked, often burning the table very nicely for roughly 7 mana more than it normally would for blind flipping. That being said, it normally gets cast T4, as we really want a second ninja to be on the field on T3 to get maximum affect. For its effect, it feels kinda overcosted, especially seeing as we're not on the Draco or Emrakul, the Promised End plan. Now that even Expropriate is out, keeping dream cache in is making less and less sense. The deck does have a correct amount of top-deck manipulation and therefore the choice to change it's slot to Sensei's Divining top was appropriate. Top was a card that was taken out roughly 5 months ago when we were running much more top-deck manipulation. The list does run Null Rod and Damping Matrix which are both nonbos, but if top is on the field when they are, simply tap top and the major downside is mitigated henceforth. Overall Top is a very slow piece of topdeck manipulation, but it deserves its slot because of its resiliency.

Static Orb > leyline of the Void

Static orb has been underperforming. Static orb absolutely disrupts certain decks, however, many decks too dont care enough about it. The fact that the card is completely equalized means we aren't exactly breaking parity. For the last two months I have had a viewpoint of it as it breaks parity, as we do not run rocks or dorks, but in reality, all this does is Time Stop yourself and then the game continues as normal, just at a slower pace. We start to attack with our ninjas over and over expecting to get the most out of the orb, but our opponent are untapping mana and using the mana whole way through while we just get a few attacks off instead. Slots are becoming way too precious now and static orb just doesn't do enough to deserve a slot. Hey, what does Doomsday , bomberman combo, worldgorger combo, flashhulk and gitrog have in common? They all suffer under Leyline of the Void . Forcing our opponent(s) to deal with this before being able to combo out is just perfect.

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