"Help me cut a card" thread

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OCPunisher
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Post by OCPunisher » 4 years ago

My Lord Windgrace deck here finally picked up a copy of Vivien Reid, and it also needs a Zuran Orb. It has a major theme of lands, and a minor theme of planeswalkers (roughly one of each). Any ideas what to cut?
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Post by WizardMN » 4 years ago

I think the following would be where I would start:
I stayed away from cutting Walkers so maybe there is something there not pulling their weight.

I think Kagemaro and Massacre Girl are just weaker than you want since I don't see much for recursion in the deck. There seems to be a high chance they might not kill everything though I would lean towards Kagemaro being the first cut since MG does scale decently well if you can get her triggers started. In honesty though, I would rather have a Damnation over either one.

Nesting Dragon seems to be the weakest of the landfall creatures and doesn't play well with Massacre Girl (might not be a big deal if you cut her). I feel that 2/2 Flying Dragons are much worse than Elementals and beefing up Plant tokens. Not to say you can't have them all, but of your threats, this is the one I like the least.

Sunbird's was really just a card I don't like a lot, but I can see where it can be powerful so it probably isn't the most serious cut. I am not sure how often it "hits" but I assume it is often enough to warrant its inclusion.

I never like Sol Ring in a green deck (especially one so focused on getting lands) but it does help get Windgrace down so much quicker so it is tough to offer it as a legitimate cut.

Beyond the initial ramp it might provide, how often do you find yourself playing more than 1 land a turn with Exploration? Because Windgrace wants us to discard lands, and he gets them back on his own, do you generally find yourself with extra lands often? If not, that could be a cut. If so, and your experience has been positive, it probably is worth keeping.

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Post by OCPunisher » 4 years ago

OCPunisher wrote:
4 years ago
My Lord Windgrace deck here finally picked up a copy of Vivien Reid, and it also needs a Zuran Orb. It has a major theme of lands, and a minor theme of planeswalkers (roughly one of each). Any ideas what to cut?
Slight mistake: Nesting Dragon was already cut for Liliana, Dreadhorde General.

Exploration is a really interesting choice, and I never would've considered it, but your logic is pretty sound. Maybe I'll give it a try...
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Post by pokken » 4 years ago

OCPunisher wrote:
4 years ago
My Lord Windgrace deck here finally picked up a copy of Vivien Reid, and it also needs a Zuran Orb. It has a major theme of lands, and a minor theme of planeswalkers (roughly one of each). Any ideas what to cut?
Here's my list of cuttable stuff:
(Farseek is way worse than Nature's lore should just be that).

I don't see Purph as being all that good in this deck. Maybe sometomes you combo with Avenger or whatever, but the deck doesn't really churn out that many dudes. Feels like just a really slow wincon to me.

Sunbird just feeels like a questionable card to me but some people have good luck with it. It mostly feels like there' sa high percentage of the time that it does not do more than pay for itself.


Avenger I get as it's a pretty reasonable way to win by itself since Windgrace can make it big.

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Post by OCPunisher » 4 years ago

You make a reasonable point about Farseek vs Nature's Lore. The downside to Lore is that most of the duals I would fetch ETB tapped either way, but if I decide to go the full-powered dual route with Taiga and Badlands, then Lore probably wins by a hair. I'll try it out and see how it goes.

Sunbird's Invocation is kind of a pet card, but I have also had great success with it. I'm more of a go-wide deck given how many of my planeswalkers make token fodder, so Purphoros fits a little better than usual. Kagemaro has been getting cut a fair amount recently,

I think Comet Storm might be the odd one out here. It's obviously very mana intensive, and while the Lord does make a lot of lands, I'm frequently tapping out.
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Post by WizardMN » 4 years ago

I agree on Comet Storm. I excluded it from my initial suggestions since I felt it might offer a win con in longer games that didn't rely on combat. I am often finding in my deck that I usually win through combat so having a noncombat method of winning can be desirable. But, if you find that it really isn't doing that and is instead just a removal spell, then it probably is right to cut.

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Post by OCPunisher » 4 years ago

Finally managed to track down a copy of Idol of Oblivion for my Oketra deck here. Not sure what to cut just yet as I haven't played it too much recently.
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Post by OCPunisher » 4 years ago

Let's try this again...

My Rakdos deck here finally picked up a copy of Spawn of Mayhem. This card checks a lot of boxes in the deck: enables Rakdos (albeit not on turn three), increases the Demon tribal count (which incidentally could make Liliana's Contract more of a thing), and it's another reasonably large flying body.

For cuts, this deck has been around for several years, so it's pretty well-tuned for what it does. I admit that I have a couple of pet cards, which makes this process even harder.
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Post by Outcryqq » 4 years ago

@OCPunisher
I think you could cut a few cards to make room for Spawn of Mayhem. Phyrexian Arena is pretty slow card draw considering your access to black, and the life loss doesn't help you because Rakdos, Lord of Riots only cares about opponents' lifeloss. Chain Reaction seems less able to be controlled, I'd prefer any of the sweepers that do 5 damage to each creature (which avoids killing most of your dudes) or Blasphemous Act. Depending your meta, your tutors seem cuttable, unless you really need a particular card....and if you need a particular card for your tutors, Gamble still seems like a weak choice.

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Post by shandiris » 4 years ago

OCPunisher wrote:
4 years ago
Let's try this again...

My Rakdos deck here finally picked up a copy of Spawn of Mayhem. This card checks a lot of boxes in the deck: enables Rakdos (albeit not on turn three), increases the Demon tribal count (which incidentally could make Liliana's Contract more of a thing), and it's another reasonably large flying body.

For cuts, this deck has been around for several years, so it's pretty well-tuned for what it does. I admit that I have a couple of pet cards, which makes this process even harder.
Bitterblossom, Hazoret, the Fervent or Purphoros, Bronze Blooded all seem good, but not great?
OCPunisher wrote:
4 years ago
Finally managed to track down a copy of Idol of Oblivion for my Oketra deck here. Not sure what to cut just yet as I haven't played it too much recently.
Winds of Abandon I'm pretty happy everytime this (overloaded) against me, ok maybe I die this turn, but you spent 6 mana and a card at sorcery speed and if you don't kill me you've given me a tremendous advantage. Compare that to a (not very good) card likeGlaring Spotlight.
Soul Warden and Soul's Attendant seem unexciting, even if they're one drops.

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Post by MeowZeDung » 4 years ago

shandiris wrote:
4 years ago
Winds of Abandon I'm pretty happy everytime this (overloaded) against me, ok maybe I die this turn, but you spent 6 mana and a card at sorcery speed and if you don't kill me you've given me a tremendous advantage. Compare that to a (not very good) card likeGlaring Spotlight.
Soul Warden and Soul's Attendant seem unexciting, even if they're one drops.
Paging @pokken for feedback on Winds of Abandon, which iirc has been absolutely savage in his favor in Ephara. Of course that may just be because he runs Archaeomancer.

The Soul sisters are great in OC's GE Oketra list precisely because they are one drops (and are thus tutorable with Ranger of Eos effects), trigger on creature 4/4 zombie and Whitemane Lion entry, and are essentially for 5 power and toughness and a relevant ability.

Winds might be the cut, not sure. Glaring Spotlight does allow for a huge zombie alpha strike, but that is pretty situational, so you may be right about it being disposable too.
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Post by pokken » 4 years ago

This is going to sound weird but I do not remember losing a game in which I overloaded winds of abandon yet. There may have been at most one, but I usually remember my losses more than the wins.

I've cast it as many as 3 times in a game. One time a guy ran out of mountains in his krenko deck. Ran out of mountains. With OC's deck and how many 4/4s it makes, it's almost guaranteed to be killing at least one person when he casts winds, and leaving the least dangerous people.

It's just too efficient in a deck that wants to win by creature combat in my opinion; sometimes more than Rift because it's a permanent solution to things people are going to gain a ton of value from recasting.

I've had outsized success partly because you can spellseeker or muddle the mixture for it, but I think that's mitigated by how good it is with OC's stronger creatures.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 4 years ago

I have managed to lose a Whift game. A guy was sitting on a token army and didn't have too much else going on, plus he built basic-heavy like he tends to. Oh would you look at that Skullclamp off the top, recast Ghave. That said, this was the only instance of stuff going aggressively to hell post-Whift. Most of the time the board state hit far outweighs the ramp compensation.
 
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Post by OCPunisher » 4 years ago

Hazoret the Fervent seems like a fine cut for Rakdos.
Winds of Abandon is flexible enough as a single removal spell or a wrath that it will probably stay. I ended up cutting Forsake the Worldly for the Idol.

If I were to cut a wrath, or just upgrade them, I would probably go from Cleansing Nova to Austere Command or Cataclysmic Gearhulk (the latter can be tutored up).
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Post by shandiris » 4 years ago

I'm looking for some advice on my Mairsil, the Pretender deck. It's currently at a decent power level with no intentions go with an infinite combo route. (Although it does ocassionaly happen due to Necrotic Ooze, but if I'm using an opponent's graveyard to go off, I'm fine with it,) It's a control deck that wants to screw around with cool Mairsil interactions while policing the table a bit. I'm looking whether I can add some more ramp (in non artifact form, due to Nevinyrral's Disk), so that Olivia Voldaren and Scarab God become better cards in the deck. That and at some point I want to add Gamble and Entomb. And there's always a bunch of Mairsil target that I want to try. However it's always pretty difficult to cut cards from this deck so I'm looking for some advice. Recently I've cut a number of wheels due to me being scared of turning opponents decks (and especially their combo pieces) on. So they were stuck in my hand quite often, so I cut a couple. Whether or not that's a good call, I still don't know. But anyways here's the list, let me know what you think!

https://archidekt.com/decks/407790#Grea ... _16-2-2020

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Post by OCPunisher » 4 years ago

shandiris wrote:
4 years ago
I'm looking for some advice on my Mairsil, the Pretender deck. It's currently at a decent power level with no intentions go with an infinite combo route. (Although it does ocassionaly happen due to Necrotic Ooze, but if I'm using an opponent's graveyard to go off, I'm fine with it,) It's a control deck that wants to screw around with cool Mairsil interactions while policing the table a bit. I'm looking whether I can add some more ramp (in non artifact form, due to Nevinyrral's Disk), so that Olivia Voldaren and Scarab God become better cards in the deck. That and at some point I want to add Gamble and Entomb. And there's always a bunch of Mairsil target that I want to try. However it's always pretty difficult to cut cards from this deck so I'm looking for some advice. Recently I've cut a number of wheels due to me being scared of turning opponents decks (and especially their combo pieces) on. So they were stuck in my hand quite often, so I cut a couple. Whether or not that's a good call, I still don't know. But anyways here's the list, let me know what you think!

https://archidekt.com/decks/407790#Grea ... _16-2-2020
I don't have too much experience with Mairsil as a commander, so I apologize if I'm missing an obvious combo piece or other such interaction.

Off-hand, I would start with something like Necromantic Selection, just based on the mana requirements. I understand the upside of wrathing and getting an extra Mairsil trigger on a hopefully clean board, but it still sticks out for me.

After that, any non-creature, non-artifact spell would draw instant extra scrutiny. So, maybe you shave either Rakdos Charm or Ashiok, Dream Render. Maybe you don't need Mystic Remora and Rhystic Study. Something like that...
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Post by shandiris » 4 years ago

OCPunisher wrote:
4 years ago
I don't have too much experience with Mairsil as a commander, so I apologize if I'm missing an obvious combo piece or other such interaction.

Off-hand, I would start with something like Necromantic Selection, just based on the mana requirements. I understand the upside of wrathing and getting an extra Mairsil trigger on a hopefully clean board, but it still sticks out for me.

After that, any non-creature, non-artifact spell would draw instant extra scrutiny. So, maybe you shave either Rakdos Charm or Ashiok, Dream Render. Maybe you don't need Mystic Remora and Rhystic Study. Something like that...
Necromantic Selection is probaly a good call. It's good and it's exactly what you want, but 7 mana is a lot.

In terms of how the deck functions: the most important thing is usually the first cage, where you ideally want Aetherling, Cavern Harpy, Nezahal, Primal Tide, Pack Rat or Shifty Doppelganger so you can get more options easily. (Aetherling is the best card in the deck by quite a bit.) However, the second one is pretty much useless as a cage target so that's why you're only playing 5 of that effect.

So in terms of non-artifacts/creatures, the number is not actually that relevant. I currently have 24 possible targets and I probaly don't want to go down too hard, but it's definately not necessary to play 30-40. In a typical game I end up with 4 things "caged" and in games when things are going well more like 6-7. But you don't need your whole hand to be targets in my experience, 2 options by turn 4 is typically fine. And given the fact that you've drawn atleast 11 cards by then 24 seems like a decent number.

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Post by cheonice » 4 years ago

Necromantic Selection would be my first pick, too. Another card I would consider cutting is Uyo, Silent Prophet. If you want to add some ramp this card seems counterproductive. How often does this card pull its weight in copying great spells oder counter spells?

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Post by cheonice » 4 years ago

I need some advice on my Selvala, Explorer Returned deck. This is my oldest deck and nearly every card has proved ist value many times or is a pet card I don't want to cut. I really like the power level because it's on par with my playgroup's. Nontheless there are some cards I want to test:
  1. Sometimes the deck struggles with finishing games. I'd like to test Finale of Devastation. It fetches End-Raze Forerunners, Champion of Lambholt or other endgame creatures and transforms my elves into a leathal force.
  2. Mostly I need a really good timing to use Selvala, Explorer Returned effectively. So an additional mana sink would be great. Dawn of Hope is a card I wanted to test for a some time now. It ticks all of my boxes, can be recurred by Sun Titan and works well with my other life gainers.
  3. I am unsure if my untap toolbox needs a little change. At the moment I'm playing Qurion Ranger (an elf for my elf package) and Wirewood Symbiote (an elf synergy card to re-trigger). Scryb Ranger would be another option, but it's not an elf. Typically I have more Plains than Forests in play due to my obsession with Emeria, the Sky Ruin.
I really struggle with finding some cuts within my pet deck. Any help is greatly apreciated.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 4 years ago

Serra Ascendant is "just" a big dumb beater. Is Sigarda, Host of Herons a meta call due to high levels of edict play? Similarly for Shalai, Voice of Plenty, but she comes with a mana sink so a bit less so. You're quite giant-light for Realm-Cloaked Giant, feels like that slot could be used better (not necessarily in this update, as some wipe quota is good). How often does the flash end up mattering?
 
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Post by cheonice » 4 years ago

Serra Ascendant has won me some games, so I'm hesitant to let him go. With my life-gaining commander he can be quite a force, even mid- or lategame. But you are right, this could be the right cut.
Both the angels pull their weight in protecting my board and, even more important, providing great flying bodies.
Realm-Cloaked Giant is a tutorable wrath, which is just great in GW! No way I'm cutting him! :?
Yeva, Nature's Herald and Vivien, Champion of the Wilds both provide flash, so yeah, keeping my elves would be better.

What do you think about Acidic Slime? He is quite overcosted for what he does and is outclassed by other options. On the other he is like a swiss army knife...

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Post by folding_music » 4 years ago

https://scryfall.com/@shquidia/decks/6c ... 60d2d82f1a (Arjun, red/blue peculiar junk)

this is basically a pile of my favourite cards rather than a cogent deck. I was hoping someone could suggest another "core" card for the deck, ie, not a refinement of the engine or an improvement to the terrible land base, but something that I'd have a plan for if it appeared in my opening hand! there's so many cantrips in here that opening hands are terrible about 100% of the time. thanks for looking in if ya do!

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Post by pokken » 4 years ago

folding_music wrote:
4 years ago
https://scryfall.com/@shquidia/decks/6c ... 60d2d82f1a (Arjun, red/blue peculiar junk)

this is basically a pile of my favourite cards rather than a cogent deck. I was hoping someone could suggest another "core" card for the deck, ie, not a refinement of the engine or an improvement to the terrible land base, but something that I'd have a plan for if it appeared in my opening hand! there's so many cantrips in here that opening hands are terrible about 100% of the time. thanks for looking in if ya do!
Here're some cards I like with that pile:

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Post by folding_music » 4 years ago

pokken wrote:
4 years ago
Here're some cards I like with that pile: (abridged giggle)
oh man, I own these cards already and didn't think about them. :))) past in flames and frantic search are absolutely the sort of thing I want in an opening hand. i deliberately run decks with no shuffling effects both for speed and power reasons so mystical tutor is out. I had windfall in and discovered it didn't combo with Land's Edge which I am stubborn enough to keep in!

Snapcaster is a card I reckon is straight up too good so I have never sought one out but, you're right, it'd suit these cards so perfectly. tempted to substitute my shiny copy of Recoup but more realistically I'll try and pick up a Breach cos that's another opening hand concept. thank you!

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Post by pokken » 4 years ago

Welcome. Spitballing card ideas is probably the only thing I enjoy more than actually crafting a deck, lol :)

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