Let's Rank al mono Black Spot Removal

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Dunharrow
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Post by Dunharrow » 2 years ago

I really like that lands thread
I think we should make a man rock thread too, but I am not good at evaluating rocks

I wanted to dive into monoblack spot removal. What's the best? I know our two-color decks are filled with Anguished Unmaking and Assassin's Trophy and more... but I thought it would be worth looking at monoblack spot removal. I am updating my Rakdos, Lord of Riots deck and I have some good 2 color removal, and only three monoblack removal spells. Did I choose the best ones?

Here is my preliminary list.
Things to consider: Versatility, mana cost, instant vs sorcery... Things like Synergy are a little hard for a list like this. Obviously Shriekmaw is better if you have recursion. Feed the swarm is better if you don't have Green or White in your deck.


Also, the point isn't to say you play the top 3 and that's it. You might want an exile effect if your deck is lacking them. You may want sorcery removal if you are always tapping out.



----- EDIT ----

Seems like the top picks are these:

1. Baleful Mastery
2. Infernal Grasp
3. Feed the Swarm (in decks with no green or white)
4. Heartless Act

But I liked the idea of breaking them down into 3 lists as you probably want a variety of options in your decks:

A) Best destroy effects
1. Infernal Grasp
2. Heartless Act
3. Go for the Throat
4. Snuff Out
5. Slaughter Pact
6. Murderous Cut
7. Victim of Night
8. Power Word Kill
9. Murderous Rider // Swift End
10+ - many cards listed in this thread but in my opinion hard to justify over these (please chime in if you disagree.


B) Best Exile or -X/-X effects
1. Baleful Mastery
2. Dismember
3. Deadly Rollick
4. Ashes to Ashes
5. Sudden Death
6. Eat to Extinction (value goes up if you want cards in your graveyard)

C) Syngergistic cards
1. Creatures that die easy to be reanimated for a second kill: Shriekmaw, Bone Shredder
2. Creatures that stick around to be flickered: Ravenous Chupacabra, Gelatinous Cube, Noxious Gearhulk
3. Tragic Slip and Malicious Affliction and Fatal Push are all better if you are actively sacrificing creatures
4. Executioner's Capsule if you have artifact recursion
5. Attrition type cards? Do they deserve to be here?
Last edited by Dunharrow 2 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by pokken » 2 years ago

#1 for me is still Deadly Rollick but depends on the deck somewhat. most of my decks it's great.

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Post by Hawk » 2 years ago

For me:

Tier 1: These are auto-includes in monoblack and near-auto-includes in most two and three-colored decks. Simple, strong, and synergy-agnostic.

1. Infernal Grasp (simply the best - hits any creature and costs minimal life)
2. Go for the Throat (even these days, this hits more than it doesn't)
3. Heartless Act (my old analysis revealed this hit the vast, vast majority of meaningful targets in the meta)

Tier 2: These cards fall lower either because they can get out-competed in multicolor decks OR because of budget concerns, but they're all clearly a cut above.
4. Deadly Rollick (arguably the best removal spell, but cost and availability makes it hard to add to every deck. Also falls off if you are playing a 5+ CMC commander).
5. Feed the Swarm (a must-run in monoblack and Rakdos, but falls off hard in other combinations)
6. Murderous Rider // Swift End (a great card with a lot of applicability - but a bit costly $$$-wise)
7. Hero's Downfall (a great staple in monoblack, but can fall off in multicolored decks. Very budget friendly now as of Crimson Vow)

Tier 3: These removal spells are, in my mind, no longer "deck agnostic" - they tend to be stronger than some Tier 2 removal in the right deck, but hard to play in the wrong one. They're roleplayers - they're totally serviceable in any deck, but sing best in specific archetypes.
8. Tragic Slip (incredible in any deck with a significant sacrifice/aristocrat component; pretty weak without a critical mass of sac games)
9. Shriekmaw (incredible in a deck that cares about EtBs, death triggers, or creature count - but definitely has some limitations)
10. Murderous Cut (great if you are reliably filling your 'yard with chaff you want to then exile, but pretty weak otherwise)
11. Bone Shredder (see everything I said about Shriekmaw except worse...except in Alesha, Who Smiles at Death )
12. Malicious Affliction (awesome in a deck that can trigger morbid at will like Tragic Slip; weak otherwise)
13. Ravenous Chupacabra (slow and ponderous, but awesome in any deck that can blink or loop it)
14. Executioner's Capsule (a must-play in any deck with Artifact synergies; stone unplayable otherwise)

Tier 4: These are "fine" removal spells, and ones you might even run in Monoblack or a controlling Rakdos, Dimir, or Golgari build, but with all the amazing removal printed and reprinted over the last few years I'd say they're generally outclassed these days.
15. Dismember: "Toughness 5 or less" has an acceptable hit rate in the meta, and the flexibility of casting for 1 mana is solid.
16. Snuff Out: Casting this for 0 is neat, although "Nonblack, nonartifact" is a heavy restriction.
17. Devour in Shadow: Totally blown out now by Infernal Grasp, but is the cheapest restriction-free kill spell.
18. Baleful Mastery: A strong spell with some solid flexibility.
19. Victim of Night: Probably worse with the prevalence of Monsters post-Midnight Hunt/Crimson vow, but still a fine spell.
20. Power Word Kill: Misses some major-league commanders, but may actually hit more relevant targets than Victim.
21.: Reckless Spite: a heavy cost in terms of life, targeting, and mana - but it is a 2 for 1.
22. Ashes to Ashes: See above, but this is also a sorcery.
23. Curtains' Call: See above, except this is even more expensive. At its best in a deck that cares about CMC.
24. Doom Blade: A totally budget-friendly reasonable spell for those on a budget, but as my old analysis notes this is gonna miss a significant amount of the time. If you're willing to take that risk - I'd be looking at Snuff Out or Malicious Affliction. Only makes the top 20 for budget considerations, as one of the most accessible and reprinted removal spells.
25. Terror: A mostly worse Doom Blade, but it is a nostalgia trip.

I've played all of these at different points (the ones I own copies of at least - still don't have any Deadly Rollicks). I wouldn't look at any other removal spell outside of some very, very niche scenarios.

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Post by Dunharrow » 2 years ago

pokken wrote:
2 years ago
#1 for me is still Deadly Rollick but depends on the deck somewhat. most of my decks it's great.
Oops forgot to include. Hard to evaluate in a vacuum... great when you can cast your general early!
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Post by Serenade » 2 years ago

I rank Baleful Mastery over everything else. Exile, hits two permanent types, cheap cost if needed (and YOU CHOOSE the opponent), instant speed...it's just terrific.

I want to try Defile in monoB one day; I just have not gotten around to it.
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Post by Dunharrow » 2 years ago

Hawk wrote:
2 years ago
For me:

Tier 1: These are auto-includes in monoblack and near-auto-includes in most two and three-colored decks. Simple, strong, and synergy-agnostic.

1. Infernal Grasp (simply the best - hits any creature and costs minimal life)
2. Go for the Throat (even these days, this hits more than it doesn't)
3. Heartless Act (my old analysis revealed this hit the vast, vast majority of meaningful targets in the meta)

Tier 2: These cards fall lower either because they can get out-competed in multicolor decks OR because of budget concerns, but they're all clearly a cut above.
4. Deadly Rollick (arguably the best removal spell, but cost and availability makes it hard to add to every deck. Also falls off if you are playing a 5+ CMC commander).
5. Feed the Swarm (a must-run in monoblack and Rakdos, but falls off hard in other combinations)
6. Murderous Rider // Swift End (a great card with a lot of applicability - but a bit costly $$$-wise)
7. Hero's Downfall (a great staple in monoblack, but can fall off in multicolored decks. Very budget friendly now as of Crimson Vow)

Tier 3: These removal spells are, in my mind, no longer "deck agnostic" - they tend to be stronger than some Tier 2 removal in the right deck, but hard to play in the wrong one. They're roleplayers - they're totally serviceable in any deck, but sing best in specific archetypes.
8. Tragic Slip (incredible in any deck with a significant sacrifice/aristocrat component; pretty weak without a critical mass of sac games)
9. Shriekmaw (incredible in a deck that cares about EtBs, death triggers, or creature count - but definitely has some limitations)
10. Murderous Cut (great if you are reliably filling your 'yard with chaff you want to then exile, but pretty weak otherwise)
11. Bone Shredder (see everything I said about Shriekmaw except worse...except in Alesha, Who Smiles at Death )
12. Malicious Affliction (awesome in a deck that can trigger morbid at will like Tragic Slip; weak otherwise)
13. Ravenous Chupacabra (slow and ponderous, but awesome in any deck that can blink or loop it)
14. Executioner's Capsule (a must-play in any deck with Artifact synergies; stone unplayable otherwise)

Tier 4: These are "fine" removal spells, and ones you might even run in Monoblack or a controlling Rakdos, Dimir, or Golgari build, but with all the amazing removal printed and reprinted over the last few years I'd say they're generally outclassed these days.
15. Dismember: "Toughness 5 or less" has an acceptable hit rate in the meta, and the flexibility of casting for 1 mana is solid.
16. Snuff Out: Casting this for 0 is neat, although "Nonblack, nonartifact" is a heavy restriction.
17. Devour in Shadow: Totally blown out now by Infernal Grasp, but is the cheapest restriction-free kill spell.
18. Baleful Mastery: A strong spell with some solid flexibility.
19. Victim of Night: Probably worse with the prevalence of Monsters post-Midnight Hunt/Crimson vow, but still a fine spell.
20. Power Word Kill: Misses some major-league commanders, but may actually hit more relevant targets than Victim.
21.: Reckless Spite: a heavy cost in terms of life, targeting, and mana - but it is a 2 for 1.
22. Ashes to Ashes: See above, but this is also a sorcery.
23. Curtains' Call: See above, except this is even more expensive. At its best in a deck that cares about CMC.
24. Doom Blade: A totally budget-friendly reasonable spell for those on a budget, but as my old analysis notes this is gonna miss a significant amount of the time. If you're willing to take that risk - I'd be looking at Snuff Out or Malicious Affliction. Only makes the top 20 for budget considerations, as one of the most accessible and reprinted removal spells.
25. Terror: A mostly worse Doom Blade, but it is a nostalgia trip.

I've played all of these at different points (the ones I own copies of at least - still don't have any Deadly Rollicks). I wouldn't look at any other removal spell outside of some very, very niche scenarios.
Thanks Hawk for your great input. Funny that I think Dismember is way better than many of the cards on your list. Same for Murderous Cut. I find they are pretty much 1-mana murders all the time. Dismember of course has some issues with big creatures but in my opinion makes up for it by hitting indestructible creatures.

I also think Baleful Mastery needs to be a lot higher.

What I also think is interesting is that I am far more likely to play
1. Infernal Grasp
2. Baleful Mastery
3. Feed the Swarm

As this covers more bases and presumably I have some tutors. Exile is really strong. I think if you are playing 3 monoblack removal spells you probably want more versatility than the 3 cards you listed as tier 1.


Maybe this list need to be divided by function?


1. Destroy spells
2. Exile or -X/-X
3. Synergistic spells
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Post by Serenade » 2 years ago

What Dunharrow just listed are my top three.
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Post by Hawk » 2 years ago

Dunharrow wrote:
2 years ago
Hawk wrote:
2 years ago
For me:

Tier 1: These are auto-includes in monoblack and near-auto-includes in most two and three-colored decks. Simple, strong, and synergy-agnostic.

1. Infernal Grasp (simply the best - hits any creature and costs minimal life)
2. Go for the Throat (even these days, this hits more than it doesn't)
3. Heartless Act (my old analysis revealed this hit the vast, vast majority of meaningful targets in the meta)

Tier 2: These cards fall lower either because they can get out-competed in multicolor decks OR because of budget concerns, but they're all clearly a cut above.
4. Deadly Rollick (arguably the best removal spell, but cost and availability makes it hard to add to every deck. Also falls off if you are playing a 5+ CMC commander).
5. Feed the Swarm (a must-run in monoblack and Rakdos, but falls off hard in other combinations)
6. Murderous Rider // Swift End (a great card with a lot of applicability - but a bit costly $$$-wise)
7. Hero's Downfall (a great staple in monoblack, but can fall off in multicolored decks. Very budget friendly now as of Crimson Vow)

Tier 3: These removal spells are, in my mind, no longer "deck agnostic" - they tend to be stronger than some Tier 2 removal in the right deck, but hard to play in the wrong one. They're roleplayers - they're totally serviceable in any deck, but sing best in specific archetypes.
8. Tragic Slip (incredible in any deck with a significant sacrifice/aristocrat component; pretty weak without a critical mass of sac games)
9. Shriekmaw (incredible in a deck that cares about EtBs, death triggers, or creature count - but definitely has some limitations)
10. Murderous Cut (great if you are reliably filling your 'yard with chaff you want to then exile, but pretty weak otherwise)
11. Bone Shredder (see everything I said about Shriekmaw except worse...except in Alesha, Who Smiles at Death )
12. Malicious Affliction (awesome in a deck that can trigger morbid at will like Tragic Slip; weak otherwise)
13. Ravenous Chupacabra (slow and ponderous, but awesome in any deck that can blink or loop it)
14. Executioner's Capsule (a must-play in any deck with Artifact synergies; stone unplayable otherwise)

Tier 4: These are "fine" removal spells, and ones you might even run in Monoblack or a controlling Rakdos, Dimir, or Golgari build, but with all the amazing removal printed and reprinted over the last few years I'd say they're generally outclassed these days.
15. Dismember: "Toughness 5 or less" has an acceptable hit rate in the meta, and the flexibility of casting for 1 mana is solid.
16. Snuff Out: Casting this for 0 is neat, although "Nonblack, nonartifact" is a heavy restriction.
17. Devour in Shadow: Totally blown out now by Infernal Grasp, but is the cheapest restriction-free kill spell.
18. Baleful Mastery: A strong spell with some solid flexibility.
19. Victim of Night: Probably worse with the prevalence of Monsters post-Midnight Hunt/Crimson vow, but still a fine spell.
20. Power Word Kill: Misses some major-league commanders, but may actually hit more relevant targets than Victim.
21.: Reckless Spite: a heavy cost in terms of life, targeting, and mana - but it is a 2 for 1.
22. Ashes to Ashes: See above, but this is also a sorcery.
23. Curtains' Call: See above, except this is even more expensive. At its best in a deck that cares about CMC.
24. Doom Blade: A totally budget-friendly reasonable spell for those on a budget, but as my old analysis notes this is gonna miss a significant amount of the time. If you're willing to take that risk - I'd be looking at Snuff Out or Malicious Affliction. Only makes the top 20 for budget considerations, as one of the most accessible and reprinted removal spells.
25. Terror: A mostly worse Doom Blade, but it is a nostalgia trip.

I've played all of these at different points (the ones I own copies of at least - still don't have any Deadly Rollicks). I wouldn't look at any other removal spell outside of some very, very niche scenarios.
Thanks Hawk for your great input. Funny that I think Dismember is way better than many of the cards on your list. Same for Murderous Cut. I find they are pretty much 1-mana murders all the time. Dismember of course has some issues with big creatures but in my opinion makes up for it by hitting indestructible creatures.

I also think Baleful Mastery needs to be a lot higher.

What I also think is interesting is that I am far more likely to play
1. Infernal Grasp
2. Baleful Mastery
3. Feed the Swarm

As this covers more bases and presumably I have some tutors. Exile is really strong. I think if you are playing 3 monoblack removal spells you probably want more versatility than the 3 cards you listed as tier 1.


Maybe this list need to be divided by function?


1. Destroy spells
2. Exile or -X/-X
3. Synergistic spells
Good point. I'll freely admit - I haven't played with our around Baleful Mastery much, and totally missed you can let ANY opponent draw. That definitely bumps it way up the list. For Feed, that's one where it's just contextual and I did my list for "all decks in general" - for monoblack, I agree I'd run it over everything except Grasp and in Rakdos, I'd run it over anything except Grasp and Terminate. Once you add W, U, or G to the mix though, there are a lot more versatile and less agonizing ways to take care of pesky enchantments.

I've been underwhelmed by Murderous Cut in my own meta though. I run it in some places for sure, and it's great in decks that care about CMC (Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow) or that tend to fill their yard with chaff (like Varina, Lich Queen). But it was really awkward in Gitrog Monster (who doesn't want to exile anything usually) and Mirri Vampires (which just tends to not have a very full 'yard). Hence my placement.

I also like your idea of breaking it up. I'll give some thought to how to reoirent my own list, but it makes sense to rank stuff as "destroy effects", "exile/-x/-x effects", and "synergy spells.

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Post by Toshi » 2 years ago

S-Tier:
1. Infernal Grasp
2. Heartless Act
3. Go for the Throat

A-Tier:
4. Dismember
5. Murderous Cut - needs a certain type of deck though
6. Snuff Out
7. Slaughter Pact
8. Deadly Rollick - missing out on future reanimation is a major downside in mono-
9. Murderous Rider
10. Defile - great in Bubbling Muck type builds

Honorable mention: Bloodline Culling & Bile Blight as they double as great silver bullets in token metas.
Honorable mention 2.0: Sudden Death is great value in creature combo heavy metas!

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Post by Jemolk » 2 years ago

My list would be really wonky. I choose flavor over power every time, and nice art over power 9 times out of 10. Also I'm a bit of a deckbuilding hipster; I'm probably not going to run Infernal Grasp specifically because it's staple quality. Still, I gotta say, I've rarely been let down by Malicious Affliction or Snuff Out, despite the restrictions. Of course, I'll also do silly things like run Phthisis in my expensive jank tribal Jodah deck and make it work for me, so it's not like that's any real indication of power.

Also don't forget things like Bone Splinters and its more recent variants (Bone Shards and Spark Harvest). Those seem like they deserve a place in the rankings. So does Noxious Gearhulk IMHO, given that its artifact status, decently large body, and the fact it gains life give it a bit of a different niche from Ravenous Chupacabra. Odds are my random pet cards from commander games of yore like Silence the Believers probably don't, though, much to my disappointment. Oh well, I'll still play them.
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Post by Dunharrow » 2 years ago

Jemolk wrote:
2 years ago
My list would be really wonky. I choose flavor over power every time, and nice art over power 9 times out of 10. Also I'm a bit of a deckbuilding hipster; I'm probably not going to run Infernal Grasp specifically because it's staple quality. Still, I gotta say, I've rarely been let down by Malicious Affliction or Snuff Out, despite the restrictions. Of course, I'll also do silly things like run Phthisis in my expensive jank tribal Jodah deck and make it work for me, so it's not like that's any real indication of power.

Also don't forget things like Bone Splinters and its more recent variants (Bone Shards and Spark Harvest). Those seem like they deserve a place in the rankings. So does Noxious Gearhulk IMHO, given that its artifact status, decently large body, and the fact it gains life give it a bit of a different niche from Ravenous Chupacabra. Odds are my random pet cards from commander games of yore like Silence the Believers probably don't, though, much to my disappointment. Oh well, I'll still play them.
Oh you know what Noxious Gearhulk should be in my Rakdos list. I don't think I own one. But that's a good example of what I would call a 'synergy' kill spell. You aren't jamming it into any old black deck. And that's where I wanted to go with this list - outside of synergies, what kill spells are the best to play.

I would probably run Attrition over Bone Shards and family. My biggest issue is that when someone counters your bone splinters you get 2 for 1... kinda rough.
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Post by onering » 2 years ago

I actually like Price of Fame a lot and think it's underrated. As often as I find myself aiming removal at commanders, and how many cards in the 99 tend to be legendary nowadays, this is more often than not a 2 mana kill spell with surveil 2 attached. It's situationally mediocre, because there are some key creatures that always need to die that aren't legendary and if this is your only removal in hand you'll have to pay the full price, but it still hits everything, is a color light instant, and surveil 2 is solid upside (better than scry 2, especially in black, because it fuels your graveyard, which gives this additional synergistic upside). It's a card whose fail state is ok, and when it's firing on all cylinders it's golden.

As for where I'd put it, I'd say top ten, probably around 6-8 depending on meta (Dismember for me is the best in cEDH because it's 1 mana and hits almost everything, but kinda meh in casual tbh).

Hot Take: Feed the Swarm sucks. It's a terrible creature removal card. Being enchantment removal in black is the only reason anyone runs it, because yea it's the only thing that does what it does, but what it does kind of sucks. You have this in your decks to deal with game winning enchantments, which it's only ok at (sorcery speed hurts it even there). Using it on a creature is a pretty miserable fail state for the card.

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Post by hyalopterouslemur » 2 years ago

Any list that excludes Snuff Out isn't worth talking about.
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Post by NZB2323 » 2 years ago

Serenade wrote:
2 years ago
I rank Baleful Mastery over everything else. Exile, hits two permanent types, cheap cost if needed (and YOU CHOOSE the opponent), instant speed...it's just terrific.

I want to try Defile in monoB one day; I just have not gotten around to it.
I agree. I think Baleful Mastery is the best one, and is definitely not #14. It's good not only for mono-black, but I also run it in my Orzhov cleric tribal deck. Baleful Mastery and Deadly Rollick are the only mono black spot removal spells in the deck.
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Post by Dunharrow » 2 years ago

I edited my OP. Please chime in on the order or any excluded cards. Would be nice to have a bit more consensus.. I had trouble ranking the free removal spells, especially the ones that are 'non-black'.

Seems like the top picks are these:

1. Baleful Mastery
2. Infernal Grasp
3. Feed the Swarm (in decks with no green or white)
4. Heartless Act

But I liked the idea of breaking them down into 3 lists as you probably want a variety of options in your decks:

A) Best destroy effects
1. Infernal Grasp
2. Heartless Act
3. Go for the Throat
4. Snuff Out
5. Slaughter Pact
6. Murderous Cut
7. Victim of Night
8. Power Word Kill
9. Murderous Rider // Swift End
10+ - many cards listed in this thread but in my opinion hard to justify over these (please chime in if you disagree)


B) Best Exile or -X/-X effects
1. Baleful Mastery
2. Dismember
3. Deadly Rollick
4. Ashes to Ashes
5. Sudden Death
6. Eat to Extinction (value goes up if you want cards in your graveyard)

C) Syngergistic cards
1. Creatures that die easy to be reanimated for a second kill: Shriekmaw, Bone Shredder
2. Creatures that stick around to be flickered: Ravenous Chupacabra, Gelatinous Cube, Noxious Gearhulk
3. Tragic Slip and Malicious Affliction and Fatal Push are all better if you are actively sacrificing creatures
4. Executioner's Capsule if you have artifact recursion
5. Attrition type cards? Do they deserve to be here?
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Post by hyalopterouslemur » 2 years ago

Oh, evoke is far more synergistic than that.

You can arguably get four kills out of Shriekmaw. The simple kill, then double it for Panharmonicon, then double it again with Mikaeus, the Unhallowed. If you have a way to blink it (there aren't many in monoblack) you can just blink it over and over. Not infinite in the way we usually think of it, but you never run out of triggers.

All entry evoke is the same. Exit evoke (like Reveillark) uses Teysa Karlov instead of Panharmonicon, but that's just "there" and largely beyond the question of this thread..

You can also get some value out of entry, sac, and death triggers from other cards doing this.

As you can imagine, token and Aristocrats players can't get enough of evoke.
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Post by Dunharrow » 2 years ago

hyalopterouslemur wrote:
2 years ago
Oh, evoke is far more synergistic than that.

You can arguably get four kills out of Shriekmaw. The simple kill, then double it for Panharmonicon, then double it again with Mikaeus, the Unhallowed. If you have a way to blink it (there aren't many in monoblack) you can just blink it over and over. Not infinite in the way we usually think of it, but you never run out of triggers.

All entry evoke is the same. Exit evoke (like Reveillark) uses Teysa Karlov instead of Panharmonicon, but that's just "there" and largely beyond the question of this thread..

You can also get some value out of entry, sac, and death triggers from other cards doing this.

As you can imagine, token and Aristocrats players can't get enough of evoke.
Oh there are many synergies with Evoke, for sure. Shriekmaw is just pretty narrow and without playing into the synergies is worse than many other removal spells.

I play Settle the Score in a deck with PW general. It is a crap removal spell, but getting your ultimate before people expect it to be possible can be really powerful.
Synergy is huge.... I think this thread is more about the mundane "I need a removal spell" evaluations.
There are many decks where Duplicant is better than most of the cards listed here.
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hyalopterouslemur
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Post by hyalopterouslemur » 2 years ago

Fair. I was just showing how synergistic evoke can be.

A lot of spells like that are similar. Which is why I like the addition of a synergy category.
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Post by NZB2323 » 2 years ago

I'd say you can add Big Game Hunter to the list of synergistic cards if you play with a discard themed commander.
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RowanKeltizar
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Post by RowanKeltizar » 2 years ago

Glad you decided to curate this list! I should start one for some other category when I feel I have the spare time.

Why is Duplicant so good? Even in my artifacts only deck I struggle to see a home for it. I can recur it, tutor for it, reduce it's cost and still I just think the cmc is too high for what it is doing when I compare it to other things in the format. Path, swords, and Deadly Rolick to be specifc. And in my artifacts only list I'd rather have Ensnaring Bridge, Crawlspace or Executioner's Capsule
WRBKaalia, Zenith Seeker - Certified Air Raid Material
WBElenda, the Dusk Rose - Drain and Gain
WRAurelia, the Warleader - Tokens/Equipment
URNiv-Mizzet, Parun - Controlled Burn primer
BRGHenzie, "Toolbox" Torre - Creature Feature
BRGSoul of Windgrace - Lands Matter
RGWGishath, Sun's Avatar - I'M YOUR DADDY
GWUBAtraxa, Praetors' Voice - Artifact Stax Beatdown
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UBSygg, River Cutthroat
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Post by Dunharrow » 2 years ago

RowanKeltizar wrote:
2 years ago
Glad you decided to curate this list! I should start one for some other category when I feel I have the spare time.

Why is Duplicant so good? Even in my artifacts only deck I struggle to see a home for it. I can recur it, tutor for it, reduce it's cost and still I just think the cmc is too high for what it is doing when I compare it to other things in the format. Path, swords, and Deadly Rolick to be specifc. And in my artifacts only list I'd rather have Ensnaring Bridge, Crawlspace or Executioner's Capsule
Duplicant is definitely much worse than it used to be, but I think should still see play in mono-red decks (especially if they have artifact synergy). Temur colors can justify it but green has more and more ETB Fight creatures so I guess it depends on your preferences.
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RowanKeltizar
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Post by RowanKeltizar » 2 years ago

Are you including non-creature removal? Things like Sinkhole? We also finally got another enchantment spot removal although not quite what we were hoping. Invoke Despair.

There's also Gate to Phyrexia and Phyrexian Tribute
WRBKaalia, Zenith Seeker - Certified Air Raid Material
WBElenda, the Dusk Rose - Drain and Gain
WRAurelia, the Warleader - Tokens/Equipment
URNiv-Mizzet, Parun - Controlled Burn primer
BRGHenzie, "Toolbox" Torre - Creature Feature
BRGSoul of Windgrace - Lands Matter
RGWGishath, Sun's Avatar - I'M YOUR DADDY
GWUBAtraxa, Praetors' Voice - Artifact Stax Beatdown
Budget Starter Decks
UBSygg, River Cutthroat
WU Shorikai, Genesis Engine
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