Thoughts on Ashaya

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Dunharrow
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Post by Dunharrow » 3 years ago

The thread about new cards that have impacted the format in the last year or so made me think a bit about Ashaya, Soul of the Wild.
It's a fantastic card. Amazing in brawl, I should mention. It dodges a lot of Oblivion Ring effects, protects your board from Cyclonic Rift rift. Really impactful for any deck that has land synergies. Just picture it in The Gitrog Monster - now triggers whenever a creature you control dies. You can upkeep sac a creature instead of a land.

The ways it impacts the game are numerous and interesting

But I feel like it will basically not get played in Commander because of mass land destruction. Also, most decks have some way to kill a Gaea's Cradle. I think people are scared to throw it into their decks and get crushed by Armageddon.

I feel like if MLD is in your meta, you need to make sure you have a sac outlet in play when you play Ashaya. It really decreased the ability to play with it.

Have any of you played with Ashaya?

Do you think the fear surrounding this card is warranted?

are you also thinking of ways to donate Ashaya and then cast Ruination ?
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ISBPathfinder
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Post by ISBPathfinder » 3 years ago

I am going to start with saying: this format is for doing anything you damn well please so if you want to build it, go for it.

That said, I think that Ashaya has a few really cool things she does and those cool things are limited in scope. Relying on your opponent having Cyclonic Rift but not a Wrath of God effect is going to be one that like, when it happens it will be cool but also you opponents likely won't just play that out for you. I don't really think that what Ashaya does is really that impressive either. Really I see her as like, cool with the weird Boompile / Oblivion Stone cards but those cards are very few and far between for mono green.

To me, she plays in a way that hopes opponents won't have the right kind of cards to interact with you and her synergy cards are things that green can't really tutor for. I think in all, its probably an ok deck but it doesn't seem like it proactively does something all that well and it doesn't seem like its that strong against interaction as its really just a narrow few types of cards that it helps against.
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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

I really like it personally. I think the card is interesting and forces your opponents to think outside of the box to solve your boardstate.

Honestly, green has plenty of ways to mitigate the threat of MLD or otherwise work around Ashaya, Soul of the Wild's high risk high reward design. Off the top of my head, Wrap in Vigor and Heroic Intervention are really easy and quick ways to make MLD one-sided, or you could just bounce her with Temur Sabertooth, Cloudstone Curio or Ancestral Statue, sac her with Greater Good (and how many damn cards would that even net you), Momentous Fall, an altar, High Market....I feel like if she's at the helm there's plenty of ways to bake in some security.

In terms of synergies and what you could actually do with her, I feel like there's plenty of stuff to make her a pretty powerful build around. Clearly she's golden for landfall, but you could also run Concordant Crossroads to turn your critters into immediate resources, Kodama of the East Tree seems like an obvious inclusion, Baru, Fist of Krosa is pretty gross, Bramble Sovereign seems pretty awesome....without spitballing too far there seems like plenty of scope for a pretty decent beatdown deck.

Personally, at some point when I can actually get to an LGS I intend to grab her for my Nissa, Vastwood Seer // Nissa, Sage Animist build. For flavour and as a great addition.
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Post by Mookie » 3 years ago

If you're in a meta where MLD is common, it may be appropriate to avoid running Ashaya, Soul of the Wild. On the other hand, if you're in a meta where Cyclonic Rift sees a lot of play, Ashaya goes up in value... and I suspect the latter is significantly more common.

That said, Ashaya is on my shortlist of cards to get for my Samut deck, primarily due to its interaction with Argothian Elder effects. I'll also note that Ashaya significantly pumps up Tatyova, Benthic Druid and Tireless Tracker and other land-based synergies. I don't know that I would run it without those synergies though - Cryptolith Rite is a cheaper alternative that also works with tokens, unlike Ashaya.

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Post by Ruiner » 3 years ago

Zero research done on my end bit some of those "land creatures get whatever" effects might be neat.

As a commander, you could run stuff like Blanchwood Armor, or Kalonian Twingrove to really take advantage of it making stuff forests.

I think this card could be pretty cool in a Yeva, Nature's Herald deck, where you could flash it out when appropriate.

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Post by darrenhabib » 3 years ago

I rarely see MLD these days, so I've been playing it without fear.

Quirion Ranger and Scryb Ranger go real nice with Ashaya as you can return a creature to hand in response to removal. You can return Ashaya in the case of MLD on the stack.

If you do have a number of MLD in your meta then Kamahl's Will and Heroic Intervention are great options in mono-green.
Nissa, Who Shakes the World emblem will also make all your creatures indestructible with Ashaya in play.

If you're also in white then using something like Eerie Interlude or Ghostway to blink them out in response to MLD is perfect as you'll have mana producing creatures afterwards.

As pointed out you're far more likely to see Cyclonic Rift, Oblivion Stone, Austere Command, etc played in commander games then you are to have Armageddon, so Ashaya going to offer more protection on average. But who knows your playgroups might be hung up on the old-land-D.

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

darrenhabib wrote:
3 years ago
If you're also in white then using something like Eerie Interlude or Ghostway to blink them out in response to MLD is perfect as you'll have mana producing creatures afterwards.
Faith's Reward will get you there, too, you'll just need to float mana in response, let MLD resolve and then cast.

Point is there's a lot of options anyway :P
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Post by illakunsaa » 3 years ago

I have no idea no why Ashaya isn't more played but she is a very powerful commander. Land destruction is generally is very disliked and MLD even more so. I don't thats the reason why Ashay isn't played.

Is she cedh playable? I dunno but she is at least most powerful after yisan and selvala. It's very easy to just win the turn you play her. People were freaking out about the 4 color omnath but I think he is kinda tame compared to Ashaya. There are ton of powerful land strategies you can take advantage of. Lotus Cobra, Stone-Seeder Hierophant, Ancient Greenwarden, Quirion Ranger, Vesuva...

Even if you don't play combos or take advantage of land synergies you can still snowball out of control by playing green value creatures like Reclamation Sage, Elvish Visionary and Eternal Witness because all your creature also ramp.

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Post by Dunharrow » 3 years ago

Thanks for the feedback

I think I will play Ashaya in my Mina and Denn, Wildborn. Commander can always bounce Ashaya if needed.
Cool interactions:
- Stone-Seeder Hierophant can now untap things like Karametra's Acolyte if I don't have Nykthos in play. Also triggers any time a creature ETBs. Also have other untappers like Voyaging Satyr and Garruk Wildspeaker that can now untap Karametra's Acolyte.
- Mina and Denn can return any creature I control to my hand. Considering Temur Sabertooth is a win-con in my deck it makes a lot of sense.
- Nissa, Vital Force emblem
- mana doublers like Zendikar Resurgent get a bit better
Seems pretty decent in the deck.

It's true that I do not see MLD very regularly (and when I do, often it is Jokulhaups anyway).
The possibility of playing Ashaya and having Strip Mine take out my Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger is real, so I think I would need to be careful to keep Mina and Denn mana up.
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Post by ISBPathfinder » 3 years ago

Oh also if you missed it, the Argothian Elder / Ley Weaver effects go infinite with the commander. There aren't that many of the effect but for those wanting to execute infinites its a thing. Hope Tender would need a land that taps for 2+.

If you delve into some of these to go infinite it might be worth looking into getting your hands on Hall of the Bandit Lord and Winding Canyons.
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Dunharrow
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Post by Dunharrow » 3 years ago

ISBPathfinder wrote:
3 years ago
Oh also if you missed it, the Argothian Elder / Ley Weaver effects go infinite with the commander. There aren't that many of the effect but for those wanting to execute infinites its a thing. Hope Tender would need a land that taps for 2+.

If you delve into some of these to go infinite it might be worth looking into getting your hands on Hall of the Bandit Lord and Winding Canyons.
Wow, you are right. I run Nykthos and Growing Rites of Itlimoc // Itlimoc, Cradle of the Sun. I had already considered these cards before but with Ashaya they get so much better.
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onering
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Post by onering » 3 years ago

Just threw this together today and its pretty fun. Stone-Seeder Hierophant is incredible here. She untaps for your land per turn and every time a nontoken creature etbs under your control. At minimum, this is nG per turn, with n being the number of lands/nontoken creatures that enter the field plus 1. That's a solid amount of mana. When you add in any mana doublers, or any multi mana land (like Cradle or Nykthos) and she gets out of hand FAST. She also has the basic utility of untapping any of your creatures if you don't need the mana that turn, giving Ashaya and others psuedo-vigilance as needed. Her plus Ashaya also happens to be an infinite tap/untap combo, though I don't have any cards in the deck that take advantage of that at this time.

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Post by Lifeless » 3 years ago

I never really considered Ashya seriously for Titania Protector of Argoth but now that I'm thinking about it I should really give it a try. Not only it she sweet Wrath insurance (and I don't care about Armageddon in this case) but there's plenty of sac interactions in the deck that would get a ton of value out of this.

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