[mtgnexus] Random Card of the Day - Samwise the Stouthearted

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lyonhaert
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Post by lyonhaert » 4 years ago

3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
Ah, it uses that symbol I don't have on my PC keyboard, only mobile. Noted. And thanks.
You don't have the pipe symbol? The | should be shift+\. Is it a non-English layout?
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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

lyonhaert wrote:
4 years ago
3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
Ah, it uses that symbol I don't have on my PC keyboard, only mobile. Noted. And thanks.
You don't have the pipe symbol? The | should be shift+\. Is it a non-English layout?
THAT'S how you do that?! I thought it was a non-standard key. Wow, that's some fifteen years at least and I never knew this................

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Post by nobody » 4 years ago

evil Twin is one of the best clones in the game. Often times i clone the other plays comander and kill it to stop them from replaying it.

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Mookie
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Post by Mookie » 4 years ago

Not my favorite clone, but definitely the most flavorful. I haven't really considered clones as an answer to enemy commanders since the legend rule was changed, but I suppose this one still supports that behavior. Not sure whether this interaction is move valuable than the added flexibility from cards like Stunt Double, Phyrexian Metamorph, and Clever Impersonator though. Seems good if you have the potential to grant haste or otherwise make the tap ability better. Alternatively, if you have flicker effects like Conjurer's Closet, you could have your Evil Twin slowly take out multiple creatures, which seems fun.

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hyalopterouslemur
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Post by hyalopterouslemur » 4 years ago

Probably the best clone in the game (except for game-winner Rite of Replication, but that costs a lot and is much more situational, usually exploiting tribal or devotion).
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tstorm823
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Post by tstorm823 » 4 years ago

This is not one of the best clones in the game. It is good because clones are good, and this is a clone with upside. But I wouldn't rate it above clones that can copy your own commander profitably, or clones that can copy more than one permanent type, or clones with haste, and those 3 things include a good selection of cards.
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Post by toctheyounger » 4 years ago

I think there once was a time that this would've been one of the best clones in the game, but Wizards really have upped their game.

It's still a cool card, but it is a little slow, and maybe just a little bit outclassed these days. I still play it for flavour in one of my Vorthos builds.
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Post by Beyondnoxx » 4 years ago

I used to run this in all my u/b commander decks. I love it. Had so Many good times with it. Nice to See it again. This post is just a flash Down memory Lane ^^
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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

Tuesday, August 6th, 2019; Circular Logic


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Post by Sinis » 4 years ago

3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
Monday, August 5th, 2019; Evil Twin
I missed this one, but am gonna post about it anyway; I really love Evil Twin. It's my favourite clone, bar none, and I play it in every deck possible. It's such great flavour from the gothic horror block, and yet it's adjacent to the zombie/vampire/werewolf/geist stuff that they were doing.
3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
Tuesday, August 6th, 2019; Circular Logic
I have yet to pilot a deck that can even occasionally take advantage of the madness ability while having a significant graveyard for the purposes of actually countering a spell. I'm curious to see if people have differing experiences.

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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

Sinis wrote:
4 years ago
3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
Tuesday, August 6th, 2019; Circular Logic
I have yet to pilot a deck that can even occasionally take advantage of the madness ability while having a significant graveyard for the purposes of actually countering a spell. I'm curious to see if people have differing experiences.
FWIW, it's best off any kind of loot in my experiences. Tap JVP to draw, pitch this to counter then (most likely) flip your Jace. Thirst for Knowledge is another long time fave with it.

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Sinis
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Post by Sinis » 4 years ago

3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
FWIW, it's best off any kind of loot in my experiences. Tap JVP to draw, pitch this to counter then (most likely) flip your Jace. Thirst for Knowledge is another long time fave with it.
Ew, discarding two cards to TFK (is it really discarding two, though?). I was considering it in Scarab God, because I use Careful Consideration, but I didn't believe I could have that many cards in my discard (I have thrown down Big Game Hunter in similar circumstances).

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lyonhaert
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Post by lyonhaert » 4 years ago

The "unless its controller pays" part would be a pretty steep cost in my Spiders deck. I don't really have any discard outlets for the Madness, though. I'm also generally leery of "unless its controller pays", because what if I'm trying to counter a game-ender where the controller has infinite mana?
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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

Sinis wrote:
4 years ago
3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
FWIW, it's best off any kind of loot in my experiences. Tap JVP to draw, pitch this to counter then (most likely) flip your Jace. Thirst for Knowledge is another long time fave with it.
Ew, discarding two cards to TFK (is it really discarding two, though?). I was considering it in Scarab God, because I use Careful Consideration, but I didn't believe I could have that many cards in my discard (I have thrown down Big Game Hunter in similar circumstances).
You're not really pitching two though since you're casting the spell. So paying 2UU to draw 3, pitch, and counter a spell seems a pretty decent rate to me.................

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Post by Mookie » 4 years ago

Circular Logic is a playable card when Circular Logic is a playable card.

More seriously, in a vacuum, I would usually play either a two mana counterspell or a three mana hard counterspell. For it to be good, you need to be able to both enable its madness consistently and have a reasonably-sized graveyard (which is likely if you're doing a lot of looting / discarding). Best-case scenario, you have 'U: counter target spell and draw a card', which is a pretty powerful payoff.

Seems like a reasonable inclusion in any commander that can serve as a discard outlet - Atemsis, All-Seeing, Chromium, the Mutable, and Jace, Vryn's Prodigy are probably the most notable. Not sure what other blue commanders would want a madness subtheme.

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Sinis
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Post by Sinis » 4 years ago

Mookie wrote:
4 years ago
Circular Logic is a playable card when Circular Logic is a playable card.
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Post by hyalopterouslemur » 4 years ago

This is one of those things where you have to go all in on discarding your own cards. I would hate to see this card without a discard enabler just because I have plenty of hard counters. (Though to be fair, it has value in a five-color deck. But again, people often underestimate the adaptability of their mana base while paradoxically overestimating how frequently they'll draw lands.)
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Post by DirkGently » 4 years ago

3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
You're not really pitching two though since you're casting the spell. So paying 2UU to draw 3, pitch, and counter a spell seems a pretty decent rate to me.................
I think it basically works out to dismiss + a free loot? The first card you draw is straight-up cantrip, the second one is a loot, and the third one replaces the circular logic you discarded.

Weird, it feels like it should be better than that.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

DirkGently wrote:
4 years ago
3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
You're not really pitching two though since you're casting the spell. So paying 2UU to draw 3, pitch, and counter a spell seems a pretty decent rate to me.................
I think it basically works out to dismiss + a free loot? The first card you draw is straight-up cantrip, the second one is a loot, and the third one replaces the circular logic you discarded.

Weird, it feels like it should be better than that.
Given counters don't typically provide card advantage, I'd say that puts this at a premium. And if you added baral, chief of compliance to the mix, its value raises exponentially. It's also easier colour commitments to 2c+ decks which is relevant. At full cost, how often is this a convolute or better?

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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

Wednesday, August 7th, 2019; Soul Burn


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Post by DirkGently » 4 years ago

I remember having one of those way back in the day. Dear god does it suck. If you're just going for huge burn finishers there's a million better options. At least it's technically mono-black.
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
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Post by tstorm823 » 4 years ago

I don't like that they discourage overkill. I make my own decisions!
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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

Nostalgically I tried utilizing this for my end game reach in my white border brews. It...has not aged well. But, I still have my deckmasters copy from Finkel vs Garfield even today.

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Post by hyalopterouslemur » 4 years ago

DirkGently wrote:
4 years ago
I remember having one of those way back in the day. Dear god does it suck. If you're just going for huge burn finishers there's a million better options. At least it's technically mono-black.
Fireball says hi! And there are so many Fireball variants, why would you ever run this? Also, why would you run it in the era of Torment of Hailfire and Exsanguinate? The other route is to use Enrage/Howl from Beyond or Blazing Shoal or if you're in green (which makes ramping up to lethal a lot easier) Untamed Might.

I mean, back in the day, it was somewhat useful, and the obligatory "it's removal therefore good in limited" trope applies, and they did reprint it in Invasion block (where you're not going to be playing Drain Life at least), but these days, dear God, why?
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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 4 years ago

I could maybe see a mono-black infinite (black) mana combo deck where you want every infinite-mana kill spell you can get your hands on. But first you'd need to exhaust every tutor that can hit torment of hailfire...and there are a LOT of those....so......
Perm Decks
Phelddagrif - Kaervek - Golos - Zirilan

Flux Decks
Gollum - Lobelia - Minthara - Plargg2 - Solphim - Otharri - Graaz - Ratchet - Soundwave - Slicer - Gale - Rootha - Kagemaro - Blorpityblorpboop - Kayla - SliverQueen - Ivy - Falco - Gluntch - Charlatan/Wilson - Garth - Kros - Anthousa - Shigeki - Light-Paws - Lukka - Sefris - Ebondeath - Rokiric - Garth - Nixilis - Grist - Mavinda - Kumano - Nezahal - Mavinda - Plargg - Plargg - Extus - Plargg - Oracle - Kardur - Halvar - Tergrid - Egon - Cosima - Halana+Livio - Jeska+Falthis+Obosh - Yeva - Akiri+Zirda - Lady Sun - Nahiri - Korlash - Overlord+Zirda - Chisei - Athreos2 - Akim - Cazur+Ukkima - Otrimi - Otrimi - Kalamax - Ayli+Lurrus - Clamilton - Gonti - Heliod2 - Ayula - Thassa2 - Gallia - Purphoros2 - Rankle - Uro - Rayami - Gargos - Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa - Ashling1 - Angus - Arcum - Talrand - Chainer - Higure - Kumano - Scion - Teferi1 - Uyo - Sisters
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote
Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena
Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6

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