[mtgnexus] Random Card of the Day - Samwise the Stouthearted

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Treamayne
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Post by Treamayne » 3 years ago

Mookie wrote:
3 years ago
Boldwyr Intimidator is essentially inefficient evasion. Assuming sufficient mana (or all your creatures are warriors), it can turn all of an opponent's creatures into cowards and let you alpha strike. This is, however, pretty mana-intensive - not only do you need to pay 5 mana for Intimidator in the first place, but you also need to spend a bunch of mana on ability activations.
My Mardu Warriors deck uses BI as a back-up wincon - not through repeated uses of the activated ability (though that remains an option), but with Shields of Velis Vel. However, in play I have found his real value is not in mass-use of the ability, but in making sure "that creature" can't block (where "that creature" is something that opponent wants to block with; be that deathtouch, lifelink, a death trigger, combat damage trigger, etc.). Less commonly, I have found political use for both abilities (if you attack "that player" instead, I'll make "that creature" unblockable).
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Post by Sinis » 3 years ago

3drinks wrote:
3 years ago
Wednesday, July 8th, 2020; Boldwyr Intimidator
If you have enough mana, you can make your opponent's creatures cowards and then play Tsabo's Decree!

Ooo, what about Species Specialist?

I think for all tribal-related combos/hate, this is just worse than Unnatural Selection, though.

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Post by 3drinks » 3 years ago

Sinis wrote:
3 years ago
3drinks wrote:
3 years ago
Wednesday, July 8th, 2020; Boldwyr Intimidator
If you have enough mana, you can make your opponent's creatures cowards and then play Tsabo's Decree!

Ooo, what about Species Specialist?

I think for all tribal-related combos/hate, this is just worse than Unnatural Selection, though.
The card you're looking for is Extinction.

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Post by Hawk » 3 years ago

I ran this in Kresh the Bloodbraided at the Dawn of my EDH playing in 2010 or 2011. The deck had a very mild Warrior subtheme (mostly, Kresh was a warrior which made playing Bramblewood Paragon and Obsidian Battle-Axe feel pretty good), so Intimidator felt like a fun top-end way to make my commander bully his way past the most dangerous defenders on the table to one or two-shot my targets.

It wasn't "Good" compared to just crushing people with Plague Wind but it was fun. Ah, to be young and innocent again.

The ability is still good. Even if you aren't tribal warriors, many powerful rumbling commanders are themselves warriors - I mentioned Kresh but there's also Tahngarth, First Mate, Greven, Predator Captain, Alesha, Who Smiles at Death, Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer, Ruric Thar, the Unbowed, Ruhan of the Fomori, Surrak Dragonclaw, and Zurgo Helmsmasher all of whom are red and like getting into the red zone (or must get into the red zone every turn).

The problem is that a 5/5 for 5RR up front is just such an awful rate; it'd be a tough pill to swallow even if he made all your opponents creatures into Cowards for free. Just in terms of red-based creatures that mess with combat somehow or payoff for a huge attack, this is more mana than Hellkite Charger, Etali, Primal Storm, or Scourge of the Throne and is competing with stuff (that we've previously agreed is sorta mediocre but is better than this) like Tyrant's Familiar, Balefire Dragon, Drakuseth, Maw of Flames, and Dragon Mage. Nevermind even better 6+ cmc beaters like Steel Hellkite, Wurmcoil Engine, Combustible Gearhulk, or Inferno Titan. Heck in 2011 I only ran this in Kresh because I was too lazy and poor and rural to go hunt down Stalking Vengeance or Vicious Shadows for my 7 mana wombo combo finisher cards.

That leaves this feeling bad anywhere BUT tribal warriors - but modern tribal warriors are overwhelmingly utilizing Najeela, the Blade-Blossom (and why wouldn't they), who is way too fast to need a silly durdly little dork like this. Tellingly its best home is in a calmer, more casual Lovisa Coldeyes deck.

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Post by Sinis » 3 years ago

3drinks wrote:
3 years ago
The card you're looking for is Extinction.
I mean, Tsabo's Decree is just Extinction with a slight premium on the cost, but a peek at their hand and at instant speed. (And that 'peek' at their hand is devastating for decks that are intentionally tribal.)

Extinction is just pedestrian by comparison.

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Post by 3drinks » 3 years ago

Thursday, July 9th, 2020; Mirari



Gosh, I can't even recall how many years I've tried to make this work. Scary effect if you can, though.

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Post by Mookie » 3 years ago

Instead of talking about Mirari, I'd instead like to begin by talking about taxes. Very simply, they suck. From Rhystic Study to Grand Arbiter Augustin IV, Smothering Tithe, and Ghostly Prison. Paying taxes is a pain - both because of the inherent cost, but also because of the mental cost. There are a ton of times when I look at my hand, count how much mana I have, and start casting spells.... only to realize that there are some additional costs I haven't accounted for that throw off my plans for the turn. It's pretty rare to have enough mana to both do everything I want and pay all the appropriate taxes unless it is in the extreme lategame (or I'm flooding out really badly).

However, this is also true of self-imposed taxes. I've tried out a variety of 'value added' cards like Lifecrafter's Bestiary, Spirit Bonds, and Dawn of Hope, and it's really hard to get full value out of any of them. Once again, taxes add up, and the added value is rarely worth the mana investment - I could try to get maximum value from every action I take.... or I could just cast a larger number of more impactful spells. I will call out Mirrorworks as pretty much the only exception that I've been happy with, but that's primarily because half the time, I'm copying mana rocks that pay for the cost themselves.

Anyway, that brings us back to Mirari. Very simply, 3 mana is a massive cost that makes it really hard to actually use. It can be worth it if you're consistently copying big stuff (ex: Cruel Ultimatum), but that requires having a ton of mana available. Meanwhile, in the spellslinger decks it is most likely to see play in, paying 3 mana to copy an Opt or other cheap spell is just not worth it. And of course, there's the obligatory callout of a bunch of similar effects that do this for free - Swarm Intelligence is fantastic, but Primal Amulet // Primal Wellspring and Double Vision are also solid. Why pay the kicker when you can do it for free?

There is one place I could see it be played though - as mentioned, copying mana rocks with Mirrorworks feels good, so I could see it as an option to multiply ramp spells like Explosive Vegetation in a ramp deck. In that case, you'll be able to make back your mana investment in a turn or two, which makes the tempo loss not as painful. Simultaneously, if you're not in Izzet colors, you may not have a ton of options for copying spells. Hard for me to say how many instants / sorceries usually see play in white / black decks though - you need to have a pretty high threshold of spells to copy for this effect to be worth running. There are also some spells that go way down in value when copied, like boardwipes and narrow removal spells. Plus, depending on how much mana you have available, you may again just not have the mana necessary to pay the tax.

In summary: cool card, crippling cost. As an object of historical significance, I could see a new version printed at some point, since they've been printing a ton of cards for old characters.

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Post by Dunharrow » 3 years ago

When you are copying spells, you are often copying card draw, which means you want to have mana to cast subsequent spells.
Unfortunately, this just isn't great.
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Post by onering » 3 years ago

This is fairly costed, which means its pretty mediocre, but copying sorceries is inherently dangerous due extra turn spells so being expensive helps keep it in line. The trade off is it comes online earlier than similar spells.

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Post by pokken » 3 years ago

Costing 8 mana to see your first payoff is a big fat no from me.

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Post by Sinis » 3 years ago

Mookie wrote:
3 years ago
In summary: cool card, crippling cost. As an object of historical significance, I could see a new version printed at some point, since they've been printing a ton of cards for old characters.
My feeling exactly. Realistically, it pales in comparison to Pyromancer's Goggles and Primal Amulet / Primal Amulet // Primal Wellspring.

If you really want a 'big Mirari turn', The Mirari Conjecture will definitely get it done.

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Post by Hawk » 3 years ago

I run this in Wort, the Raidmother for the reasons Mookie mentioned - I built the deck before Double Vision and Twinning Staff were released, I don't own and didn't feel like buying Primal Amulet // Primal Wellspring, and I wanted MOAR COPYING. It's been...fine. It's super sick when it copies Harvest Seasonor Explosive Vegetationor Battle Hymn, it's decent when it copies a big token making spell, and its best game is actually when the dinosaurs player stole it with Etali, Primal Storm and proceeded to duplicate their Swords to Plowsharesand Beast Withins to ruin all of our lives. But it's often been a dead card, one I can't justify casting. That's partly a problem of Wort (the most "all or nothing" deck I've ever built), and probably a problem inherent to a "taxing" effect like this; if you can afford to pay that 3, you were probably in a winning position anyhow which makes this inherently win-more and only good when you are already very far ahead. If Wort survives (as he may get scrapped for parts for a new Samut deck), this is on the cutting block especially if I acquire Staff or Double Vision instead, as they are "win more" cards that are just better.

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

Yeah, this hasn't aged well. You really do need a ton of mana to manage to copy spells with it. These days there are at least 4-5 cards that significantly outclass it. Thousand-Year Storm, Double Vision, Primal Amulet // Primal Wellspring, Swarm Intelligence all come to mind just off the top of my head.
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Post by 3drinks » 3 years ago

The best I got from it was in a welder deck, but even that had an identity crisis between spells and artifacts. And it was still just passable, rather than good.

But the aura of it's lore. The imagery. Argh I want it to be so good. Hmmm, maybe in Maelstrom Wanderer but then it's just win-more................

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Post by toctheyounger » 3 years ago

3drinks wrote:
3 years ago
The best I got from it was in a welder deck, but even that had an identity crisis between spells and artifacts. And it was still just passable, rather than good.

But the aura of it's lore. The imagery. Argh I want it to be so good. Hmmm, maybe in Maelstrom Wanderer but then it's just win-more................
Honestly, it's one of those iconic pieces of lore I can't help but agree. Perhaps we can hope for a retcon for it in upcoming sets?
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Post by weltkrieg » 3 years ago

Actually, in a deck with a ton of mana, the Mirari is an amazing card. That said, it is not a card I would run if I had blue or red available. It is at it's absolute best in black or green decks which can generate a metric *expletive deleted* ton of mana. You can use it to copy tutors with coffers mana. I run it in my sasaya, orochi ascendant deck because at times, I need to double up on what I am doing (pretty much whatever I am doing at the moment). I believe it would probably be also worthy of consideration in a white deck that wanted to do spellslinger (interesting concept, actually...we should look into how it could be accomplished)

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Post by 3drinks » 3 years ago

Friday, July 10th, 2020; Upwelling



What a dangerous card. Nope, I'm out haha.

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Post by DirkGently » 3 years ago

This coexisting with mana burn is hilarious. Imagine playing this to bait your opponent Into floating tons of mana, then sacking it.

The effect can be fairly strong, but it's weaker than it looks since you're not getting any extra mana. If it was asymmetrical it'd have merit (especially in tandem with cards like Seedborn Muse) but symmetrically it's probably a no-go.
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Post by Mookie » 3 years ago

Upwelling is... an interesting card. Best-case scenario, you play Upwelling, spent a few turns banking mana, then funnel that mana into one supercharged explosive turn. The issue is that due to its symmetric nature, your opponents have the exact same opportunity... and that's usually going to backfire spectacularly. There are a few ways to prevent your opponents from using all that banked mana (ex: Gaddock Teeg, Rule of Law, Mana Short), but not enough to do so consistently.

Ignoring the symmetric nature, I'm still not particularly impressed - it doesn't generate any mana by itself, and you'll need it to live a full turn cycle before it does anything. And of course, the idea that you'll have extra mana is itself somewhat flawed - if you have more mana than you can spend, it's a lot easier to just run another mana sink (or less ramp). There are certainly some upsides to being able to pick and choose when to spend your mana, but not enough to justify this - it's usually better to take action sooner rather than later.

If I wanted to get absurd amounts of mana, I'd prefer to run a mana doubler like Mana Reflection instead - you get the extra mana immediately, isn't symmetric, and doesn't require multiple turns to function.

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Post by 3drinks » 3 years ago

DirkGently wrote:
3 years ago
This coexisting with mana burn is hilarious. Imagine playing this to bait your opponent Into floating tons of mana, then sacking it.

The effect can be fairly strong, but it's weaker than it looks since you're not getting any extra mana. If it was asymmetrical it'd have merit (especially in tandem with cards like Seedborn Muse) but symmetrically it's probably a no-go.
My issue with it isn't you getting extra, it's symmetrically allowing everyone to do that. And it scares the crap outta me.

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Post by tstorm823 » 3 years ago

This card makes me want the keep track of game states with Excel.
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Post by BeneTleilax » 3 years ago

worse kruphix

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Post by TheAmericanSpirit » 3 years ago

I'm with Dirk on this one. Unless you can somehow punish your opponents for using it, it's pretty insane to spend four mana just to establish a central bank in-game. What really gets me is the lack of accrued interest and FDIC insurance. How else are you supposed to maintain a succesful corporate business model without incentives for growth or consumer protection? And even in monopoly, you can arrange a mortage but not here at Upwelling International.
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Post by Outcryqq » 3 years ago

Upwelling
When this card was released I picked up two play sets, thinking it was going to be a game-changer because it changed a fundamental rule of the game. I was wrong!

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Post by DirkGently » 3 years ago

3drinks wrote:
3 years ago
My issue with it isn't you getting extra, it's symmetrically allowing everyone to do that. And it scares the crap outta me.
I mean, it's both? Tbh I'd probably be less worried about opponents using it since they probably aren't set up to exploit it super well.

The printing of Omnath, Locus of Mana shows that the effect, even asymmetrical, isn't super valuable given that it was printed on a 3-drop that can also become a large beater (and it doesn't even see that much play). Add an extra mana, symmetry, and the lack of a big fat body, and you've got a terrible card.

Also a nightmare to keep track of. Omnath and Kruphix learned that lesson by making sure you only need to track one number (although they still have problems with any tags on your mana, that's always fun).
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