[Deckhelp] Yarok. Frustration

Wollyb
Posts: 5
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Wollyb » 3 years ago

Hey guys,
this is my Yarok deck ( https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/05-06-20-yarok-budget/ ) and I really like it but its kind of weak. I played it 3 rounds yesterday and it was a nightmare.. I dont know how to describe it but my starting hand is always bad. Either I have only 2 lands and dont draw lands or ramp in the next few draws or I have some ramp and lands but no drawspells and no interaction. In this 3 games I missed at least one land drop (up to 3 in row in one game) in the early game and I had a handful of cards wich were more expensive than Yarok (turn 1 – 4 ) or super useless.

I dont know exactly what I need to change but please do me the favor and test the „Playtest" function on tappedout and convince yourselves. I know cards like Palinchron are super strong with Yarok but way over my budget. So please let my know if you have a suggestion or cut. I would be very grateful for help!

The main game plan is:

Infint mana and etb:

Peregrine Drake + Shrieking Drake
Peregrine Drake + Deadeye Navigator
Peregrine Drake + Temur Sabertooth
Cloud of Faeries + Shrieking Drake
Cloud of Faeries + Deadeye Navigator

And finish with:

Avenger of Zendikar or Gonti, Lord of Luxury or Gray Merchant of Asphodel or Torment of Hailfire


Thanks!

User avatar
Hawk
Slayer of Threads
Posts: 1166
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: Salt Lake City, UT

Post by Hawk » 3 years ago

- 36 lands for a 5 CMC commander who is very mana hungry feels a bit risky, especially with 13 of them ETB tapped. I think is compounded by how many of your ramp/draw cards are 3 CMC+. I think I'd consider dropping Cultivate, Kodama's Reach, Shared Summons , and Zendikar's Roil for a land, Nature's Lore, Fblthp, the Lost, and Wall of Blossoms. This will get your curve a little lower. In a perfect world you'd replace one of those cantrip-dorks with Baleful Strix but I'm not convinced that it is $5 better - if you were going to blow some cash you'll get WAY more value by upgrading your vivid lands to stuff like Woodland Cemetery instead. We also up your creature count, which feels crucial for ensuring that your many, many Pod effects (too many pod effects?) have enough fodder.

- You are running enough interaction, but a lot of it feels really unreliable which is why I think you are finding that you are "stuck" with useless cards in hand. I'd look to cut Autumn's Veil, Unwind, Negate, and Languish and replace them with some combination of Reality Shift, Heartless Act, Arcane Denial, and Evacuation or Life's Finale as your boardwipe of choice. I also personally like Shriekmaw and Plaguecrafter but they definitely depend a lot on your meta. In a perfect world you'd instead be running stuff like Cyclonic Rift, Hostage Taker, Toxic Deluge, and Venser, Shaper Savant among your removal suite options instead but I see that budget and again, upgrading your mana base is going to do a lot more good for you imo.

- I do think you should consider dropping at least one or two "Pod" effects or expensive tutors or draw engines in favor of even more low-curve value/interaction like Elvish Visionary, Solemn Simulacrum, Sylvan Ranger, and Man-o'-War or even better protection like Lightning Greaves. I think Soul of the Harvest, Neoform, Aspect of Mongoose, Rune-scarred Demon, and/or Conjurer's Closet are among the first places i'd consider cutting.

User avatar
Mookie
Posts: 3460
Joined: 4 years ago
Answers: 47
Pronoun: Unlisted
Location: the æthereal plane

Post by Mookie » 3 years ago

Your decklist looks fine to me. There are a few improvements I would suggest, but I suspect this is mostly just a problem of variance.

- One thing I would recommend is more card draw, since you look a bit light there. Elvish Visionary, Sea Gate Oracle, Tireless Tracker, Generous Patron, and Raven Familiar are all options. This should also help you hit land drops and filter through your deck more consistently. Sylvan Ranger is also reasonable.

- I'll also call out your manabase - you have a lot of tapped lands, and the bouncelands in particular have negative synergy with your commander. There aren't a ton of budget options I would recommend off the top of my head, but still worth noting.

User avatar
PrimevalCommander
Posts: 872
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by PrimevalCommander » 3 years ago

I did not look at the full decklist, but the above suggestions look like really good "grease" for a deck that is playing a bit clunky.
The Temples (Temple of Mystery) are pretty good, and while the still ETBtapped, I consider them some of the best that do.

Other budget land cycles
Check lands (Hinterland Harbor)
Pain Lands (Yavimaya Coast)
Tango Lands (Sunken Hollow)

Wollyb
Posts: 5
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Wollyb » 3 years ago

Hey guys. Thanks for all the suggestions!

So I changed some cards: ( https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/05-06-2 ... 1591702150 )

Cuts:

Shared Summons
Kodama's Reach
Autumn's Veil
Conjurer's Closet
Deadeye Navigator
Rite of Replication
Torment of Hailfire
Zendikar's Roil
Sire of Stagnation
Soul of the Harvest
Languish
Negate
Unwind
Archaeomancer
Golgari Findbroker
Vivid lands

Add:

Nature's Lore
Sylvan Ranger
Lightning Greaves
Elvish Visionary
Fblthp, the Lost
Sea Gate Oracle
Wall of Blossoms
Arcane Denial
Evacuation
Heartless Act
Hostage Taker
Man-o'-War
Reality Shift
Shriekmaw
Venser, Shaper Savant
1x Forest, Swamp, Island

So I reduced my combos and wincons, removed some expensive or useless cards and added some more cantrips, counterspells and disruption.
The mana curve is now 2,94 (from 3,22),

@Hawk
1: Why would you cut 3CMC ramp spells? Yarok cost 5 mana.
2: I added your interaction spells ( Reality Shift, Heartless Act, Arcane Denial and Evacuation. But I also own Hostage Taker and Venser, Shaper Savant. Would you play all or should I cut/ swap some for Hostage Taker and Venser?
3: You also mention that I should cut Neoform and Rune-scarred Demon. But this is hard for me. I just can win with a combo. So cutting tutors feels super bad. Or what is your idea behind this cuts?

Questions

4: Would you guys add more cantrips or tutors?
5: cut down some removal?
6:Other suggestions?

Thanks!

User avatar
Hawk
Slayer of Threads
Posts: 1166
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him
Location: Salt Lake City, UT

Post by Hawk » 3 years ago

Wollyb wrote:
3 years ago
Hey guys. Thanks for all the suggestions!

So I changed some cards: ( https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/05-06-2 ... 1591702150 )

Cuts:

Shared Summons
Kodama's Reach
Autumn's Veil
Conjurer's Closet
Deadeye Navigator
Rite of Replication
Torment of Hailfire
Zendikar's Roil
Sire of Stagnation
Soul of the Harvest
Languish
Negate
Unwind
Archaeomancer
Golgari Findbroker
Vivid lands

Add:

Nature's Lore
Sylvan Ranger
Lightning Greaves
Elvish Visionary
Fblthp, the Lost
Sea Gate Oracle
Wall of Blossoms
Arcane Denial
Evacuation
Heartless Act
Hostage Taker
Man-o'-War
Reality Shift
Shriekmaw
Venser, Shaper Savant
1x Forest, Swamp, Island

So I reduced my combos and wincons, removed some expensive or useless cards and added some more cantrips, counterspells and disruption.
The mana curve is now 2,94 (from 3,22),

Hawk
1: Why would you cut 3CMC ramp spells? Yarok cost 5 mana.
2: I added your interaction spells ( Reality Shift, Heartless Act, Arcane Denial and Evacuation. But I also own Hostage Taker and Venser, Shaper Savant. Would you play all or should I cut/ swap some for Hostage Taker and Venser?
3: You also mention that I should cut Neoform and Rune-scarred Demon. But this is hard for me. I just can win with a combo. So cutting tutors feels super bad. Or what is your idea behind this cuts?

Questions

4: Would you guys add more cantrips or tutors?
5: cut down some removal?
6:Other suggestions?

Thanks!
1. In a vacuum, these cards are amazing and it isn't that they're not helpful in ramping to T4 Yarok or fixing. But you specifically mentioned keeping 2-landers and then fizzling out. I look at all your 3 CMC stuff, and obviously in a Yarok deck you don't want to cut hugely synergistic cards like Wood Elves and Elvish Rejuvenator since those things go nuts once you land Yarok or Panharmonicon. But, I think the deck does run smoother and cleaner by replacing some amount of 3 CMC ramp with 1 or 2 CMC draw, land-tutoring, or ramp - hence the recommend to cut a stone-cold classic that has no special synergy for stuff like Sylvan Ranger or Wall of Blossoms :).

2. It depends a lot on your meta. What are you up against? If games tend to go long, then I'd probably drop Heartless and Denial for the two of them. If games are lightning fast and everyone else is also trying to go infinite ASAP, I'd probably keep the lower CMC effects to ensure you can develop your board and still hold up interaction to not insta-die to random combos.

3. Your original deck is running Defense of the Heart, Eldritch Evolution, Birthing Pod, Fauna Shaman, Fierce Empath, and these two, and has the ability to see a ton of cards. Again, you'd mentioned that you were just fizzling out - so finding your combo doesn't matter if your deck never starts moving to begin with, ya know? To me, when I here that, I start looking at a deck and thinking that maybe you run too many clunky enablers and too few streamlined value cards. Neoform requires a creature in play, is a sorcery, requires two colors of mana, and only "upgrades" by +1 (compared to Evolution grabbing up two ranks and Pod working every turn). Rune-Scarred Demon is a 7 mana card that telepgraphs your endgame and is not by itself an amazing body. I consider these worse/less efficient than the rest (although slightly better than Shared Summons). To be honest, it's close and I think cutting some "cute but not infinite "cards was also a fine call.

Wollyb
Posts: 5
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: Unlisted

Post by Wollyb » 3 years ago

Hawk wrote:
3 years ago

1. In a vacuum, these cards are amazing and it isn't that they're not helpful in ramping to T4 Yarok or fixing. But you specifically mentioned keeping 2-landers and then fizzling out. I look at all your 3 CMC stuff, and obviously in a Yarok deck you don't want to cut hugely synergistic cards like Wood Elves and Elvish Rejuvenator since those things go nuts once you land Yarok or Panharmonicon. But, I think the deck does run smoother and cleaner by replacing some amount of 3 CMC ramp with 1 or 2 CMC draw, land-tutoring, or ramp - hence the recommend to cut a stone-cold classic that has no special synergy for stuff like Sylvan Ranger or Wall of Blossoms :).
Thats a good call. Thanks for the explanation!
Hawk wrote:
3 years ago
2. It depends a lot on your meta. What are you up against? If games tend to go long, then I'd probably drop Heartless and Denial for the two of them. If games are lightning fast and everyone else is also trying to go infinite ASAP, I'd probably keep the lower CMC effects to ensure you can develop your board and still hold up interaction to not insta-die to random combos.
I play against a Yuriko (but no combo), a Krrik (combo, quite fast), Anje (combo, but not that fast) and a no combo player but with super expensive cards.. So my meta is not that fast and game can be loang (+45 min) So I swap Heartless and Denial for Venser and Hosttake Taker.
Hawk wrote:
3 years ago
3. Your original deck is running Defense of the Heart, Eldritch Evolution, Birthing Pod, Fauna Shaman, Fierce Empath, and these two, and has the ability to see a ton of cards. Again, you'd mentioned that you were just fizzling out - so finding your combo doesn't matter if your deck never starts moving to begin with, ya know? To me, when I here that, I start looking at a deck and thinking that maybe you run too many clunky enablers and too few streamlined value cards. Neoform requires a creature in play, is a sorcery, requires two colors of mana, and only "upgrades" by +1 (compared to Evolution grabbing up two ranks and Pod working every turn). Rune-Scarred Demon is a 7 mana card that telepgraphs your endgame and is not by itself an amazing body. I consider these worse/less efficient than the rest (although slightly better than Shared Summons). To be honest, it's close and I think cutting some "cute but not infinite "cards was also a fine call.
Oh nice.. Yeah thats also good calls. So I will cut Neoform and Rune-Scarred Demon.

So overall 4 cuts ( Heartless, Denial, Demon, Neoform). Means 4 open card slots.

https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/05-06-2 ... 1591702172

Do you have some other nice calls? :D

Thanks!

tempoEDH
Posts: 112
Joined: 4 years ago
Pronoun: he / him

Post by tempoEDH » 3 years ago

I, personally, also have a Yarok EDH list, which I personally think functions quite well, it's a lot of fun. However, in looking over your list, it seems that we have VERY different decks. Because of this, a lot of my advice may not be to your liking, so take this with a grain of salt. First integral difference between our decks is that mine has much more of a focus on value, and is also much more linear in focus. There's less disruption, as the deck is designed to play creatures, draw cards, play more creatures, draw more cards, and, eventually, go infinite and win. From my immediate point of view, I don't see any reason to run Avenger, Gonti, Gray merchant, AND torment. With the cards you're going infinite with, you can then blink any creature you control infinitely. For me, this means blink any creature that can draw, draw deck, play wincon. Basically, what I'm saying is keep one wincon (Probably Gray Merchant) because typically when you go infinite, you should be able to then see your entire deck. Phyrexian reclamation seems slow. Again, maybe this is due to a difference in core deck structure, but I never see any reason to recur creatures- just play more that do the same thing! Mystic remora seems unnecessary. With all the cards being drawn, remora is honestly slow, even if it funtioned as one mana draw 4. It's not worth the mana. I notice your not running The Great Henge, Wild Pair, Prime Speaker Vannifar, and are cutting Soul of the Harvest. Wild pair is one of the most explosive cards in my deck. Typically playing Pair means winning the next turn, or this turn. Vannifar is another pod effect, what's not to love. Soul and Great Henge turn each creature into more fuel, which is perfect. Agent of treachery seems like a worse version of Sower of Temptation in this deck. Underrated card in yarok is Spark Double. Lets you reuse etbs that are on the field, but, more importantly, it copies yarok without being legendary, so it's a more flexible version of Panharmonicon at WORST. I would reccomend keeping Neoform, but only for one reason. Adding Golgari Findbroker to your deck gives you access to a Neoform line straight to Peregrine Drake. Any time you have a 2 cmc creature out, you play Neoform, sac it, go for witness, return neoform, play it, get findbroker, return neoform, play it, get drake, now you have 10 mana and drake out. I didn't see Equilibrium in your list either, this is both an incredible control piece and a combo enabler that turns any creature into a shrieking drake for you. I assume since Palinchron is beyond your price range, that Cloudstone Curio is too, but if it isn't find a way to run it. This card is NUTS. Playing a curio basically wins you the game.
Current Decks:
Alesha, Who Smiles at Death EDH
Karlov of the Ghost Council EDH
Sidisi, Brood Tyrant EDH
Edgar Markov EDH
Emmara, Soul of the Accord EDH
Yarok, the Desecrated EDH
Grenzo, Dungeon Warden EDH
Kalamax (No infinites) EDH
Ghalta EDH
Current Projects:
Sidar Kondo of Jamuraa/Silas Renn, Seeker Adept EDH
Neheb, the Eternal EDH

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic

Return to “Commander”