Unreleased and New Card Discussion

[Igzex]

I gotta agree with that. Lately these precons have doing doing a great job of avoiding Fierce Guardianships, Teferi's Protections, and Derevi, Empyrial Tacticians.

[ilovesaprolings]

Disappointed by the esper deck too. Other ones are pretty good and don't start from 0. The gruul dragon deck for example got awesome new cards, but there already are plenty of good dragon cards.
Venture on the other hand is a new mechanic and... it's pretty crappy. If the best we get is that 3/6 solar...

[Mookie]

Aaaand the remaining new cards...

• Klauth, Unrivaled Ancient looks absurd. Seven mana is a lot, but that's a lot of mana production. No easy infinite with Aggravated Assault, unlike most instances of this effect, which is somewhat nice from a meta perspective.
• Bag of Tricks is interesting as a low-investment Birthing Pod. Random stuff is obviously much weaker than random creatures, but you don't need to sacrifice a creature either. You could also only play one creature of a specific mana cost, if you wanted a bit more consistency.
• Druid of Purification is a super-Reclamation Sage. It can backfire if one of your opponents wants an Oblivion Ring or hate piece gone, but otherwise seems quite strong. Seems like the most obvious mega-staple in the new decks.
• Wulfgar of Icewind Dale is a sweet way to double Inferno Titan / Etali, Primal Storm triggers. Seems like an easy include in the hypothetical Samut stompy deck I sometimes brainstorm.
• Nihiloor is... interesting. Theft effects are strong, but you need some beefy creatures to overpower your opponents' creatures, which Esper isn't exactly known for.
• Immovable Rod is an interesting option for a trinket package. Repeatedly venturing is a bit costly, but locking down a problematic permanent is sweet. Also hits lands, which is interesting.
• Radiant Solar is a snap include in Brago. Would I like to complete multiple dungeons every combat? Yes, yes I would. Seems strong in any blink deck.
• Revivify is an interesting Faith's Reward variant. I suspect the latter is going to be better in most situations, but costing a mana less is relevant.
• Thorough Investigation is card advantage in white. I wasn't expecting them to actually just give white card advantage from attacking, but.... I guess I won't complain either. Also fun for any clue-focused decks.
• Minn, Wily Illusionist looks like a lot of fun. Illusion tribal, Show and Tell shenanigans, drawing two cards per turn... lots of interesting ways to take that commander.
• Phantom Steed is another fun option for blink decks. Sort of a pseudo-Restoration Angel in blue, which is cool.
• Midnight Pathlighter is more venture shenanigans, plus some interesting evasion.
• Component Pouch is an interesting Manalith variant. Only produces mana every other turn, but you get two mana instead of one, so it's more explosive. Seems outclassed by Coalition Relic though.

[darrenhabib]

Robe of Stars is my cup-o-tea. Phasing is by far the most protective method of saving cards and the fact that you can phase out equipment and auras attached to a creature gives it more depth.

Minn, Wily Illusionist has tickled my fancy as a build around commander.

Lorcan, Warlock Collector is a bomb if you got some mill going. I feel the need to specifically build a deck to make use of it.

Nihiloor as a potentially reusable Blatant Thievery of sorts is actually pretty scary. Easily can steal all the creatures on the board without that much of a setup.

[DirkGently]

Didn't realize we were getting a whole extra day of spoilers. So are they just doing a full set of precons for every set now? Is that the hellscape we're all accepting? Jesus.

On the other hand, more shiny new cards to review.

Klauth, Unrivaled Ancient - power is pretty high. How much i like it is a 1/5 though. I think the only precon commander from this set I'm going to groan at.

Berserker's Frenzy - what a pointless timing restriction. Anyway seems pretty weak, can't imagine playing this. 1/5.

Chaos Dragon - at least if gives you SOME degree of choice, not totally random. If you want a medium-sized slightly-undercosted beater I guess it's fine. 2/5.

Maddening Hex - So this deals...like 7 points of damage in an average turn cycle maybe? I guess it's kind of efficient but random damage sucks balls imo. 1/5.

Vengeful Ancestor - Decent critter, strange that he's not in the BR deck. Fine for that sort of power level. 3/5.

Bag of Tricks - am I crazy or is this pretty strong? Can't say I love the combo of being strong and also random, but it'll see play, so I guess it's a 4/5.

Druid of Purification - political rec sage. Extra mana is significant, but I do like it. 4/5.

Indomitable Might - this is a precon rare? 1/5.

Neverwinter Hydra - big beater...meh. 2/5.

Wild Endeavor - I guess it's decent value but you've kinda gotta want both. 3/5.

Dragonborn Champion - seems pretty self-limiting since you'll just kill people. Funny that it can trigger on yourself I suppose, but still hard to trigger and not efficient. 1/5.

Klauth's Will - nice flexibility here. multicolor limits it a lot ofc, but it's good where it can be played. 4/5.

Wulfgar of Icewind Dale - every trigger must be doubled, lol. No saboteur doubling though. Doesn't seem too crazy, but I can dig it. 4/5.

Nihiloor - This is so much setup, and so easy to see coming, that I can't imagine it ever works out the way you want it to. If I want to play esper theft, I'll play Merieke Ri Berit, thanks. 2/5.

Immovable Rod - damn strong commander neutralization tech slash value engine. Into Phelddagrif you go. 5/5.

Radiant Solar - pretty strong effect, although, we've seen the same with drawing a card at the same cmc. Interesting alt-cost stuff. Weird that they're so strict about sorcery-only venturing in the main set, but don't give a crap in the commander stuff. 4/5.

Revivify - much weaker version of similar effects. 2/5.

Thorough Investigation - pretty solid value generation in white. Will see play. 4/5.

Arcane Endeavor - 7 mana single-use draw spell...eh, I'm not that impressed. 2/5.

Minn, Wily Illusionist - cute, neat trigger and neat result. I like it. 4/5.

Phantom Steed - One of the stronger cards in the set. Multifunctional too. 4/5.

Rod of Absorption - Neat design. Probably best used to copy a bunch of cheap cantrips and stuff. I don't like storm, but I do think the design is cute, so I guess 3/5.

Grave Endeavor - into Toshiro Umezawa with you. I don't think I usually want a bunch of tacked on stuff to my reanimation, though. 3/5.

Wand of Orcus - powerful, but relatively fair and slow. Kinda niche since it wants zombie tribal and also high power. 3/5.

Extract Brain - requires quite a lot of investment to not suck. Otherwise they'll just show lands or whatever. 2/5.

Midnight Pathlighter - static evasion is risky, everyone has a legend, and the trigger isn't that impressive. 2/5.

Component Pouch - people are sleeping on this. Most of the time you'll be able to find turns to refuel this where you don't miss out and you can stack them up, making this roughly comparable to Worn Powerstone, a very popular card. 4/5.

[Gamazson]

I am really liking Fiendlash for my Valduk, Keeper of the Flame deck. The floor is a piece of equipment with reach, +2/+0, and creates a reason to not block my commander. The ceiling is using Goblin Bombardment to sac off my surviving elementals to damage Valduk himself, creating an even bigger damage trigger. If I can pull that off with a Harmonic Prodigy or a piece of lifelink equipment on the board, I may laugh maniacally.

[ilovesaprolings]

Didn't realize we were getting a whole extra day of spoilers. So are they just doing a full set of precons for every set now? Is that the hellscape we're all accepting? Jesus.

Technically this is a core set and the 4 commander decks are replacing the 5 planeswalker decks.

[5colorsrainbow]

Didn't realize we were getting a whole extra day of spoilers. So are they just doing a full set of precons for every set now? Is that the hellscape we're all accepting? Jesus.

Gavin said they wanting to offer a bigger choice of decks to the DnD players who might come into the game through ADF and that they are taking the place of the five plane walker decks they typically do for corsets. He also noted that Midnight hunt and Crimson Vow for Innistrad would be more normal with two decks each set that are closer in design to the Kaldheim and Zendikar pre-cons.

[folding_music]

Component Pouch inserted directly into Rasputin Dreamweaver proliferate boredom deck <3 most of these cards are strong, but I'm still digesting the STX Commander stuff tbh

[UnfulfilledDesires]

My The Ur-Dragon deck would have killed for Dragonborn Champion. A cheap Dragon that draws cards? Instant include. All these new Dragons make me want to put it back together, but I really need to limit myself. Thirty-six lists is more than enough. I can't see anywhere for Dragonborn Champion apart from Dragon Tribal decks, but it shines there. I get maybe power-matters lists or decks that care about Warriors might want it.

I agree Component Pouch is solid. 55% of the time you cast it & can then tap it for two mana the next two turns. That's quite respectable. Even without any synergies it's fine. With proliferate, Unwinding Clock, Seedborn Muse, or other synergies, it gets better. I need a few copies.

Immovable Rod is too mana-intensive for my taste but I can see the appeal. I don't particularly want to pay 3WW to turn off an opposing permanent when I could be three mana instead via Generous Gift, Beast Within, Song of the Dryads, or what have you. If I want to lock down commanders specifically, I prefer Kenrith's Transformation & Darksteel Mutation. Maybe with synergies like Zirda, the Dawnwaker, Trinket Mage, Clock of Omens, etc.

Thorough Investigation strikes me as the best venture card. (Ok, Acererak the Archlich is better with Aluren.) There's no once-per-turn limitation, so dedicated Clue decks might easily complete a dungeon or even multiple ones in a burst of sacrificing. It's trivial to get a pile of clues with cards like Tireless Tracker, Trail of Evidence, Lonis, Cryptozoologist, & company.

[darrenhabib]

The Book of Exalted Deeds got banned in Standard, and it did get me thinking that if used with Faceless Haven or Mutavault that you do have a land that literally has "you can't lose the game and your opponents can't win the game.".
Now there is a number of ways to remove lands in Commander, but still forcing your opponents to have something to deal with it before they can win does actually seem very good to me. The triple white does mean that it might be mono-white or bi-color only.

[Hermes_]

The Book of Exalted Deeds got banned in Standard, and it did get me thinking that if used with Faceless Haven or Mutavault that you do have a land that literally has "you can't lose the game and your opponents can't win the game.".
Now there is a number of ways to remove lands in Commander, but still forcing your opponents to have something to deal with it before they can win does actually seem very good to me. The triple white does mean that it might be mono-white or bi-color only.

Light bulb

[DirkGently]

Lol world record for fastest banned card. That combo is honestly hilarious. I love it. But also get your %$#% together wotc.

I kinda think that effect sucks in commander tbh. I guess it depends on the meta. But you don't get to know how safe you are until you're using it as your lifeline. Then suddenly the removal comes down. So you don't really want to go into lethal range anyway since you don't know if it's safe. Not a great feeling imo.

[Mookie]

I'll call out that The Book of Exalted Deeds is not actually banned in Standard - it's banned in Standard 2022, which is a best-of-1 format with a smaller cardpool (meaning you can't sideboard into an answer for games 2 or 3, and you probably don't want to run Lithoform Blight maindeck). It also had unfortunate implications in the mirror match, since ties aren't really supported. As they note in the article, it isn't going to be planned in the upcoming Standard format, at least initially. If the upcoming sets have the speculated Ghost Quarter reprint, it may not be an issue at all.

...that said, I'm going to hope that it doesn't become that widespread in EDH, if only because I don't feel like slotting Strip Mine into all of my decks. I'm running incidental land destruction in most of my decks, but usually not anything dedicated.

[Igzex]

I hope the Ghost Quarter in Innistrad wasn't demolished during the events of the Shadows block then...

As for EDH, I feel even decks piloted by people who hate land destruction have ways to deal with lands without even knowing it. Beast Within, Assassin's Trophy, Acidic Slime, Chaos Warp, Spine of Ish Sah, and such to the point where I doubt the combo will cause a lot of problems.

Still I gotta admire how cute that little interaction is.

[Gashnaw]

The Book of Exalted Deeds got banned in Standard, and it did get me thinking that if used with Faceless Haven or Mutavault that you do have a land that literally has "you can't lose the game and your opponents can't win the game.".
Now there is a number of ways to remove lands in Commander, but still forcing your opponents to have something to deal with it before they can win does actually seem very good to me. The triple white does mean that it might be mono-white or bi-color only.

Light bulb

Damnit, I don't want to build non dragon decks. I'll tell my friend to build t. he already has a mono white angel deck. Telling him to add those land and this book will be helpful (And he can also use the book to just make tokens if for no other reason.)

Granted he does not always liek my strategies (Kormus bell + Urborg, tomb of yawgmoth was not something he enjoyed doing (HE RUN LINVALA) not because he didn't like stopping us from doing stuff, he didn't like us being able to attack with our lands. "Dude, if you can pull it off early enough, you literally shut us down from playing"

So i am gonna run this by him and tell him to put the kormus bell combo back in, (if he refuses, Screw it, making linvala myself)

[Dunharrow]

Forget mutavault.
Thespian's Stage copying Mutavault. Then activate stage again to copy an indestructible land.

[Gashnaw]

Forget mutavault.
Thespian's Stage copying Mutavault. Then activate stage again to copy an indestructible land.

*SLAP*
Don't give me ideas like that.

[Sanity_Eclipse]

Or just keep it mono-white with Terra Eternal.

[darrenhabib]

Forget mutavault.
Thespian's Stage copying Mutavault. Then activate stage again to copy an indestructible land.

Probably even better is copying Lotus Field for the hexproof and mana upgrade.

[Sanity_Eclipse]

As you're copying Mutavault, use That Which Was Taken to give it a Divinity counter, then go into the Lotus Field copying.

And then promptly stand up to be pimp-slapped by everyone you're playing with

[Dunharrow]

Tomik, Distinguished Advokist as commander? To protect everything while you set up.
I am happy I am not buying this set or I would be tempted to do this.

[Mookie]

See, this is why I run Death Cloud. The solution to (and occasional cause of) pretty much any land-based problem.

[Sanity_Eclipse]

Tomik, Distinguished Advokist as commander? To protect everything while you set up.
I am happy I am not buying this set or I would be tempted to do this.

See, this is why I run Death Cloud. The solution to (and occasional cause of) pretty much any land-based problem.

Sigarda, Host of Herons.

Note to everyone, please don't do this lol.

[Crazy Monkey]

For protection, wouldn't Tyrite Sanctum be better here because the indestructible property comes from the land instead? It also keeps the whole thing in the lands, which is more on theme.

This plan is convoluted enough that I might build around it or add it to a bad deck.