Do you think C19 is above and beyond?

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Nimbaway
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Post by Nimbaway » 4 years ago

For me Commander 2019 hasn't really gone above and beyond. In fact, when the themes were revealed I already adjusted my expectations for what we would be getting and I feel that the decks have lived up to that for me.

I ended up pre-ordering the Flashback and Madness since their themes looked interesting enough to take a gamble on them. Contemplated Morph when the initial Commanders were spoiled but am in the end glad I didn't add it to my order.

Now spoilers are done I am only ordering eight additional singles, since I feel not too many of the cards are going to find a home in my current decks. Flashback will likely remain an unmodified deck to have on the shelf, but the Madness deck certainly is inspiring some modifications. So all in all it's an okay release but nothing too special to me.

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Post by DirkGently » 4 years ago

Rumpy5897 wrote:
4 years ago
I see a bunch of folks brought up proxying. While on the whole it's a nice idea, it doesn't work if you float out into the open waters of playing with randoms.

Also, allow me to weave a cautionary tale of what happened with my old group. It all started when a new guy came around with some gold-bordered cards in 2015. For the first time in the meta's experience, there was something other than actual tournament-legal magical cardboard at the table. We nodded along to it, but didn't adopt it. As time went on, he discovered Chinese fakes and built a ludicrous Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder deck with a clock far unsuited for the group. That was also manageable, I'd get the table to focus him into the dirt and usually the game went ok because of it. However, I moved two years ago, and a couple new folks hopped on and adopted his ideals. The group devolved into a full-on proxy arms race. I still sometimes meet up with one of the old guard who stuck it out, and when he pulls out the deck he built to try (and fail) to keep up I get destroyed. I've been blessed with a microcosm of a playgroup where the Muldrotha is Lhurgoyf tribal. Just about everyone in the old group has a Muldrotha with a Chinese Lion's Eye Diamond. Irresponsibly granting power can corrupt the wielders, and this whole "arms race" scenario is widely disliked by the community.
This is why I tried to be clear about "if you need X to compete in your group" then you should proxy. If you don't need that, don't proxy it.

I think the format is held together in no small part by prices. Established players can have the world at their fingertips and know better to restrain themselves from playing something beyond the power of the group, but new players won't necessarily understand the vibe. I know when I was new to magic, when I realized there were infinite combos I wanted to get. in. there. 17 years and a few million combos later, I'm about as interested in 2-card combos as I am in eyeball scraping.

I'm generally fine with people proxying in my group, because I do get being on a budget and it's not exactly fair that I get to run anything I want while other people are stuffing guildgates into every deck they build. That said, if you're proxying to build something original, funny, or interesting, then proxy whatever you want - if you're proxying a bunch of boring format staples, then I guess it's ok - if you're proxying a cEDH netdeck, then piss off.
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Post by Jace » 4 years ago

I'm neither impressed with the reprints nor the new designs. I feel like there was minor reprint value improvement this year, but the bar was set very low after last year in this regard, that it really was insufficient. The new designs last year were the best Commander has ever seen, or at least on par with 2016. But 2019 failed to capture my interest on any front. I will, however, admit that it appears to be for others perhaps, and just not for me. But as far as the value being there, I'm not seeing it. Not when so many cards for Commander are expensive because of Commander, and were nowhere to be seen. Thought Vessel, Cyclonic Rift, Oracle of Mul Daya, Worldly Tutor. At the very least the latter. I mean, C19 evaluations began with poor reprint quality last year and the handicap of no Masters reprint sets to pick up any slack. With such a bare minimum done here, promises were not kept about adding value to Commander decks on both fronts. It's almost being implied that Masters sets returning is the only recourse, when it never had to be if WOTC had the integrity to deliver on their promise to feature more value in these decks.

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Post by RxPhantom » 4 years ago

I've been underwhelmed by Commander precons for years now. When I got into this format in 2011, the whole thing didn't seem too prescriptive. It was really fun to hunt for a cool commander and use your wits, guile, and ingenuity to build around it. But with the precons, it's just like "HERE, USE THIS" and there's just something about most of them that turns me off. Same with commanders like Feather, the Redeemed; sure, it's a great commander in a color that's lacking in that department, but every single Feather deck is going to run the same ~40 cards or so.
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Post by boer0829 » 4 years ago

Last precon commander deck I bought was the monowhite deck C14 deck... That deck just sucked and never bought another precon deck after that. Just picked some singles that looked cool. Until this year i'm in doubt about the madness deck and the populate deck of just buying some singles. As a commander player I almost own all the staples so i'm not really interested in reprints. I've never played with a rakdos commander and the new Greven and Chainer look fantastic. Also some cool single cards like Bone Miser and K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth
If I buy this deck I tear it apart and build a new deck and put some cards in other decks. The precon itself doesn't seem to know what it wants.
I want to build a new token deck and populate seems like a fun way to build a token army. The populate deck offers a lot of those cards and just needs some minor tweeks to have a fun deck. This deck would be hold together with some tweeks.

Don't know if I buy a precon. The madness and the populate seem cool but is the price tag justified for someone who already owns the majority of playable EDH cards? Isn't it better to pick up some cool new singles and making a deck from scrap? Reprintwise the decks arent interesting for me to buy. Oterwise, the madness deck has a lot of cool new commanders in colors I havent have a deck yet and the populate has some decent enchantments that I could use (dont own them yet) but nothing interesting.

Hope that the new fairy tale set has some nice reprints and cool new cards. Also some commander cards like command beacon and Teferi's Protection could use a reprint. I expected more of that in the set.

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Post by Rumpy5897 » 4 years ago

RxPhantom wrote:
4 years ago
I've been underwhelmed by Commander precons for years now. When I got into this format in 2011, the whole thing didn't seem too prescriptive. It was really fun to hunt for a cool commander and use your wits, guile, and ingenuity to build around it. But with the precons, it's just like "HERE, USE THIS" and there's just something about most of them that turns me off. Same with commanders like Feather, the Redeemed; sure, it's a great commander in a color that's lacking in that department, but every single Feather deck is going to run the same ~40 cards or so.
I had the same feeling for a while, but I don't think WOTC are ultimately the only ones to blame. We've also changed as players. We've gotten years of experience under our belts, we're able to judge a legend quite quickly upon exposure, having seen more than our share of decks. 2014 me saw Patron of the Orochi and Tromokratis while exploring the legend pool, and built weird activated ability spam/tapdown voltron around them as at the time it was new and exciting. 2018 me would have figured out the required gimmick quite quickly, snorted in derision and moved on. Are the 2011 precon legends really that much objectively better than current "formulaic garbage" like Hallar, the Firefletcher? I mean, in a vacuum, Kaalia is three-creature-type tribal, how's that objectively more exciting than kicker spell/+1/+1 counter shenanigan tribal? And yet one of those is beloved to the point of having two primers and a guy sporting her as his avatar, and the other lives on in infamy as a guy holds him up as his Brawl commander of choice in a photo rubbing in how dead the format is. A new guy recently joined my playgroup, and it's been exciting watching him brewing up various legendss I dismissed as shallow and having a blast with them. Helped me see stuff in a less jaded way.

That said, WOTC turned the supporting legend into a McDonalds-tier automaton, and their designs also seem formulaic in what sort of stuff they support and how they go about it. I feel KLD/AER are to blame here, as people got riled up that there was no energy legend or {u/r} artificer. As such, anytime anything of note happens in a set, there's a cautionary legend riding its coattails, often in the form of "when you do X, double it or draw a card". Sometimes they manage to word it excitingly (Teysa Karlov), other times they don't (Zegana, Utopian Speaker). I actually like Feather a lot, but she's tailor-made for me - supports a weird thing in the wrong colour combination. Apparently that's an easy way to my heart. I like that they also spit out oddball legends like that every now and then, even if some of them are horrendous misses (Etrata).
 
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Post by Cyberium » 4 years ago

Rumpy5897 wrote:
4 years ago

I had the same feeling for a while, but I don't think WOTC are ultimately the only ones to blame. We've also changed as players. We've gotten years of experience under our belts, we're able to judge a legend quite quickly upon exposure, having seen more than our share of decks. 2014 me saw Patron of the Orochi and Tromokratis while exploring the legend pool, and built weird activated ability spam/tapdown voltron around them as at the time it was new and exciting. 2018 me would have figured out the required gimmick quite quickly, snorted in derision and moved on. Are the 2011 precon legends really that much objectively better than current "formulaic garbage" like Hallar, the Firefletcher? I mean, in a vacuum, Kaalia is three-creature-type tribal, how's that objectively more exciting than kicker spell/+1/+1 counter shenanigan tribal? And yet one of those is beloved to the point of having two primers and a guy sporting her as his avatar, and the other lives on in infamy as a guy holds him up as his Brawl commander of choice in a photo rubbing in how dead the format is. A new guy recently joined my playgroup, and it's been exciting watching him brewing up various legendss I dismissed as shallow and having a blast with them. Helped me see stuff in a less jaded way.

That said, WOTC turned the supporting legend into a McDonalds-tier automaton, and their designs also seem formulaic in what sort of stuff they support and how they go about it. I feel KLD/AER are to blame here, as people got riled up that there was no energy legend or {u/r} artificer. As such, anytime anything of note happens in a set, there's a cautionary legend riding its coattails, often in the form of "when you do X, double it or draw a card". Sometimes they manage to word it excitingly (Teysa Karlov), other times they don't (Zegana, Utopian Speaker). I actually like Feather a lot, but she's tailor-made for me - supports a weird thing in the wrong colour combination. Apparently that's an easy way to my heart. I like that they also spit out oddball legends like that every now and then, even if some of them are horrendous misses (Etrata).
Agree. I dislike legends with such "given" mechanics, where decks are already made just by looking upon their restrictive (yet powerful) effects. Sevinne is at least effective with any spell cast from graveyard, not just flashback, Ghired is his own populate, Anje can simply be a value engine, but Kadena is truly one dimensional. They could've given her an ability to manifest cards akin to Jeskai Infiltrator, for example: "UBG: Shuffle your graveyard and manifest two cards at random." That would've open up so many more directions.

If there's one thing I want to see improved next year, that's the creativity department. I understand they need a face commander for a cohesive deck, lest they suffer the problem of the original precons (yes, I know some people buy these for reprints), but I still wish the "themes" could be more open-ended, or at least with cards that encourage people to use such mechanic outside of its "tribal". Scroll of Fate is one such, and Endless Atlas from last year.

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Post by toctheyounger » 4 years ago

Above and beyond? No. Interesting? Sure. There's neat stuff in each of the decks, so that's something.

My rationale behind 'to buy or not to buy' is either I see a commander with a reasonable degree of support from the precon that I want to build, or there's reprints I want copies of; I've had hiatuses from the game and missed the window on some staples of the format. It's not the end of the world, but I will not be able to afford them any other way.

While I will wholly admit that there are some neat commanders (I really like Greven) there's nothing I absolutely have to build, and honestly, the reprints here are mostly pretty underwhelming. Seedborne Muse is great and so is Geth, but what gives with the rest? There's freaking nothing.

The most predictable and most disappointing thing though is the lands. Again. Nice to see Thespian's Stage, but otherwise the lands are just as lame as they've ever been. No one is asking for Ancient Tomb or anything, but jesus, there's plenty of stuff they could add in to make the lands more attractive than they have. Ok, yeah - painlands are in there this time. That's not nothing, but damn. It's literally the most expensive part of any deck you build, and being stuck with precon dross land is just a bit lame.

I should add to this gripe that I am well aware that I am not the target audience for the precons, in that I have established decks and am well entrenched in the format, so I'm not as salty about it all as the above paragraphs probably sound. Still, being stuck with Akoum Refuges for your best colour fixing while your pals already in the format drop Bloodstained Mire into Blood Crypt has gotta suck. The curve just shouldn't be THAT steep.
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Post by Mookie » 4 years ago

I'll preface this by saying I do not intend to purchase any of the precon decks, but I do intend to acquire some singles.

There are multiple ways to evaluate the precons. One way is to evaluate them from the perspective of the potential audience of 'people who want to get into EDH'. For these people, I think the precons look great - they're solidly built, have interesting cards, and should play well. I will wholeheartedly recommend any of the new precons to anyone new to the format.

Another way is to evaluate the decks for people who may not be new to the format, but do want to try something new. I would give the precons a good rating on this axis too. Populate, morph, flashback, and madness are all mechanics that haven't really had much support if you want to build a deck around them, and the new commanders (and cards) help them a lot. Adding red to the populate deck opens a lot more options for token production. Morph didn't really have a good commander other than Animar. Casting spells from your graveyard already had some support with commanders like Karador and Kess, but most of the support has been enablers, and not payoffs. Madness, like morph, didn't really have a good commander (Olivia is alright, but not a perfect fit). So from this axis, I think all the commanders (and decks) do a good job of enabling their mechanics.

Most of the complaints I would have are related to reprint value, which is somewhat to be expected, given the differing goals of WotC compared to the playerbase. Each of the decks appears to have two higher-end reprints (Seedborn Muse, Geth, etc), with several others in the 'not bulk, but not particularly valuable' range, with a few staples like Ash Barrens, Myriad Landscape, and Sol Ring appearing in every deck. The total value of these reprints is greater than the cost of the deck, so they are arguably successes from that perspective, but as a person that already owns most of the lower-end cards, only the higher-end reprints excite me, and these are pretty lacking.

So, on the reprint axis, I think the decks look alright for someone trying to build a collection, but lacking for someone that already has one. This is the main reason I don't plan to buy any decks - the most any of them have are ~3 reprints I want, so it's easier to just pick up singles.

If we instead want to evaluate the decks based on the new cards, I think they look reasonable. There are some cards targeted at solving some problems, such as Mire in Misery, Tectonic Hellion, and Leadership Vacuum. There are some cards that look specifically good in their decks, such as Bone Miser and Full Flowering, a few quirky build-arounds like Aeon Engine, and generically good cards like Voice of Many and Dockside Extortionist. Not every card is going to be for every person, but I think they hit a pretty broad set of interests.

Looking just at the new commanders, I see a mix of more linear commanders (Kadena, Slinking Sorcerer), more open-ended ones (Chainer, Nightmare Adept), generic goodstuff (Elsha of the Infinite), and gimmicky nonsense (Pramikon, Sky Rampart). Again, not every commander is going to be for every person. I actually like the set of commanders they have more than many previous years, many of which leaned heavily towards the Spike-ier side of things.

tl;dr: Above and beyond? Design-wise, yes. Reprint-wise, no.

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Post by Sinis » 4 years ago

Rumpy5897 wrote:
4 years ago
I'm not sure there is a clean way to solve all this without a Chronicles-tier debacle where the hoarders get mad.
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Post by Mapccu » 4 years ago

I'm really not trying to white knight but the title of the thread is kinda inflammatory. I don't know Gavin, but I'd have to imagine being the face as a designer doesn't mean you get 100% control of the final product. There are a lot of hands in the pot, and important decisions have to be delegated out to meet deadlines or you have to successfully sell upper management on a product idea. Gavin may be our target as far as transparency goes, but don't kid yourself in that he has full control. He very well could have meant every word he typed in his letter and I have really no reason to doubt after battlebond and the introduction of brawl decks.

We had a great response for why Ixador wasn't in the product. They could have made him another card, sure. There is limited real estate, however.

The decks also serve an onboarding function for new players. Reprints may mean squat to us, but how often are we buying entire precons once you've built up a collection for a decade. I buy singles which means that retailers have to break down some number of products specifically for me now. New players need these cards when they aren't aware of the secondary market, want more copies for other decks, or it provides them with trade fodder with other newer players.

If I had to be critical of the precon Products of wotc these days, id like to see them be made up of pieces that are more interchangeable to encourage deck building and trading. That's not just a commander precon gripe, but this year is a pretty big offender aside from the mono color sets of years past.

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Post by Sinis » 4 years ago

Mapccu wrote:
4 years ago
I'm really not trying to white knight but the title of the thread is kinda inflammatory. I don't know Gavin, but I'd have to imagine being the face as a designer doesn't mean you get 100% control of the final product.

There are a lot of hands in the pot, and important decisions have to be delegated out to meet deadlines or you have to successfully sell upper management on a product idea. Gavin may be our target as far as transparency goes, but don't kid yourself in that he has full control. He very well could have meant every word he typed in his letter and I have really no reason to doubt after battlebond and the introduction of brawl decks.
Eh.

Of course he's not in complete control. Let's not kid ourselves, he reports to someone.

But, let's talk about how we arrived here. He acknowledged a failing in the C18 product, specifically about reprints. He promised to do better. Arguably, he did not follow through on his promise.

Your position seems to be that his hands are tied (or at least somewhat restricted) in such a way that he could not follow through on his promise. Is it less blameworthy to make promises you can't keep, or to fail to keep promises you can make?
Mapccu wrote:
4 years ago
We had a great response for why Ixador wasn't in the product. They could have made him another card, sure. There is limited real estate, however.
His Ixidor response was stellar. I'm glad they gave that out.
Mapccu wrote:
4 years ago
The decks also serve an onboarding function for new players. Reprints may mean squat to us, but how often are we buying entire precons once you've built up a collection for a decade.
I am a veteran. The I remember opening the revised Demonic Tutors I play in my decks. Yet, I buy all precons, ever year. I have since Commander started being a product. Part of it is that I'm into the hype and I want to play new cards, but the other part of it is that after C13, I realized that the secondary market will always favour someone who preordered. I don't want to try to find/pay for a Containment Priest. I want to just throw $200 at the whole thing, and let god sort it out.

Humourously, I was at a LGS last week, and they had C16 products on display. One of them was $150. I don't want to have to deal with that. So, I just buy them sight unseen and hope for the best. And that strategy has not failed me yet.
Mapccu wrote:
4 years ago
I buy singles which means that retailers have to break down some number of products specifically for me now. New players need these cards when they aren't aware of the secondary market, want more copies for other decks, or it provides them with trade fodder with other newer players.

If I had to be critical of the precon Products of wotc these days, id like to see them be made up of pieces that are more interchangeable to encourage deck building and trading. That's not just a commander precon gripe, but this year is a pretty big offender aside from the mono color sets of years past.
I think my initial post was a bit harsh. From my own perspective, the reprints suck. I'm at least a little excited about new cards (black enchantment removal?! Leadership Vacuum!). I'm intrigued by some of the new commanders, and at least a couple of people in my playgroup are excited about egg-commander, or even Marisi. But, let's not kid ourselves; the reprints are just... not great. And, nobody, new or old, needed Pristine Skywise or Pristine Angel.

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Post by DirkGently » 4 years ago

Mapccu wrote:
4 years ago
The decks also serve an onboarding function for new players. Reprints may mean squat to us, but how often are we buying entire precons once you've built up a collection for a decade.
I usually buy 2 sets of precons - one to keep forever to play against each other, and one to scrap for singles. If you want every new card, it's usually cheaper to buy the whole set than singles. Even on cardmarket(maybe especially on cardmarket).

In this case I'll probably want a few of the reprints because they are newly-viable thanks to anje/Sevinne/snake lady. Didn't want them before but I do now.
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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

DirkGently wrote:
4 years ago
Mapccu wrote:
4 years ago
The decks also serve an onboarding function for new players. Reprints may mean squat to us, but how often are we buying entire precons once you've built up a collection for a decade.
I usually buy 2 sets of precons - one to keep forever to play against each other, and one to scrap for singles. If you want every new card, it's usually cheaper to buy the whole set than singles. Even on cardmarket(maybe especially on cardmarket).

In this case I'll probably want a few of the reprints because they are newly-viable thanks to anje/Sevinne/snake lady. Didn't want them before but I do now.
What the heck is cardmarket? Is that just a nickname for tcgplayer?

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Rumpy5897
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Post by Rumpy5897 » 4 years ago

That's the EU version of it.
 
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DirkGently
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Post by DirkGently » 4 years ago

3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
What the heck is cardmarket? Is that just a nickname for tcgplayer?
It's a euro-only card-selling marketplace, and has a wider seller-base than tcgplayer (i.e. individuals can also sell there, it's not just stores - it's somewhere between tcgplayer and ebay).

Prices range from only slightly cheaper to as little as 50% of tcgplayer, depending on the card. For example, to buy a set of 4 2019 decks costs minimum $165 on tcgplayer and minimum 120 euros on cardmarket (which is roughly $135). It's pretty sweet. Downside is that it's a lot more annoying to use imo.
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Post by darrenhabib » 4 years ago

I think a few misconceptions about the annual commander sets need to happen to satisfy consumer expectations.

Firstly that it's a product that will be used to meet the demands of in demand reprints. It's not like the "Masters" series where you can open boosters for lottery high value cards.
It's a pre-constructed product. and as such the notion of putting a $35 card like Oracle of Mul Daya into one is not likely to happen. So stop waiting for it to be this sort of product.

The thing with the current run of reprints is that you are going to get a ceiling of like $10 maximum like Seedborn Muse and as such you are only really saving a couple of dollars on a single (maximum). Which isn't really doing anything long term.
So the whole idea of reprints for commander products isn't to do with meeting demands, but rather packaging up decks for newbies.
I think once WotC conveys this more, you'll see less complaints.
But obviously WotC needs to actually run reprints of in demand commander cards, and that is left to other products, like the "Masters" series and we got that with Battlebond as well. We literally might get a "Commander Masters" as the next installment...you heard it here first.

As far as a product for seasoned commander players, the legendary creatures themselves are the things we look for most. This years lot definitely has enough to sink your teeth into, without being under-powered or over-powered. So pretty nicely balanced,
We get about 100 legendary creatures a year with the other products, so the annual commander product gives us an additional 15 to play with, which is a fine injection.

Of the new commander cards for your 99, I'm going to say that it's mediocre. Sevinne's Reclamation, Bone Miser, Curse of Fool's Wisdom, Anje's Ravager, Backdraft Hellkite, Dockside Extortionist, Ohran Frostfang being the main new cards that can add consistent value to some decks.
Not to say that some of the other cards can't be played, but in the grand schemes of things it's slim pickings. Certainly disappointing.
7 cards from the entire set is just not enough to satisfy commander players. It's all about supply and demand, and I really think a "Commander Horizons" type product is on the..horizon. We already got Battlebond to quench this thirst a bit, but expect more products like that in the future I'd have to imagine.

As far as the reprints, as I've pointed out you are really not saving more than a couple of bucks on even the most "premium" offerings, so it's doesn't even matter what they jam in.
For most people it's about getting the new commanders, and hopefully cover the cost of overall product with the reprints, rather than getting the desired cards they need for their pre-existing decks.

As far as investments, I do think that the Rakdos deck has some sleeper hits with Anje's Ravager and Wildfire Devils being Legacy playable cards, and very powerful ones for that format in my opinion. I honestly think it'll take a while to cotton on (Legacy players), but there is scope for it to be like a sleeper for awhile until people want a number of them for a play set. Plus you can never go wrong with another Solemn Simulacrum in your collection, The legendary creatures are all competitive.

The Jeskai one has the most powerful legendary creature options in my opinion, and the Dockside Extortionist is certainly tempting.
And then the Sun Titan and Clever Impersonator are fine reprints, you'll always find a deck for those.

The Sultai deck offers the least in my opinion and although there are some fine reprints with Ixidron, Grim Haruspex, Seedborn Muse making plenty of decks, they are easy to pick up for cheap as singles.
I find the legendary creatures to be below average and then the "new" cards are awful.

The Naya one looks to have the least commander staples. The legendary creatures have unique twists to them, and I think they'll end up being better than they first look, when it actually comes to game play.
Ohran Frostfang will make token decks a lot better and Idol of Oblivion will be surprisingly good in some decks.

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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

DirkGently wrote:
4 years ago
3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
What the heck is cardmarket? Is that just a nickname for tcgplayer?
It's a euro-only card-selling marketplace, and has a wider seller-base than tcgplayer (i.e. individuals can also sell there, it's not just stores - it's somewhere between tcgplayer and ebay).

Prices range from only slightly cheaper to as little as 50% of tcgplayer, depending on the card. For example, to buy a set of 4 2019 decks costs minimum $165 on tcgplayer and minimum 120 euros on cardmarket (which is roughly $135). It's pretty sweet. Downside is that it's a lot more annoying to use imo.
Oh. Well that doesn't do anything for me, ha. Thanks for the explanation.

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Post by Sinis » 4 years ago

Fwiw, some mtg finance heads are saying that the EV for the decks are really high. So, regardless of how dissatisfied about the reprints some of us may feel (as individuals, myself included), many more $5 cards are going to be in circulation.

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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

I think these prices are a bit inflated, especially as we're still in presale phase. There's no way the morph face commander is a $25 card, and most the cards are dipping into $2 range.

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Post by toctheyounger » 4 years ago

They'll definitely drop - it's pre-release hype. Same thing happened with Modern Horizons - I had my eye set on Yawgmoth, Thran Physician among other things, and pre-release date generally prices were up there. Give it a couple weeks and the hype drops, so do the prices. Unless there's something EVERYONE wants, such as Teferi's Protection.
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Post by 3drinks » 4 years ago

toctheyounger wrote:
4 years ago
They'll definitely drop - it's pre-release hype. Same thing happened with Modern Horizons - I had my eye set on Yawgmoth, Thran Physician among other things, and pre-release date generally prices were up there. Give it a couple weeks and the hype drops, so do the prices. Unless there's something EVERYONE wants, such as Teferi's Protection.
I suspect K'rrik retains most of it's price, as will the goblin pirate. Everything else though...........

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Post by toctheyounger » 4 years ago

3drinks wrote:
4 years ago
toctheyounger wrote:
4 years ago
They'll definitely drop - it's pre-release hype. Same thing happened with Modern Horizons - I had my eye set on Yawgmoth, Thran Physician among other things, and pre-release date generally prices were up there. Give it a couple weeks and the hype drops, so do the prices. Unless there's something EVERYONE wants, such as Teferi's Protection.
I suspect K'rrik retains most of it's price, as will the goblin pirate. Everything else though...........
Yeah, can't see much else keeping up there. It remains to be seen, but yeah you're probably right.
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Post by Rumpy5897 » 4 years ago

Yeah, seems plausible. I'm a few iterations into my Ghired and the only new cards left in are Ohran Frostfang, Hate Mirage and Idol of Oblivion. It's a bit sad that the stuff they built to support the populate idea turned out to perish in confrontation with other existing options.
 
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Post by Jace » 4 years ago

Commander just doesn't do enough anymore.
It relies so excessively on surrounding product to make its contents count, that it does the bare minimum. Yes, past legends getting cards is phenomenal. Yes this should continue. But reprint value is scarce, the mana based leave a lot to be desired, and the product doesn't try to be innovative. This is the place we should be seeing Enchantment lands, the enemy colored Tango lands, cycles being finished, Sagas, mechanics like Ninjitsu and Bushido that are too plane flavor locked, card art that gives us glimpses of planes we love like Kamigawa, etc.

Instead, it's just a slop of Jank with generic cards and the bare minimum of Vorthos cards to make the deck passable

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