[STX] Strixhaven: The First Lesson

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Krishnath
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Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

BeneTleilax wrote:
3 years ago
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
BeneTleilax wrote:
3 years ago
Well, save for that black, oily substance on the Silverquill prerelease pack
It's called ink. You know, something you use with a quill to write. >.<
Could be, but I think it turning out to be oil is more likely than Strixhaven turning out to be an original and well-rounded work of fantasy.
Well, on the theme booster the liquid is silver, so....
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Post by clariwench » 3 years ago

Wizards had said on the previous week's Weekly MTG that they had something special planned for the next week's. This was not a reaction to the leaks and was planned ahead of time. They've started doing sneak peeks to help stores gauge interest for pre-orders. I'm not sure what the article going up later in the day has to do with anything because they just did it after the regularly scheduled stream time. The leak with the college names was 100% just a store getting confused about dates and putting their pre-orders up a few days early.

Literally the only similarity between HP and Strixhaven is that it's a magic school. Wow, what a ripoff. The house/college system is completely different, and almost every university has colleges that divide students out into their specialties and is named after someone important involved with founding/funding it. People just desperately want it to be similar to HP so they can rage about it. It's so boring and predictable. We've seen FIVE cards.
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Post by BeneTleilax » 3 years ago

clariwench wrote:
3 years ago
Literally the only similarity between HP and Strixhaven is that it's a magic school. Wow, what a ripoff. The house/college system is completely different, and almost every university has colleges that divide students out into their specialties and is named after someone important involved with founding/funding it. People just desperately want it to be similar to HP so they can rage about it. It's so boring and predictable. We've seen FIVE cards.
Ah yes, every school names its different houses after their founders, with blunt magic-y sounding kennings, no specific resemblances there. It's not just it being a magical school, it's the color palette of all the art we've seen, it's the aforementioned names, heck, it's even the look of the watermarks. As these are indeed the cards WotC deliberately chose to establish their tone, I do not think it unreasonable to predict the tone of the set from them. It's you and Krisnath that are refusing to look deeper than it being a magic school at present.

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Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

BeneTleilax wrote:
3 years ago
Ah yes, every school names its different houses after their founders, with blunt magic-y sounding kennings, no specific resemblances there. It's not just it being a magical school, it's the color palette of all the art we've seen, it's the aforementioned names, heck, it's even the look of the watermarks. As these are indeed the cards WotC deliberately chose to establish their tone, I do not think it unreasonable to predict the tone of the set from them. It's you and Krisnath that are refusing to look deeper than it being a magic school at present.
Literally every university or private school the world over is either named by its founder, the leader of the country when it was founded, or the location it was built. Stop acting like something is unique to Harry Potter when it isn't. If anything, Harry Potter is incredibly bland, and the only two good things it did was get a generation to read and blessed the world with some good actors that might never have been discovered if it weren't for Warner Bros. buying the movie rights at the height of the books popularity.
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Post by 5colorsrainbow » 3 years ago

The theatre building at my school was named after the department head at the time who helped build it. The English department building was named after the wife of the schools founder.

Really if you look at strixhaven and only see Harry Potter make you need to read more. I used to think those memes about HP fans not reading anything was just a meme but dang y'all proving the meme right.
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Post by BeneTleilax » 3 years ago

I'm not a Harry Potter fan, and I'm not sure where you're getting that. I've specifically referenced the Earthsea cycle, The Magicians, the Books of Magic and LotR to stave of y'all's facile comparison to those. Also, you note that they are named for their founders, but not that the names tend to be really obvious spins on existing words or kennings (combinations of existing words stuck end-to-end) which is very much JKR's style. Nor am I saying it alone is my reason for assuming an outsized Harry Potter influence, rather the names, the watermarks, the color palette used and the general tone of the art all point towards Harry Potter in combination. If you look at any one aspect as if it were an isolated occurrence, I have no doubt you'd be able to claim Half-Blood Prince isn't actually based off Harry Potter.

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Post by 5colorsrainbow » 3 years ago

BeneTleilax wrote:
3 years ago
I'm not a Harry Potter fan, and I'm not sure where you're getting that. I've specifically referenced the Earthsea cycle, The Magicians, the Books of Magic and LotR to stave of y'all's facile comparison to those. Also, you note that they are named for their founders, but not that the names tend to be really obvious spins on existing words or kennings (combinations of existing words stuck end-to-end) which is very much JKR's style.
So do many fanasty authors, even magic with Angrath (anger wrath).
Nor am I saying it alone is my reason for assuming an outsized Harry Potter influence, rather the names, the watermarks, the color palette used and the general tone of the art all point towards Harry Potter in combination. If you look at any one aspect as if it were an isolated occurrence, I have no doubt you'd be able to claim Half-Blood Prince isn't actually based off Harry Potter.
Not quiet seeing the art, maybe Silverquill but thats really it, thought art is subjective so what is there are you seeing from all the schools that says Harry Potter? I don't see what your talking about at all with the water marks.

And we already have a number of differences from HP;

-Its a college not a Middle/High school nor a boring school. This also means all the students will be ~18+ (except for a child genius trope I would bet we'd see more likely than not).

-Its has non-human students and teachers that seem able to use magic in the same ways.

-Related above none of shared non-humans between Harry Potter and Strivhaven look similar (thought we have to wait to see the cultures of them) and most seem to be out right in different tropes spaces.

*might be orcs

-Also we have a number of non-humans not in Harry Potter such as dryads, the three different kind of beast folk we have seen so far, elementals, kor, ogres or half-demons.

-Nothing about the flavor outright screams UK and currently seems like Ikoria or Zendikar and not hugely based on anything real world.

-The subjects are magical version of real world subjects than pure magic.

-The subjects are also what separates the students, like a real college, not some inherited traits.
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Post by BeneTleilax » 3 years ago

5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
So do many fanasty authors, even magic with Angrath (anger wrath).
Right, but having such names for all the houses certainly points towards Harry Potter influence.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
Not quiet seeing the art, maybe Silverquill but thats really it, thought art is subjective so what is there are you seeing from all the schools that says Harry Potter? I don't see what your talking about at all with the water marks.
The design of the watermarks resembles the style of the house symbols or w/e for HP. The art is in a very colorful, almost childish style, which is reminiscent of the movies and the countless YA knockoffs.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-Its a college not a Middle/High school nor a boring school. This also means all the students will be ~18+ (except for a child genius trope I would bet we'd see more likely than not).
I would not be so sure of that, given that an atypical number of the characters depicted on the packaging look like children.
image.png
and several figures on Lorehold Command
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-Its has non-human students and teachers that seem able to use magic in the same ways.

-Related above none of shared non-humans between Harry Potter and Strivhaven look similar (thought we have to wait to see the cultures of them) and most seem to be out right in different tropes spaces.

*might be orcs

-Also we have a number of non-humans not in Harry Potter such as dryads, the three different kind of beast folk we have seen so far, elementals, kor, ogres or half-demons.
These are all one point, and yes, they have more tribes than Harry Potter. I think this has far more to do with how WotC tries to push as much niche tribal support as they can into recent sets to improve casual/EDH marketability than any broader lore point.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-Nothing about the flavor outright screams UK and currently seems like Ikoria or Zendikar and not hugely based on anything real world.
The names are all quite anglophone, and I'd be hard-pressed to find any real-world culture Strixhaven resembles more than the pop-culture hybrid of the UK and the US
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-The subjects are magical version of real world subjects than pure magic.
The subjects in Harry Potter were generally British boarding school subjects, just with a lazy coat of magic gloss. Herbology=Biology, Quidditch=PE, etc.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-The subjects are also what separates the students, like a real college, not some inherited traits.
No, they're separated by color, aka what magic their soul or whatever is drawn to. Almost something that could be detected and categorized by some sort of magic hat.
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Post by 5colorsrainbow » 3 years ago

BeneTleilax wrote:
3 years ago
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
So do many fanasty authors, even magic with Angrath (anger wrath).
Right, but having such names for all the houses certainly points towards Harry Potter influence.
I see your point but again I don't see that being just a HP thing.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
Not quiet seeing the art, maybe Silverquill but thats really it, thought art is subjective so what is there are you seeing from all the schools that says Harry Potter? I don't see what your talking about at all with the water marks.
The design of the watermarks resembles the style of the house symbols or w/e for HP. [/quote]

The HP are crest and shields with animals in them. Nothing like these ones.
The art is in a very colorful, almost childish style, which is reminiscent of the movies and the countless YA knockoffs.
I don't see this any different from sets like Battlebond, Ixalan or even Kaldheim with the rainbow aura on everything.

And you do know magical school genre in general are YA?
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-Its a college not a Middle/High school nor a boring school. This also means all the students will be ~18+ (except for a child genius trope I would bet we'd see more likely than not).
I would not be so sure of that, given that an atypical number of the characters depicted on the packaging look like children.
image.png

and several figures on Lorehold Command[/quote]

All of which are non-humans, are to tell how old they are or if they play by non-human aging (such as how Nissa is 60 but in elf years that makes her mid-20's).

Most of then humans don't look that much age difference than Will and Rowan who are barley 18.

And I think the "child" on Lorehold Command is a dwarf.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-Its has non-human students and teachers that seem able to use magic in the same ways.

-Related above none of shared non-humans between Harry Potter and Strivhaven look similar (thought we have to wait to see the cultures of them) and most seem to be out right in different tropes spaces.

*might be orcs

-Also we have a number of non-humans not in Harry Potter such as dryads, the three different kind of beast folk we have seen so far, elementals, kor, ogres or half-demons.
These are all one point, and yes, they have more tribes than Harry Potter. I think this has far more to do with how WotC tries to push as much niche tribal support as they can into recent sets to improve casual/EDH marketability than any broader lore point.[/quote]

The recent tribal push is to have a running them through the year since they moved away from full on blocks and need mechanical ties.

And point still remains though they are in different trope spaces, the elves are Tolkien/magic ones, the ghosts are spirits of the past called to lean from, Dragons are not beast like, ect and uses a larger and diverse range. HP was very human centered and only humans where students.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-Nothing about the flavor outright screams UK and currently seems like Ikoria or Zendikar and not hugely based on anything real world.
The names are all quite anglophone, and I'd be hard-pressed to find any real-world culture Strixhaven resembles more than the pop-culture hybrid of the UK and the US[/quote]

And Hp is a cultural icon of the Uk. Anything that isn't a looking like UK boring school already dilutes comparisons as the really only "original" thing about it.

This being a full on magical world vs hidden from the real world also dilutes as a big trait of HP, that its set in the real world.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-The subjects are magical version of real world subjects than pure magic.
The subjects in Harry Potter were generally British boarding school subjects, just with a lazy coat of magic gloss. Herbology=Biology, Quidditch=PE, etc. [/quote]

Herbology = Botany

I don't see where stuff like charms, transfiguration or defenses against the dark art is anything in real schools, thought potions is pretty much chemistry. But again Strixhaven very much have the real world subject front and center vs "magical school subject" found in myth or folklore, which also atypical of most of the wider genre even.

On that note Quidditch is more = to sports teams which Strixhaven seems to be missing.
5colorsrainbow wrote:
3 years ago
-The subjects are also what separates the students, like a real college, not some inherited traits.
No, they're separated by color, aka what magic their soul or whatever is drawn to. Almost something that could be detected and categorized by some sort of magic hat.image.pngimage.png
[/quote]

Color pie is still an element yes, but the point your going into Witherbloom to be a biologist not cause your happen to be brave of heart. I doubt they are "sorted" so much are young adults looking for higher education is a subject.

And look not saying there isn't or won't be any Harry Potter influences but again how much of this is HP and how much of it is touching on stuff that the wider magical school genre (and what looks like also typical college life) has that HP also touches on. So far Strixhaven doesn't seem anymore directly HP than Innistrad is to Twilight or Anne Rice.
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Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

BeneTleilax wrote:
3 years ago
Right, but having such names for all the houses certainly points towards Harry Potter influence.
Dude, no. D&D used similar naming conventions 20 years before the first Harry Potter book was released, and even then it was nothing new.
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Post by Sporegorger_Dragon » 3 years ago

There's bound to be some influence, no doubt, and I feel that this discussion all boils down to how much influence one believes there is.

Magical school/academy is a pretty old and widespread trope (so much that it's even a trope in mamga/anime), and MtG itself explored that to an extent. Plus sets already have factions, which neatly aligns with whole house/college/fraternity structure, and I think college/university culture is even more of a mainstay in Western culture than HP.

I think it's obvious that HP's pervasiveness in pop-culture influenced/played a big role in the selection of the setting for this bottom-up set, and there are bound to be references for the same reasons, but the previous being true does not necessarily means it's explicitly based on HP.

In the end, it's going to come down to one's own interpretation on the extent of HP's influence on the set.

EDIT: If there's a kraken in the lake, a treefolk/giant groundskeeper, a greenhouse full of monstrous plants, and a course on raising monsters, then yeah, it's pretty blatant.
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Post by ilovesaprolings » 3 years ago

A big difference i'm seeing from HP is that the founders aren't human and maybe they are still alive.
I wonder if they are "real" elder dragons, or just big dragons that wanted to look cool like the Tarkir ones

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Post by 5colorsrainbow » 3 years ago

ilovesaprolings wrote:
3 years ago
A big difference i'm seeing from HP is that the founders aren't human and maybe they are still alive.
I wonder if they are "real" elder dragons, or just big dragons that wanted to look cool like the Tarkir ones
I'm guessing we will see them as legends in the commander decks, imo be a cute nod to have a cycle of elder dragons made for commander.
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Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

ilovesaprolings wrote:
3 years ago
A big difference i'm seeing from HP is that the founders aren't human and maybe they are still alive.
I wonder if they are "real" elder dragons, or just big dragons that wanted to look cool like the Tarkir ones
Well, if the Ur-Dragon visited the plane and put down a clutch of eggs that hatched into dragons, then they are real Elder dragons.
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Post by SecretInfiltrator » 3 years ago

Sporegorger_Dragon wrote:
3 years ago
EDIT: If there's a kraken in the lake, a treefolk/giant groundskeeper, a greenhouse full of monstrous plants, and a course on raising monsters, then yeah, it's pretty blatant.
Going by the college descriptions there'll definitely be a course on raising monsters.

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Post by ilovesaprolings » 3 years ago

Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
Well, if the Ur-Dragon visited the plane and put down a clutch of eggs that hatched into dragons, then they are real Elder dragons.
That's what i wonder

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Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

ilovesaprolings wrote:
3 years ago
Krishnath wrote:
3 years ago
Well, if the Ur-Dragon visited the plane and put down a clutch of eggs that hatched into dragons, then they are real Elder dragons.
That's what i wonder
Time will tell.
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Post by The Fluff » 3 years ago

liking the Prismari and Silverquill commands, gonna get a few when they become available. Feels like the power level is ok for pioneer.
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Post by CommanderMaster999 » 3 years ago

Hey I just remember "Professor onyx" was revealed and she's actually liliana (as in gatewatch liliana)

She made the mystical archive? That would explain Demonic Tutor because of a little contract

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Post by Krishnath » 3 years ago

CommanderMaster999 wrote:
3 years ago
Hey I just remember "Professor onyx" was revealed and she's actually liliana (as in gatewatch liliana)

She made the mystical archive? That would explain Demonic Tutor because of a little contract
Pretty sure the archive is considerably older than she is, even if she is a couple of centuries old.
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Post by The N82O Molecule » 3 years ago

so let me get this straight, Liliana leaves after the war of the spark, buys a dress in Fiora and then turns into naughty teacher? wow, did not see that coming.

ive always had a little sum tin sum tin for Queen Marchesa and Teysa, Envoy of Ghostsand now with that Dress Pronyx is added to the list.

so do we know anything about the plane Strixhaven. . .or is that the school name? are there many schools or just this one? Im sorta thrown off that there are two planes walkers already probably a third. . .like, tenure? no background checks I guess.its going to be a real bummer that some of the schools aren't led by a planes walker.

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Post by The Fluff » 3 years ago

CommanderMaster999 wrote:
3 years ago
Hey I just remember "Professor onyx" was revealed and she's actually liliana (as in gatewatch liliana)

She made the mystical archive? That would explain Demonic Tutor because of a little contract
nice, this makes things a lot more interesting.

I wonder if she plans to live peacefully in this plane? Or she planning something again?
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