First Official Theros Spoilers: Ashiok, Elspeth and Buy a Box Promo

[Serpent_Steve]

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/magic ... 3B3A982C1E

Looks like that leak from a month or so ago was mostly correct. That Elspeth has the same artwork. Better start the number crunch soon.

[SyntheticDreamer]

Ah, you just beat me to it! Yeah, the Elspeth had previously been leaked. I'm digging the art on both versions of Ashiok.

[CalebLost]

Borderless Ashiok is truly amazing! For Elspeth I may prefer the regular art, she feels more dynamic and the spear is great

[Dusk]

So....Ashiok is the first borderless walker art I actually want (and the normal is gonna look great in foil). I like the original art of Atheros, God of Passage more than this new one, but this one has a neat effect.

Rules question: I control both Atheros in play and there is one other creature that dies with a coin counter on it. Do I get to order the triggers such that original Atheros resolves before this new one? Or vice versa?

Edit:
It might be a bit early for the crunch, but if one is not up later I will get one created. Will take some time to get numbers off the leaks

[Marquis]

Just a reminder the leaks are still unofficial and should not be discussed outside that forum. I'm going to talk with the other mods to see if we can make an exception for the crunch

[Dusk]

Marquis, would you like the crunch to wait until more have been officially revealed? In slowly mocking up a crunch I've left all the leaked cards as unconfirmed. Or I can remove them entirely.

[Marquis]

Right now just use the the first 3 letters of any leaked card in the crunch. if we decide to change that i'll let you know

[Dusk]

Will do, thank you

[Arkmer]

Ashiok seems like a house. 5cmc seems right too. Bit of disynergy with "opponent's grave matters" cards like Into the Story but it also feeds they're -7, so I'm not sure how to think about that. Ashiok seems great, I'm pretty likely to try to pick up 1 or 2.

I feel like Elspeth's best role is against Burn like decks? Gain 5, make 2 Soldiers seems good in that situation. I am SUPER curious what the deal is with the black oil and the weapon. Looks like a combination of Godsend and something? I don't think it's Spear of Heliod, tbh.

If you had both Athreos, you'd get to order them. I used to do it with Athreos and Persist in some long forgotten lists. You control the triggers and you control the permanent being affected (I don't think the second one matters in this case).

[BeneTleilax]

looks like Xenagos's staff, also, is that Phyrexian oil? original Theros had some hints of Phyrexia, it'd be interesting if with Bolas gone, and the Eldrazi defeated for the time being, the Phyrexians come back to the fore.

[SyntheticDreamer]

looks like Xenagos's staff, also, is that Phyrexian oil? original Theros had some hints of Phyrexia, it'd be interesting if with Bolas gone, and the Eldrazi defeated for the time being, the Phyrexians come back to the fore.

It's likely not Phyrexian oil. It would be very, very out of character for Elspeth to use that as a weapon considering her origin story. More than likely it has something to do with the underworld, especially considering the end of the spear resembles Elspeth's Returned mask.

[Watchwolf]

350!!??

[Dusk]

350 should have an asterik, and the set proper have 254 (as seen in the normal art for both walkers). The rest are alt-arts/walker decks/brawl? decks/etc

[Pip_Maxwell]

So we have two planeswalkers, both look fun in their own ways, but will we see Dack?

[SyntheticDreamer]

So we have two planeswalkers, both look fun in their own ways, but will we see Dack?

Dack's dead, so no.

[Dusk]

So we have two planeswalkers, both look fun in their own ways, but will we see Dack?

Dack's dead, so no.

It will depend on when this set takes place. If after the events of WAR, then yeah, Dack is dead. However, if the events of THB happen before the events of WAR we could see a Dack card. Remember that the events of Throne happen before the events of Battlebond, even though the latter was released as a set first.

[SyntheticDreamer]

So we have two planeswalkers, both look fun in their own ways, but will we see Dack?

Dack's dead, so no.

It will depend on when this set takes place. If after the events of WAR, then yeah, Dack is dead. However, if the events of THB happen before the events of WAR we could see a Dack card. Remember that the events of Throne happen before the events of Battlebond, even though the latter was released as a set first.

Good point. I guess the key would be whether or not we see Ajani or Gideon/Kytheon in this set. If they're in the set or at least depicted on cards, then it has to take place after WAR since Ajani was on Dominaria before WAR.

[Dusk]

Dack's dead, so no.

It will depend on when this set takes place. If after the events of WAR, then yeah, Dack is dead. However, if the events of THB happen before the events of WAR we could see a Dack card. Remember that the events of Throne happen before the events of Battlebond, even though the latter was released as a set first.

Good point. I guess the key would be whether or not we see Ajani or Gideon/Kytheon in this set. If they're in the set or at least depicted on cards, then it has to take place after WAR since Ajani was on Dominaria before WAR.

Indeed. Though, with Ashiok and Elspeth both in set I think that there will be a new walker as the third, possibly as RG to replace Domri who bit the dust in WAR.

[CommanderMaster999]

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350!!??

Look at the link again

It's saids 250 new cards it's a misprint

As for Theros: Beyond Death, the new set has more than 250 new cards with new and returning mechanics

[Mookie]

Actual, official spoilers? Huzzah!

Ashiok, Nightmare Muse is interesting - not a huge departure from the normal 'default standard-playable walker' template (+1: card advantage / -3: removal / -8: ultimate), but a few things to make Ashiok a bit different. 2/3 nightmare tokens are pretty beefy. Does feel like you may just win because of the bodies before you win off the mill, but getting stuff exiled is still fairly annoying. -3 feels a little weak, but Recoil is a solid card, so I'm probably underestimating it. Ultimate is fine and will probably win the game just from raw card advantage, but can suffer a bit if your opponent's deck doesn't mesh with your game plan. On the other hand, -7 means it comes a turn faster than the standard template.

Elspeth, Sun's Nemesis looks a little weak, but I'm probably under-evaluating the Escape mechanic. I see it and think of Skaab Ruinator, which was virtually unplayable. One thing that particularly concerns me is that white is the color that tends to be the worst at filling its graveyard, which makes it harder to abuse her Escape cost. On the other hand, maybe it's a sign that there will be graveyard enablers in white? Hmmm.... Anyway, ignoring that, the pump ability doesn't excite me, and neither does the lifegain. On the other hand, four tokens for four mana is a reasonable return on investment, and makes her hard to pressure.

Athreos, Shroud-Veiled looks like a lot of fun. Indestructible enchantments are still a pain to get off the field and obnoxious to play against, but I'm a bit more forgiving when it costs six mana - at that point, I start to expect things to be a bit harder to deal with. Triggering at end of turn makes it much more likely for you to get value, even if you do have to wait for the target to get removed. Being the buy-a-box promo means I probably won't ever get one, but we'll see. (also, reminds me of Debtors' Knell)

[Cyberium]

Exiling stuff be easy with Ashiok, and people are usually unwilling to exile their stuff in EDH unless it's worth the price, let alone being forced to do so.

[Dusk]

The thing to keep in mind is that Ashiok's ult can grab any card in face-up exile, not just ones exiled from its abilities

[Max Rebo]

Well.
Confused as to where these Marble statue alt arts will show up (non-foil alt art??)??
Elspeth art is not that great (on either card)
Ashiok seems annoyingly fun.
Pokemon Energy are just that.

[Dusk]

Well.
Confused as to where these Marble statue alt arts will show up (non-foil alt art??)??
Elspeth art is not that great (on either card)
Ashiok seems annoyingly fun.
Pokemon Energy are just that.

The alt-arts will, if like Throne of Eldraine as expected, will have a chance to be in normal boosters but have a higher chance of coming from the collector's boosters. They can be both foil and non-foil

[Max Rebo]

I forgot the Planeswalkers had alt arts in Eldraine..........duh.