Kaya and the Rectors

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Ardeyn
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Post by Ardeyn » 3 years ago

If I use Kaya the Inexorable to give Academy Rector or Arena Rector a ghostform counter, will they return to hand if they die and I use their triggers - thus Exiling them - to search for an enchantment?
Somehow I keep thinking this should work... :thinking:

Ardeyn

Accepted Answer

by Argus » 3 years ago
Ardeyn wrote:
3 years ago
If I use Kaya the Inexorable to give Academy Rector or Arena Rector a ghostform counter, will they return to hand if they die and I use their triggers - thus Exiling them - to search for an enchantment?
No, that won't work.

If you put the ability granted by Kaya on the stack first, the rector's intrinsic ability will resolve first. If you choose to exile it, it won't be around to be returned by the first ability (although you'll still get a 1/1 white Spirit creature token with flying).
400.7. An object that moves from one zone to another becomes a new object with no memory of, or relation to, its previous existence. There are nine exceptions to this rule:
exceptions
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400.7a Effects from spells, activated abilities, and triggered abilities that change the characteristics or controller of a permanent spell on the stack continue to apply to the permanent that spell becomes.
400.7b Prevention effects that apply to damage from a permanent spell on the stack continue to apply to damage from the permanent that spell becomes.
400.7c An ability of a permanent can reference information about the spell that became that permanent as it resolved, including what costs were paid to cast that spell or what mana was spent to pay those costs.
400.7d Abilities that trigger when an object moves from one zone to another (for example, "When Rancor is put into a graveyard from the battlefield") can find the new object that it became in the zone it moved to when the ability triggered, if that zone is a public zone.
400.7e Abilities of Auras that trigger when the enchanted permanent leaves the battlefield can find the new object that Aura became in its owner's graveyard if it was put into that graveyard at the same time the enchanted permanent left the battlefield. It can also find the new object that Aura became in its owner's graveyard as a result of being put there as a state-based action for not being attached to a permanent. (See rule 704.5m.)
400.7f If an effect grants a nonland card an ability that allows it to be cast, that ability will continue to apply to the new object that card became after it moved to the stack as a result of being cast this way.
400.7g If an effect allows a nonland card to be cast, other parts of that effect can find the new object that card becomes after it moves to the stack as a result of being cast this way.
400.7h If an effect causes an object to move to a public zone, other parts of that effect can find that object. If the cost of a spell or ability causes an object to move to a public zone, that spell or ability's effects can find that object.
400.7i After resolving a madness triggered ability (see rule 702.34), if the exiled card wasn't cast and was moved to a public zone, effects referencing the discarded card can find that object.
If you put the intrinsic ability on the stack first, the ability granted by Kaya will move the card to your hand first. When the intrinsic ability resolves, you will not have the option to exile it.
608.2d If an effect of a spell or ability offers any choices other than choices already made as part of casting the spell, activating the ability, or otherwise putting the spell or ability on the stack, the player announces these while applying the effect. The player can't choose an option that's illegal or impossible, with the exception that having a library with no cards in it doesn't make drawing a card an impossible action (see rule 121.3). If an effect divides or distributes something, such as damage or counters, as a player chooses among any number of untargeted players and/or objects, the player chooses the amount and division such that each chosen player or object receives at least one of whatever is being divided. (Note that if an effect divides or distributes something, such as damage or counters, as a player chooses among some number of target objects and/or players, the amount and division were determined as the spell or ability was put onto the stack rather than at this time; see rule 601.2d.)
Example: A spell's instruction reads, "You may sacrifice a creature. If you don't, you lose 4 life." A player who controls no creatures can't choose the sacrifice option.
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Argus
Posts: 80
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Post by Argus » 3 years ago

Ardeyn wrote:
3 years ago
If I use Kaya the Inexorable to give Academy Rector or Arena Rector a ghostform counter, will they return to hand if they die and I use their triggers - thus Exiling them - to search for an enchantment?
No, that won't work.

If you put the ability granted by Kaya on the stack first, the rector's intrinsic ability will resolve first. If you choose to exile it, it won't be around to be returned by the first ability (although you'll still get a 1/1 white Spirit creature token with flying).
400.7. An object that moves from one zone to another becomes a new object with no memory of, or relation to, its previous existence. There are nine exceptions to this rule:
exceptions
Show
Hide
400.7a Effects from spells, activated abilities, and triggered abilities that change the characteristics or controller of a permanent spell on the stack continue to apply to the permanent that spell becomes.
400.7b Prevention effects that apply to damage from a permanent spell on the stack continue to apply to damage from the permanent that spell becomes.
400.7c An ability of a permanent can reference information about the spell that became that permanent as it resolved, including what costs were paid to cast that spell or what mana was spent to pay those costs.
400.7d Abilities that trigger when an object moves from one zone to another (for example, "When Rancor is put into a graveyard from the battlefield") can find the new object that it became in the zone it moved to when the ability triggered, if that zone is a public zone.
400.7e Abilities of Auras that trigger when the enchanted permanent leaves the battlefield can find the new object that Aura became in its owner's graveyard if it was put into that graveyard at the same time the enchanted permanent left the battlefield. It can also find the new object that Aura became in its owner's graveyard as a result of being put there as a state-based action for not being attached to a permanent. (See rule 704.5m.)
400.7f If an effect grants a nonland card an ability that allows it to be cast, that ability will continue to apply to the new object that card became after it moved to the stack as a result of being cast this way.
400.7g If an effect allows a nonland card to be cast, other parts of that effect can find the new object that card becomes after it moves to the stack as a result of being cast this way.
400.7h If an effect causes an object to move to a public zone, other parts of that effect can find that object. If the cost of a spell or ability causes an object to move to a public zone, that spell or ability's effects can find that object.
400.7i After resolving a madness triggered ability (see rule 702.34), if the exiled card wasn't cast and was moved to a public zone, effects referencing the discarded card can find that object.
If you put the intrinsic ability on the stack first, the ability granted by Kaya will move the card to your hand first. When the intrinsic ability resolves, you will not have the option to exile it.
608.2d If an effect of a spell or ability offers any choices other than choices already made as part of casting the spell, activating the ability, or otherwise putting the spell or ability on the stack, the player announces these while applying the effect. The player can't choose an option that's illegal or impossible, with the exception that having a library with no cards in it doesn't make drawing a card an impossible action (see rule 121.3). If an effect divides or distributes something, such as damage or counters, as a player chooses among any number of untargeted players and/or objects, the player chooses the amount and division such that each chosen player or object receives at least one of whatever is being divided. (Note that if an effect divides or distributes something, such as damage or counters, as a player chooses among some number of target objects and/or players, the amount and division were determined as the spell or ability was put onto the stack rather than at this time; see rule 601.2d.)
Example: A spell's instruction reads, "You may sacrifice a creature. If you don't, you lose 4 life." A player who controls no creatures can't choose the sacrifice option.
Why bother with mere rulings when so many answers can be found in the Rules?

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